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What Would It Take for YOU to buy a diesel car?

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Comments

  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    Perhaps this is old school, but if one has to blind oncoming & the drivers in front, it's almost proof positive one is probably better off not driving @ night.?

    Normally each states DMV will list when to turn off/on high beams? Here is CA's https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/detail/pubs/hdbk/driving_in
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Interesting diesel tidbit. With all the worry about getting a vehicle that has been under water. We may have to be vigilant with our desire to own a diesel.

    According to local police, as many as 69 Dieselgate buyback vehicles have been reported missing from the Silverdome. One particular dealership may have played a part, as it handled as many as 41 of the missing cars. Legal representatives for the dealership say that the dealer purchased a number of the recalled diesels from a supplier in Michigan, spending about $11,000 each. Indiana police say the vehicles were given forged Michigan titles allowing them to be transported out of state and sold. This investigation into apparent title fraud led to the discovery of some of the missing vehicles.

    http://www.thedrive.com/sheetmetal/14289/nearly-70-recalled-dieselgate-cars-have-been-stolen-from-volkswagen
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    Good news, they are being found. Form the article, it's obvious TDI's all have good to great resale values! I hope they arrest & convict the thieves.
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,724
    edited September 2017
    https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/detail/pubs/hdbk/speed_limits+

    The DMV isn't known for publishing the best driving handbooks in CA.

    They actually have the audacity to say with a straight face - "All speed limits are based on ideal driving conditions." - Maximum speed law paragraph in the link above.

    Really?

    So all the driver's on the road in CA driving 15 -25 over the speed limit must not being taking "conditions" into account then!

    At least they don't lie about the Basic Speed Law anymore. It used to say you may never go over the prima facie speed limit, but that you may have to go under it, LOL! Not how the Vehicle Code read, ever!
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    Well, I think if one were to look at the National Highway Traffic Safety.gov, speed (year over year) accounts for (only) app 20% of accidents/fatalities. They don't say this all too loudly. The other side would be the other 80% of all accidents/fatalities occurs at LEGAL speeds and/ or BELOW!!

    Just like it's hard to NOT applaud that 50% or more of the accidents due to DUI and then driving: now CUT to 30%. This of course means that 70% of all accidents are now added/due to being stone COLD SOBER!! .
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,724
    ruking1 said:

    Well, I think if one were to look at the National Highway Traffic Safety.gov, speed (year over year) accounts for (only) app 20% of accidents/fatalities. They don't say this all too loudly. The other side would be the other 80% of all accidents/fatalities occurs at LEGAL speeds and/ or BELOW!!

    Just like it's hard to NOT applaud that 50% or more of the accidents due to DUI and then driving: now CUT to 30%. This of course means that 70% of all accidents are now added/due to being stone COLD SOBER!! .

    That 20% figure is much too high. Takes delving into the numbers deeply (TMI), but it really is probably around 3% of accidents or fatalities are attributable (even partially) to speeding. Yes, 2 to 3%!.

    What skews the numbers?

    Well, for one, anyone going even 1 MPH over the speed limit is technically speeding and that makes accident reports say things like "speeding a factor in causation."

    The big one though, is that drunk drivers THAT tend to SPEED tend to crash, and drunk drivers that speed AND crash tend to die in those crashes. No one with any logic would include drunk drivers that speed and blame the speeding, but that's how it is done at most government agencies. Filter out the idiocy from the statistics and you end up with about 2-3%.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    I'm ok with either figure! They don't describe the methodology or protocols? But this helps to keep this system rolling along! As it applies to diesel, it's going to be around for @ least 3 generations!
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 16,747
    I don't drive diesel often, but when I do, I drive drunk!

