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High Performance Luxury Sedans

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  • mac2002mac2002 Posts: 17
    Just curious what was the deal the dealer had for you and for which model?

    I paid sticker for an '01 E55. Put $2,000 down November 8th (ordered it 2 weeks previous), and will be picking it up at Sindelfingen on May 2nd. Included in the price is 15 days insurance for driving in Europe, and 2 nights at one of the hotels chosen for the European Delivery (or two different hotels)

    Anyone on the board here done the Euro Delivery deal? Would love to hear about it. Mac
  • shehzadshehzad Posts: 52
    I did the Euro-delivery plan back in 1990 when I had just bought a new 300sl. It was, in a word, fantastic. I picked the car up from the factory and was given a tour of the factory the day I picked it up. I was then given some temporary type tags, and I was then free to drive as I wished for a good two weeks, and I went through germany, switz-land, belgium, and france. As I recall it, MB only paid for some of my hotels, but they did help me book via recommendation the others, but it's been so many years that I can't remember which, although I do recall that the hotels were pretty decent. The only problem is that after the vacation it took a damn long time for the car to be shipped-I think it was two months or something, and at the time, as the 300sl was a new model with a rather long waiting list, I was really disappointed in the turnaround time. But overall, a great way to buy a car, and you get a slight discount on it too.
  • mac2002mac2002 Posts: 17
    I can't wait to tour the factory. After arriving from the U.S., and making the connecting flight in Frankfurt to Stuttgart, then having lunch, taking delivery of the car, then the factory tour, there will not be much time left to drive on the first day. So, the plan is to stay in the Stuutgart Hotel Inter-Continental the first night, then on the following day make the 2 hour drive to Baden-Baden and stay at the Schlosshotel Buhlerhohe, so that will be the 2 free nights. After that, will probably visit Austria, Switzerland, then France. Plan is to drop car off in Paris.

    I bet it will be tough waiting for the car to arrive at my dealer. 2 months? Seriously?

    Discount? The only thing I save was the $645 destination charge.

    Thanks for your reply, Mac
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    What ever happened to the 300SL?

    M
  • shehzadshehzad Posts: 52
    I had bought it primarily for my wife as a "fun car" for her, but she never cared to drive it. In about a year and a half of owning it, I think we only took the hardtop off once. Moreover, I regretted cheaping out and buying it and not a 500sl b/c the engine was a little weak for the weight of the car. I really should have gotten the 500. Anyhow, since it was still in pretty high demand when I sold it, I didn't lose too much money on it and bought a 911 c4, for myself and not the wife this time, which I still own.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Just curious thanks. Yep the 6-cylinder SL was a little lacking in go power.

    M
  • Does anyone have experience or insight regarding performance modifications to a 1998/99 Jaguar XJR?

    Essentially, I am looking to get the car from 370 HP to ~425 HP. I have contacted an outfit in Bronxville, NY called Eurotek Designs (http://www.eurotekdesigns.com) who indicate that the following things must be done to acheive such a goal:

    1. Under drive pulley and exhaust: ~ $5000. This will get the car to about 450BHp w/ 423lb/ft. torque

    Additional modifications:
    2. Brakes (Brembo): ~ $3,500
    3. Suspension: ~ $900
    4. Gear ratio: $2,300

    These are parts prices, not installed prices. It was explained to me that a reputable Jaguar dealer (Seattle has no such thing) would likely charge $1,200 for installation of the exhaust, underdrive pully and maybe brakes. The suspension and gear ratio are not factored into the costs.

    The brakes, suspension and gear ratio are not necessary for the Horsepower gains but brakes and suspension are recommended.

    The modifications can be done at Eurotek (if you want to pay to ship the car) or at an approved local Jaguar dealer who is willing to do the work (Eurotek will ship the parts). I live in the Seattle area so I would probably find a dealer in California since the Jaguar establishments in my area are such avaricious swine!

    So basically it is possible to add an additional 50-60 HP to the vehicle for under $10,000. If the brakes weren't included it would be around $7,000.

