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High End Luxury Cars

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Comments

  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    Any growing Lexus has to do has nothing to do with Audi, which has no buzz, no hype, and it's tuner cars are either overpriced (RS4) or underwhelming (S8). And the R8 is nothing to get worked up over.

    DrFill,

    your above statement proves you have not read much or heard much or driven in any Audis lately. Your statement reminds me of the quote below:

    The great threat to the young and pure in heart is not what they read but what they don't read.”
    Heywood C. Broun, 1910
  • sysweisyswei Posts: 1,804
    They don't even offer a manual in the top performance car, yet all others do.

    Does MB?
  • blkhemiblkhemi Posts: 1,717
    MB does not either. But all of that will change when the new '08 C350/63 bows this fall.

    But Audi offers 6-speed manual from an A4 2.0T to an RS4. So does BMW.
  • drfilldrfill Posts: 2,484
    Oh, that's right. I forgot! :surprise:

    Audi is the one with the winning strategy! They are the true ballers!

    Make base cars nobody buys, then make uber cars nobody buys!

    Why didn't Lexus think of that! Darn fools!

    I guess you missed the part when I said no buzz, because I would only listen to Audi news when there is buzz.

    And here we are. :confuse:

    We need to work on a yawning icon. Right away!

    DrFill
  • blkhemiblkhemi Posts: 1,717
    The current MBZ C350 is available with a 6-speed manual. That leaves the IS350 as the lone ranger.
  • blkhemiblkhemi Posts: 1,717
    After all of the Lexus hype of world domination only to see a value dud once again, I'm with you, we need a yawning(or napping) icon.

    And here we are. You've finally come to a point where you've aired out your dirty laudry with Audi to realize them for the true "ballers" they are.

    Gee Doc, I didn't think you had it in you.
  • Lexus is like a 2-Liter soda. Fizz all the way, for about 2 days, and it's as flat as Kansas from then on.

    I am sure you are talking about VW/Audi. Just look at their US market share percentage for the past 30 years.
  • drfilldrfill Posts: 2,484
    Slap on an Audi emblem.

    Yawning? Audi news, or sales, release.

    DrFill
  • But to call Audi negligible, a brand whose std. AWD has forced the hand of even the prodigious MBZ to at least offer it

    blkhemi, MB had 4-matic for a long long time. And who doesn't? BMW, Infinity, Lexus and Acura all have it. And they all sell more than Audi. In that sense, MB's move is not toward Audi, but actually aimed at BMW and Lexus (in North American, that is).
  • laurasdadalaurasdada Posts: 2,487
    Luxury automobile owners rated Cadillac a solid first place as the brand that delivers the best customer experience in the 2007 Luxury Customer Experience Index (LCEI) survey of Automobiles from the independent New York-based Luxury Institute (www.LuxuryInstitute.com). Lexus and Acura placed second and third, respectively.

    http://www.marketwire.com/mw/release_html_b1?release_id=210784

    '13 Jaguar XF, '11 BMW 535xi, '02 Lexus RX300

  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Nothing! What platform can be shared between MB and Chrysler without dilluting the prestige of MB? Did Zetsche's Chryselr advertisemnts about German engineering help Chrysler sales? No, not at all.

    Supposedly the idea is not to share platforms but to develop a range of V6 engines that can be shared between Chrysler and M-B products, with the Mercedes cars getting some reserved features like dual VVT or direct injection. Chrysler has a really old and uncompetitive iron block OHV V6 used in the new Wrangler and the minivans, and some OHC ones that are also lousy.

    What Chrysler needs is good products. The PT Cruiser and the Pacifica are old news, and no one asked for or wants the Aspen. They have the 300 and thats about it, and that car will not sustain them forever. They also need to admit to the fact that sales aren't what they used to be and stop pumping out cars so they can sit on storage lots. Ford is in very bad shape, but at least they know it. Chrysler seems to be taking the "cover your ears and shout LALALALA!" approach.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    And who doesn't? BMW, Infinity, Lexus and Acura all have it. And they all sell more than Audi.

    Infiniti started offering AWD in '04, Lexus and Acura in '05. Only Subaru's commitment to AWD goes back as far as Audi's. For the record, Acura's only AWD car is the RL, and its sales are much lower than the A6's.

    I don't buy the "Lexus is great, Audi stinks" argument. Audi does not stink. Just saying "look at the sales numbers!" over and over doesn't mean anything. The Audi A6 despite its lower sales in the US is a much better car than the poorly executed GS. The A4 is at the end of its life cycle. The next one will most likely beat up the IS pretty badly.

