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Will Green Cars Be Exciting To Drive And Enjoyable To Own?

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  • we're in beautiful Coeur d' Alene, ID. Took a little trip to Spokane earlier today and now I'm in Post Falls, ID. It's nice to have the temperature down to a reasonable level lately.

    Yes, I still have the 2008 Mitsubishi Lancer GTS and although it needs a bath pretty badly I'm glad I chose the Rally Red color and kept to the waxing and protectant routine every 6 months with Avondale Mitsubishi. It's paid off.

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    I love Couer d' Alene. At least I did last time I was there in 1968. We just had the two hottest days of the year. 111 degrees Monday 101 yesterday. Both records. July was the coldest July on record. Strange weather.

    I think our dreams of having a practical EV are still a long ways off.

    Bailo also said Nissan expects the roughly 450 Leafs its sold in Arizona to have an average battery capacity of 76 percent after five years -- a slightly worse rate of shrinkage than elsewhere -- with some owners suffering more. That did little to assuage worried owners about their newfound range anxiety; as one posted on the MyNissanLeaf forum after Bailo's letter: "If they truly believe this they would have a better battery warranty. I LOVE my Leaf, but I can't recommend them anymore because of this issue."

    http://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoramic/nissan-leaf-battery-troubles-owners-negat- ive-shock-180958755.html
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Posts: 5,737
    edited October 2012
    yeah, I no longer am interested in buying an electric car. When they can build one with a price around $20,000 and a range of 250 miles with a top speed of 90mph I'll be at their door knocking.

    Notice how BYD and their e6 have made a gigantic flop of their "dreams" to import the e6 here, with it's range of 250 miles and top speed of 100mph? Right. :)

    Of course, they were planning on charging around $40,000 for that one, too, though.

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    Burn, Baby, Burn: Fisker Inferno

    More than a dozen Fisker Karma plug-in hybrids caught fire at a shipping facility in New Jersey after being submerged in seawater during Hurricane Sandy.

    The fire in Port Newark burned 16 of the $100,000 vehicles after a storm surge submerged the cars, which are produced by Anaheim-based Fisker Automotive, the company confirmed.


    http://www.ocregister.com/articles/fire-376417-company-fisker.html
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Elon Musk (of Tesla) is cracking up right now.

    Leno just tested a Model S and loved it.

    Meanwhile, CR's Fisker broke down completely and needed a tow. Embarassing, plus these fires, yikes.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    PS Imagine all the environmental damage those fires did, probably more pollution than a good car would put out in its lifetime.

    Fiskers have a gas tank, so I bet the gas fuelled the flames (eventually), but the batteries started it.

    Salt water in the electrics = not good.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    Maybe the fires that burnt 80 homes were started by a hybrid or EV????

    May be a long time till they figure out what happened there.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I wouldn't want to speculate about that, plus I doubt it.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    Usually those things start with a broken natural gas line. I have not found any cause. Fire dept says the start of the fire is unclear.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Salt water, electrical shorts, sparks, lots of fuel supplies, ... could be anything.
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 44,132
    Not that it matters if all the cars are under 5' of seawater.

    "After a thorough inspection witnessed by (National Highway Traffic Safety Administration) representatives, Fisker engineers determined that the damage to the Karmas was the result of the cars being submerged under 5-8 feet of seawater for several hours that left corrosive salt in a low-voltage Vehicle Control Unit in one Karma," the company said.

    "The Vehicle Control Unit is a standard component found in many types of vehicles and is powered by a typical 12V car battery. This residual salt damage caused a short circuit, which led to a fire that heavy winds then spread to other Karmas parked nearby."

    Fisker Reveals Cause of Karma Fires During Hurricane Sandy (Inside Line)

    Moderator - Minivan fan. Feel free to message or email me - stever@edmunds.com.

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    And if you believe that BS I got a bridge for sale. That is all Damage control for the EV agenda. Cars we paid to have built in a foreign country. I guess we are stuck with 4 more years of lies and deception on the Green Agenda.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    edited November 2012
    They very carefully worded their statement to imply the standard 12v battery started the fire, but if that were the case all flooded cars would have gone up in flames.

