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High End Luxury Cars



  • airmaticairmatic Posts: 54
    merc1: maybe you should read this article (it's not too long)

    for now, i think i'll stick with my S430
  • stehersteher Posts: 37
    And u take this article for serious?
    With an BMW-advertisment below?
    Ha ha ha!
    When all people would make their buying decisions depend on such articles, then - Goodnight!
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    I have to ask the same question as the poster above. Autospies will say whatever the REAL automotive sources say, just like the bunch of followers they are. They are without a doubt the worst website for automotive information. Do you ever notice how their "inside" is usually info already known to everyone, and/or it's already in print in a real publication like Autoweek. Autoweek can't be topped for prompt and accurate news delivery, autospies is garbage. Some examples:

    "The SL55 is being canceled for 2004".....they even posted a made up lie about a customer that said: "When I tried to place an order for a 2004 SL55 I was rejected and was told I could put a deposit down on a SL65, which per my salesman replaces the SL55 for 2004". Not! The SL65 hasn't even been officially announced yet, better still Mercedes would never, ever cancel such a car in it's SECOND model year. Absurdish rubbish.

    The SL is getting a cloth top for 2004. This is even more absurd than the above.

    I find it rather pathetic of them to post what C&D said and then agree with it, knowing they've never driven the car.

    You owe it to yourself to drive the A8 before writing it off. Car and Driver's test car appears to have been suffering from a software glitch concerning it's suspension. The rest of their article really didn't say anything bad about the car, they more or less weren't "wowed" by the car. They mainly harped about four things" 0-60 times, styling, ride and it not being the lightest car in the class. That last point I somewhat understand because it's actually heavier than at least one of it's competitors (S500 4Matic), so that kinda makes one question why they should put up with buying an aluminum car if it isn't lighter than the rest, by a significant margin. The Jaguar XJ shows a clear weight advantage by using aluminum. However the A8's styling and ride are both very debatable, especially since their car was suffering from a glitch. It's 0-60 times are a little behind the S500 and 745i, but it's still within the class, so I don't see the big deal there either. I guess by now you realize I really like this car. Check out Edmund's review of it.

  • airmaticairmatic Posts: 54
    i joined this discussion simply for the sake of pleasure, to learn information, and share polite thoughts and ideas. not to be attacked.

    merc1- well guess what? i HAVE SEEN And TEST DRIVEN the new Audi A8L (actually, several times; one of them is my neighbors; and the other time a close-friend). and i will be driving it AGAIN for the THIRD time within A MONTH.

    although it a beautiful sedan, it just doesn't meet my expectations, in terms of styling and creativity. they really could have made more bold and interesting design, but i guess they decided to "play it safe" and be more conservative. even the Lexus LS430 looks just as uninteresting and boring as the A8L, in my opinion.

    face the facts, even the editors at didn't particularily like the design of the rear. .html?articleId=100355&editorialpage=photo.html

    as for autospies-
    it's obvious that autospies isn't a website that's accurate or true, and i know that. for the love of god, i was simply offering you a link to an interesting story.

    steher and merc1-
    i don't appreciate it when people insult my intelligence.

  • libertycatlibertycat Posts: 593
    has the features, room, power, and handling to compete with LS430, 7 Series, XJ Type, S Class, and A8. It simply is a value at its low price. It has the features like a great stereo, lots of room, luxurious interior, voice recognition, back-up camera, etc. And boy does it have a powerful engine, Wow! It really is only $5,000 under a LS430.
  • fsvfsv Posts: 196
    Q45 vs M45 - M45 is so-o-o pointless, in my opinion - I wonder, what resale on it will be...
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    What in the world did anyone say to insult your intelligence? I guess you took my post as arguing?? That surely wasn't what I meant or was trying to do. I didn't know you drove the car so good grief calm down. If you had already driven it then why even reference a roadtest when yours is the one that counts?

    There is nothing to "face" by Edmunds not liking the rear of the car, who cares. They can't tell me or anyone else how a car looks to them....someone is way too touchy about this.

