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Pontiac Grand Prix - 2000-2005

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  • Hi,
    I've posted before (#3955), but didn't get any help. Same car, an updated question.
    I think I have eliminated just about everything, except the ignition switch. I even tried a new key with the same resistance as the original one.
    Someone once told me, you can eliminate the resistor on the ignition key if you measure the resistance in ohms across the key (1.13k in this case), get an inline resistor, cut a wire from the ignition switch and install the resistor.
    If anyone knows of this method, could you please post. Also, if this is the case, would I have to remove the resistor on the key itself.
    Thank you for your time. Mike.
  • Well, if he waits long enough, that stupid person will say "ok". I will check around. I am taking my Aurora out tomorrow to show it off to prospective dealers. I hope it doesnt snow.

    My cousin told me I should buy a Dodge. I test drove the Magnum Hemi, but that is as far as I go with that.
  • hammen2hammen2 Posts: 1,313
    Huskerfan, I have a '98 Aurora, and will soon have my second '04 GTO (first one had some unique problems, GM has agreed to exchange it for another), so I'm familiar with the pro's and con's of the Aurora.

    I've had Impala rental cars and been extremely unimpressed with the interior quality. I also had an '05 Grand Prix rental for a week while my GTO was in the shop, and, while I wasn't super-impressed with it at first, it kinda grew on me after awhile. I still like the exterior appearance of the 1997-2003 models (wife had an 01 GTP) better, but the interior of the 2004-2005 is much better.

    You might consider the Bonneville GXP - Northstar-powered, Aurora-sized, with seats from the 2001-2003 Aurora, but a lot sportier (18" wheels, sports suspension, et. al.). You should consider the GTP - my wife's car was VERY reliable in the 3 years, 39k miles we owned it. There is also an upcoming Grand Prix GXP coming later in the 2005 model year, with a 5.3L V8.

    Strongly suggest you go over to the Real World Trade-in Values board over in the Finance discussion here on Edmunds, and find out what your Aurora is worth. My guess is you'd do a lot better if you went private-party...

    --Robert
  • Hi,

    I have the dealer going to the St. Louis auction on Thursday. He has found a '04 GP GTP "factory special event" car with only 8k miles. He is going to call me from the auction to let me know about the pirce, says it's a good time of year to buy.

    As for the Aurora, he thinks he has a buyer waiting in the wings. It's a win, win for everyone if the price of this GTP is reasonable.

    I will post here what I end up getting.

    Kelly
  • Well, the Bonneville comes with what I would call a downtuned Northstar V8. Not too shabby. But nothing high performance. I was going to say the Grand Prix will have a V8 soon but I think that will still be FWD. I think the deal with FWD is that it just plain costs less. They save on materials and labor costs and stuff like that. And I think you get a little more room in the cabin.
  • Sure it cost less especially when your sharing the same platform with the other GM models (ex..le sabre, impala....).

    Wouldn't be nice if Pontiac made a Pontiac. No more sharing of parts platforms and engines.

    How bout a 4 door RWD, V-6 with 250 hp and a optional 350 hp V-8(made by Pontiac only for Pontiac) mated with a 6-speed gear box and shod with 18" fat sticky tires.

    Make it look good, engineer it like a BMW (handling, suspension etc....) and build quality of a Japanese car. Build the car here in the states, not importing them from Australia.

    Pontiac would sell a ton of them.
  • ocmike3ocmike3 Posts: 232
    GM confirmed it, and Car & Driver in their January edition have a short take on it.(page 37) "Displacement on demand" 5.3L V8 @ 290hp & 325lb-ft torque. Per what I've read this is about the hp/torque limit s for a FWD. Its also 15hp more than the Bonne GXP.
    I looked over and sat in a Bonne GXP last weekend. Some interior upgrades - suede insert in seats, "carbon fiber" like trim, white face gauges... even with the V8 not sure it is worth the $5k mark up over the SLE. I sure hope Pontiac is smarter about procing the GP GXP.
  • I know what you mean but it will probably never happen. American car companies still don't get it. They would have to do things like you are talking about and they are not quite up to it. Actually they could do it only it would cost $50K.
  • ocmike3ocmike3 Posts: 232
    hmmm... that must be why they dropped the SSE Bonne - not enough delta between the SSE & GPX. The GP GTP w/ comp G has magnasteer, stabilitrack...
  • I am seriously considering buying a Comp G GTP. In fact it is parked in my garage right now. Any thoughts, comments would be helpful. My last car was a 1998 Buick Regal GT, which was great except for a few electrical problems. I am trying to decide whether the GTP is worth trading my 2002 Envoy for..
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,541
    “I am seriously considering buying a Comp G GTP.”

