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Toyota Corolla Electric-Assist Power Steering (EPS)

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Comments

  • mnfmnf Posts: 404
    edited April 2010
    Not sure what she paid or if there was any down payment but after two years of owning mine if i sold it today i wouldn't be in debt. Sorry to hear that you have had issues but if you plan on waiting for a law suit remember that Walmart's law suit is just now coming to light. Nine years later !!!!!
  • silvercoupesilvercoupe Posts: 326
    I've been driving a 2010 Corolla LE for two days now while my 2010 Camry SE is being repaired (parking lot hit-and-run).

    The steering is a little different. There seems to be some lag in steering response. Because of this I find myself overcorrecting a little during Interstate travel.

    Maybe it's just me, but it is a little disconcerting at times. Don't think that I want a car with EPS.
  • pekelvrpekelvr Posts: 61
    that's a EPS defect...you've come to the right place here. Have you gone to NHTSA and reviewed the Toyota complaints on EPS? There is a defect in the computer in the steering. The EPS was designed to "help" out drivers with correcting the steering while we drive. SO for example if you are on the highway and the road has like ruts from truckers, the steering will guide the car automatically BUT BUT this is a major problem because that rut can take you over the line and into the next car in the next lane. The problem is most noticeable when on the highway going over 50, do you find yourself meandering and have a feel like the car is weaving without you doing it and then you are constantly correcting because if not the "wind" that isn't even there is going to sweep you over left right left right?
    link title

    Well for a long time there wasn't a "fix" at Toyota but there is NOW! Call Toyota's experience line and tell them the car is weaving, that you feel like wind is blowing you all over the place when there isn't any wind....They will get you dealership info, so please have that on hand, and they will assign you a case manager who will contact the dealer for you. Then you take the car in for inspection and they will test drive it, make sure you defend yourself and tell them that car is going to kill you and you wont drive it like that!!! Make sure because they tend to attempt to sweep it under the rug. The actual problem is the ELECTRONIC POWER STEERING COMPUTER and they will order a replacement that supposedly was designed to not over correct the steering in the car. I have to take my car in on this Saturday just to order the part. I already traded in my 2008 Corolla that I had purchased new on the lot for the very same issue. After you go to NHTSA website.....you will need your vin # file your complaint then research others. (copy paste url)

    http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/complaints/

    this is what you key in on the search: Selected TYPE: VEHICLE » YEAR: 2010 » MAKE: TOYOTA » MODEL: COROLLA then you select "retrieve complaints."

    currently there are 248 filed with NHTSA under steering. Then call Toyota's experience hotline The Customer Experience Center phone # is 800-331-4331.
    do that 1st first.and tell them you need a case manager for the EPS etc....hope that helped! good Luck!:)
  • pekelvrpekelvr Posts: 61
    I forgot to say its also known as the steeering box! donot let them fool you Toyota knows it and they have a fix to those who seek it. They will not call you.....YOU MUST CALL THEM AND DONT TAKE ANY PRISONERS!
  • terceltomterceltom Posts: 1,017
    Better keep your 2010 than, as the 2011 Camry has it as well as almost all other new cars.
  • terceltomterceltom Posts: 1,017
    First off, it's only a loaner car for Silvercoupe so I doubt if they want to follow-up with the NHTSA and all those other suggestions you offered.

    Secondly, I would correct you in that the "defect" as you call it only shows up in a small number of 2009/2010 Corollas

    Thirdly, if you traded your 2008 Corolla because of a EPS problem you made a big mistake as the 2008 Corollas weren't even manufactured with EPS ??????
  • silvercoupesilvercoupe Posts: 326
    "Better keep your 2010 than, as the 2011 Camry has it as well as almost all other new cars."

    Toyota's website shows the 2011 Camry to have "Variable-assist power rack-and-pinion". No mention of EPS except for the hybrid.

