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The Rebirth of Buick.........

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  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 22,051
    Holman Lincoln/Mercury near me still keeps a few new GMs in stock and always has a quite a few late model used GM and TCs. I don't care what anyone says they are really great cars. .

    A used car lot local to me had a 2007 Grand Marquis on their lot about a year ago. It only had around 10,000 miles on it, IIRC, and I think they only wanted $12-13K. It was just a GS model, but for the price seemed like a steal. I briefly thought about buying it. Heck, if I really needed a car at the time, I probably would have!
  • tjc78tjc78 JerseyPosts: 5,025
    It was just a GS model

    Now they don't even offer the GS its only the LS and a scant few options. Same thing on the Town Car they pretty much only come one way now, loaded.

    1999 Chevy S10 / 2004 Merc Grand Marquis / 2012 Buick LaCrosse

  • kernickkernick Posts: 4,072
    say a lot about the excitement of the Rebirth of Buick; you have Lemko of course drooling for anything with a Buick badge, and the rest of the group - who are either reminiscing of the 60's, or talking about a 2 year old obsolete Mercury! :D
  • Glad I found this thread.

    What are the thoughts about a new Buick compact sedan slotting below the 2011 Regal? From what I understand it will be similar in size to the 2011 Chevy Cruze.

    Do you think a compact Buick will sell? GM is betting it will and Motor Trend said this month that GM thinks the compact sedan will be the vehicle of choice for future U.S. car buyers.

    Thoughts?
  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,196
    As a Chevrolet - yes. As a Buick - no.
  • cooterbfdcooterbfd Posts: 2,770
    ".....Maybe it's because they don't offer anything with a 5 or 6-speed MT. "

    Wait a few more months (I think I'm gonna wish I did); rumor has it the 2010 Regal may have a GS model w/ the 3.6 and a 6 sp Manual.
  • cooterbfdcooterbfd Posts: 2,770
    ".....Do you think a compact Buick will sell? GM is betting it will and Motor Trend said this month that GM thinks the compact sedan will be the vehicle of choice for future U.S. car buyers. "

    Gosh, I dunno. But there was a post on Autoblog while back about that car being built along side the Cruze, and---get this---EXPORTED to China.
  • berriberri Posts: 4,234
    Well, since the Yuan is artifically tied to the Dollar and shipping is a wash in either direction, if the Lordstown plant (or wherever they build it) is fairly automated the higher volume of the Chevy Cruze may make this a good decision.
  • I'll have to drive a 2011 Cruze first - before passing judgment on the potential success of the new 2012 mini-Buick.

    I am surprised Buick is going that small with a new sedan but it may turn out to be a good move if GM is even around in 2012.

    The 2011 Regal seems like a no-brainer and that is a car I'd be very interested in purchasing.... ;)
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,693
    Now THAT'S serious talk from Buick! I wonder if that will really come to pass.

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • berriberri Posts: 4,234
    If Buick keeps the quality up and prices aggressively, I thnk the upcoming Regal has the potential to be a big seller like the old Cutlass. However, Buick seems to be pricing a bit higher in scale which could hurt Regal vice Camry, et. al. I guess we'll see in another year or so. Unfortunately, the new Malibu hype seems to have vanished which may be a bad sign for these new Buicks.
  • cooterbfdcooterbfd Posts: 2,770
    Well, originally, there was talk about the car being built in China for export here. I think Fritz wanted up to 150,000 cars to import from China here, but that overall NA production would be more here, and the UAW howled like a banshee. Next thing I read is that GM relented, and that the "baby Buick" would be built here and shipped there. I see that and think :surprise: wow!!! It could still wind up here as well. Then you here that the WTO is pressuring China to be fairer w/ imports into their country. All this sounds good for the US and GM, as they have made great inroads into China. Maybe this is the silver lining in the cloud for the US trade imbalance w/ China.
  • hpmctorquehpmctorque Posts: 4,228
    I wouldn't take issue with your conclusion about the U.S. trade imbalance with China. Regarding the U.S. balance of payments overall, however, the dollar's weakness is probably the biggest factor in our recent balance of payments improvement. Therefore, one could say that the silver lining in the weak dollar is that it helps our balance of payments.