     

    Well, I have driven a CompG (shortly after the intro., quite a while ago now) and spent a couple of days recently driving a GTP (non-CompG) rental in Colorado with my daughter. And I owned a ’97 GTP for approx. 3 years.

     

    Depending on your time-line, and what you really want out of a new vehicle, you may want to wait until the new (long rumored) GXP actually hits dealers. Sounds like that will be early 2005.

     

    With a 5.3L V8 (and a different exhaust system – that I expect will allow some measure of the characteristic V8 heterodyne beat to escape) with (Est.) 290 HP / 325 TQ, all the CompG equipment, a beefed up trans., etc. – this new model / version may interest me.

     

    According to GM, 18” wheels / tires and Bilstein dampers will be included – and a stiffer rear stabilizer bar. Upgraded disk brakes. It will be almost a half inch lower.

     

    My understanding is that this all aluminum V8 weighs less than the S/C 3800 V6. With a bunch more Torque and DOD, this may prove to be a significantly improved drivetrain.

     

    And rumor has it that the pricing will be little (if any) more than the CompG.

     

    Although an optimal drag race style start will likely be problematic with such TQ numbers (with a 3.4” pulley on my ’97 it certainly was) the pull through the gears for highway merging and passing ought to be improved over the S/C V6. We’ll see.

     

    We certainly live in interesting times.

     

    Again, depends on exactly what you want and when you want / need to make a change.

     

    - Ray

    Waiting . . .
  • dan165dan165 Posts: 653
    I love my GP GT and it's been trouble free but I fear you will take a pretty big hit on your Envoy?
  • I had a 2000 Maxima which I loved, pressently am renting a GT1 until the GT2 comes in. (1st week w/ car) Pros and Cons: I love the low end torque of the Pontiac, the interior feels a bit rubbery and cheap. The radio knobs (volume and tuner) are not lit, right next to each other and both same size and feel. Never hit the one I want. Car handles better than the tires equiped with. Seat is very comfortable. I ordered the sunroof option which I was surprised actualy costs more than the leather option. Never saw that before, but could only order one (company car) and find sunroof more fun to have than leather. Not sure that was the right choice but never the less. The windows are very short and confining copared to the Maxima so thought Sunroof would open up the space a bit. The rental has 14k on it and the front tires are half worn. Just my observations so far.
  • jcat707jcat707 Posts: 168
    If I had to choose between a sunroof and leather interior, I would choose the sunroof everytime. For some strange reason, I just love them.
  • gunitgunit Posts: 469
    Personally I think a 5.3L V8 would be too much for the midsized front drive W body platform the GP utilizes. Can you say horrendous torque steer? The 3800 S/C V6 is already the limit on this platform.

     

    As for the Bonny GXP, that platform was designed to use a V8, same platform as the Caddy. Nice car the GXP is, but not worth nearly $40k. GTP is just as fast if not faster 0-60 and 1/4 mile with a V6 and $10k less !!
  • gunitgunit Posts: 469
     

    <<<<As for the Grand Prix's reliability Consumer Reports gives the Grand Prix's with the base engines a bullseye for excellent reliability. However they don't recomend the 04 Grand Prix's with the supercharged engine>>>>

     

    "The Grand Prix is a mediocre sedan. it's ride, rear seat comfort, and 20mpg overall fuel economy aren't up to the levels of MOST competing sedans. The V6 is fairly quick but NOISY. Taller drivers may find headroom insufficient. the rear seats are very CRAMPED" Consumer Reports January 2004 Review summary.

     

     

    CR never gave ANY model of the GP a "bullseye for excellent reliablity" The only year the GP was above average in reliability was 2002. The 1997 & 1998 GP are on their list of used cars to AVOID and below reliability.

