Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





High End Luxury Cars

11071081101121131156

Comments

  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Well.......

    TLC/LX470 - 235hp
    Navigator - 300hp
    Escalade - 345hp
    Range Rover - 282hp

    I clearly see the inferior engine in the Toyota products. You'll have to do a little better than "hearsay" as far as the RR having engine problems. It's the same engine as the current BMW 540i, thats been around since 1997 so I hardly think it's bug ridden now.

    M
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    Sorry merc, having not owned one, all I have to offer is what my friends who own one have said.
  • ljflxljflx Posts: 4,662
    Inferior horsepower - not an inferior engine. I know two people who have had Range Rovers and they had terrible experiences. One's in a TLC now and the other is in a LX470. They would clearly not share your view as both had engine problems.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    That's all I'm saying too.
  • tasillotasillo Posts: 51
    Please take the comparison of SUV engines to the proper forum. The fact that the RR has a BMW V-8 doesn't make this the place to discuss.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    If hp isn't a trait of an inferior engine then you'll need to explain what you're talking about a little better than coming up with that "I know people this and I know people that" stuff. From a pure engine design standpoint 235hp is pitiful in a class of vehicles that all push 280hp or better. Two experiences CERTAINLY don't make an inferior engine either, not at all. Then I have to ask whether or not you're talking about the new RR, because it doesn't share anything with the previous model.

    M
  • ljflxljflx Posts: 4,662
    I learned a long time ago that where there is smoke there is fire. Everything I've read over the years states that a Range Rover is a trouuble prone vehicle. Then the only two people I know who've had one (one was a 99 and the other was a 2000) have problem after problem. Proof enough for me. Technical prowess and beauty isn't worth much if you can't or don't have confidence in the automobile.

    If I'm going to spend $60k plus on a vehicle I expect perfection or something real close to it. I think in the future you'll see that cars that don't live up to that will lose market share - MB included. People may look past things once but most don't get burned twice.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Thats too bad that you don't realize that new Range Rover is a new from the ground up vehicle and shares nothing with the previous generation. The 1999 and 2000 model is completely irrelevant to the current model. Yes the old model was trouble prone. I'm not sure where the new model stands in the all-important surveys. I suspect its not setting any reliablity records, so I have to ask why even bother looking at one?

    Sometimes (like in this case) I can't believe that you're seriously holding those two cases against such a fine and completely new vehicle. Since you already have what 3(?) Lexuses I think you should really check out something that isn't a Lexus. Live a little. Even I wouldn't have all Mercedes-Benzes if I were in your postion.

    M
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Maserati Quattroporte:

    http://car.kak.net/modules.php?op=modload&name=news&file=- article&sid=1045

    Set to take on the S-Class, 7-Series, A8 and XJ.

    M
  • jagboyxtypejagboyxtype Posts: 241
    I expected it to be a little more volumptuous somehow, probably because of some of the concept sketches I've seen, like the ones below:

    http://car.kak.net/bilder/maserati/maserati_quattroporte03s.jpg

    http://car.kak.net/bilder/maserati/maserati_quattroporte02s.jpg

    http://car.kak.net/bilder/maserati/maserati_quattroporte01s.jpg

    Maybe I'll have to see it in person and get the full effect of mass and proportion, but right now, the XJ and S-Class are my picks for best looking cars in the class. I do like the Buick-like vents along the side (I'm not being sarcastic - I think they really jazzed up the Park Avenue and look good on the Quattroporte too). The way the doors meet the bottom of the car reminds me a little of the 7-Series though, along with the rather bland, blank sides themselves, and that's not a good thing.

    http://car.kak.net/bilder/maserati/maserati_quattroporte04s.jpg

    I really want to like the car, but it just doesn't seem "fresh" or "new" or inspiring enough from these pics to capture me yet. The Maserati coupe/convertible were already a few years old before they came here (well, the coupe and its general styling which transfered to the convertible that was new), and I had already seen the coupe in Europe with the different rear end styling - which was more unique and desireable than the U.S. version IMHO. This Quattroporte carries a lot of the same theme, and I find it a little dated already. The interiors I've seen elsewhere were beautiful though. I think I just have to become more accustomed to it, but Maserati's designes seem bland IMO. Just get a volumptuous Ferarri and be done with it, or a Jag or Merc.

    http://car.kak.net/bilder/maserati/maserati_quattroporte05s.jpg

    I do like the hood proportions and the way the A-pillars meet the body of the car - looks a little Aston Martin to me, but the rest of the exterior of the car dissappointed me.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Yeah I was kinda thinking the same thing. It doesn't have as many curves as I thought it would have. I'll reserve final judgement until I get to actually "see" it.

