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Sunroof leak on my Saturn Outlook

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Comments

  • gmcustsvcgmcustsvc Posts: 4,055
    thejetzman,
    Sorry to hear that the AC noise came back. Keep us posted on your progress with your dealership as we're available if you should need anything.
    Sarah, GM Customer Service
  • You have to take it to a sunroof specialist or someone who installs them. That was the only way i got mine fixed completely.
  • Sarah, how long does it take to hear back from someone at the email address you provide? I sent the email last week and haven't heard anything. The dealer told us we had 30 days from the time we paid to have the diagnostic done to have that money applied to the so called "fix". I have no clue what to do next!! We don't have the money to keep taking this car in! I'm just waiting until we start getting tickets for the headlight like others have said. This is so frustrating!!
  • Anglins4 et al:

    Want to send a quick reply here - long story, but our 07 Outlook is now entering week 3 at Gm dealer - with full host of electrical water damage - fuse box, wiring harness, ECU, etc... (I had to tell them where to look!) In our experience thus far, dealing with Gm social media will get you NOWHERE. They will reply briefly in email, no phone # ever, and will not even read your email, unfortunately. Our experince with 'sarah' and 'ashley' lead us to believe they are actually not human, and some sort of automated computer response. Though I don't know the specifics of your current situation, my best advice is to go through a Service Manager (not just the Service rep - has to be someone with some decision making ability) at your GM dealer. in our case, though yet unresolved, our service manager had his own contact at GM - wouldn't give a name or # - and had never heard of 'Ashley' or 'Sarah'. Our service manager had to 'build a case' for us, and convince GM to cover the repairs. Will post more here when our issue is resolved, if that happens, but hope that helps in some small way. I am convinced you are wasting your time with GM social media.
  • gmcustsvcgmcustsvc Posts: 4,055
    anglins4,

    If you haven't heard back yet I would recommend trying to resend the message. My apologies that we haven't been speedier!

    Sarah, GM Customer Service
  • WOW...Thanks for the heads-up tallgolf.....right after I posted the comment about not hearing from anyone within minutes I got this email.....

    You do only have 30 days to get the work done for the diagnostic to stay current. However, this is something that would normally be covered uner the bumper bumper warranty but it is expired due to both age and mileage on the vehicle. We apologize for the frustrations.

    Brandon
    GM Customer Service

    Funny how convienent it is that it would "normally be covered"! If that's the case WHY are so many other people experiencing the same problems right after getting the vehicle and still can't get it fixed!! I will take your advise tallgolf and see if that will help us....this is just crazy! We are at a loss of what to do. Please keep me updated on your issue....Thanks!
  • tfish30735tfish30735 Posts: 1
    I too have a 2007 Saturn Outlook with a leaking moonroof. It leaks down the passenger side A pillar onto the passenger floor. I can replicate the leak with my garden hose when I pour water on the moonroof. Currently, the sunroof can withstand the gardenhose test. I've had the draintube extensions installed and the tubes cleaned out twice and it continues to leak. My dealer is telling me it will cost a minimum of $500 (cost to remove the headliner) to continue to find the source of the leak. I am not willing to pay money for something that isn't fixable. Has anyone tried applying a bead of silicone or similiar water repelling chemical product around the stationary moonroof? I know it won't look the best but I can't afford to trade cars and am more concerned with dryness than appearence.
  • tallgolftallgolf Posts: 8
    Hello Outlook owners - couple updates:

    After 5 weeks at GM dealer, got my Outlook back. As described before, they replaced seemingly every electronic component, Fuse box, wiring harness, ECU, etc. Again, to their credit, my local GM dealer went to bat for me with GM and I DID NOT PAY A DIME for this repair (a $3000 + estimate for repair) - I believe largely because I had already paid to have the leak repaired prior -and as we all know, the leak is not fixable. So, just prior this last round of repairs, I too did use some silicone sealant on both the sunroof and the moonroof - and I truly believe this was working - and in my case, it was the moonroof, not the sunroof. So, long story short GM, buy some $7 tubes of silicone and seal the you know what out of the moonroof! (though, I'm sure GM can't 'prescribe' this fix, as that would admit the problem exists, then lawyers get involved, etc..) I basically filled the 'gutter' of the moonroof with the silicone (a 'marine' type sealant) on the first dry day I could.

