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Chevrolet/Geo Metro

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  • 91m4l91m4l Posts: 3
    I didn't set the timing cause of the lack of tools but i did moved the distributor around advancing and retarding but the knock keeps on trukin and moves me into motioning for a rebuild. Today i went to a junkyard in search of the vacum advancer since its needed anyways and saw this manual 1991 metro vertible with the entire fornt end still intact minus a few relays, t-stat housing, damage from a frontside collision; everything in the bay looks good in condition. The junkyard will be holdin a 50%off day the week of Thanksgiving. Pray with me that the 1991 vertible is still there. The odometer reads 134k. If its still there i will be taking the instrument cluster(maybe), the wiring harness from the front half f the car( not sure if it matters when converting auto to manual) and other items that might be necessary. When and if the cnversion goes through ill be up the the MPG Crew and will also have a fancy Shift Light flashing at me which means my baby tells me its time to move it on up!

    91M4L
  • I want to thank zaken1 for the very timely and informotive tips.I really enjoy this forum due to the fact I have two metros. A 1990 automatic 4dr/hchbk and a1993 2dr/hchbk. I drive 110 miles to and from work so these little jewels are worth their weight in gold to me. Unfortunately my 1990 broke down right across the freeway where 3 days earlier I was rearended by an s10 pickup.Fortunately no one was hurt, but I got to feel the sensation a jet pilot goes through when engangeing his aft
    erburners,,,that s10 gave me a shove.
    The 93 5-speed has a rebuilt title and is considered total loss by the insurance co. It gets consistantly 48mpg.Three years ago I put in a japenese crate moter for which I paid 300 dollars.The motor had sat quit a while in a wherehouse because the lifters clacked away for a long time,,but eventually got quite and smoothed out,, que bella.
    In regard to the 90 4dr auto not starting,,the car is in the parking lot where Im employed.I work a nightshift so I can work on it a little before work begins.Because of the lighting or old age I didnt notice the timing belt wearing through the plastic cover,,,in essence the crankshaft pulleybolt was working its way out! Hopefully this week I can put it back together and get it running.I will let you all know.
    This 90 was my pet project,,I liked this car,, it is roomy and has a/c. It is a 3 cyl. and because its an automatic gets approx. 10 mpg.less than a 5 speed.One month earlier I replaced the piston rings,the rebuilt head I purchased from e-bay, I did lap and put in brand new valves for less than $50,New oil pump,water pump. All items purchased from Bruce Roller with Partsdinosaur from Arizona,,good people.
    Three weeks ago I took the 90 automatic metro to break in the rings and bearings on a worthwhile trip consisting of around 800 miles. I took my "GO BAG" for overnight accommidations.It was a great trip,,but the seats need some work. My back was sore the next day.It was a momentous trip which I will always remember.
    The American countryside is beautifull and I drove it in my Geo,,,Life is good!!!
    Luke
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    It is fulfilling to me when someone becomes empowered by what I write!! Thanks for the kind words.

    I have a 1990 2 door hatchback, with a 5 speed. I bought it in 1992, with 58,000 one owner miles on it. The previous owner never put anything but Castrol in it. He broke it in on GTX, and then began using their 5W-50 Syntec at about 10,000 miles. He also installed a huge Amsoil bypass oil filter. Since I'm a fanatic about using only one brand of oil, I've stayed with the Syntec, and have kept on using the super fine Amsoil filter. I also add 3 ounces of Tufoil when I change oil (every 7,500 miles, due to the type of oil and the superior filtration). My Metro now has 270,000 miles on it, and never has even had the head off. It now runs better than it did when I bought it, still uses almost no oil, and recently broke it's own gas mileage record (by getting over 57mpg on a 300 mile freeway run). The only work it has ever needed was a timing cover oil seal, a wheel bearing, an alternator, and a water pump. The water pump ran almost 270,000 miles, before the seal finally started leaking about 2 months ago. The car still has the original clutch, original CV joints, and the original struts, But the CV joints will have to be changed soon.

    I think the Metro is an absolutely fantastic car. People who've driven it are amazed at how much power it has (yes, I've done some fiddling with the tuning). So I intend to keep this car for the rest of my driving life. And I've learned to live with the tire howl, which always seems to reappear after a set of tires gets a few miles on them. But since It gets better mileage than my friend's brand new Prius, I really can't complain.

    Suzuki outdid themselves when they built this car. Maybe that's why they decided to stop making them. But I did modify their design in one important way: I replaced the driver's seat with one from a Camry.

    I hope you keep yours going forever!

    Joel
  • Hi there all....