    I know EPS is probably coming to most all new cars in the future. Hopefully it will be improved considerably by the time I need another new car.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    I could count on one hand the vehicles that come standard with EPS that are on sale today that I know of; I'm sure there are more, but few receive as much flack as the system in the Corolla. What other vehicles offer EPS besides hybrids? All I can think of is Chevrolet Cobalt and Malibu off the top of my head.
  • pekelvrpekelvr Posts: 61
    My car isn't a hybrid. Electronic Power Steering is just a new feature designed to assist the driver. It is NOT for hybrids alone.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_steering

    and I quote....

    "Originally invented in the early 20th century, automotive engineers have implemented this now standard feature with a variety of technologies."

    :confuse:
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    "Originally invented in the early 20th century, automotive engineers have implemented this now standard feature with a variety of technologies."

    Your quote is about power steering in general, so I don't quite know what you're trying to say. Yes, we've had power steering for decades. Um... ok. :shades:

    Electronic Power Steering is just a new feature designed to assist the driver. It is NOT for hybrids alone.

    I know it is NOT for hybrids alone. Who said it was?

    It "assists" the driver by removing all possibility of road-feel in the Corolla I drove (very "video-game" feeling). Toyota drivers won't notice much of a change, however. They came with most of the buttoned-down, controlled handling dialed out years before the EPS system. In a way, its faint praise for EPS, because Toyota's never had decent handling or steering feel before the EPS either. I drove an 04 Corolla extensively, an '04 LE I4 and an '07 Camry LE V6, all three of which handled like a wet dishrag, and an '07 SE V6 Camry which had better control but still no noticeable steering feel. EPS just takes away straight-line stability in some applications, it had little to do with the already soggy handling.

    To EPS's credit and Toyota's detriment, several automakers use EPS and manage to still incorporate driving feel and a sense of driver involvement, and without the highway wandering many have reported here.
  • silvercoupesilvercoupe Posts: 326
    It "assists" the driver by removing all possibility of road-feel in the Corolla I drove (very "video-game" feeling).

    Very good description of the EPS on the Corolla.

    My daughter had a 2005 Malibu with EPS. I only drove it a few times, but the steering feel was much the same.

    The steering feel in my 2010 Camry SE is better, but nothing like in my 2000 Accord Coupe. On the other hand, road noise in the Accord is terrible.

    My wife and I have been Honda owners since 1983, and have been well served.
    We have become part of the "blue hair" crowd and were looking for something a little more "comfortable" but still a little "sporty" when we chose the Camry SE. So far we are well pleased with our choice.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Toyotas are hard to beat in the comfort department; they're La-Z-Boy chairs with a steering wheel. And darn good ones. For anyone who gives a lick about driving though, Toyotas aren't likely to be on your list. Lucky for them, a large number of Americans place more value on quiet, soft rides than they do on engaging driving characteristics.
  • terceltomterceltom Posts: 1,017
    You are correct, upon further research it's only the 2011 Camry hybrids that have EPS. My mistake!
  • spikejr1spikejr1 Posts: 13
    Some of you may be interested - I just got this from the NHTSA -

    "Hello, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) has been investigating alleged problems with the steering on MY 2009-10 Toyota Corollas. You have previously filed a complaint with us concerning the steering of your vehicle. We are looking for a vehicle to be used for testing at the Vehicle Research Test Center located in East Liberty Ohio. Please select the "REPLY" button in your E-mail browser and then fill in the questions at the bottom of the page and then "Send" to me.

    Even if you cannot lease your vehicle to us, I would like an update describing the current status of your car.

    Fill out the form included in this message and send it back to me.

    Thank You in advance,
    Chris Lash
    Safety Defects Engineer
    National Highway Traffic Safety Adm.
    Office of Defect Investigations

    1200 New Jersey Avenue, SE
    Washington, DC 20590
    W48-215 NVS213cnl
    Direct 202-366-2370
    Fax 202-366-1767
    chris.lash@dot.gov

    DOT Toll Free
    1-877-536-8368 ext 62370
    HOTLINE (888) 327-4368 "