    After getting the Outlook back, I had absolutely no faith that the problem was permanently solved, in fact the dealer admitted as much - only the broken parts fixed. Sadly, I gave up on GM and traded in the Outlook. Though I believe it is fixed in it's current state, I simply could not drive that car anymore, as there is no real guarantee it wouldn't leak again a year from now.

    Good luck to you all.
  • dmunizdmuniz Posts: 16
    I have had my 07 Saturn back from dealer and it looks to be the non ooperational moonroof that is the problem. They took car to sunroof place and resealed the rear moonroof and I have been leak free for a month.

    The dealership covered this so I have no idea on cost.

    Hope this helps anyone.
  • dassarinadassarina Posts: 2
    Hello all,

    I really do love my Outlook, but I'm faced with the decision of a possible hefty dealership fix of many issues (that may or may not be related to the leak).

    They believe all of the current problems I am having are from the leaking:

    Parking brake light on when the parking brake isn't on
    service air bag
    engine issues (doesn't turn off when key is removed)
    steering noise
    back hatch won't automatically open.

    They said that leaks aren't covered even if we are under warranty. The service rep even said "you've been bringing this car in since 2010 every 10 months for leaks." Yes, I have and every time I've asked if it will cause greater damage and have always been told "Nah, it's fine."

    The car leaks from:

    The driver and passenger side air bags
    The parking break and same area passenger side
    visors
    inside the front windshield
    the back seat belts

    Any ideas of cost? Do we just start looking for another car? Will the dealership cut me a break since this isn't new?
  • smoore812smoore812 Posts: 2
    I was wondering if anyone had contacted a attorney. I purchased my 08 Saturn Outlook 6 days ago.. on the 5th day the car would not shut off.. I took it back to dealer, and they now have it and are sealing a seam and replacing the fuse box due to corrosion, however after reading all these, I know this will not fix the problem, my plan was to seal the moon roof again once I got the car back but im sure that wont help.. Im not sure what to do at this point. I have this car financed for 5 year. and im only 6 days into it. Why are dealerships able to continue selling this vehicle! I read the reviews before I made the purchase and all was good.. then I had this issue and it wasn't till I seen this forum that I realized I just got screwed! Please help!
  • mklvkcmklvkc Posts: 3
    Abandon ship! These vehicles are JUNK. Get an attorney (through Lemonaid.com if you are in WI) or try to return the vehicle under return clauses in your contract. If financed through a bank or non-dealership source they may be willing to help in order to protect their interests. Good luck.
  • smoore812smoore812 Posts: 2
    I purchased my 08 Saturn outlook exactly 7 days ago.. I have already had to take it to have the fuse box replaced do to corrosion from leaky sun/moon roof. Now I am being told there is nothing that can be done. I have only had this car for 7 days, I love it! but I am financed in for 5 years, haven't even paid my first payment yet, and I already am faced with a vehicle that I cant drive. I don't want anything accept for the sun/moon roof fixed replace the seals/tubes whatever it is that is causing the issues, please! all im asking is you stand behind your product and fix its issue. Please help me!
  • nancy1960nancy1960 Posts: 54
    edited May 2013
    I was in your same position. A month after purchasing our Outlook massive problems started to occur.... We too had a loan. Too make a long story short, we had to return the car to the bank despite all the extensive repairs. We could not continue to pay on a car that continue to have serious electrical problems and unsafe to drive. Our fuse box was flooded along with the motor to the back hatch. I was devastated to say the least... When I returned the car to the bank, I gave the bank all the documented repairs and history on the well known problems the Saturns have had. The car was in the shop a total of 40 days combined. I could not in good conscious trade this car in and pass along this nightmare. I would like to note that GM paid for all the repairs and rented us a car. There was a service bulletin to extend the sunroof drains and despite repairs, as you can see, that repaired failed many of us! There is a little secret that GM has and it's called a Secret Warranty!! This is why they pay for repairs to prevent a class action.
    There are some States like CA that not only have a Lemon Law (that does not apply to so many of us) but breach of warranty of mercantability. This only applies to certain States. It allows a vehicle owner a repurchase if the vehicle has so many problems that it does not meet the legal standard for ordinary goods of this type. Check your State and see if this applies to you.
    I don't think the dealers can take all the blame. The blame lies with GM as this is a manufacturer defect. It's criminal and has hurt their customers financially, emotionally and with a flooded fuse box your car can just die, thankfully, mine died in my driveway! If I/we were on the freeway it could have been fatal.