     

    To my knowledge CR has never tested a Supercharged GTP, only the normally aspirated 200hp GT1 and GT2 in their car review of Jan. 2004. They never tested a 1997-2003 GTP either.. only GT. .

     

    Actually the normally aspirated 3800 V6 has the weak plastic intake manifold which is known for leaking coolant, where as the supercharged 3800 uses a metal intake manifold that lasts much longer.

     

    I have had a 1997 and 2002 GTP. The 1997 had many problems..most fixed under warranty. My 2002 is doing pretty well... only 1 problem in 2 yrs now.. knock on wood. Much better car. I have now learned my lesson buying 1st year cars.. my 1995 Aurora V8 was pretty problematic too.
  • tek3tek3 Posts: 20
    CR rated the non-supercharged GP as one of the ten most reliable sedans. Interestingly, they rated the supercharged version as one of the eleven least reliable. I'd be curious if anyone knows of any specific problems that earned it this rating.
  • ocmike3ocmike3 Posts: 232
    Reading through the article it states that Pontiac had to do some engineering on suspension and front end to accomodaqte the V8 and transaxle. Torque steer might be a bit of a problem with all the V8's torque. Pontiac uses the same V8 & transaxle in the Bonne GXP which I've read handles the torque steer pretty well.

    My 2000 GTP had enhanced traction control which did a good job. I've driven lesser powered FWD cars that handled the torque steer terribly. (Hang on and fight to keep a straight line)
  • mrrogersmrrogers Posts: 391
    I agree with you that CR never gave the Grand Prix the highest reliability rating in their annual car issue each April. However they have an annual buyer's guide that comes out every November, and the most recent guide gave the Grand Prix the highest reliability rating.

          Now that the Grand Prix is built in Canada at the same plant where the Buick Regal was built, the reliabilty ratings are as high as the Regal's. My 2004 Grand Prix GT has 49K miles, and all I have had to replace are fluids and filters. It has not been back to the dealer once.
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,541
    &#147;Reading through the article it states that Pontiac had to do some engineering on suspension and front end to accomodaqte the V8 and transaxle. Torque steer might be a bit of a problem with all the V8's torque. Pontiac uses the same V8 & transaxle in the Bonne GXP which I've read handles the torque steer pretty well.

    My 2000 GTP had enhanced traction control which did a good job. I've driven lesser powered FWD cars that handled the torque steer terribly. (Hang on and fight to keep a straight line)&#148;

     

    Perhaps I have missed something here (I only stop in this Forum occasionally) but the Bonne GXP uses (essentially) the old FWD SLS version of the Northstar 4.6 L V8. DOHC and all. . . Likely pretty expensive to produce.

     

    The Grand Prix GXP uses a very different OHV V8. Cost to adapt to this applicateion, not trivial, I expect &#150; but perhaps cheaper to build in volume.

     

    The increased torque can certainly be an issue when trying to accelerate around a (slippery) corner.

     

    And I expect that it will not result in particularly impressive 60&#146; times, if drag racing numbers are important to you. I expect that an aggressive launch will be tricky.

     

    OTOH, this boost in torque makes the wide ratio 4-speed automatic (as opposed to 5 or 6 ratios) somewhat more palatable (to me) - and keeping the Grand Prix final drive at 2.93 (Bonne GXP is 3.7 &#150; one reason their highway fuel mileage is not very impressive) combined with DOD may produce reasonable highway fuel mileage.

     

    But driving the beast will tell me more.

     

    - Ray

    Still interested in a test drive . . .
  • ocmike3ocmike3 Posts: 232
    Yeah, I was confused on the Bonne motor. It will be interesting though to see what Pontiac decides to do with the Bonne GXP.

    At the PDX auto show in 2004 they had a special GP show car with a 5.3L V8 which the GM Rep said was never likely to be built! Sounds like somebody changed their minds....

    Anyway, I'm looking forward to testing one as the practical side of me has me shying away from the GTO or the Bonne GXP.
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,541
    With DOD (DoD?) and a much less aggressive final drive (than the Bonne GXP), I am wondering what the EPA highway mpg will be - as well as "real world" mileage at cruise.