    If you can get your hands on seats from a GT or GTi, you will be amazed by the difference!
    I just sold my 91 GT seats to a chap with a 98, bolted right in!

    They will also fit in the convertible, but you must retain your runners. I think that the vert has the worst seats of all. I also have GT seats in the vert, the grayish-silver ones, they are more of a match to the door panels.
    The Mark 3 and 4 seats have springs running lengthwise under the seats, whereas the GT seats have a full metal shell. A world of difference.
  • hey i have a metro and i love the gas milage but when i press the gas and it has some hesitation.
    it jumps when shifting in the lower gears
    and it can hardly get up to 50
    what the heck is goin on?
    something i can do?
    i want the push that a geo should have
    i think its a 91' metro
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    It is difficult to sort out this kind of situation without actually being able to test and drive it. I'm not clear about what you mean by "it jumps when shifting in the lower gears and it can hardly get up to 50." That sounds like the clutch might be slipping. If the engine sometimes speeds up while the car doesn't go any faster, that would be caused by a slipping clutch. The clutch pedal free play on those cars is adjustable. If you start to press on the clutch pedal; it should move freely, with little or no resistance over the first 1" or 1 1/2" of pedal travel, but when you press it further, it should then feel like you're compressing a spring. If the pedal feels tight from the beginning, with no free play, then it desperately needs to be adjusted. The adjustment is done by loosening the large nut that is located at the end of the clutch cable, where the cable connects to the arm coming from the transmission housing. Keep turning the nut until you get 1" to 1 1/2" of free play at the top of the pedal stroke. After you make this adjustment, if the clutch still slips, then it is too late: The clutch has worn out, and will have to be replaced.

    All clutches used to be adjustable, but many drivers didn't watch the free play. The free play distance becomes smaller as the clutch wears. If the free play is allowed to go away entirely, then the clutch will burn out. In recent years, manufacturers have begun making self adjusting clutches, so that owners wouldn't have to check the free play. But the downside is that people have become used to cars having self adjusting clutches; if they then buy a car with a clutch that's not self adjusting, and the free play goes away, it destroys the clutch. Knowing whether the car you drive needs to have the free play checked, and always watching the clutch free play are just a few of the many responsibilities we have to take on, in order to survive in today's complex and wonderful world.
  • Can a 3 speed automatic be removed without removing the 1.3L engine?
    Thanks,
    Al
  • I think that I may be able to help a little with your problem. My 91 geo metro convertible just had a similar problem, but what it did was that it wouldn't rev up higher than 4000-4500 RPM and it didn't go much faster than 50-55 mph, and that was with me stomping on the gas pedal. My problem was the Catalytic Converter insides worked themselves loose and all that crap was pushed down to my muffler and clogged up my whole exhaust system, thus making my engine lose it's performance and it was extremely sluggish. I couldn't get my RPM's over the previously stated RPM range. If you can't rev over that limit, then there's a good chance that you're Catalytic converter crapped the bed and took your muffler with it clogging your exhaust exit.
    If you do see the RPM problem with your car, a good way to double check that is by taking out your O2 sensor, or just taking off your exhaust manifold or pipe that connects to your Manifold (it's easier to take off the manifold because the 2 bolts that hold the pipe onto the manifold rust and break easily when removing. Sounds stupid because you'll be taking about 6 or 7 fasteners out to drop the exhaust manifold). After you've done that you've officially bypassed the plugged up exhaust; Start up your car and rev it up. It'll be loud like a family of chipmunks screaming, but you should see that you'll be able to hit 6500 RPM without any problems. Let me know if this helps. If you don't have the RPM problem, there's a chance that it's something else, but after what I've seen with these cheap catalytic converters, it wouldn't surprise me to see someone else with the same problem.
    You might also consider checking your sparkplugs to see if they're fouled out due to the exhaust obstruction. Also, check your Air filter and the assembly that provides the air to the intake. There may be an obstruction there keeping your little car from performing like the go cart it should be. Check your timing, and all of your distributor parts for corrosion and poor electrical connections there. Could be a loose wire somewhere. Also, if you haven't changed your fuel filter for some time, it wouldn't hurt. That may be clogged or dirty if you haven't changed it in the last year causing fuel restrictions to your injector. Bad gas will really make your chipmunk in the wheel engine constipated and irritable. A dirty injector will give you a little grief too. Wouldn't hurt to have your injector cleaned/ serviced. Check your fuel pressure, maybe a bad fuel pump is not giving your engine the much needed sipping sustainance. All of these things could be cheap fixes to your problem. If none of these fixes work, then you may have internal problems in your engine, maybe worn lobes on your camshaft, bad valves, or a dead cylinder. Do a compression check just to be sure before you fix things that aren't broken.
    Best of luck to you from a fellow geo metro owner. Let me know how you do.
  • stepzstepz Posts: 2
    My Metro will shut off when I let off the gas after cresting a hill. If I let it coast for a few seconds then push the gas it will take off again most times. The mechanic said I had good spark and fuel pressure. and was getting a pulse to the injector but no fuel into the throttle body. What could it be?
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    That sounds like you have a problem with the throttle position sensor. This sensor is mounted at the end of the throttle shaft, on the passenger side of the throttle body. It is held in place by 2 mounting screws, and has an electrical plug attached to it. The sensor is designed to shut the fuel off when the throttle is closed during deceleration, and then turn the fuel flow back on when you step on the gas. In earlier models, it is mounted on adjustment slots. That adjustment is extremely critical. If the sensor has been moved to the wrong position (too far counterclockwise), it will not turn the fuel back on soon enough when you step on the gas. If you have a later model sensor that does not have an adjustable mounting position, then it may have developed an internal electrical problem. Bad connections at the plug, or damage to the wiring harness could also cause the same symptoms.