    :p
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,072
    I drove by this apparent holding lot for Dieselgate buybacks on the WA coast. Virtually all Golf/Jetta:

    https://youtu.be/CgldIzy__g8

    Little road trip today, 46.1 mpg per the trip computer.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    ruking1 said:
    Rocky loved his 2014 Cruze diesel and was planning to lease the new one. I guess the deals are not as good and he settled for a gasser. Bet he will not be as happy with it at the gas pump. He was always over 40 MPG even around town.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    Slow diesel news day! Daughter will be flying home to take her mom on a road trip! She will do her rotations in Las Vegas, NV. The wife was concerned about the 2003 VW Jetta TDI @ 188,000 miles & took it to a 5/5 star Yelp rated VW diesel shop, to get a second opinion. The shop checked it out and declared it fully functioning in excellent condition for a 1,750 miles road trip & desert operation. They did not charge her anything for it!? I was totally amazed ! The wiper blades probably need changing! :)
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 16,747
    edited September 2017
    There was a 2005 Ford Excursion with a PowerStroke (6L) diesel that came up for sale locally a few days ago. The guy said he owes $16K on it, but will entertain any offer. I thought he must be hopelessly upside down owing that much on a vehicle so old. I looked up details on KBB, and it came back at $21K for the vehicle in "fair" condition! That's totally NUTS!

    I thought I might replace my old plow truck with it if I could maybe snag for $10K, but I think I would be waay out of the range of reasonable on that.
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    Really can't call fault for trying!

    I had fully intended to have put 200k to 300 k miles on the 2003 VW TDI. 400,000 miles total. It was not to be.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    While criminal: grand thief autos, for starters, here is one proof positive the TDI renaissance is underway! http://blog.caranddriver.com/dozens-of-volkswagen-tdis-missing-from-michigan-storage-lot-resold-out-of-state/?ref=yfp

    But then on the other hand, here's an organic & recycled vehicle that can be used by a card carrying environmentalist (Al Gore?) to: for example, Apple Board Meetings? https://www.yahoo.com/gma/canoe-unearthed-hurricane-irma-could-hundreds-years-old-195804517--abc-news-topstories.html

    I wonder where the organic & recycled paddles are? :)
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    xwesx said:

    There was a 2005 Ford Excursion with a PowerStroke (6L) diesel that came up for sale locally a few days ago. The guy said he owes $16K on it, but will entertain any offer. I thought he must be hopelessly upside down owing that much on a vehicle so old. I looked up details on KBB, and it came back at $21K for the vehicle in "fair" condition! That's totally NUTS!

    I thought I might replace my old plow truck with it if I could maybe snag for $10K, but I think I would be waay out of the range of reasonable on that.

    How many miles? I see here with 100K miles in average condition about $10k trade-in value That is for the 4x4 Eddie Bauer model. Our friends with 6 kids had an Excursion diesel. They seemed to have a lot of trouble with theirs. Then they did have 2 teenage boys that drove it a lot. I wanted one when they first came out. Too expensive.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    Yup! How many miles is one good question.

    I can speak for the ones I have or now to have HAD!

    So on the 2003 VW Jetta TDI 1.9 L, 5 speed MANUAL, 400,000 miles on the oem cluch is doable given "normal" operation. That would be @ the 14th oil change.

    If I wanted to upgrade to bigger injectors, or not, a more heavier duty OEM clutch assembly can be swapped in @ the same time or not! So it's a no brainer to go from 155# ft to 250 - 300 # ft or so, or NOT! The kicker or sleeper: one can still post the " normal 48 to 52 mpg" unless one exercises ones right foot in an "UN" disciplined manner.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Will the 1.9L TDI get past the CA sniff test with larger injectors. Can they tell when they plug into the computer?Thankfully I have paid for my last stupid smog test. Had to have the Lexus smogged before we gave it to the nephew. As usual passed with flying colors. What a waste of $52.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    The 2003 VW Jetta TDI passed the "SMOG ONLY" inspection with flying colors.

    So I'm told yes, new injectors will pass.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    I should let the professionals give the 411 on the TDI's TMI! http://www.dbwllc.net/shop//

    They can & will steer one to the products with the proper EPA #'s, if & when appropriate.