    My question is for the 'real' user community out there to determine if this is realistic and/or recommended activity. Your perspective on this is appreciated...
  • These are all good points: "why would I want more horsepower?". What, with a vehicle that already produces 370 HP. Really, why would I want a car with 370 HP in the first place, the 290 HP XJ8 would probaly suit me just fine - or for that matter my Acura Legend does the job. But no, I want the XJR because I am interested in an automobile that does more than just get me from point A to point B. If I were interested in merely transportation I likely would not be changing automobiles. I want an XJR for the same reason that anyone in the market wants one: very high cool factor, takes the mundane out of daily driving, sporty, yet semi-practical (it has 4 doors, right). Performance improvements stand to enhance the driving experience, further individualize the car and finally, possess the ability to let any BMW M5 know that he is about to be sorely embarrassed if he attempts a confrontation.

    Regarding the warranty, that is a question that I asked Eurotek. Based on their explanation, the changes do not void or otherwise compromise existing warranty on the car. I will be hooking up with a local Jaguar dealer to flat out ask the question. I will post the answer I get. Exhaust modifications would be the most obvious change, doing so does not invalidate warranty. The only other mechanical change is the underdrive pulley which would be undetectable unless a mechanic were looking specifically at or for it.

    Visual modifications - I don't know. I am interested in making changes for a reason. In other words what benefit will I derive if I make this change. Horsepower improvements are clear, suspension makes sense, brakes make sense. But just asthetic changes. I am concerned that it will make the car look too 'pimpy' or 'high school'. The car has such an elegant and understated look to it deserves to be preserved. The only change that I am planning in this regard may be wheel/tire change. Perhaps a 19" Arden/Oz 2-piece wheel. No body modifications are necessary to compensate for this larger wheel. This would be visually striking yet subtle enough to maintain the original character of the car.

    Good observations, thanks for you input...
  • bhill2bhill2 Posts: 1,271
    If you want a recommendation for a dealer to do your modifications or tell you why it's not a good idea, and are willing to take the car to (Southern) California, I would recommend Silver Star (yes, they handle Jags too) in Thousand Oaks. We have bought two Jags from them (the first one got stuffed) and I am very happy with their service and their knowledge of the marque. In fact, ask for Ray Marcuse. What he doesn't know about Jags isn't true. The dealership's number is (805) 371-5400 (Ray's direct number is 5483).

    2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv, 2001 Jaguar XK cnv, 1985 MB 380SE (the best of the lot)

  • As far as interior modifications to the XJR are concerned – none necessary as far as I am concerned. The interior of the XJR is posh and one of the biggest selling points over the E55 and M5 right out of the factory. As far as ‘peakier’ torque, I called Phil at Eurotek (http://www.eurotekdesigns.com) and asked him what to expect if a new rear-end were installed (gear ratio). He said this is the most dramatic improvement for this car and will likely shave about a second off the 0-60 time – indicating that the low-end torque is greatly improved. I visited a new Jaguar dealer in my area that has just opened to introduce myself and took the opportunity to drive a new XJR. Maybe it’s me (and maybe its due to the traction control being on) but the car doesn’t get off the line quite like the M5 – or the E55 for that matter. The new gear ratio (at $2,300 parts/$800 install) will improve this.

    Both Paramount Performance (http://www.paramount-performance.com) and Arden (http://www.arden.de) have wheel/tire packages that include 19” wheels with 255/40 – ZR 19 tires and maintain the 8J wheel width that do not require any body modifications on the XJR. While the Arden/Oz Opera 2-piece wheels are striking, Phil suggested HRE wheels due to their strength and light weight. However, these wheels are pricey at ~$1,200/ea.

    Bhill2 – Thanks for the referral to Silver Star Motors in Thousand Oaks. I gave Ray Marcuse a call yesterday but was only able to leave a message. Hopefully I will hear from him today and can discuss his experience with doing aftermarket modifications to Jaguars to see if the things that I want to do are reasonable or if I am insane. I know that I am not the first to pursue Jaguar tuning (just looking at Arden and Paramount proves this). If the modifications are AMG or Dinan quality I will do them. By the way, what do you mean by "the first one got stuffed" when referring to one of the Jaguars you purchased at Silver Star?

