Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





High End Luxury Cars

15795805825845851156

Comments

  • bdr127bdr127 Posts: 950
    Facts, and only facts. The last go-around meant before the recent and upcoming new designs. I personally know several people who picked G over E46, including several sedan buyers over the past four years and a coupe buyer only a few months ago.

    So is that "factual evidence" or "anecdotal evidence", then? Sounds like the latter.... How about we use the actual sales numbers from BMW's and Infiniti's annual reports. We'll use 2004 numbers, if that's okay...

    BMW 3-Series: 98,615 units sold
    Infiniti G35: 71,177 units sold

    Even if I take out the 3-series convertibles and wagons (which Infiniti doesn't make), BMW is still at 81,904... and that's not even including about 8,000 M3s sold last year.

    Now we've got the facts.
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    with even greater urgency than before.
    No person in his right mind who can afford a 330i picks the G.

    I can only conclude that the 71,177 people who bought or leased the G in 2004 did so because they simply couldn't afford to move up to the ultimate driving machine which is the amazing and incomparable 330i, the undisputed leader in the entry level luxury performance sedan category.

    As for myself, I would rather spend another year or so saving and sacrificing to purchase the 330i sometime in the future then to drive such a weak imposter now.
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    What is your point with these lease numbers when they have no relation whatsoever with the 2800CS successor called the BMW 6 series.

    A MB S350 in USA?. They certainly dont sell any S350s in Canada so I am quite amazed that a single S350 is selling in hp hungry USA.
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    The only reason I love BMWs now is because I think they are the best driving sedans. And I strongly believe the BMW e90 will remain the benchmark vehicle in the future.

    Having said the above I can assure you that if I test drive a second generation G and I find it the best among all my test drives then I will buy a G. An unlikely scenario, but you never know?
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Interesting that you've already written the '07 Gxx's obituary, since nobody but Infiniti even knows anything about the new car yet.

    "Nobody will ever be able to displace BMW"

    Thats a pretty rediculous statement to make. Even you know how close Infiniti got to the "invincible" BMW 5 series with the M. The 540i dominated every comparison test it was in. The new 5 in almost all cases has lost to the M. The previous 3 was also essentially given the #1 spot in every comparison test. The '07 G could very well follow in the M's footsteps and become the darling of the press. The IS350 is already faster than fabulous 3 series, and I have no doubt that Nissan will make sure that the next G is faster than the IS350.
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    They pay me the big bucks around here to be provocative and stimulate debate.

    It's doubtful that the new G will be displacing the 330i in sales or performance.
    BMW has taken a great car, the 330i, and made it even better. All the car mags acknowledge this.
    BMW is not resting on its laurels and never will. Infiniti will always be playing catchup.

    The M "beat" the 5 in comparos because the former is considered to be an outstanding value.
    Every car mag that picked the M over the 5 has acknowledged that the "losing" 5 was the better performer.
    I thought these car mags put performance at the top. Obviously another agenda is at work here.

    Motor Trend in its November issue picked the 545 non-sport over the M45 sport!
    It's good to see honesty finally returning to a comparo. Performance was paramount in this comparo.

    Where is the integrity when a car mag shows off a Maserati on page 37 that none of us can afford ( and they all do this over and over, ad nauseum) and then proceeds in a comparo on page 83 to praise the M as "number one" because it's a better "value" than the 545 and yet admits the 545 wins in every performance category. Road & Track did just that and it made me sick.

    I remember a few years ago the car mags were singing the same tune when the G came out, that is was an outstanding value and hence "beat" the 330i.
    People are smarter than that. They drove both and the sales reveal that people are willing to spend a little more because with BMW, you do get what you pay for.
  • BMW 3-Series: 98,615 units sold
    Infiniti G35: 71,177 units sold


    In other words, roughly 20k 330i vs. 71k G35. Yes, I know a lot of 325 poser buyers.
  • Hey, don't ask me why; ask MB. All I know is that North America market is a little bigger than that of Canada alone.
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    A bit of accuracy would help if you want to make comparisons. Your G35 and BMW 3 series sales figures are both wrong.

    G35 November YTD sales = 62,507
    BMW 3 series Nov YTD sales = 96, 358

    A 54 percent difference is quite a difference dont you think?