    This problem could also be caused if an ignorant person had tried to reduce the idle speed by loosening the throttle stop screw. The throttle stop screw is factory set. That's why they put a lock nut on it. It should not be used as an idle speed adjustment. The engine computer automatically adjusts the idle speed. Yes, I know that the engine sometimes takes a while to slow back down to an idle; but that is deliberately done to keep the emission levels down. If a knowledgeable person reduces the throttle stop screw position, they also reset the throttle position sensor to a more clockwise position, to match the new stop screw setting.
  • WOW, that's all I can say!
    Versia23 and Zaken 1... wow and double wow.
    You two guys will make me believe that the world is a good place.
    I thank you for these informations.
    I replaced my automatic tranny in Vanilla Latte with a manual and, yes, I admit the idle was very high, I...I...I did set it lower by manipulating the forbidden zone....
    BUT I never did go over 4000 rpm, I installed a tacho from the company and I doubt if I can go over that. A few times it did feel sluggish and with pedal to the floor was going 40 miles an hour tops. Then I started unscrewing the gas cap and...presto, power! This happens when the tank is quite full.
    But you say 6000 to 6500 RPM? Really?
    Come this spring I shall go over all that has been said by you two fellows you can be sure of that.
    I thank you very much for your time.
    Frederick.
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    I NOW KNOW THE ANSWER TO YOUR PROBLEM!!! The Metros with automatic transmissions have a totally different type of throttle position switch than the Metros with manual transmissions. In order to get stick shift class fuel economy, you now need to change over to a throttle position switch from a stick shift car. If you're lucky, it will have the same harness plug. Otherwise, you'll have to change the harness, and possibly the computer. It was the automatic transmission throttle position switch which was messing up the idle speed and the fuel cut operation. You just might be able to get by if you readjust the AT type switch, but I expect it will never work right.

    But the problem with unrelieved vacuum in the fuel tank is a whole different issue. That one comes from your charcoal cannister, which is on the firewall near where the speedometer cable comes out. There is a large diameter hose from the fuel tank vent, which is supposed to connect to that cannister. It sounds to me like that hose has been plugged. If that happened, there would be no path for air to get into the tank as you draw fuel out of it. And this would be most severe when the tank was full.

    Joel
  • finally got it running. The module in the distributor was defective. after changing distributor car runs like new. Thanks for all the help.
  • Would like to buy a Chevy Geo Metro with automatic transmission. Have a 99 Metro stick shift. Wife can't learn to drive on stick shift. Want to buy her a Metro with automatic transmission. Only 6 for sale within 500 miles of Mesquite, Nevada (80 miles from Vegas). This is my first time in this forum. What now? -- Donald Hendon
  • Would like to buy a Chevy Geo Metro with automatic transmission. Have a 99 Metro stick shift. Wife can't learn to drive on stick shift. Want to buy her a Metro with automatic transmission. Only 6 for sale within 500 miles of Mesquite, Nevada (80 miles from Vegas). This is my first time in this forum. What now? -- Donald Hendon. Reply to donny88a@yahoo.com
  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Pennsylvania Furnace, PAPosts: 5,893
    A reminder... the buying and selling of items is not permitted on the forums. So unfortunately there really isn't a "what now?" yet to come.

    If you click on a member's username and want to contact them off the forum via email, that's up to you, but no transactions or requests for transactions can happen here at this point.