    I feel so bad for you as I know how blown away you are. Research these pages and be prepared when you talk with GM.

    Here is information on the Secret Warranty. As you go down this unfortunate path you will see how this information applies to us all!!

    Secret warranties are a multi-billion consumer abuse. Every auto company makes mistakes in building cars. Whether they are design defects that affect every car or whether they are manufacturing defects which affect only some cars, they must be repaired. The only question is who pays for the manufacturers' mistakes, the manufacturer or the consumer. Although the auto manufacturer often establishes a secret warranty to pay for the repair, all too often it is the consumer who pays for the manufacturer's mistake because the consumer never finds out about the secret warranty. That's wrong and the Center for Auto Safety wants to change it.

    In a 1987 report the Center for Auto Safety (CAS) created national headlines by identifying 10 exemplary secret warranties covering 30 million vehicles and $3 billion in repair costs. Yet this is but the tip of the iceberg for we estimate that at any one time over 500 secret warranties exist for all auto companies. According to a Toyota whistleblower who provided a complete list in May 1988, Toyota alone had 41 secret warranties at that time.

    By exposing secret warranties, CAS forces manufacturers to pay for their mistakes and creates a strong incentive for them to build better cars in the future. once secret warranties are disclosed, consumers will save hundreds, if not thousands, in repair bills on their personal cars. Spurred on by CAS exposes, state legislatures are moving to pass secret warranty disclosure laws that will protect consumers. Until then, consumers must rely on the strategies suggested in our book, Little Secrets of the Auto Industry, to discover and use secret warranties to pay for repairs in their vehicles.

    What is a secret warranty?
    Auto companies hate the term secret warranties. They call them policy adjustments, good will programs, service campaigns or extended warranties . But whatever they are called, they are a longstanding industry practice. When a car company has a major defect that occurs after its written warranty expires, it establishes an adjustment policy to pay for repairs rather than deal with many thousands, if not millions, of complaints on a case by case basis. But the auto company communicates the policy only to regional offices and not even always to its dealers. The auto manufacturers never notify the consumer; so only the consumer who complains loudly enough gets covered by the secret warranty. Other consumers end up bearing the costs of the manufacturer's mistakes.

    Examples of Secret Warranties
    CAS has documented case after case of secret warranties since our founding in 1970. one of the first and most famous was Ford's J-67 Limited Service Program which covered rust on 12 million 1969-72 cars and trucks. In this case a bulletin which went out only to Ford regional offices stated, "This is a limited service program without dealership notification and should be administered on an individual complaint basis." Under this program, Ford would pay up to 100% to repair rust and paint damage on its vehicles even if it cost over a $1000.

    CAS has uncovered secret warranties on all auto companies with little differences between them. A 1972 Mazda secret warranty bulletin doubled the coverage for rotary engine damage but cautioned, "Since this is a temporary program which may be terminated at [any] time, owners are not to be informed of the extended coverage." Honda had secret warranties on head gaskets and rusting fenders in the mid-1970's; Chrysler had rusting fenders on Volares and Aspens in the late 1970's; GM had the transmission secret warranty caused by a ban on sperm whale oil as a lubricant; Peugeot and Subaru both covered defective head gaskets; and VW covered valve stem seals.

    Secret warranties soared after 1980 when the federal government dropped all efforts to ban them. GM had a 5 year/50,000 mile secret warranty covering repair of defective rack and pinion power steering systems on all 16 million of its 1981-88 front wheel drive cars. Toyota covered pulsating brakes on its 1983-86 Camry in a $100 million secret warranty. Ford never told owners of its 1985-92 F-series pickups that America's most popular truck had peeling paint because Ford skipped the primer layer. According to Nissan documents provided to CAS by a whistleblower in 1990, Nissan had at one time up to 48 secret warranties covering various cars and trucks.