    It's probably just a matter of time before they have a product line for the GM TDI. There are also a plethora of after market vendors that cater to the American diesel market.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    90.4% & up of USA "electrical power" is provided by "disapproved" sources! This is according to https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=427&t=3
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,072
    You can get around emissions test nonsense by getting a diesel that predates it, and is grandfathered in:

    https://youtu.be/hjVmkUTuMGU

    You'll just need patience :)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    Seems the video shows the example needs a tad more than just "patience"? @ 87 # ft of torque, is an interesting price to pay for $40 CA every two yrs.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,072
    Patience to maybe let it warm up, set the idle speed correctly. and for the 25-30 second 0-60 times :)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    One use for the diesel smokers? https://youtu.be/6s7Ktn-p-oY
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,072
    I don't believe most of that was diesel smoke.

    Coal-rolling bro trucks should receive financially crushing citations.
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 16,747
    gagrice said:

    How many miles? I see here with 100K miles in average condition about $10k trade-in value That is for the 4x4 Eddie Bauer model. Our friends with 6 kids had an Excursion diesel. They seemed to have a lot of trouble with theirs. Then they did have 2 teenage boys that drove it a lot. I wanted one when they first came out. Too expensive.

    89,000 according to the ad. From what the owner said, it is not without its problems.
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    Wow! For as much as VW is vilified, @ 100,000 the major tune up was done. (kit of 30 plus parts) belt/pump change & computer adjustment )

    @ 200,000 + miles, it will need its 2nd major tune. I'm sure my mechanic guru will have some other parts change recommendations. I will probably need new windshield wiper inserts & new tires.

    Too bad the EPA/CARB didn't include the 2003 VW TDI for compensation @ what was paid new in 2003. :)
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    X
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    Slow diesel news day! Just came home to a $1,500 Bosch Settlement check! I'm guessing it's for the earlier 2.0 VW TDI filing. We just got to love depositing the check by internet & phone! I can't wait for the 2nd check to arrive ! (3.0L )
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    ruking1 said:

    Slow diesel news day! Just came home to a $1,500 Bosch Settlement check!

    Hope mine did not get lost in the mail... :@ :@
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    edited September 2017
    Just got back from Pahrump driving the new GMC Canyon diesel. I took the road less traveled home across the desert, through Palm Springs up 74 to Anza, Aguanga and across to Julian then down to Descanso to Home. First 85 miles the computer said 33.4 MPG driving mostly 65 MPH. Hopped on I15 from Baker to Barstow and set the cruise on 75 MPH. When I hit Barstow I was down to 27.9 MPG. Pushing that big front end at 75 MPH takes its toll on mileage. When I rolled into my garage 396 miles with one potty break it was at 28.1 MPG. Exactly 7 hours driving with one stop.

    I have driven that route with the Touareg TDI. The VW is still the better vehicle for winding mountain roads. Not to mention the extra two hours to travel about 60 more miles. If I can hit I15 during decent traffic it is the best route. My Sunday afternoon drive from San Diego to Pahrump was 5 hours flat, 336 miles and one potty stop.

    This is for Andres3: I went to the DMV in Pahrump on Monday morning to change my drivers license and get the new GMC Canyon licensed. Their system is still slow. I was 15th in line when it opened at 8 AM. I was out of there at 9:30 with my new license and plateS. I asked about the front plate. She said if there is no place for it, then it was not required. Their license fees are NOT cheap. $625 for the new PU truck. It is rated over 6001 lbs.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    I'm sure the USPO forwarding system will reach you?
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    ruking1 said:

    I'm sure the USPO forwarding system will reach you?

    We are still getting mail in San Diego. They are holding for us in Pahrump. Picked up a pile on Monday. I won't forward until we sell this place in CA.