    MODERATOR
    Need help navigating? pf_flyer@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
    Share your vehicle reviews

  • My apologies. I joined only yesterday. Didn't know buying and selling wasn't permitted. BTW, I went online, typed in my zip code (Mesquite, Nevada, 80 miles from Vegas), said I was looking for Metro hatchback within 500 mile radius. Only 6 for sale (3 in southern Calif, 2 in Phoenix, in in Vegas). I guess we Metro owners are too smart to part with 'em, huh? -- Don Hendon
  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Pennsylvania Furnace, PAPosts: 5,893
    No problem Don. Live and learn :P

    Since you're new, if you have any questions about the forums, chats, or your CarSpace page, just pop me an email (click on my username) and I'll get you pointed in the right direction!

    MODERATOR
    Need help navigating? pf_flyer@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
    Share your vehicle reviews

  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    I hope you realize that a Metro with an automatic transmission will get about ten miles per gallon less than a stick shift Metro. It will also have less power. The 3 cylinder engine just can't handle the added load created by the torque converter and the automatic four speed gearbox. The engine's life expectancy will also be less, especially in the hot Nevada climate. For those reasons, I think you'd be better off buying a Toyota Corolla or Tercel, a Geo Prizm, or a 4 cylinder Metro or Suzuki Swift with an automatic. Those cars are designed to work with an automatic. In my opinion, the automatic in the 3 cylinder Metro was just offered to increase the car's marketing appeal.

    I can give you tips on picking out a good used car, but I'd consider it a waste of my time, and an ultimate disservice to you, to do so with a 3 cylinder automatic Metro.

    Just for your information, I've owned a stick shift 3 cylinder Metro for the last 15 years.
  • Gee...thanks a million.
    I'll definitely look at that canister in the spring. Right now Vanilla Latte is snoozing in a quiet antique barn, her innards with a Stabil cocktail and her battery in my dry warm basement.
    As for economy.....I just don't know....it gets aprox. 58 miles to the gallon and I did a run of 62 once.
    My motorcycle buddy is the "culprit" who lowered the idle speed and that did bring down the revs to a steady 850 RPM from 1250. When the automatic was in the revs were at around 850 also.
    I switched the tranny and I did get some help here, but I really don't know whre it comes from, except that the garage told me it was in excellent shape and that it came from a three humper. BUT, at 65 miles an hour, my motor is turning at 2600 RPM. Albeit I do have 15 inch wheels on Vanilla.
    Besides sometimes lacking some stamina (gas cap thing), the engine runs fine. Although in one post I did see a mention of shaky idling when it has been lowered without the proper knowledge. I swear it isn't shaky , by that I mean it doesn't swing semi violently from left to right. Not to my eyes anyway.
    I thank you agoin for your time. Frederick.
  • soften the tires they Will grip the road better. i run my tires in the snow at 20# and in the summer i have them up to 30. the factory has them at a bit higher pressure
  • on the geo/metro the wheels will not lock up. i can't get mine to lock on sand gravel or most snow conditions, ice will allow the tires to lock. the metro has a coaster brake for a braking system. i have been on yahoo's geo groups for some time and they all say the same thing. i complained about my brakes on that site one time and i got tons of replies about the breaking system and how it is supposed to work.
  • Yes, 15 inch wheels NO problems. I have them on Vanilla Latte, my small white convertible. I acheive 58 miles to the gallon with them. In summer.
  • i got hit last fall early winter no snow but cold and thee was ice on the bridges but where i was setting still on the road due to cars sliding off the road, a big pickup truck came along and hit me in the front side of the headlight on my 90 metro hatchback. the truck lost the bumper and i got a few scratches on the front fender. the car is so lite it was pushed of to the side and i was spared the trouble of a smashed up car the hospital and maybe a long walk. the truck slid the whole way along my car but the front had the only scratches on it.
  • I have a 1996 Metro, 1.0 liter, manual trans. It was running great until Sat night. Shut it off, when I went to start it a few hours later nothing. Dash lights would come on and go dim when I turned the key to the start position. The starter would not engage. No whining or any other sound. I checked the battery, it was dead as a door nail and frozen solid. For kicks I pulled the starter and had it tested. It failed. Replaced the batt and starter, still the same problem.
    I then checked the clutch position switch. I got continuity when I disconnected it and depressed the button by hand and the opposite when I released it. I then checked for voltage at the fuse box under the hood at the 70 amp fuse for the batt, good.
    I also checked the 60amp ign fuse, good. I then checked the ign switch in all positions seperatly, all read good. I re checked the cps for current, when depressed it had voltage on both sides, when released, the opposite.
    I have power at the starter from the batt cable, but am not getting any power the starter when ign switch is in start position.