    Warranty issues are still a minor concern and I asked the Jaguar dealer to confirm/deny any issues with this. The service manager wasn’t around to talk to but they suggested that they would find out for certain. I guess what I really want to know is if I do these changes and the engine or tranny explode, am I out of pocket because I put a new exhaust or gear ratio in. Hmmm.... Stand by for an answer.
  • bhill2bhill2 Posts: 1,271
    Sorry for the slang. A driver on a side street forgot there was a stop sign and pulled DIRECTLY out in front of me when I was going about 45 with my wife beside me. Our Jag (XK8) was totalled, but we both opened our doors and walked away. This impressed us enough to go get another. I hope you enjoy Ray, I find him great fun to talk to.

    2009 BMW 335i, 2003 Corvette cnv, 2001 Jaguar XK cnv, 1985 MB 380SE (the best of the lot)

  • wencaowencao Posts: 52
    Just placed a bigger engine into 5-series and E series ? I do agree they are the best sports sedan on market,and demand is so strong. Do you know Chrysler will build its 5.7L hemi power 300N/convertable in 2004, the Hemi V8 engine has the same power as MB's 5.5L AMG V8, 353hp, big torque 393pound/foot at 4000rpm. If DC put the same tranny of E55 into hemi 300, I expect the same performance as E55. However, Chrysler only ask for no more than $40K, half price of E55, M5.
    I agree E55 and M5 are superior in quality and refinement, but are they worth 100% primium ? With stock market buble burst, so does this forum.
  • wencaowencao Posts: 52
    Both the next generation Intrepid and Concorde will be rear wheel drive! While they will continue to be primarily V6 powered, using revised versions of the 2.7, 3.0 and 3.5 liter engines, Chrysler's hot new 5.7 liter, all aluminum HEMI V8 will be available as an option on both models.

    The cars will incorporate systems and components from Mercedes Benz, including: transmissions, steering columns, seat frames and axles. They will also be the first Chryslers to share electronic architecture with MB products.

    The LX cars will have a wheelbase four inches longer then the current LH cars but the overall length will be reduced by over a foot. Both width and height will be unchanged. Wheels will probably be in the 20-inch range and they will ride on wider tires.
  • 4426444264 Posts: 67
    What happens in 3 year's time is anyone's guest but I'm sure BMW & MB will have even more powerful sedans then.

    One thing for sure, Daimler Chrysler isn't going to shoot its own foot by offer a model as good as its best sports sedan at half the price. You don't see Ford doing it to Jaguar, and Daimler Chrysler won't do the same to MB.
  • wencaowencao Posts: 52
    Yes. DC may improve E55 will even better engine or drop a 4-speed to Hemi 300N. I hope they do the first thing.
  • wencaowencao Posts: 52
    Chrysler made supercars, the 300 series, many years before BMW. The "300F special" cars are among the most valuable postwar collection cars.
  • wencaowencao Posts: 52
    but 300N maybe among the best $$$/performance car. That is what I care about. Consider similar powered S600 costs $120K. Do you think those toys(like massage seats) on S600 worth $80K more ? Of course rich people want to buy the high priced to show off. Most guys want to buy best price/performance car.
  • mmcbride1mmcbride1 Posts: 861
    Well said.
  • wencaowencao Posts: 52
    it is the 300N, based on info available now, if DC put the same tranny in E55 to the 300N, 300N(with 5.7L hemi V8, 20'inch wheels and P255 wide tires) will have the same performance as E55. At half price, it is a shame for $80K car that it can not beat a 40K car in term of power,speed and handling ? It is called super just because it is costly ?
  • wencaowencao Posts: 52
    CHRYSLER 300 HEMI® C CONCEPT ? It is basicly the convertable version of 300N. The only IF is what TRANNY will DC put in 300N, 4-speed or 5-speed or manual ? I wish M5, E55 will get better after 3 yrs, while 300N has the same performance of today's E55, enough,that is enough.
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