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Ford Fusion/Mercury Milan Hybrid

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Comments

  • wvgasguywvgasguy Posts: 1,405
    What is a FFE? Simply a typo
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,669
    Ok - I thought I saw it more than once so I wasn't sure.
  • Update

    The new ETA for the first FFH at the local ford dealer is now 3/2/09. Which sounds more reasonable than 2/16th, but I'll believe it when I get to test drive it.
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 9,618
    my focus was PZEV and had the same warranty.
  • bigtbigt Posts: 412
    How does the HB Milan get rated 36-38 mpg on the highway where as a regular Milan does not? They must calculate it differently.
  • texasestexases Posts: 5,534
    The HB uses an Atkinson cycle in its I4 engine, which gives it better highway mileage than the regular Milan's I4. The Atkinson cycle has less power at low speed, but that's where the battery power kicks in.

    (Not 'Atkins', unless it's on a diet! Oops)
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,669
    The engine uses the Atkinson cycle, plus the battery assist, electric steering, and all of the other things that are different in the Hybrid.
  • zrobl1zrobl1 Posts: 1
    Okay, I want to help stimulate the economy, at the same time help out our auto industry, and oh by the way save money in the process.

    My answer if I buy a Ford Fusion Hybrid I get it all. First I help the only one of the big three not asking me to give them my tax dollars. Second I do my small bit for the environment. Third I get the most economical hybrid available (MSRP $19,270) at 41 MPG. Fourth I get a tax credit on the sales Tax (around $1400). Fifth and finally If I buy by 31 March 2009, I get a $3400 Hybrid car Credit.

    Here’s the problem, you just can’t do it. The car is not available, dealers won’t even give you an estimate on when it will be. What they do say is forget about 31 March.

    Okay so lets try another one, love the look of the Mazda Tribute Hybrid. Sorry only available in California.

    How about the Ford Escape it hits the mark although a lot more expensive (MSRP $39,000 mileage Mpg 25). After a lengthy search I actually find one near Charlotte…where I can pick it up for $54,000.

    Hmmm guess it isn’t going to happen. Frankly I would really like it to be a Ford or if not a company where Ford holds a 40% stake. The other two big three took the government handout and still may fail.
    Well where do I go now?
    http://www.fordvehicles.com/features/news/detail/index.asp?id=1714

    How's this for false advertising, spent 30 minutes on line with Ford marketing the confirmed NO WAY to get the $3400 Tax Credit...the vehicle is not available untill June (maybe)
  • lessachslessachs Posts: 44
    I switch from a Prius to the Camry H. Totally agree with coldcranker. Prius gets the chatter but as a family car the TCH is a better choice. :)
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,898
    You might want to make a trip to San Diego. Our dealers seem to have over 100 Escape hybrids in stock. The big problem is not one of them is an AWD. So if that is on your list you may be out of luck here. I used the Edmund's inventory feature which the one time I checked it with the dealer was accurate.
  • daninoahdaninoah Posts: 45
    If you order the FFH by 3/31, you qualify for the full $3400 tax credit. That is official news from Ford, not from some blog. I ordered mine last week. The vehicle is estimated to arrive no later than end of April, maybe sooner. I should have a VIN by next week.

    Ford is advertising this vehicle heavy right now. It will be in showrooms by next week.
    As for the FEH, there are plenty available. If you don't have them in your area, just order it from a dealership in California. You will get it at invoice (or less) plus about $500 to ship the vehicle to your doorstep. I did the same thing several years ago when I was getting a raw deal on an Odyssey mini van locally. I bought it for $2500 less from a Honda dealer in Ohio. We still have the vehicle in our garage.
  • acdiiacdii Posts: 753
    Well Damn, now that I dont need a new car, grrr. BTW, AWD is for sissies, real drivers can get by with one wheel drive! ;) :P :shades:
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,669
    As previously stated, it appears as long as your order is accepted and verified by Ford before 3/31 you get the tax credit.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,898
    I should have mentioned. If you buy from a CA dealer you have to take possession out of the State to avoid CA sales tax. No exceptions that I know of.
  • pableaupableau Posts: 6
    :confuse: Daninoah & akirby,

    My local CA Ford dealer said I had to take delivery of the FFH by Mar. 31 to get the full tax credit, not just place my order by then.

    Have you both confirmed this with your dealers?

    zrobl1's post #369 above says:
    "How's this for false advertising, spent 30 minutes on line with Ford marketing the confirmed NO WAY to get the $3400 Tax Credit...the vehicle is not available untill June (maybe)"
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,669
    I don't have a dealer (not buying). I'm just going by what several others have reported plus the reports of Ford verifying retail orders before 3/31 and the IRS language around the tax credit that has an example of a buyer "buying" a vehicle in August but not actually taking delivery until January. You get the tax credit as of August but you can't claim it until the following year's tax return. I can't think of any other scenario where you would "buy" a vehicle but wait several months to take delivery except for a factory order. Of course this could be different in CA and the interpretation could be wrong, but it does make sense.
  • daninoahdaninoah Posts: 45
    Pableau,

    Ford is saying that an order placed for the vehicle by 3/31 qualifies for the credit so long as that same vehicle is purchased. Here is the exact language from the Ford Motor Regional manager in a memo to his dealers (my salesman sent me a copy):

    "Tax Credit Update
    Since Ford Motor Company reached the 60,000 vehicle threshold in the 4th Quarter of 2008, under current federal law the tax credit amounts are reduced by 50% beginning April 1, 2009 and by an additional 25% beginning October 1, 2009.  No tax credit amount is available for hybrids after March 31, 2010. Customers who order or purchase any Hybrids by 3/31/09 will remain eligible for the full tax credit amounts. (This applies to Retail Orders of Fusion/Milan Hybrid.)"