    --
    As a side note, one of the questions I was asked at the end was whether or not THE new EPS module had been installed, and whether or not I had adapted...Didn't know there was a new module, and after re-reading this thread I see that [pekelvr] highlighted that a fix was available...I will find out what the lease terms are to the NHTSA for them to test the vehicle and post the findings later...
  • pekelvrpekelvr Posts: 61
    Sometimes I feel like people do not have their settings set up to receive pertinent information on this board....that being said I reported the same information and I called NHTSA and let them know my Corolla was indeed fixed. The steering box computer for the EPS was replaced and now my car stays center,.. I reported this on this site so that all of you "following" the board would know the outcome after my car was recalled. I dont know if you have followed by threads but if you had you would have seen the vital information from Toyota that I posted and the experience hotline. Because in order to get the new box computer aka EPS you have to call Toyota, get a case manager, report that your car is all over the place, and then their rep will call your dealer repair manager and let them know the part is ready but that it must be ordered specifically for your car. Why Toyota doesnt just make a recall on the faulty EPS systems is beyond me. For those of you who caught this thread.....go to your edmunds setting and set it to receive email notifications for the issue you want to info about. That way you dont miss pertinent info you could have had a week ago. Im very happy with my 2010 Corolla now. Id let my grqandma drive it ...lol ;)
  • terceltomterceltom Posts: 1,017
    I have all Toyota forums set-up to receive new posts and I also, have not seen any updated information about your EPS problem. The last I received was your post #259 when you were first notified about your fix. Sometimes I can go days without any new post notices.
  • spikejr1spikejr1 Posts: 13
    Appreciate the update - I also have my settings correct...seems that I get most, but not all of the updates. In any case, I'm surprised that the NHTSA is aware of the new EPS fix...and Toyota is obviously aware...However, neither party notified me that a fix is available. This is troubling since I complained to them both directly, and even more troubling for Toyota since they had a Field Tech Rep inspect the vehicle so I know that they are aware that my vehicle is having issues...you would think that they would contact me sooner rather than later...
  • terceltomterceltom Posts: 1,017
    Yea, you think you would have been one of the first to find out about the fix. Did the field rep. give you any feedback on your car after testing it? I hope you already contacted Toyota again to find out what's going on.
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Posts: 10,913
    Please do post back and let us know what you've decided to do. I've never seen such an offer and didn't know the gov't used privately-owned vehicles to do testing.

    MODERATOR
    Need help navigating? kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.
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  • pekelvrpekelvr Posts: 61
    My story continued.....I purchased my brand new 2008 Corolla S model at the end of 2008. I only test drove on side streets near the the dealer and a little bit on a 2 lane hwy going 45 at maximum. However, after I got it home and drove on the highway going 60-65 a few times including on the way home, I found that I had to overwork and struggle consistently to keep the car in my lane. The car had crossed me over the center line (yellow line), it (my car) took me into the right lane and I almost hit the car next to me, she (the driver), was able to move fast enough out of the way. The final straw for me was driving to Asheville, North Carolina from where I live which was on the east coast of North Carolina only this time my husband was driving. Now I'm not bragging in any way here but my husband is not a light weight as he has professional built muscle as a pro body builder. He is a strong man is what I'm trying to stress here, so by the time we arrived which was a 6 hour drive, his forearms were strained a little bit and luckily our hotel had a jacuzzi! But my husband became very concerned about me because he thought all the time I was complaining that I'm just some woman driver blaming my poor driving skills (NOT) on my car. I knew something wasn't right and he apologized to me. He became so concerned that while we were in Asheville we to a local Toyota dealer to have the car checked. The dealer then sent me back to my dealer and they told me the car is fine...it all checked out good, to drive home and bring the car to my dealer. So I did just that when I got back to Fuquay Varina, NC. By December 2009 I was done the car yet again tried to kill me and I was shaken to my core. My survival skill was to try not to ever drive the car on the hwy but on my way to the dealer again the car had me feeling I was being blown all over the road without wind.

    For those who do not understand what Electronic Power Steering is...."Power steering (or more correctly for most road vehicles power assisted steering), assists the driver of an automobile in steering by directing a portion of the vehicle's power to traverse the axis of one or more of its wheels. On most road going vehicles there has to be a mechanical linkage as a fail-safe. Originally invented in the early 20th century, automotive engineers have implemented this now standard feature with a variety of technologies."