    The battery pack stores a LOT more energy than a regular 12v pack and relies on liquid cooling and all sorts of sophisticated engineering to cool itself.

    Not that cars must be built to withstand floods, but the statement is extremely misleading.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    I don't think a 12V lead acid battery would get that hot with salt water covering it. It would dissipate its charge. I wonder how big the 12volt battery is. In the Prius it is a little thing to keep the computers going. I noticed the careful wording as well.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    I did not realize they lost 300 of the Fisker plug-in Hybrids.

    The Fisker is not new to fires.

    The company previously had incidents of cars catching fire, one in California related to a cooling fan, and one in Texas for which the cause is still being determined, the company said.

    http://blogs.wsj.com/drivers-seat/2012/11/06/sandy-swamped-shipment-of-more-than- -300-fisker-cars/
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    It was news to me also. Here:

    http://green.autoblog.com/2012/11/07/fisker-loses-over-300-karmas-in-sandy-flood- s-at-port-newark/

    Those didn't catch fire, though. Maybe the 12v battery was dead! ;)
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    http://www.autoblog.com/2012/11/07/hurricane-sandy-cost-automakers-15-000-vehicl- es-may-have-ruined/

    15,000 unsold vehicles, but NADA is saying it could have destroyed 200,000 personal vehicles! Yikes.

    Hopefully with good insurance.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    Are EV sales Dead???

    Nissan Motor CEO Carlos Ghosn finally admitted the automaker will not meet its sales target for its all-electric Leaf — in another sign of the broad struggle of the electric vehicle industry.

    "The forecast we have given ourselves for the year will not be reached," Ghosn told Bloomberg Television in Mexico City on Thursday.

    Despite months of lagging sales, the Japanese automaker has steadfastly refused to acknowledge that it could not double sales in 2012 to 20,000 after selling nearly 10,000 in 2011.

    In October, the Leaf also had its best month all year, selling 1,579, up 86 percent from a year ago. For the year, Nissan has sold 6,791 Leafs, down 15.6 percent from this time a year ago.

    Nissan sold 9,679 all-electric Leafs in 2011.


    http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20121115/AUTO0104/211150461/1361/Nissan-CEO-a- bandons--12-electric-vehicle-sales-target
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Volt sales just hit an all time high, new record last month: 2961.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    They are selling at invoice to unload the 2012 models sitting on the showrooms. CA has given them the HOV sticker as well.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    True, but hybrids and even diesels had incentives for a while (now expired).

    Obviously not as big, but hybrids and diesels used that to become more or less mainstream.

    It's a tougher battle for EVs given their cost.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    edited December 2012
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Funny, but I think they've come up with a standard interface.

    Our garage has 2 EV charging spots, and they only charge about 1/3rd of what it would cost to charge at home given the rates here.

    I've seen one Volt and one Prius plug-in, so not many takers.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    The one Leaf owner I talked to said his wife has had her car unplugged several times in her parking garage. It is the Navy parking garage in downtown San Diego. The time stops when you unplug so it does not cost her for the person that unplugs it. Just disconcerting to come out after work and your EV is not charged up. It takes most of a charge to get home the 35 miles as it is mostly up long grades on I8. A big downside of owning a pure EV.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Wonder why, maybe a Hummer owner tired of all the smug looks? :D
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 29,597
    No it was people pulling the plug out and charging their Volts and Leaves. She left her car 8 hours while at work. Someone comes in charges for a few hours and leaves. Doesn't say much for the class of people that own plug-in vehicles. Not sure how long it takes for a full charge.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I've had people cut in front of me in line for gas, so I wouldn't judge based on that alone.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=OawY6sUAn3g

    Still can't get used to not hearing any engine noise.
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Will Green Cars Be Exciting To Drive And Enjoyable To Own? - Page 27 - Car Forums at Edmunds.com