    Jagboyxtype, what do you think of the new A8?

    M
  • jagboyxtypejagboyxtype Posts: 241
    I haven't seen it in person either. However, I think it has a pretty clean, organized design all around, with a sporty Germanic, machine flair to it. I like how the wheels fill up the wheel wells - Audi has always styled the flares around the edge of the wheel wells nicely, and I like the simple pillar arches and their shapes. The C-pillars taper nicely into the rear quarters at good angles from the rear 3 quarter views I've seen. Overall, I'd say it is a handsome car. But like the XJ, it may be a little too conservative in some peoples' views, though its sheer size (I've read it's larger than the S-Class, 7-Series, and XJ) might give it a lot of presence on the road. The interior also looks to be quite nice in a simple modern fashion as opposed to classic, almost overstated elegance like the XJ - but both come off well. I like the unclutteredness of the car's detailing, and can definitely see how VAG is trying to make the Audis look sporty and upscale v. luxurious and upscale, as the Phaeton fills that role. Truthfully, beyond that, I haven't really given it a whole lot of thought though, so I hope I haven't dissappointed you with my rather skin-deep analysis of the vehicle. Though it's aluminum intensive, I also read that it is still quite a heavy vehicle and that it doesn't feel exactly light the way the other aluminum car here does - the XJ - but I haven't actually checked the weight stats on the cars, so I cannot be sure. Stylistically though, it gets great marks in my book, as do S-Class and XJ (and you know how much I like those, so it's a real complement).

    CAR did a comparison that I gave a cursory glace at, but I did not read the whole article; just the captions for the pictures - and you know what car I was interested in within the group. Didn't the A8 win the comparison? I believe it did, and the Jag didn't do so badly either. They were rather harsh to the Bimmer, saying something along the lines of it trying to scare the Jaguar away with its ugly rear end, and at another point saying that although the XJ was following the 7 in the photo, the XJ was a superior vehicle. I didn't read much about the A8, and that might be its only flaw - it doesn't grab attention so much as the curvy Jag and sleek Mercedes (at least in photos) - even the 7, though not aesthetically pleasing in the traditional sense, grabs your attention. But that is the problem with photographs - the proportions and sheer mass of the vehicle do not come through to create the car's presence, and Audi's styling, being modernized, sporty-simplistic, relies a lot upon balance and dimension for its true effect. A lot of the beauty of the car is in its 3 dimensions.

    For market shars, the other cars it is against also all have names that carry solid reputations: BMW is supposedly "the Ultimate Driving Machine" and the hot thing right now - it is known to be a great drive and technologically advanced to a perplexing degree; Mercedes is more luxury oriented but massively powerful and holds its own in terms of performance, it is to some the ultimate status car and is known to be solid all around with technology under every panel that doesn't confuse the driver like iDrive does, though Command may have to be learned for a few minutes; Jaguar, though with a bad rep for quality (despite being one of the top brands in terms of quality in reality), also carries a powerful name that to some is up there with Mercedes-Benz, it is slightly mysterious being that its numbers are more limited and its world class wood and leather interiors are iconic along with the leaping jaguar hood mascot - from its Le Mans racing history, the words "Jaguar" and "speed" have become synonomous, and the beautiful cars feature styling like no other - they also carry a reputation for having snooty drivers, but the repuation is half of the fun - they are ultra smooth with fantastic rides and perhaps the epitome of refinement. The A8 and Audi, however, are still developing a meaning as I'll call it, and while Audi has gotten a pretty good connotation, "A8" is not as widespread as "7-Series", "S-Class", or "XJ." Maybe this will be the A8 to solidify its name into widespread fame and acclaim; it seems like it is off to a good start.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    See post #2288, I posted some some of the ending comments from that comparison. The A8 did win. They called the Jag a better car than the BMW. High praise indeed. If it wasn't for that dangone Phaeton I think the A8 could really hit the big time here now.