    So how does it work? Normally when you're on the hwy. in a lane where a lot of tractor trailers pass on, the road, the actual tar/cement then gets what is known as a "rut"...normally when the your tires hit a rut it will like pull you into the rut, but if we begin to feel it pulling us over the center line or it begins taking you into another lane, your reaction will be impulsive and you will correct the steering. The defect with the EPS in our cars is that the car will act as if there ruts when it may be just a little dip and it over corrects itself. :cry: The next problem with the EPS is that when the EPS detects wind it corrects itself yet again...but the problem is if the wind blows you to the left the car fights it back and pushes you to the right and vice versa. If it's raining the car again corrects itself. This makes for dangerous situations as this car is constantly moving you when and where you are not choosing it to. So that day I went to the dealer and it almost killed me by taking me into the lane beside me, When I got to the dealer I handed them my keys with tears in my eyes and I told them I need to call a taxi to take me home. The person, I think she was the receptionist, she asked me to sit down because she saw I was shaken up by it. The General Manager happen to be there and without question he said he would trade it in for me and just take the car back, however he convinced me the latest model the 2010 had built in stability control aka VSC and that it would help. So I drove the same model, the S for "Sport" and they gave me discounts for sticking with the Toyota brand. They also gave me $10,000 which was a ridiculous value considering the car had less than $10,000 miles on it but the Blu book had the car at only $8,000 which was bull!!! But I had to get rid of the car because it was going to kill me....so I took the $10,000 the GM offered and I have to say this man was a nice man and he felt bad about what he was seeing when i sat in tears in front of him...to the point he also gave me an additional discount off the price of the 2010. We traded and I went home. Well guess what the 2010 model was slightly better, but I was scared to death to drive it too as it kept doing the same thing the 2008 model did. But I repeated the same thing I went back to the dealer, to repair services and then I came onto this forum and I went to NHTSA and I have remained proactive for getting the issue of this EPS resolved. So finally in like June Toyota sent me the "recall letter" only it wasn't for the EPS!!!! I was so angry!!! I called the telephone number that it said to call. Well guess what the tele# was not correct, apparently you need to call not customer service but the "Experience" center. So finally, I reach them but this only leads to be assigned a "case manager." The following business day the Case mgr. calls me and I told her that the floor mats were not my problem as this was their reason for sending me the notification, to recall my car for floor mats!!!! Boy was I angry!! :mad: I let them have it! over the phone, but professionally. Well the mgr. hooked me up she told me that the is a part, a new computer box. She called my local dealer made my appointment and told me that the dealer would need to order the part after they did the repair for the floor mats and accelerator pedal then they will order the part which they did. 2 weekends ago and i have to say. My Corolla is tight to the point I look for reasons to get on the hwy!!! SO I can stay centered and go FAST!!!! Sorry if my thread is long but I wanted to let you know my story and let you know Toyota has "The FIX" for the EPS system, but they certainly are not advertising it as I have only heard on the news one time that they were "working on the problem with the Power Steering." The fact is they have new computer boxes for the power steering but they aren't going to advertise it and they aren't going to call you .....YOU HAVE TO CALL THE "TOYOTA EXPERIENCE HOTLINE." Today I'm so so happy with my Corolla and I will remain Toyota loyal!!! but the hubby wants a Mazda 3 after we thought about and test drove a nice little red hot one after the bs I was going through with my 2008 car. So cheer up Toyota people the EPS can be fixed just givem a call:) :shades: :shades: :D
  • spikejr1spikejr1 Posts: 13
    Update - [terceltom] I agree that somone should have contacted me about the "fix" that has been available. Glad to read that [pekelvr] has had a positive outcome with the new "fix". As for what the tech rep told me last March...I dropped the vehicle off at a local dealership so their Regional Tech Rep could investigate. I was called the next day and said I could pick up the vehicle...I had to ask what the findings were! The maint rep that I was speaking to said that all he knew was everything was "ok" and no problems were found. I asked to speak with the Tech Rep that did the work and he "wasn't available". I asked if any adjustments were made, otherwise I was confident that the problem still existed. After pressing the issue, he said that a minor alignment problem was corrected. I asked him to send me a copy of the alignment, along with the Tech Reps name. The "Vehicle Alignment Report" arrived all by itself in an envelope...no other names or info was included. After reviewing the report, I noticed that the top of the report didn't have the VIN, Tech Name, License #, Customer Name, Odometer....NOTHING that would identify this was my vehicle other than the date of service...In fact, it had 2009 Toyota on the report (I own a 2010) so I really doubt they sent me an accurate report...OR, this just tells me the level of interest they really had in investigating the problem...

