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High End Luxury Cars

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Comments

  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    People lived in Florida long before AC.
    It builds character (if one doesn't die from dehydration first).
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    So it has to drive someone out of business to be better. Wow.

    Yes competition is alive and well even in the luxury markets.
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    No, unfortunately. Of those who made the pilgrimage, and BMW fanatics are urged to go to Munich once in their lifetime; from what I recall, quite a few of those pseudo-enthusiasts ordered their cars completely loaded.
    I'm shocked that the mother-factory would actually allow this.
  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    Mercedes is not being driven out of business for goodness sakes and neither is BMW. Lexus is good, but NO one should expect the ENTIRE Luxury market to consist of only Lexus's. That's ridiculous. Heck, if I were to waste a bunch more money than I already do, I'd have a couple of Mercedes, BMW's, Jag's and MAYBE even a Lexus in the garage. Why? Because each has it's own unique credentials.

    For example, will a Lexus outperform a BMW on a tight twisty country road? NO, IT WILL NOT! Will it give a sumptuous ride without many visits to the shop? Yes.

    Lexus is better at some things and BMW is better at some things, Mercedes is better at some things, etc., etc.

    I try to respect you Lexus guys for having certain feathers in your caps, but do not try to steal away the ones that rightly belong to the other marques. Credit where credit is due.

    TagMan
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    It builds character (if one doesn't die from dehydration first).

    I guess this is why all serious performance cars should have cup holders. It's good to have character and be alive at the same time.
  • ljflxljflx Posts: 4,661
    Tagman - it wasn't us who suggested that. It was Dewey who said MB and BMW would be in Jaguars shape if Lexus was really good. Thus the comment back was that the need to drive someone out of business to prove yourself is a ridiculous position to take. Seems like something got lost in translation.
  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    Hey, ljflx . . .I've been thinking about trying out one of those TemperPedic beds, y'know with the memory foam and all that, but now that I've seen the back seat of the LS460L with that LazyBoy recliner with the built-in massager, maybe I'd actually get better ZZZZZZZ's in the back of the Lexus. Gosh, I knew that car might be good for something!
    TagMan
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    Isn't it funny how BMW can design such sophisticated vehicles, yet the ergonomics of a simple cup-holder still eludes them?
  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    I agree. see post 12982
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    It was Dewey who said MB and BMW would be in Jaguars shape if Lexus was really good.

    Is that what I said? I dont think so?

    Found in translation
    Your view was that the Lexus LS is not only cheaper but equal or better than German offerings.

    My view was that if a cheaper Lexus LS was really better than German offerings then the Germans would have serious problems like Jaguar.
  • oacoac Posts: 1,594
    Tagman:

    ".... get better ZZZZZZZ's in the back..." ... "LazyBoy recliner" ... "TemperPedic beds".... Were these same reclining feature not on an MB Maybach 57 or 62 ? But the LS460L can provide this for a whole lot less $$$, than a Maybach. I'd hope the S550 can try to match the LS460L in this area...

    Maybe I am missing something cos I forgot what all the noise is about ? What exactly is the point you German car fans are making about the new LS460 ? I have lost touch with what the beef about this car is ??? Why not just promote the heck out of the Bimmer 745/750 and S500/550 ? There is no need to bash Lexus to make anyone feel good...
  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    oac, I was joking, not bashing. Really. RELAX!
    (It truly DOES look comfy)

    Heck, if we can add the DirecTV that ljflx was joking about, then we can watch Monday Night Football on ESPN next season in the back seat! C'mon now . . . lighten up.
  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    Seems that the Lexus folks have decided to call the long wheelbase model the LS 460 L Vanden Plas . . . it comes with the Grey Poupon AND a little sushi, being from Japan.

    What do you think, oac?
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    As far as Lexus cars looking alike, if you look at the cars, in profile, they definitely look much different from each other. The GS has a more rounded profile. The IS is full of particularly sharp styling cues, and is heavily starched, without becoming an Acura TL. The LS falls in between. So I'm not seeing it either, Merc. A crease here or there, but that's it.

    Oh I didn't think you would, though in the pics its obvious from the rear. I agree that the GS doesn't look the same from the side. Thank goodness the LS and IS don't have the humpback whale look of the GS - its awful looking from the sides.

    And the ML has obviously learned quite a bit from the original RX300.

    HA! Small problem, the ML came out BEFORE the original RX300 so this statment is just flat out false regarding styling.

    M
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    The previous S had a sleek tailored look that was very attractive. The new S seems to revert to the bulky style of the S preceding that one.

    First part of this is true - I agree. I passed a 2006 S500 Sport this morning in Pewter, absolutely gorgeous. However the new car doesn't look nearly as bulky in person as the 1992 Blitzen Benz S-Class.

    M
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    But let's say you're right (for the sake of arguement, and I'd still like to hear an unbiased opinion for instance from designman), and the Camry is a clone. What makes it ok for the S to copy the Maybach butt, but not ok for the Camry to copy the LS butt?

    I guess it is acceptable when a German company does it, but not acceptable when a Japanese company does it?


    Yeah its more acceptable for Mercedes to take cues from Maybach because for one the Maybach was to be a "Mercedes" in the first place. Remember the original concept from the Tokyo autoshow in 1997? Secondly, the knock your fellow Lexus fans heaped on MB (and others) was that they made their cheap cars look like the least expensive ones. Well the S taking cues from the Maybach is the opposite. Big difference from that to a LS430 looking like a overfed Camry. Huge difference!

    M
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Merc1 may not like the styling but everyone else does.

    Everyone? Try the NYT likes the styling. They in no way, shape of form speak for "everyone". Is this the same "source" that had a writer that said something ridiculous about liking a Maxima more than LS430?

    M
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Try look at 1989 LS400 and 1989 420SE side by side. The 420SE with its busy grill protruding like a tumor is positively ghastly and the rest of the car was replete with 80's boxy designs. Whereas the LS400, by the looks alone it can well be a car made today, with all its cleanly flowing lines.

    I already gave you that the original LS400 was a rounder car, but it doensn't look anything today to my eyes. Just a large Toyota. True the W126 S looks like it was from another era because it was, having debuted in 1979.

    Strangely enough I agree *somewhat* about the original Audi V8 and the original LS400 - that agreement being that they were both rounder than the W126 S, though the Audi was no curve presentation either. However Audi being a nobody doesn't have anything to do with them being the one to usher in the Aero theme with their 5000 model. This had a lot of influence on a lot of cars including the original Ford Taurus.

    Going back to 1906 really doesn't make sense to me so you can have that one. Hell if we're going to go back that far then why not 1886? Really silly IMO, we're talking about modern day car styling.

    Don't know enough or care enough to get into a ridiculous arguement about semis and who copied who.

    M
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    oac - when you say "dethrone", what exactly are you referring to?

    Yeah I'd like to know too. The only S-Class model the LS has "dethroned" has always been the entry-level model. I have never seen a S500 lose a fight to any LS model. Secondly the "S-Class" isn't just one car, it is a group of cars and to beat the S-Class you have to have something at the top to compete with the upper models, which is why Lexus is going for their faux "LS600h" to do battle at the upper end. When you look at the big picture the LS is hottest car in the segment (by sales) in the U.S, but worldwide the S-Class is still the segment leader by far, and if the S-Class isn't (as some say) then its the A8.

    M
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