  • stehersteher Posts: 37
    My post was never ment to insult your intelligence! I only asked you, if you take this article for serious?! In my opinion, good discussions consist of facts and figures and opinions (positive & negative). But listing up all the negative aspects of a car is very easy, and shows also, that knowledge is limited (I mean not your knowledge airmatic!!). I'm sorry, if my post has "attacked" :-) you, but if someone shows such links, he must be able to deal with such posts like mine and merc1's!
  • fsvfsv Posts: 196
    and this is supposed to be discussion projested by the spirit of the car being discussed - calm and relaxed - and where it is, this spirit? Hey, guys, let's be emotional ONLY re. the cars. Peace. Frieden. Cars.
  • fennfenn Posts: 197
    Everything is subjective. I personally like the way that the new A8 looks. It is not exactly revolutionary or edgy... However, I am not sure that seeking a revolutionary look or design is what makes marketing sense in the 70k luxury car segment.

    I find the A8 to be clean looking and sleek for a big car. IMHO, much more so than the current LS 430, which Lexus is going to update a bit in the fall.

    I have driven the A8 a couple of times, and really like it. It is not a thrill ride, but it is a great driving vehicle for a big luxury car. I am also "wowed" by the interior, which is where I am going to be sitting most of the time.....

    For those thrill seekers that want a big Audi that thrills: wait for the S8 next year!
  • fsvfsv Posts: 196
    Don, what was/is the actual gas mileage on your Q's - my Lincoln LS was burning much more comparing to what they said it should be burning... And how bad was the maintenance so far?
  • libertycatlibertycat Posts: 593
    M45 makes perfect sense, shame on you, J/K. But M45 vs. Q45 is just like GS300/430 vs. LS430. Different prices, different classes, different objectives. Q45 is a direct LS competitor, M45 is direct GS competitor.
  • fsvfsv Posts: 196
    Is it again emotions flying, or it's only me?
    M45 is pointles; as opposite to any well executed car that makes a statement as the benchmark in styling, handling, performance & engineering sophistication. M45 is, may be, not a bad car by itself, wouldn't be out there and prior to it's existance Q45; in this situation, with Q45 being so poorly advertised and undermarketed, a car, that has the same size, same engine, same performance, nearly the same interior, and pricetag nearly 20G's lower (in real sales prices) + the car is plain ugly + still lagging behind against it's competition such as BMW540, Audi A6, Lexus GS400 is pointless. You have one excellent car, that is still a lame duck in sales, and now you put on sales floor nearly the same thing - which sells even worse, but competes with your own struggling flagship... And you have to discount this car nearly 20% - it is a killer for the image of a luxury brand. Situation is not like BMW745/BMW545 (or is it 540?) - same engine which is adequate on the bigger car makes smaller car speed demon. It is simply very awkward situation. The only good variable here is that C. Ghosh is still running Nissan, and this situation hopefully will not last long, and he'll straighten it out. M45 is not more than a placeholder for the market segment (I believe it is built on the japanise Sima platform(hope this is correct name), and Q45 in the current form will not last long, and previous gen. Maxima fate is awaiting them - soon better cars will replace though good, but uninspiring current cars. And, we should hand it to Ghosh - look at the parade of Altima, G35, Maxima, coming Titan, Murano. It's not a big deal, to make a mistake, as long as it is corrected promptly.

    P.S. don't misunderstand me - I love Q45 and already love M45 for them being excellent cars, that have devastating depriciation in two years. Better than that could be cash given to me only...
  • aramusaramus Posts: 5
    After work today, I am taking delivery of a 2003 Q 45. It is the 5th Q 45 that I have leased, starting with a 91. They have all been exceptionally reliable cars and I have enjoyed each one. The 2000 that I am returning, looks and drives as if it was new.
    One thing not mentioned in any of the posts concerning the comparison to other luxury cars is the large difference in the real cost of a lease. I will be paying approximately 2/3 the price of a lease of a 745 or a S 500. The way I see it, I'm getting a car that is 95% or more of the competition, at a bargain price.
  • fsvfsv Posts: 196
    Aramus, congrats, good choice, enjoy the car!!!
    If I may ask, what are the lease terms?
  • fennfenn Posts: 197
    Congrats to Aramus... .... I think that the current Q45 is the best bargain on a lease basis. Lots of content at a great price. I really like my 2002 Q... The only reason that I am looking to jump ship is that I do not want to drive the same exact car for another two years, and the Audi and 2004 Jag XJ8 are very appealing....