    The answer is probably starring me right in the face and I just can't seem to see it. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
  • ggeeooggeeoo Posts: 94
    Other GM Starters sometimes the solenoid that allows the starter to work is in
    the starter. Thus you may have power at the starter but no solenoid no spin.
    I recently had battery short out inside the battery. When I replaced battery
    with a new one everything worked great.
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    Before you assume a problem exists in the starting circuit, make sure the engine is not locked up, by either turning the crankshaft pulley clockwise, or by putting the transmission in 5th gear, releasing the brake, and pushing the car.

    Electrical problems with the symptoms you describe are typically caused by corroded connections in the battery cables, resistive switch or fuse block contacts, a corroded, broken or missing auxiliary ground wire from the negative battery terminal to the sheet metal of the body, or a defective or improperly charged new battery.

    The fact that the dash lights dim when you turn the key to the 'start' position, but the starter doesn't receive battery power, indicates that the battery either doesn't have enough energy to drive the starter, or that there is a substantial resistance on either the hot or the ground path between the battery and the starter, or that the starter solenoid is not being activated by the ignition switch.

    The way to sort out these possibilities is to test them one by one, and eliminate the possibilities that test good. These tests are designed to depend on each other, so do not skip any steps or change the sequence. The first thing to do is to test the battery, while leaving it connected as usual. Attach the voltmeter leads to both battery cables, and confirm that the meter reads 12 or more volts when the key is off. If the meter reads less than 12 volts, take the meter leads and hold them directly on top of the battery posts. If that brings the voltage up above 12 volts, the battery cable clamps are either corroded or loose. If the voltage does not come up, then the battery is either defective or improperly charged.

    Once you get 12 or more volts at the battery cables, have someone turn the key to the 'start' position while you watch the meter. This is a tougher test, which may produce different results that the one in the previous paragraph. If the voltage drops below 11 volts, while the starter does not turn; try the test again while the meter probes are held directly on top of the battery posts. If that brings the voltage up, then there are bad connections at the cable clamps. If the voltage does not come up, the battery is either defective or improperly charged.

    If the battery voltage stays up during all the above tests, then the battery and its cable connections can be ruled out as a problem. The next step is to check the ground path. First, confirm there is a ground wire running from a fender bolt to either the engine or the negative battery terminal; and that the battery ground cable is attached to an engine bolt. Leaving the positive meter lead connected to the battery, move the negative lead to a clean engine bolt. You should see 12 or more volts when the key is off. Turn the key to the 'start' position, if the starter does not run, the meter should not drop below 11 volts. If the meter drops below 11 volts, there is a problem in the ground cable or its connection.

    If the voltage stayed above 11 in the preceding test, the ground leg can be ruled out as a problem. The next thing to check is the positive battery cable. Take the positive meter lead off the battery, and move it to the battery cable at the starter. Turn the key to the 'start' position and watch the meter. If it drops below 11 volts, while the starter does not run, there is a problem in the positive battery cable or its connection to the starter.

    If all the above tests were good, then connect a jumper lead to the battery positive cable (be careful to not let the free end touch any metal parts), and briefly touch it to the solenoid terminal on the starter (where the wire from the ignition switch normally connects). The starter should now run. If it runs, then you have a resistive connection in the ignition switch or the fuse block.
  • ggeeooggeeoo Posts: 94
    You can buy at a Ace Hardware store in the fastener area If you do not have
    those in your area let me know I will get the store to mail you some.
  • stepzstepz Posts: 2
    Thanks for the info. Someone told me to put some fuel system cleaner in it. I tried it and it ran fine till I put gas in it again. It started to shut off again. I put some more cleaner in it and it was fine. I think I have dirt in the injector or some where. Will it hurt to put cleaner it to much? Also I'm told there is no filter on it just a sock in the tank.
  • zaken1zaken1 Posts: 556
    From what I understand, you can put cleaner in it as often as you want; providing you do not use more then the recommended amount, and don't add it more than once per tank of fuel. But it should not be necessary to use cleaner to keep the engine running. Try replacing the fuel filter. Also, some gas stations have sediment in their underground storage tanks. If you are unlucky enough to be buying your gas while a tanker is refilling the station's storage tank, and the sediment gets stirred up in that process, it can end up in your car's fuel system. Other stations buy what is called 'bottom tank fuel' from refineries; which is the oldest and most deteriorated type of fuel. If you commonly buy fuel from the same place, and keep getting dirt in your gas tank, try switching to another source. Even if you have to pay more, it will probably save you money over the long run.

    You were given bad information by the person who told you there is no fuel filter on the Metro. That car has a very fine filter, which is located underneath the car, on the driver's side, just in front of the fuel tank.
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