    A stronger dollar would be beneficial from some important aspects, however. One of these is that a strong dollar reduces the risk of inflation, although inflation doesn't seem to be an immediate problem. Inflation is likely to become a problem, however, if the economic recovery strengthens and unemployment is reduced. It could also become a problem without these positives, if the decline in the dollar's value should accelerate.
  • grbeckgrbeck Posts: 2,361
    ...about the new Regal. If Buick is supposed to be a premium brand, then replacing the Lucerne with a more modern car should be the top priority. The LaCrosse should be the cheapest Buick.

    Let Chevrolet handle the market for smaller cars. That is why Alfred P. Sloan wanted all of those brands in the first place. The market isn't crying out for a cheaper Buick. And if Buicks are supposed to be premium motor cars, then not everyone should be able to afford one. I guess we are back to "every division offering a full line of cars." So the new GM isn't that much different from the old one.
  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,196
    I couldn't agree more! I would most definitely be in the market for a larger substantial upscale Buick. Buick should be taking aim at the Lexus LS! Call the Lucerne replacement a Park Avenue! The concept of a smaller, cheaper Buick has led to abominations like the Skyhawk.
  • tjc78tjc78 JerseyPosts: 5,025
    should be taking aim at the Lexus LS!

    Couldn't the platform the G8 is on serve as the Buick flagship? Its a nice roomy car, with a big V8 and RWD. Seems to me that it could be done. I guess GM doesn't feel they have the market for it.

    1999 Chevy S10 / 2004 Merc Grand Marquis / 2012 Buick LaCrosse

  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,196
    GM feels they don't have the market for it?!?!? I'M STANDING RIGHT HERE WAVING A BIG WAD OF CASH!!!
  • bumpybumpy Posts: 4,435
    image

    Here you go. You planning on buying all 25,000 per annum for the next five years?
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 41,276
    Your image is broken for us Bumpy (me, anyway). Can cut and paste it but the site isn't letting their images get posted elsewhere I guess.

    Moderator
    Minivan fan. Feel free to message or email me - stever@edmunds.com.

  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,693
    But can this really be a good thing for the "new GM"? Building cars here (higher-priced goods and labor) and exporting them to the Chinese market (lower-priced goods and labor)? That sounds like a formula for failure in the long run.

    Really, it makes much more sense for GM to take the trend it started (with the GM-DAT purchase and 10 years of production relocations to Mexico) to its logical conclusion and start building all Buicks in China for export to the U.S. Not the other way around.

    They could even go so far as to make it a China-only brand during periods when the dollar is too weak to make importing Chinese Buicks profitable.

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 18,371
    Here's bumpy's picture from a post a couple back.

    Nice Buick!!!

    image
  • cooterbfdcooterbfd Posts: 2,770
    "......Really, it makes much more sense for GM to take the trend it started (with the GM-DAT purchase and 10 years of production relocations to Mexico) to its logical conclusion and start building all Buicks in China for export to the U.S. Not the other way around."

    Well, a couple theories here. If (IF!!!) GM intends to keep Buick here and market it as entry level premium, could importing them give them a bap rap, as people in the US perceive that Chinese made goods are of a lower quality and lack the control of harmful chemicals (ie; lead paint in toys)?? Many people laughed a couple years ago at the thought of Buick being perceived as high quality luxury in China, but as we have come to learn, it's no joke. Perception IS reality, whether it's true or not.

    Another loose theory. Could part of Hyundai's sucess in the past 12-18 months be due to the fact that people who could normally afford the $20,000 or so Camry or Malibu are now opting for a $16,000 Sonata in order to cut back some, yet still get that new car??? If so, could part of the reason that the new LaCrosse is flying out of the showroom (outside of it being a new model) be that a comparably equipped model is several thousand dollars cheaper than a Lexus or Acura, thus allowing people to buy new (and American), yet still cut back the payment somewhat??