    As for the NHTSA offer - I have contacted them and they have decided that they do not want to lease the vehicle since they will be opening up the electronics...Also, they do not want to return the vehicle to a private party after that type of testing. Instead, they asked if I would sell the vehicle to them for testing. I am in the process of sending all the information (I have everything from window stickers to maint records) so they can make an offer...I suspect it will be KBB / Edmunds values but we will see. I also asked if they knew about the EPS "fix" and they do...they said that customers have to ask for the fix...Toyota is not sending notifications or "recalling" the vehicles, but they are doing this as a "customer sevice".

    Also, the NHTSA said if I were to install Toyota's EPS "fix" then they would be no longer interested in buying / testing my vehicle...

    If the $ figure is acceptable, I will sell it to them and move on...if not, then I will get the Toyota "fix" and see if that works...
  • biffprestonbiffpreston Posts: 59
    edited August 2010
    I own a 2009 Corolla Le and I am not optimistic about the "fix". I do not believe it will change a single thing about the extremely poor handling characteristics. I believe the technical service bulletin that was issued was not really about a fix but more about a customer service strategy. Take your car to the dealer and they will do an alignment check and check the air in your tires. They will place your car on a high tech machine that will check your alignment. It will inevitably as with practically any other car on any road anywhere in the world register it as being out of alignment to some degree regardless of how minute. The customer service department will come back and tell you they have made some adjustment and that they believe the car is "fixed". It will fool a certain percentage of people. Keep complaining and they might offer to stick a new computer chip in. It's not going to make the car handle better. Relative to what I call a normal car it is still going to feel like your driving in mud or sand. Very sluggish handling. Don't expect to be able to make sharp turns. I do not believe for one instant that the steering wheel will center itself like in what I call a normal car either.

    Something else I would like to say. The NHTSA, you know the very same people that people are complaining to regarding the deleterious electronic assist steering in the Corollas is also very much pafrtially responsible for these electronic steering systems being placed in the cars in the first place. Surprise! The NHTSA is responsible for establishing CAFE standards. Corporate Average Fuel Economy. It's sort of a racket I believe. They set unreasonably high standards that cannot be attained with normal fossil fuel powered vehicles and then the auto manufacturers are fined for not being able to meet the intentionally unattainable standards then the fines are passed on to the consumer. Sounds like a sneaky way to transfer money from consumers to whomever in government gets it in the end. Real honest way to take peoples money. Auto manufactursrs are switching to EPS steering largely in part due to the fact that you get 1 or 2 extra miles per gallon per car with EPS, at the expense of course of having a car that drives like a motorized shopping cart. I'm not sure of the formula but I believe this saves auto manufacturers a little money by increasing the miles per gallons of their cars even by 1 or 2 miles. So people who are complaining to the NHTSA are complaining to some of the very people responsible for the problematic steering to begin with. What do you actually expect the NHTSA to do about it?
  • pekelvrpekelvr Posts: 61
    WOW Im so serious does the forum not post my messages Im wondering...the fix works I have a Corolla and i can testify it worked. Previously I would not permit my grandson to ride in my car and now that i have the new Computer box and I drove in fact all the way from Fuquay Varina NC to The beach on the east coast over a 2 hour car ride Im happy with The fix" i posted it earlier and if you look for it you will see the facts of my testimony. The fix works but you have to call Toyota 1st call the Experience hotline and get assigned a case manager, they in turn call your dealer repair service and tell them to schedule the appt for your car with you. Your assigned a manager at Toyota and they take the car for the day because this fix requires taking out the whole dash. Good luck
  • pekelvrpekelvr Posts: 61
    I think there are 2 discussions going on but under different Forums about the same issues EPS and Steering. Which may be why and I apologize that some didnt get my message about "the fix." I had posted under steering.