    Just a note on the VW Touareg. It is parked in the garage in NV. It has not been driven for 3 weeks. I left it locked up and got concerned about a dead battery. Can you open electric doors with a dead battery? So I did leave them unlocked. It started fine after 3 weeks sitting. Our 2007 Sequoia would go dead battery after 2 weeks in the garage. Not only that the Toyota factory battery was shot right at 3 years. The VW is over 4 years old and the battery seems as strong as day one. Engine popped to life like I had just turned it off. I will miss the Touareg if VW does not fix and has to do the buyback.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    ruking1 said:

    Slow diesel news day! Just came home to a $1,500 Bosch Settlement check! I'm guessing it's for the earlier 2.0 VW TDI filing. We just got to love depositing the check by internet & phone! I can't wait for the 2nd check to arrive ! (3.0L )

    My 2.0 litre settlement from Bosch was just $3XX. I'd guess the $1500 is for a different vehicle.

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  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    gagrice said:

    ruking1 said:

    I'm sure the USPO forwarding system will reach you?

    We are still getting mail in San Diego. They are holding for us in Pahrump. Picked up a pile on Monday. I won't forward until we sell this place in CA.

    Just a note on the VW Touareg. It is parked in the garage in NV. It has not been driven for 3 weeks. I left it locked up and got concerned about a dead battery. Can you open electric doors with a dead battery? So I did leave them unlocked. It started fine after 3 weeks sitting. Our 2007 Sequoia would go dead battery after 2 weeks in the garage. Not only that the Toyota factory battery was shot right at 3 years. The VW is over 4 years old and the battery seems as strong as day one. Engine popped to life like I had just turned it off. I will miss the Touareg if VW does not fix and has to do the buyback.
    While I've been using semi scheduled trickle charge cycles on all my batteries (cars), "A" particular battery will give up the ghost at whatever it's internal time & logic. That being said, I have found the (5 yrs old) 2012 VW Touareg TDI battery to be very robust. I've had ZERO issues, just like you seem to! So yes, I'm of the understanding the doors can be functioned both with a dead battery, & as I recall with a pass key in each of its two remotes.

    To answer the host's posting, I've read in more than one article & more importantly VW settlement agreements, that Bosch was supposed to pony up $ 1,500 per affected eligible unit. But you are right, I'm now waiting to see, if it will be $500 or $1,500.
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,724
    edited September 2017
    gagrice said:

    ruking1 said:

    I'm sure the USPO forwarding system will reach you?

    We are still getting mail in San Diego. They are holding for us in Pahrump. Picked up a pile on Monday. I won't forward until we sell this place in CA.

    Just a note on the VW Touareg. It is parked in the garage in NV. It has not been driven for 3 weeks. I left it locked up and got concerned about a dead battery. Can you open electric doors with a dead battery? So I did leave them unlocked. It started fine after 3 weeks sitting. Our 2007 Sequoia would go dead battery after 2 weeks in the garage. Not only that the Toyota factory battery was shot right at 3 years. The VW is over 4 years old and the battery seems as strong as day one. Engine popped to life like I had just turned it off. I will miss the Touareg if VW does not fix and has to do the buyback.
    We got stuck in the Sportwagen TDI before the buyback because the Key remote battery died (with plenty of advance warning that my wife ignored for far too long!!!! :angry: )

    I had to call VW roadside assistance, not very helpful other than queuing a tow truck. I called a VW dealer to talk to a knowledgeable service or sales guy, and that was helpful, led me through the following steps:

    1) You can easily pop off a plastic trim piece that pretends to be a door handle, and like magic, a keyhole cylinder appears! Doors open-able at that point.

    2) You have to put the key FOB near (like within an inch or two) of where you'd normally put in an ignition key (but since all VW's are pretty much push-button start), this wasn't intuitive or known to me without being told.

    3) With the FOB adjacent to the steering column sensor, the car recognizes it, and only then can you use push-button to start the vehicle.

    4) Was happy VW engineers thought about the CONS of modern technology! Thought we might be screwed by the fact no one uses a real key anymore.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • xwesxxwesx Member Posts: 16,747
    edited September 2017
    Nice to hear that it went a solid three weeks without issue, Gary! As I recall, diesels use deep cycle batteries which tend to be able to deal with longer periods of slow draw than the starting batteries gasoline vehicles use. I can leave my 1969 C20 sitting for months without any battery issues, but anything longer than about two weeks with my Subarus and they will not start.