    Also, I'd assume it costs very little to ship to China these days. Think of all those EMPTY cargo ships heading back to China. I'll bet the shipping companies would like to start sailing full both ways ;)
  • srs_49srs_49 Posts: 1,394
    Call the Lucerne replacement a Park Avenue!

    And there goes the image Buick is so carefully trying to craft ;) . Here's what i think of when a Buick Park Avenue is mentioned:
    1. Big
    2. Bloated
    3. Living room on wheels
    4. Zero road feel
    5. The kind of car my 85 year old FIL might consider

    If Buick is really serious about reinventing itself, it needs to stay away from many (maybe not all) of the names from the past.
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 22,051
    Nice Buick!!!

    Good looking car, from the front at least. It's enough to make me consider going over-budget the next time I buy a car! And even now, every once in awhile I throw around the idea of trying to find a nice used/leftover new Pontiac G8.
  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,196
    I'm starting to see quite a few G8s around here. There must be a lot of people who feel the same way. I think the G8 is the nicest looking Pontiac in a long time.
  • ingvaringvar Posts: 205
    It looks good and it drives good for it's price.
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,693
    If Buick is really serious about reinventing itself, it needs to stay away from many (maybe not all) of the names from the past.

    I will second that, and will add that naming a new Buick a Regal is a bad idea. They should just come up with something new and luxurious-sounding.

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 22,051
    An all-new name probably would be for the best, but if they're going to dredge up an old name, "Regal" probably has the least baggage associated with it. My only real issue with it is that the first thing the name "Regal" conjures up is a nicely appointed, upscale coupe. However, a sedan was offered along with the coupe for most of the Regal's lifespan. The name was first used in 1975, and a sedan was offered in 1975-77, 1982-84, and 1990-2005 or whenever they quit making the Regal. In contrast, the coupe was offered consistently from 1975-96.

    And as of a few years back, when it was still in production, the Regal was the most "youthful" Buick sedan, with an average buyer age of around 57. While that might sound ancient, for that class of car it's really not, when you consider that teens and twenty-somethings, for the most part, don't shop for mid- or full-sized cars. I think the average buyer age for the Intrepid was around 45, and that was probably about as youthful as a mid/full-sized car got!

    However, while the Regal's average buyer age was around 57, the LeSabre was more like 67, and the Century and Park Ave were around 70!

    I always liked the name "Electra", but to me that's better suited for a bigger flagship car. Maybe that would be a good replacement name for the Lucerne? I can see how a name like "Park Ave" can come off as old and stuffy, but "Electra" conjures up images of something smooth, sleek, and voluptuous...even if the old Buick Electras didn't always fit that description!
  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,196
    ...when you consider that teens and twenty-somethings, for the most part, don't shop for mid- or full-sized cars.

    There are exceptions! ;)

    How about Invicta? It was a short-lived but pretty cool Buick name.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 18,371
    I don't believe there's anything wrong with the "Park Avenue" as a name. It will depend on the demogrpaphics to whom you are directing the car. As andre1969 points out, not many single kids in their twenties are shopping for a full size sedan with ability to carry people and luggage in comfort, so aiming the naming at them is a waste of money.

    I would like to see a leSabre replacement. I don't need a Park Avenue and that eventually cooled me on the Lucerne. The lower price end was not as fully equipped as the higher-priced models.

    As for "Park Avenue" meaning no road feel, sofa, etc., as an earlier poster posits, they haven't spent much time in a recent Park Avenue. You can have full comfort for a 7 hour trip with one stop and arrive without feeling like you've been beaten up by tar strips, sunken pavement pieces on the interstate, etc.

    It looks to me as if the new LaCrosse has combined quality features into a slightly smaller and well-equipped package. I'm afraid to go test drive one.
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