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High End Luxury Cars

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Comments

  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    You're likely right, but a diesel hybrid is going to be a mightly expensive car. I mean Mercedes can sell one at the S-Class level, but at the E-Class level it would be ridiculously priced out of the E's market segment making it pointless IMO. Diesels already cost a little more than their gas counterparts, then adding a hybrid system....$$$$$$$ :surprise:

    M
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Place your bets while the going is good folks!

    A - 80-90K
    B - 90-100K
    C - 100K and beyond

    I vote B.

    M
  • Impossible I say. If Lexus wants to go in 100K plus territory it will have to offer something more than a V8 or V8-hybrid.

    Something which will compete directly no cylinders barred with S600.

    Thats just the nature of the market. A V8 or a hybrid-V8 wont do here.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    That statement is going to set off alarms!

    M
  • I vote A

    and I throw an open challenge to anybody who votes any other than A. You will lose! Thats as assured as the sun rising from the east tomorrow morning.
  • It wont exceed 430 hp. On the other hand I suspect all the benefit of extra power will evaporate if the power to weight ratio is not better than LS 460 L.

    Ask any Ferrari or Porsche engineer and they will tell you that its not power but power to weight ratio that matters.

    Thats why S65 AMG shows very little improvement over S600. Even edmunds admits it.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Thats why S65 AMG shows very little improvement over S600. Even edmunds admits it.

    Nah I think its traction in the case of the Benzes with their superhero torque.

    M
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    A timely article on hybrids.

    It really does touch on all the points made here by everyone I think.

    M
  • sysweisyswei Posts: 1,804
    Well I'll only speak for myself, but when MB introduced the 7-speed I think I said something like "Yes, I want one, the mileage and acceleration will be slightly better but I think there are diminishing returns...the benefit of going from 6 to 7 is less than that of going from 4 to 5."

    I don't think I exactly trumpeted the 8 speed in the LS460 as being a major revolution, maybe other people did.

    And I hope you'll admit that going to effectively infinite gear ratios as in the CVT of the LS600 is a "bigger" jump from MB's 7-speed than MB's 7-speed was versus its competition at the time of introduction.
  • sysweisyswei Posts: 1,804
    I also vote B. My guess is the base version goes in the low 90s and the fully loaded (reclining back seat etc) near 100.
  • sysweisyswei Posts: 1,804
    Fair enough and I wasn't aware of some of that, but Nissan only went as high as a 3.5-liter, 2WD version.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    No, not you...it is never you it was other Lexicans...!

    And I hope you'll admit that going to effectively infinite gear ratios as in the CVT of the LS600 is a "bigger" jump from MB's 7-speed than MB's 7-speed was versus its competition at the time of introduction.

    Possibly after it comes to market, but CVTs don't feel normal to me and they're pretty much no fun at all IMO. I suspect that is one reason (along with new power levels) that the LS600's CVT is dual-mode or whatever they're calling it.

    M
  • sysweisyswei Posts: 1,804
    Dual mode, two-stage, whatever, they haven't explained what that might mean.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    I suspect it will be something to counteract the normally lifeless feel/operation of a normal CVT with an extra mode for high-speed, big-hp driving that this car will no doubt be capable of.

    M
  • sysweisyswei Posts: 1,804
    That makes sense, a "normal" and "power" setting.
  • drfilldrfill Posts: 2,484
    that makes it double tough to speculate on 600 prices!

    As I've said before, I expect the 460 to be just under $65k, and $80k loaded. Add $5k for LWB.

    And the 600 would probably be $90-95k.

    I would get right under $100k, personally. I don't see it being more than $5k more than the most expensive 460.

    DrFill
  • british_roverbritish_rover Posts: 8,476
    They did that several years ago an dhad to develop a lot of technology on their own to do even that.

    They do a 3.5 liter AWD now in the murano although that is a transverse engine and transmission mount.
  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    I Vote B.

    I'll have a little more fun and guess the base price will be: (drumroll)

    $91,350.

    If it ends up coming in less than 90K, I'll nickname the car "The Predator" . . . cause that would be predatory pricing, no doubt.

    TagMan
  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    a diesel hybrid is going to be a mightly expensive car. I mean Mercedes can sell one at the S-Class level, but at the E-Class level it would be ridiculously priced out of the E's market segment making it pointless IMO.

    Good point. Heck, even the AMG version of an E can put it into questionable territory, IMO, at a tad over $82K.

    merc, BTW, the official pics of the new C are very encouraging. And, believe it or not . . . it's NOT a clone. Mercedes will have a good volume car in the new C, without a doubt. It seems to me MB is on track. :)

    TagMan
  • ljflxljflx Posts: 4,665
    That's why I said it's a free market research period. But the problem here is that in order to judge the interest accurately one needs to give some bandwidth on price.
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