    The 4Runner, Sequoia, and TLC and their Lexus cousins are 20th century. Toyota had better develop a full-size unibody platform and fast. Even Ford and GM have beaten them to the punch. How often does that happen?
  • ctsangctsang Posts: 237
    NEW YORK, NY -- (MARKET WIRE) -- February 05, 2007 -- Luxury automobile owners rated Cadillac a solid first place as the brand that delivers the best customer experience in the 2007 Luxury Customer Experience Index (LCEI) survey of Automobiles from the independent New York-based Luxury Institute (www.LuxuryInstitute.com). Lexus and Acura placed second and third, respectively.
  • Thanks, appreciate the info. Sounds like actually getting into one could be the hardest part. No snow where I live, so whatever I get will have to be the daily driver. Heavy rain is the only nasty weather in my area.
  • This is only February 07; the new S class has been on the market for less than a year, in a 6-8 year model cycle. Does any of us really believe that the price premium can be maitained this time around, when previous cycles saw massive discounting? "This time it's different"?? I'm not born yesterday. I was reminiscing a similar debate on a different forum half a year ago when some other posters were berating GM management because Ford Mustang and Chrysler 300M were selling well in their first model years. I pointed out back then that the new model price strength can not last, and Ford and Chrysler were in even deeper trouble than GM; how did I know that? past experience. Likewise, what the new S class can command in the first few months of its 6-8 year model cycle, especially before the release of the new LS, can not possibly persist. The discounts routinely available in previous model cycles are much better indicators of what holds true for S class in the bulk of its model cycle. Like I said, I'm not born yesterday.
  • sure there will eventually be discounts on the S class. Maybe there is already.

    I'm pretty sure Lexus is not immune to this either. After my Taste of Lexus experience, I immediately received a coupon for $750.00 off a new LS, or any other Lexus I wanted. Big deal, everyone wants a discount.

    That's what Lexus is, a discounted, less passionate Benz.[maybe a little more reliable, but who knows these days]
  • Lexus is a luxury brand in any market that it has presence, because Toyota brand has the rest of the market covered. MB is a luxury brand in the US. In Europe, the most prevalent sighting of an MB is a taxicab, not an S class or even a loaded E. Selling more C, A and B classes in the US would not contribute to MB brand image in the US. That's where Chrysler may come handy: help amortizing MB R&D without diluting MB brand with more C and A/B econoboxes.
  • Sure, almost every model eventually offer discounts. What is rather unusual about MB is the drastic discounting that exist after the first model year (of a 6-8 year cycle), especially through financial engineering (interest rate and residual manipulation) that make the real cost of getting one of their cars much much less than what the MSRP's say. Just to give a hint of how massive such discounts are like, S320's were eventually discounted to $400/mo! That's the price of an ES/IS250, not even IS350/GS, much less LS.
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    Supposedly the idea is not to share platforms but to develop a range of V6 engines that can be shared between Chrysler and M-B products, with the Mercedes cars getting some reserved features like dual VVT or direct injection.

    Sounds wonderful for Chrysler doesn't it? But how wonderful is it for the MB brand itself? Is it mere coincidence that the few MB fans in this forum have put their heads in the sand regarding this news item? (except Tagman) . Every MB fan knows this is bad news indeed!Stronger MB support for Chrysler is like killing the goose that lays golden eggs. Initially the former DCX CEO Juergen Schremp wanted to share technology between Mitsubushi and Chrysler. Such an idea was not a bad idea at all but unfortunately their ties with Mitsubishi have been severed. But now there are strong rumors about platform sharing between MB and Chrysler cars and SUVs. That is definitely not good news for MB's exclusive image, dont you think?

    Back in the 90s BMW realized that the only way they can save Rover is by sharing more engineering with Rover. Fortunatley BMW realized that such closeness is too close for comfort and would harm BMW more than benefit Rover itself.

    Ditching Chrysler like BMW ditched Rover is the only healthy solution Dr. Zetsche is faced with right now.
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    S320's were eventually discounted to $400/mo! That's the price of an ES/IS250, not even IS350/GS, much less LS.

    Thanks for the history lesson but the MB S320 is as relevant as my 83 MB300D is today. In other words that $20K MSRP difference between the current S Class and LS is as real as real greenbacks can ever be.
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