    As for the M45, there is no doubt that this was not a long term development project. It was a "quickie" new model based on an existing chassis and components. It is a price leader in its class for the HP that it offers....... It is a decent car that has a very nice big V8 engine, at a good price.

    Yes, Libertycat, you can compare an M45 to a Q45 as a comparison of two different model classes, much like a GS series vs LS series Lexus... However, both Lexus models underwent their own independent development and evolution. The M45 is more of a late comer, built from the Nissan/Infiniti parts bin. It has a Q45 engine and dash put into a 5 year old Nissan chassis. The car had to live with the limitations of the body size and chassis, so interior is cramped, and the trunk is small.....I am not really trying to knock the M45. I am just saying that it is not "the state of the art" car that Infiniti needs in this class. Worse yet, putting so much of the Q45's good stuff in a cheaper car only hurts the current Q45.

    When the "new" Infiniti comes out with the 2005-2006 replacements for the Q45 and M45, I am betting that you will see some fresh ideas and innovation.
  • jagboyxtypejagboyxtype Posts: 241
    "The only reason that I am looking to jump ship is that I do not want to drive the same exact car for another two years, and the Audi and 2004 Jag XJ8 are very appealing...."

    Here's the latest from Car & Driver:

    2004 Audi A8 4.2: - - id=6853&page_number=1

    2004 Jaguar XJR: id=6849&page_number=1

    Just a note on that XJ, the color in the C&R pictures is not a standard available color on the XJR - "Quartz" is only available as a standard color on the XJ8 and Vanden Plas; the tested XJR had a $1,000 extra for its special custom paint. Don't ask me about the logic there - the paint is a standard color on every other car Jaguar produces.
  • dwongswongdwongswong Posts: 63
    Here are my ratings of what luxury cars I would like to have:

    1) Audi A8L
    2) Mercedes S500
    3) BMW 745Li
    4) Mercedes E500
    5) Lexus LS430/Infiniti Q45 (tie)

    My ratings are based on these criterias:

    1) exterior looks
    2) interior looks and feels
    3) quality of fit and finish
    4) bang for the bucks
    5) reliability

    I would have ranked the Japanese cars higher if they looked as good as the Germans.

    My rankings for luxury suv's:

    1) Range Rover
    2) Lexus LX470
    3) VW Toureg
    4) Porsche Cayenne
    5) BMW X5 4.6

    I also wanted to say that this is a discussion on cars. It is based on ones' opinions and experiences with the cars. Some people take these opinions too seriously. Remember this is based on subjectivity. Your opinion is right for you, and my opinion is right for me. There really is no right or wrong. If you like the car, then good for you. If you don't, then say so so that others can view your opinions and make a judgement on whether to purchase the car or not. There is never a need to take a harsh tone with anyone. I've been on the receiving end as well as some of the others that I have read on the board. As always, drive safely out there.
  • jagboyxtypejagboyxtype Posts: 241
    Well, my own tastes in cars differs from your own in terms of these luxury cars - though I respect your opinion. But I can totally relate on that last part - very well put; I agree 100% with you there.

    You all would probably say I'd choose the XJ-Series as my favorite of the bunch, and if that is your guess, you are correct. However, I don't dislike any of the cars of this class either - okay, the trunk on the 7 is not to my liking, but it is a nice car even though it's not my favorite; I see no point in hating or disliking any car, though being apathetic is understandable. For SUV's, I actually like the Cayenne - despite all of the criticism aimed at it - and the Range Rover, but that's for another board.
  • libertycatlibertycat Posts: 593
    The Q45 has full-size leg room while the M45 has mid-size front and compact rear leg room according to reviews.
  • ksurgksurg Posts: 48
    Sorry I didn't mean to say you can't be rational and have fun. It's just lately some of the posts are getting brutal. There's a lot of subjectiveness when it comes to rating cars. I remember when JDP evaluated initial interior quality based on number of imperfections. Ever compare a hand made car with quality leather to a plastic and vinyl interior. I have and guess what... the cheap interior was "more perfect." Though Toyota may indeed have captured the hybrid market there is other technology on the horizon. And especially as things stand now, no one manufacturer has the auto market cornered. I hope for all our sakes the competition continues. I'm glad you like Lexus, merc1 prefers MB, DonFenn votes Jaguar and bmwseller sells BMW. You are all well informed, savvy consumers. All I was trying to get across is people have different tastes and that's OK.
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