    I did manage to drain my Passat's battery a few times, but it was due to the starting issues I had last winter (cold weather), not the long sits. As with yours, it fired right up like I had just used it the day before (when the fuel was flowing!).
    2018 Subaru Crosstrek, 2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2013 Subaru Forester, 1969 Chevrolet C20, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    I'm a believer in trickle chargers! ( non diesel related topic)

    The 2001 Corvette Z06 is tethered to a Battery Tender Plus (brand) & ithe Z06 doesn't even stutter start. One try, drive off immediately if not sooner.

    There are obviously TMI's!

    One TMI on VW deep cycle DIESEL batteries is that VW engineering has transfer a lot of functioning to the electrical systems, for fuel saving purposes. The electrical systems are NOT designed to FULLY recharge the battery: to 100% for example.

    (Off topic the battery tender plus gives blinking lamp (circuit) indication of the battery's charge, i.e below 80%, @ 80 %, @ 100%.)
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,072
    I haven't parked this diesel or the prior one for more than 12 days or so without being started. In both cases, no issues. It will sit for about 20 days in November, I am not worried.

    The fintail, which has a large battery and little to draw it down while parked, fires right up on the first turn even when parked for 5-6 weeks. I suspect a lot of modern cars, with small batteries and systems constantly running, can't pull that off.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    http://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/global-warming-who-are-the-deniers-now/?ref=yfp

    Global Warming's core arguments, which have never been true, & never proven are being gutted by....science! In fact the "change" to Global "Climate change" was much more than a pivot! It's hard to have not noticed winter, spring, summer & fall since the ice age @ least 10,000 years ago! It's just the REAL deniers are in FACT & in fact in denial!

    Now, I believe in freedom of religion! However, when it's wrapped in "settled" pseudo science to begin with, & passed around the world like communal pork cutlet bits in everything, I take extreme umbrage!
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    ruking1 said:

    http://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/global-warming-who-are-the-deniers-now/?ref=yfp

    Global Warming's core arguments, which have never been true, & never proven are being gutted by....science! In fact the "change" to Global "Climate change" was much more than a pivot! It's hard to have not noticed winter, spring, summer & fall since the ice age @ least 10,000 years ago! It's just the REAL deniers are in FACT & in fact in denial!

    Now, I believe in freedom of religion! However, when it's wrapped in "settled" pseudo science to begin with, & passed around the world like communal pork cutlet bits in everything, I take extreme umbrage!

    Just read an article where ESPN and the NFL is blaming the weather for lack of viewers. :D
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Will the shortage of humanely mined Cobalt breathe new life into diesel for the next few years?

    “There’s a section on sustainability... asking what processes are in place to make sure the cobalt does not come from child labour in the DRC,” one said.

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-volkswagen-cobalt-evs-exclusive/exclusive-vw-moves-to-secure-cobalt-supplies-in-shift-to-electric-cars-idUSKCN1BX1RE

    http://www.dw.com/en/child-labor-still-rife-in-democratic-republic-of-congo/a-39194724
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    For me anything but around town driving DIESEL is the answer. Just filled the GMC Canyon after my return from Nevada. Even with about 30% of the trip driving 75 MPH + it calculated out at 27.84 MPG. That included climbing up out of Palm Desert on SR 74 to Anza and on up to Julian before heading downhill toward home. Even on the trip to Nevada fully loaded with tools and boxes, driving most of the way at 75+ MPH I averaged 26.55 MPG. That included about 150 miles of city driving. And it only has 1700 miles on it. I don't think it will be difficult to squeeze 30+ MPG out of what would have been a full sized PU 10 years ago. Name any gas powered vehicle that gets even close to that mileage, and capable of towing 7700 lb trailer.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    Any alternative STILL does NOT match/beat the around town mpg issue as cost effectively as diesel ! (Based on 15,000 miles per yr.)

    Indeed, TESLA has seen fit to discontinue their cheapest EV (model, X). Anyway it is sliced, EV (pmd: fuel) is FAR more costly. Government subsidies at all levels have to be even FAR better than they already ARE to get at least me to switch to EV.

