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High End Luxury Cars



  • guestguest Posts: 774
    I don't care what Tag says about you, I think you're doin' a hell of a job! You can take a hint with the best of 'em. ;)

    Now that the wake is over, and Dewey is back into the fold, let's talk about the High-End again!

    I just noticed that the Merc GL in the commercial doesn't have power lumbar? What's up with that? :confuse:

  • designmandesignman Posts: 2,129
    Tagman, this is in response to your post #74 in the thread that just got shut down.

    Even though my original '97 Boxster was underpowered, I regret that I sold it. Since yours is an S, what other Porsche would you really consider, unless you need the power of the turbo?

    I’m considering all Porsches from 1988 up to the 997 Carrera S. The exceptions are the 944s and 928s. That’s a lot of cars.

    In addtion, you've already got the cabriolet, and the mid-engine. The Cayman, while better, wouldn't be enough of an improvement, IMO, to lose the drop top. Cayman doesn't even have a sunroof. Already owning the Boxster S, there's little reason for a Cayman here, IMO.

    Cayman is a longshot for me even though it a fantastic car. If I go coupe I think the Croc has to wait in line behind a lot of 911s. The drop top was very important with my purchase of the Boxster and it cost a lot less than a 911 cab. As it turns out, if I had bought a 993 cab as I had originally planned, it would have cost considerably less in resale, but with the Boxster I got an impeccable driving car with the 4-year warranty, in addtion to the mid-engine experience which is necessary for anyone who considers themself a well-round Porsche aficionado.

    Is your Boxster S in good condition? Why sell it?

    It’s in great condition. Why sell it? Remember the movie Close Encounters where there was the craving to get to the encounter? I’ve had this craving for 911s for over 30 years. I’ve driven many of them through the years but never owned one. It’s manifest destiny.

    Could you consider waiting two+ years for the all new 911? Now THAT could be a real reason to make a change.

    Two years is a long time. I could get a lot accomplished with the quest by that time and it may be more desirable to start in the past and work forward. Not sure. Too bad buying and selling cars is a bigger hassle than doing so with stocks as Blkhemi alluded to, although the way some people go through cars you would never know there is any problem. Lastly, Porsches have changed so much through the years in terms of mechanics and driving dynamics. All true Porsche fans want that experience and knowledge of the marque—the historical perspective and understanding of its great sport engineering. Close Encounters, Tag. I guess I’m building the butte with topsoil in my backyard.

  • houdini1houdini1 Kansas City areaPosts: 5,767
    The above quote is from Merc back on Nov. 27, 1999! The 3rd post of 20,928! Looks like you were wrong on that one Merc!!
    Thanks Pat.

    2013 LX 570 2010 LS 460

  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    I'll probably just delete it shortly - there certainly isn't much in there about cars!! ;)

    You can untrack it to get it off your list. I promise nothing new is going to be posted in it. Ever!! :shades:
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    To answer something you posted in that other place, hosts' profiles contain their email addresses and their profiles are always linked at the top of the boards/discussions they host - so they are always available.

    And you're welcome. :)
  • hpowdershpowders Posts: 4,269
    Thanks. I will use the power mode when I drive the LS460.

    Hope this thread doesn't metamorphosize into something "new and improved" before I get back! :surprise: :P
  • deweydewey Posts: 5,243
    Based on the following quote it seems MB is taking reliability a bit more seriously than before expecially in the case of their new S Class :

    Lab workers put each new model's electronics system through a battery of 10,000 tests that run 24 hours a day and take three weeks to complete. One favorite tactic: Simulate what happens when a driver hits buttons all over the dashboard willy-nilly at the same time. "We try to come up with every strange situation possible," says Dieter Serries, Mercedes' head of development testing. Mercedes used the technique to ferret out more than 1,000 errors in the new S-Class, including one where the blinkers didn't function when there was no air conditioning system in the car. Says Zetsche: "You can find 99% of the glitches before a car ever hits the road."

    Unfortunately MB has a great cost disadvantage when compared to BMW and Lexus:

    But Mercedes still has a long way to go. Its costs per vehicle are as much as $3,800 higher than for comparable BMWs, says Ferdinand Dudenhöffer, director of the German Center for Automotive Research at the University of Gelsenkirchen. Much of that difference could be made up by standardizing design and manufacturing and sharing more parts, but Mercedes is a good five years behind the likes of BMW and Toyota Motor Corp. (TM ) in this arena.

  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    I don't care what Tag says about you


    What's this? You've GOT to be kidding.

  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    Remember the movie Close Encounters where there was the craving to get to the encounter? I’ve had this craving for 911s for over 30 years. I’ve driven many of them through the years but never owned one. It’s manifest destiny.

    I completely understand. I'm very close to a 911 myself. But it would be my second 911 and my third Porsche. I've had a deposit in place for a few weeks now . . . 911 Carrera 4S Targa.

    So, I DO understand.

  • It's good to see everyone is still around. The changes have been confusing to say the least. Thank's Pat for speaking up and keeping a good thing going....
  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    Thank's Pat for speaking up and keeping a good thing going....

    To the point. Thank you's are in order here.