    There is no doubt that auto manufacturers presently have many other secret warranties. However, assessing how widespread secret warranty programs are is difficult because these programs, by definition, are not intended for public disclosure. Since CAS began exposing secret warranties more widely in the 1980's, the auto makers having gotten better at keeping them secret. Even CAS can no longer get lists of secret warranties to disclose. one Honda insider told CAS that Honda has only one secret warranty book for each of its regions. The book is chained to a desk.
  • gmcustsvcgmcustsvc Posts: 4,055
    smoore812,

    I can certainly look into your concern with your sunroof. Can you please email me your information at socialmedia@gm.com ATTN: Erica? I will need you to provide me with your name, VIN, mileage, address, phone number, and the name of the Certified GM Dealership you are working with in regards to this concern. Look forward to hearing from you soon.

    Erica Tiffany
    GM Customer Service
  • anglins4anglins4 Posts: 7
    PLEASE.... file a complaint with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) at https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/ Everyone having these problems needs to file a complaint to help keep this from happening to others. We are still fighting with GM to help with our repairs. Now we can't even get a rep from GM to call us back. It has been a nightmare for so many. We also went thru "Sara" here on this forum and got NOWHERE... We were offered $3000 on a new GM vehicle....who can afford a new car when we can't in good conscience trade in our Outlook! Our latest is we found a service bulletin on one of our problems and the dealer tells us because our VIN number is not included they can't do anything for us! It's all so unbelievable! We all need to file a complaint! Good Luck to you!!
  • dompdomp Posts: 24
    Agree 100%. I've just hit 100k miles and now the transmission is acting odd. I can't afford repairing a wave plate transmission issue right now. I've just finished paying for all the repairs caused by the sunroof leak. Wondering what it's going to take for gm to own up to these issues.
  • anglins4anglins4 Posts: 7
    PLEASE.... file a complaint with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) at https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/ Everyone having these problems needs to file a complaint to help keep this from happening to others. We are still fighting with GM to help with our repairs. Now we can't even get a rep from GM to call us back. It has been a nightmare for so many. We also went thru "Sara" here on this forum and got NOWHERE... We were offered $3000 on a new GM vehicle....who can afford a new car when we can't in good conscience trade in our Outlook! Our latest is we found a service bulletin on one of our problems and the dealer tells us because our VIN number is not included they can't do anything for us! It's all so unbelievable! We all need to file a complaint! Good Luck to you!!
  • ghman59ghman59 Posts: 1
    Sunroof leaking 2008 outlook xr: there is an easy fix to this problem if you are mechanically inclined. There is a drain tube that runs from the sunroof corners if sitting in your car looking out the front on the left and right side. If you open the roof and climb up the running board look into the front most right and left hand corners of the plastic cutter and you will see a hole the size of a Q tip head or 3/16 th size drill bit thickness. Take an air hose from a compressor with an air nozzel (not a tire nozzel) the type you would blow the dirt off a floor with. Put this agianst the hole and pull the trigger you will see either dirt or water come shooting out of the wheel well on what ever side you are doing. There is a rubber grommit that is at the end of the water drain that gets clogged by very small debri and pollen which is set into the firewall and once that is slightly wet it drys and hardens because of the design in the grommit. It has a very small slit in it like an X to not let I guess bugs crawl in it and this is where the dirt rests and drys which then cloggs the hole. Trust me I had to totally take mine out by dropping the front of the head liner and take off the plastic along the colunnm and part of the dash board to pull mine out. I threaded a wire through mine which was explained in a way to clean it out and the wire got stuck. This is in my opinion that there is a flaw design in the grommit not allowing enough water to flow through without getting clogged. So the best way without going through what I have is to use an air hose occasionally and just blow the dirt out even though this shouldnt be after paying all this money for an SUV. :mad: So the drain hose runs from the sun roof corner down the windshield post to slightlly under the dashboard to a grommit in the firewall.
  • tallgolftallgolf Posts: 8
    I am so sorry the sunroof/moonroof complaints continue to grow. This is such a hideous problem. I hate to read about the safety issues people have. We did contact the NHTSA - no response. These people from GM who come on here, all they do is tell you to get your car fixed. No offer of any help with paying for it, despite the design flaw in the car. If we could afford endless repair bills, I think we would all take the cars in, right? My husband believes its just to get you to stop posting here. My advice is to try and get to your regional GM rep. They have the connections to help you. And, may even feel sympathy for you. Ours did. Gratefully.

    We are happy with our Dodge Crew now. Liked the Outlook more, but that chapter is closed. GOOD LUCK everyone.. keep pushing. Remember - YOU are right!
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