    Maybe some would find more info there perhaps and could see different stories also. The fix works and i would testify to it because i had already sought legal representation after my 2008Corolla fiasco and i still have a lawyer because I lost $7,000 when I traded it in for the 2010 that supposedly didnt have the EPS issue. I lost the money and will probably be paying it and the interest for it for the next year or so. Toyota devalued there own vehicles which they KNOW has an EPS defect. they also haven't announced that they have a fix and you have to go to them as their field reps don't contact you. You have to use language like I did which was "my car is going to kill me" and what is Toyota going to do about it?
  • pekelvrpekelvr Posts: 61
    i went to a dealer just to see what my 2010 Corolla Sport model would go for and i have 9,000 mile on it...i was told $13,000 and its a gift...LOL Dont sell it call Toyotas experience hotline and tell them if they dont do something that your lawyer will contact them after the car kills you!!!
  • terceltomterceltom Posts: 1,017
    I think your very mistaken about the real problem in the first place. The Corolla owners that are having this problem are complaining about the inability to keep the steering on line and that the steering is too touchy. I haven't heard one complaint about the steering wheel not centering itself after a turn or not being able to make sharp turns or not even about the sluggish handling, as you describe. In fact, one poster has already stated that after his computer "fix", his car is just fine. Why all the negativity and over statement of the underlining problem?
  • terceltomterceltom Posts: 1,017
    edited August 2010
    I must say I'm somewhat skeptical myself about your story as you keep addressing your problem as an EPS problem when in fact the 2008 Corollas, like yours, were never even built with EPS. You have avoided addressing this question every time it has come up on this thread. Why?
  • terceltomterceltom Posts: 1,017
    edited August 2010
    It does sound like your he**bent on suing Toyota. You sued them for your 2008 now you want to sue them for your 2010.
  • biffprestonbiffpreston Posts: 59
    edited August 2010
    EPS is dreadful period. Regardless of the fact that most of the complaints regarding the EPS relate to difficulty keeping the car mocing in a stright line my car does not crisply or accurately maneuver. Sharp turns are out, a thing of the past. I really wanted a car that handled well. There are a lot of people who absolutely do not care about handling. I do not understand them. I always want a car that handles well on the road. It's rather ridiculous to me not to care.Your life may or may not depends on being in a vehicle with good handling and that is setting aside the comfort and fun of driving a car with good handling I made a mistake in buying my Corolla and I am paying for it with the daily dislike I have for driving it. I can't speak for other Corollas but not for one instant do I believe that any other 2009 or 2010 Corollas with EPS drive any better. At low speeds the steering feels loose and wobbly and at high speeds you really get what I like to call "the shopping cart effect". You struggle to keep the car moving in a straight line. At all speeds whether you are changing lanes or making a turn it feels akin to a car with regular steering with flat tires or a car with regular steering with tires partially submerged in muddy ground. Sluggish. You simply cannot maneuver the car well, it is impossible. I mean something that used to be as simple as making a quick left turn into a drug store parking lot at 20 mph then a sharp right then a quick sharp left into a parking space is no longer possible. You must go very slow with the EPS. It's a lot like senior citizen driving. Painfully frustratingly slow driving wth both hands clutched on the wheel wiggling or wobbling it back and forth and hanging on for dear life.
  • terceltomterceltom Posts: 1,017
    Okay, now your addressing the real problem some are having. It does sound like you have one of the infected Corollas. I on the other hand, have had no problem with my 2009 Corolla XLE from day one. In fact, I not only love the steering of this car, but the handling as well. Sharp, one finger turns are no problem ! Set the cruise, tune the XM radio with 400 watts of JBL power and I'm set. Oh, and by the way, I don't work for Toyota either.
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