     

    The Bonne GXP at 17 / 24 is not impressive (to me) - and postings seem to indicate that 24's about as good as it gets.

     

    I wonder if the GP GXP will match the CompG - at 18 / 27 - or even better?

     

    And if Job #1 is in March, I expect that magazine reviews will start hitting the streets in February.

    - Ray

    Just wondering . . .
  • I always felt the "dual" exhaust with the twin split again outlets looks real tacky. Saw a nice looking single outlet version on a 2005 was wondering if only on base model. I have 2005 GT2 ordered and I think the spec says dual stainless exhaust. I don't want to drive a vacuum cleaner around, may have to cut off and put on single tips.
  • I purchased 2004 Grand Prix last year when 1st come out. If you ask me do I like the car! yes I do it is a pretty car, best performance , best handling, best acceleration, fun to drive, but the build quality realy needs to be tighter especially under the hood and the chasee. In addition Gm must look at the steering wheel again and make it tighter. don't let them fool you with megna steer the wheel overall is loose. Some driver may not notice this issue. I am trading this car for Chrysler 300C, or InfinitiG35, or Accura TL. When Gm build this car better, I will be again the first buyer.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    sindibad: I HIGHLY recommend you have a long test drive in a Chrysler 300 before you buy. I drove one for a week in California in September (I am a former owner of a Pontiac Grand Prix GTP, among other things).

     

    I own a Ford Five Hundred, NOT a Chrysler 300. There are many reasons, not relevant here. But you REALLY need to give that 300 an extended test drive before you jump out of the Grand Prix.
  • dan165dan165 Posts: 653
    Anyone here see pics of the new 06 Impala. Optional SS V8 with DOD. My next car may be a Chevy.

     

    Anyone know if the V8 in the upcoming GP is the same?
  • Yes the Grand Prix GXP starts production in March with the same 303HP engine.
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,541
    &#147;OTOH, this boost in torque makes the wide ratio 4-speed automatic (as opposed to 5 or 6 ratios) somewhat more palatable (to me) - and keeping the Grand Prix final drive at 2.93 (Bonne GXP is 3.7 &#150; one reason their highway fuel mileage is not very impressive) combined with DOD may produce reasonable highway fuel mileage.&#148;

     

     - From my post of a few days back . . .

     

    Perhaps I need to clarify this. For those interested:

     

    I believe that the final drive of the GT/GT1/GT2 Grand Prix is 2.93 or 3.05 (C+D).

     

    The CompG / WS6 package includes a change in final drive ratio to 3.29. Not a huge difference, but approx. 10%. Primarily to further enhance acceleration, I expect.

     

    The GXP reverts (?) to the same 2.93 ratio as the GTx-s. (I hope it is re-engineered to handle the additional torque &#150; as the trans. reportedly is.)

     

    In combination with the increased TQ and HP of the V8 (compared to the S/C 3800) I expect that this will result in better acceleration than the CompG (mid- or low-14s?) but potential for slightly better &#147;real world&#148; highway MPG as well &#150; between the DoD and the 10% lower RPM required at cruise. (More with the 18&#148; wheel / tire package? I did not check the rolling diameters . . .)

     

    Drag Strip launches (and even any aggressive acceleration with the front tires pointed anywhere but straight ahead and / or less than optimal surface grip) will likely be a challenge. But a freeway ramp merge may be pretty entertaining.

     

    Just my opinion. We&#146;ll see in a few months.

     

    - Ray

    Wondering if an overnight extended Test Drive will be available . . .
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,541
    2nd gear start is part of the current CompG WS6 RPO.

     

    If this is also part of the GXP package / option, this would mean that one could start in second gear at 0 mph and shift to 3rd at (looking at the gearing of the current CompG and the GXP) something close to 98 mph??????

     

    More relevant (?) speculation:

     

    With this gearing and HP / TQ, it looks possible that the GXP with 303 / 325 could be a (very?) low 14 second SS Quarter. And may hit the traps at the top of 2nd gear &#150; again at approx. 98 mph. Current CompG (260 / 280 HP / TQ) = 15.0 at 93 in C+D test.

     

    - Ray

    Well &#150; it was raining during lunch time . . .
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