    G35

    BMW 3 series
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    Hey, don't ask me why; ask MB. All I know is that North America market is a little bigger than that of Canada alone.

    Thanks for answering a question I never asked in the first place. The MB product range in Canada is larger than that of the USA. MB Canada sells the B Class and Smart cars.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Hey you can talk about discounting until forever, but the LS430 doesn't outhandle the S-Class. Period. Switching the subject doesn't change this, nor did I say the S-Class was some kind of sports sedan either. Spinning and twisting won't work here brightness.

    M
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    #1 in what regard?

    Prestige.

    Most MB's sold today are not even in the luxury price range today, much less high end luxury luxury, thanks to all the discounting.

    Bull, plain and simple. Did it ever occur to you that the current S-Class is being discounted heavily because uh...in about 45 days a new version goes on sale?

    M
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    If I were Infiniti, I would be tearing apart a Quattroporte, and copying everything. That car absolutely sets the benchmark on how to make a full size, super-lux sedan that is also a blast to drive. Not even the 7 comes close.

    So refreshing to see a "lexusguy" liking a car like the Quattroporte so much. I know you don't like Audis, but I think the S8 will give the Maser a run for its money, though it still won't be as exotic.

    M
  • Your G35 and BMW 3 series sales figures are both wrong.

    Please follow thread before making accusations. Those numbers were not mine. They were quoted from bdr127's post regarding 2004 sales. As for G35 vs 3, please note:
    (1) only 330i is really relevent; 325i is a poser mobile that has no counterpart in the G; 325i accounts for something like 70-80% of 3 sedan sales
    (2) I never claimed G outsells 3, only that many would-be 3 buyers bought G instead in the last go-around, so your point that the new 3 (especially 325i) outsells the long-in-the-tooth G35 is quite irrelevent.
  • I can only conclude that the 71,177 people who bought or leased the G in 2004 did so because they simply couldn't afford to move up to the ultimate driving machine which is the amazing and incomparable 330i, the undisputed leader in the entry level luxury performance sedan category.

    You can conclude whatever you wish. My conclusion was that, until the arrival of the 2006 model year E90 330i in the Spring of 2005, BMW 3 series was way underpowered when compared to the G. Also, the E46 was too small when compard to G. Performance sedan is by definition a compromise . . . an entry level luxury performance sedan is more so . . . different people simply make different compromises.
  • I don't think 330i ever outsold G35. 3 series sales over-all is 70-80% in 325i. No one in his/her right mind would claim 325i (E46 or E90) out-performs G35.
  • Thanks for answering a question I never asked in the first place. The MB product range in Canada is larger than that of the USA. MB Canada sells the B Class and Smart cars.

    Thanks for reminding us how far from prestige MB has descended. Don't get angry with me. You are the one who try to deride me for talking about S350 before knowing that it actually is sold in North America.
  • LS430 out-handles variants of S-class quite well. Have you driven an S600 lately? Quite a porker indeed. Spinning and twisting won't work here indeed, M(itsbishi).
  • Prestige.

    Prestige my you-know-what. Massive discount in pricing is reflective of massive loss in prestige.

    Bull, plain and simple. Did it ever occur to you that the current S-Class is being discounted heavily because uh...in about 45 days a new version goes on sale?

    LS430 is being replaced very soon as well; do you see 30% discount on them? Of course not. Is R class being replaced soon? Is E class being replaced soon? Both MB models have massive discounts. "Bull, plain and simple."
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Dude the LS430 doesn't outhandle anything in this class. Nope, haven't driven a S600. Now one minute the LS430 doesn't compete with the S600, but now it does? I mean which is it? If I were to bring up that a S600 would blow the doors off a LS430 it would be seen as desperate and what not, yet you feel the need to bring up that LS430 could (in your words) outhandles a S600. Thats wrong too because the S600 has standard ABC suspension that is stiffer than the Airmatic setup on the S430/600 models. The S600's suspension is closer to the S55's and we all know a LS430 doesn't have a prayer of out handling a S55.

    To make matters even worse you can't even get a LS430 with its wannabe Euro option. A Euro LS430 is more exotic than a VW Phaeton.

    M
Sign In or Register to comment.