    M
  • jagboyxtypejagboyxtype Posts: 241
    I think if word gets out about the A8 enough, it will get the sales it deserves. Phaeton is a great car, but it is also a Volkswagen - a "peoples' car" - and in this class, people do buy into the image of the car as well as its tangible traits. Audi is already upscale, so the A8 does not face the battle the Phaeton faces of becoming recognized as a real luxury car. But as I said, the competition has solid names already, and this A8 will have to fight to secure its own name among them, as I don't feel the previous one - however marvelous it may have been - was successful, or as successful as Audi would have wanted it to be, at doing that. This one is beautiful and engineered right, so it just may be the A8 that gets the recognition it deserves.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    I do not see the appeal of the VW, speaking of image......
  • jagboyxtypejagboyxtype Posts: 241
    That's what I meant - most people don't view "veedub" as an image car with the same appeal of a leaping cat, roundel, or tristar, but the quad rings of Audi are recognized as a marque with (almost - it still needs to become more widespread) the same appeal as Jag, Bimmer, and Merc, so that is already to the A8's advantage over the VW Phaeton. VW has more image to build than Audi does as an upscale brand = advantage A8.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    I think VWOA is having second thoughts about the uber-peoples-car here, they still haven't said "when". It was supposed to go sale this spring.

    M
  • dwongswongdwongswong Posts: 63
    Hi everyone! I'm new to the luxury car board. I recently got an Audi A6 in February. Since then, I've already put close to 11,000 miles on it. I really like the way it drives--comfortable, fast enough for me, like the way it looks, and feels safe with the quattro. I've owned three BMW's before I finally got the Audi (a friend advised me to get one). Though I did research on it and found out that it had many, many bad reviews on the Audi board, I went ahead and purchased it after seeing it in person.

    The three BMW's that I owned (I still have a 2000 model), all have had numerous problems with them. The first was a '94 525i. I spent an extra $11,000 on the car fixing it after the car overheated and killed the engine. Plus, the glass fog lights kept breaking every few months whenever a small rock hit it. The second was a '00 323Ci. I had to replace the speakers, amplifier, wood trimmings, instrument cluster, outside temperature gauge and door moldings (twice). The 2000 328Ci that my wife drives has had the VANOS intake system, wood trimmings, and door moldings (twice also) replaced. The only reason I haven't traded it in is because my wife likes the way it looks and likes to drive cars until it is at least five years old. A BMW specialist told me recently that BMW's are not made to be owned more than 60,000 miles. They are sprinters; not marathon cars like Japanese vehicles.

    I've been following the news about the 2004 Audi A8 L every since I first saw it at Autoweek.com. It's the best luxury sedan I have ever seen. I even sent AudiUsa.com an e-mail telling them how in love I was with it when I saw it. I wish that I could afford one, but not in this economy right now. Maybe someday.

    For those of you who don't like Japanese luxury cars, I tell you this--no car, in general, will last as long and as easy to maintain as the Japanese brands. Many of my relatives and friends own them, and they all have never had any complaints about them. They may not look as good or drive as nice as the Germans, but they are fine cars if you intend to keep them for several years.

    If there are any owners out there who like or dislike their luxury cars, please post on this board or e-mail me at dwongswong@yahoo.com telling me the likes and dislike about these fine cars. I want to know so that I can have an idea about what luxury car I want to get next. Also, if there is anyone who just got the 2004 A8, please let me know about your experience.

    Thank you! And as always, drive safely out there.
  • benzownerbenzowner Posts: 20
    why don't you try a mercedes there very good cars too.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Try asking on the A8 board, I think there are two people there that just got new 04' A8s.

    M
Sign In or Register to comment.