    So . . .




  • garyh1garyh1 Posts: 386

    Hi Dewey. Nice to hear from you. I too went into "read-only" mode for a while (just to be clear to everyone, not boycotting, just fell about 1700 messages behind while on vacation and never able to catch up; now Pat has given me an excuse to skip over the last 1700 messages! So if I say something already covered or miss some allusion to a previous post, please forgive me).

    Thanks for that link to the BusinessWeek article. I raised the question in that other short-lived forum (HELV or whatever) that nobody has really answered: is the still low ratings in CR for S more based on the average of the past 3 years (which includes '04-'06), so that any improvements made in '06 got overshadowed by the well-documented problems in '04 and '05? I'd like to believe that the earlier 2 years masked any significant improvement in the last year of production; this becomes very relevant if I wanted to consider a lightly used '06 some time in the future.

    Anyway, I am still hoping that MB has really righted themselves with the quality of the W221. This line from BusinessWeek gives me hope:

    Since electronics problems peaked in 2002, the number of flaws has dropped 72%, to about one per car. And warranty costs are down by 25% this year. "It's about doing things right 1 million times over," says Mercedes Chief Operating Officer Rainer Schmückle.

    But boy, all you have to do is look at the online "reader's comments" following that article and you see how far MB has to come to win back previous owners.
  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    So, Dewey you are back. Now that you've got that beautiful new BMW, we're not supposed to talk about it. :(

    Oh heck, keep us posted on it from time to time . . . I'm sure a little blurb or two won't destroy the forum. ;)

    Quote from BusinessWeek:

    But Mercedes still has a long way to go.

    Y'know . . . BusinessWeek is a great magazine, IMO. I subscribe to it, and love it. Remember that article about BMW I posted recently? That was also a good one, IMO.

    That quote from the article you posted makes us realize that while MB is on the right path, the final benefits won't show up for a while yet. But it is good news, nonetheless . . . especially in the wake of the recent CR report, which can't be helpful as it extends the poor quality reputation, even though it is more of a historical data report as opposed to a current one.

    Fortunately the current reliability is likely improved beyond what the CR report would have us believe.

    That should mark the end of those bad CR reports for MB, as future reports should start to reflect the current improvement . . . finally.

    Edit: I see garyh has made a good reply. Nice to see he has made it back to this HELC (?) forum.

  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Would you believe that 1999 mesg was posted after another forum change? This board, the former HELM, now HELC isn't the original board for this type of chat. There was another board before this one and when it was closed it took some time for people to fome over to this one, the one we almost lost!

    Thanks Pat!

  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    I'm betting on the new W221 S-Class to get some good marks next year, but I still have no faith in the Bama made Benzes. For some reason (still) Mercedes-Benz USA, Mercedes-Benz in Germany and MBUSI still won't spend the money to make things "right" at the Bama plant. In just reading owners posts on MBWorld the new R/ML/GL are much better than the original M-Class, but that doesn't say much because the original was likely the worst Mercedes in history when it came to reliability and build quality.

    True the new ML, R and GL (in that order) are built pretty well physically as far as their interiors and bodies go, especially the GL, but there are still many posts about problems with suspension (on models with Airmatic), nav systems, and even transmissions. That latter of which I don't get because other Mercedes' (E,S,SL,CLS,CL,C350 etc.) use the same tranny and there have been very few if any problems. Someone is still pinching pennies in Bama it showing up once again.

    Now with the GL450 Mercedes made a curious decision regarding Airmatic. Every other Mercedes that has Airmatic (S550, E550, all CLS models, E63, ML63) have the adaptive damping standard, but the GL450 has just airmatic with no adaptive damping standard, to get it you have to order the off-road package. That is the only major difference between the GL450's airmatic and say the S550s, and the GL450's airmatic has been troublesome and the S550's isn't. The MBworld forums on the new S-Class has no reports of any problems and some of these owners now have over 10K on their cars. Total opposite to when the W220 was introduced.

    With the new X5 BMW produces the same level of fit and finish here as they do in cars made in Germany. Why Mercedes won't (because I know they can) do that is beyond me. Oh well I'm not in charge of the plant. Why the ML and R have the old 5L V8 is beyond me also, a ML550 or ML450 should have been a given ditto for the R. Hopefully they'll do an early 08' model (next spring) with a sligh re-fresh next spring with the new V8(s).

  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Dewey and tagman - please go to the BMW 335i 2007 discussion if you want to talk about his new 335i. Sylvia was very serious about having to stay on topic. Please don't put me in a bad position.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Good to see you! :D :D :D

    (Tagman, I knew drfill was kidding, btw.)
  • tagmantagman Malibu, CaliforniaPosts: 8,441
    Thanks, Pat.

    BTW, since you're "lurking" about :) . . . you had suggested twice on the short-lived HELV/C forum that you have never objected to different body styles, so long as they were high end. Does that mean that I can continue some discussion with Designman regarding our Porsche quests, and with lexusguy about the high end suv's?

  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    If others don't object, I don't either.
  • sysweisyswei Posts: 1,804
    Why the "management decision" to change the title from "Vehicles" to "Cars", anyway?
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