    The way I see it, they are guaranteeing eligibility for the credit (so long as the taxpayer's status allows the credit -- i.e. AMT, total income etc). Check with your dealer again. Ford also put out a press release a couple of weeks ago claiming the same thing.
  • acdiiacdii Posts: 753
    If the government really wants to push the sales of Hybrids, then they should make the tax credit permanent, no cut off date. What gets me is all the hype about save the planet, global warming, blah blah blah, yet with hybrids, which are there to help fight the aforementioned stuff, there are rarely any incentives to purchase, rarely ever low financing, and if lucky get one for MSRP.

    And don't get me started about electric plugins!!
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,669
    If the government really wants to push the sales of Hybrids, then they should make the tax credit permanent, no cut off date.

    That wasn't the purpose of the tax credit. The purpose was to encourage more manufacturers to start building hybrids. This means Hyundai could start building hybrids and have an immediate $3400 cost advantage over Toyota and Ford. Consumer demand is already there and the hybrid costs are now reasonable, so there is no need for additional consumer incentives. I'd argue that there is no need for any further mfr enticements, either.
  • texasestexases Posts: 5,534
    While Ford may be sure the tax credits works this way, isn't it up to the IRS? I'd feel better if Ford was quoting the IRS.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,669
    The IRS isn't going to elaborate any more than they already have. The key to me is the example the IRS gives where you "purchase" the vehicle in September 2009 but you don't take delivery until January 2010. You still get the tax credit that was in effect as of September 2009 but you can't submit the claim until you file your 2010 tax return in 2011.

    There is no other possible scenario I can think of where you "purchase" a vehicle one month but don't take delivery until several months later.
  • texasestexases Posts: 5,534
    OK, your IRS example is good enough for me.
  • wvgasguywvgasguy Posts: 1,405
    After a lengthy search I actually find one near Charlotte…where I can pick it up for $54,000.

    Seriously :confuse: Why would anyone pay $54K for an Escape Hybrid?????
  • wvgasguywvgasguy Posts: 1,405
    If you can't get one in time for the tax credit you might want to wait until the rush is over. Currently Fitzmall has the TCH selling for about $4K off MSRP. You might like the Ford, but if you pay over MSRP and lose the credit, it might not be such a deal. In a year or two when the market is normal with supply and demand they will discount them.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,898
    This means Hyundai could start building hybrids and have an immediate $3400 cost advantage over Toyota and Ford

    The car would have to be as efficient as the Fusion Hybrid in comparison to the non hybrid version. This is the first time the IRS has offered $3400 tax credit in this program. That is the maximum amount. The Prius was $3150 and the Camry Hybrid was only $2600. So Ford did a good job on their FFH to get the maximum credit. Too bad most people will not get that much.

    Also remember if you are so unfortunate to be hit with AMT on your Federal Taxes, you will not be allowed any tax credits.

    The only car I know of with a better tax credit is the Honda GX CNG car that has a $4000 tax credit. Not part of the same program as the diesel & hybrid incentives.
  • acdiiacdii Posts: 753
    If the government really wants to push the sales of Hybrids, then they should make the tax credit permanent, no cut off date.

    That wasn't the purpose of the tax credit.


    You kinda missed the whole point I was making there. With the push for more people to go green by legislatures, IE Cap and Trade, you would think they would have more incentives to purchase a hybrid over a standard car, and one way would be tax credits. So far their stimulus bill doesn't have much at all in it that will stimulate me to buy anything. Economy is money, when people have it, they spend it, when they don't have it, nothing is purchased, so there are no orders for more goods, without those orders, people don't have jobs. Seems simple enough, yet our glorious leaders are constantly missing that whole point. Their bailouts are doing nothing more than crippling the system by letting the bad linger, its like treating a fever with an ice cube, feels good for a little while, but the fever is still there. If there are cars out there that not only save money by using less gas, but can also give you a bigger refund at the end of the year, don't you think more people would be buying? The same should go for cars that get 35+ MPG, a small tax credit for those, and maybe for diesel powered ones. Not only would it help sales, but there would be more fuel efficient cars on the road that way as well. It would spur manufacturers to build more fuel efficient cars then on lines that currently make gas guzzlers. Put the money towards those who would spend it on goods, not piss it away on parties and airplanes.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,669
    I don't see why we need to use tax money to help people buy cars - period. I was just pointing out the current tax credits were never intended to do that in the first place, and I don't think using them for that is a good move. I don't think it's the purchase price of the vehicle that is the problem and I don't think throwing a few thousand on the hood will help sales at all - it will just make it cheaper for those who already decided to purchase. It might sway a buyer from one make or model to another but it simply won't generate more sales.

    I understand the desire to have more fuel efficient cars but that will only happen if consumers want them and that can't be legislated.
  • bigtbigt Posts: 412
    A eagar dealer in Maryland told me that they are going to have the Milan HB in a few weeks and wanted to get from a date when I want to come in and test drive it.

    Is this real?
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,898
    I agree, that most of the tax credits are a waste of tax dollars. Most ended up in the dealers pocket as premiums added to the Prius that ate up the tax credit. Without the tax credit on the Prius they are stacking up on the lots like all the other vehicles.
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    gary says, "Without the tax credit on the Prius they are stacking up on the lots like all the other vehicles."

    Your part about "without the tax credit the Prius are not selling" is COMPLETELY FALSE.

    We had that conversation the month or two after the tax credit stopped on the Prius and the sales did not "tank" in that period.

    THE FAILED ECONOMY combined with NO KIND OF CARS SELLING combined with LOWER GAS PRICES are the reasons that hybrids are not selling.

    It has NOTHING to do AT ALL with the end of the Toyota tax credits.
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