    So in fact by the % of (your) mileage, diesel remains the best cost-effective around town mpg & cost effective solution already "in the quiver". Whom in their right, even wasteful minds would buy a $45.000 to $140,000 EV to do a portion (whatever #/%) of those miles/mileage! ??

    In contrast your 27 mpg would suck up 577 gals of ULSD?

    It's no real secret that I considered the 2003/2004 Toyota Prius, which certainly at the time would have easily taken care of the around TOWN miles, albeit (even then) FAR more costly (pmd:fuel) miles. In almost 2 decades that has not changed.

    So faster forward, the 2003 VW Jetta TDI ( should have had 511,000 + miles ) has a leisurely 186,000 miles.(13,300 miles per yr average) As it turns out, the 2004 Honda Civic (225,000 miles) was bought since the primary commuters did not want to drive stick shifts. This was to be followed by the 2009 VW Jetta TDI (120,000 miles) The 2003 and 2004 VW A/T's were to be avoided (like the plague). So faster forward to 2017 Las Vegas, Nevada, the 2003 VW Jetta TDI is for @ least 3/4 mos being used for commute purposes. Now she's driven 1996 TLC, 2003 VW Jetta TDI, 2004 Honda Civic, 2009 VW Jetta TDI, 2012 VW Toareg, MB GLK 250 BT, etc. So she's developed a perspective ON diesels.

    Ever slow Las Vegas diesel news day! . My daughter won $900 shawdowing her friends crap table bets!! She also was thrown a few chips for having a 20 min ROLL! For those that are not acquainted, the house does everything to break up a 20 min uninterrupted roll. I think it may have paid for parking the diesel @ the casino. :)
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    Not to mention the $45,000 Tesla battery replacement after 8-10 years. Not even a chance I would consider any EV with the price of electricity in CA from the utility or buying solar panels. Hard to charge at night on solar. And the CA utilities have gotten very stingy with Net Metering.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    I can only surmise the environmentalists yell the talk, but do NOT walk the walk!!?? I truly do not understand how anybody would believe that the electrical costs will/could get CHEAPER ! ? I routinely cruise/go/meet into such high tech areas, such as Palo Alto, CA. Not many wind or solar, etc installations.
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    ruking1 said:

    I can only surmise the environmentalists yell the talk, but do NOT walk the walk!!?? I truly do not understand how anybody would believe that the electrical costs will/could get CHEAPER ! ? I routinely cruise/go/meet into such high tech areas, such as Palo Alto, CA. Not many wind or solar, etc installations.

    I would say 2/3rds of my neighbors have solar. Most are in their 70s and hope they will pay for themselves over their 20 year life cycle. Think about it.
  • ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    edited September 2017
    Well yes! It only encourages home ownership to go down!? A solar system will probably need expensive rehabilitation or R/R near or @ the end of its life cycle.

    It also can drive already unaffordable rents higher! How many renters would demand their rents be higher, so landlords could install solar panels & those devices to meter solar panel renters usage? To write that here realily sounds absurd! ?

    In S F. CA, some rental units owners are being forced to seismically upgrade with absurdly low to no renters contributions. Up to 9% loans can be gotten through the government seismic "improvement" programs to get seismic upgrades. Seismic upgrades have zero (earthquake resistant) guarantees!
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,724
    ruking1 said:

    Well yes! It only encourages home ownership to go down!? A solar system will probably need expensive rehabilitation or R/R near or @ the end of its life cycle.

    It also can drive already unaffordable rents higher! How many renters would demand their rents be higher, so landlords could install solar panels & those devices to meter solar panel renters usage? To write that here realily sounds absurd! ?

    In S F. CA, some rental units owners are being forced to seismically upgrade with absurdly low to no renters contributions. Up to 9% loans can be gotten through the government seismic "improvement" programs to get seismic upgrades. Seismic upgrades have zero (earthquake resistant) guarantees!

    Remember Haiti after their earthquake? Seismic engineering works, but nothing is fail-proof.
    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
This discussion has been closed.