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Audi A6

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Comments

  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    LOL! I guess they might as well try to hook 'em while they're young. At least assuming papa will pay the price!
  • bargamon1bargamon1 Posts: 110
    Good shopping! Your epic is, well, epic!

    I can't say I disagree with your logic. I just can't figure why you felt is so important to get a rear spoiler?

    LOL, You need not answer that one!

    Good luck with your new vehicles! It has always been important to not just get the right car, but to feel your being smart about it also! :)
  • nygalnygal Posts: 7
    I'm in the market for an A6 (or possibly a 2006 525i....still comparing) and wanted to know if any of you have gotten the A6 with the Sport Package. Good/Bad/Worth it? Does it work well with the Quattro?
  • richcreamrichcream Posts: 205
    I've compared the A6, the 530i, and the M35x.

    If you're deciding between the A6 and the 525i, then I would say the HANDS DOWN choice would be the A6. Fully loaded the A6 probably tops out a little above a comparably equipped 525i, and delivers a more powerful car, one with all wheel drive, and one that IMO has a far superior interior.

    The BMW is overpriced, underpowered, and it's interior is underwhelming. Even still, opinions on the interior aside, the A6 is a much more gratifying performer VS. the 525i. And this is from someone who thinks that the M35x was a better overall car for the money than either the A6 or the 530i.
  • nygalnygal Posts: 7
    Fair enough.....I'm not necessarily trying to bring up the A6 vs. 5-series debate again and in all fairness I'll test-drive the M35x, but I do want to know about the A6 sport package. What is the "real" added value?
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    Hi, nygal. I had the ball rolling on buying an A6 4.2 w/ Sport Pkg, etc. a few months ago. FYI, the "sport package" is no longer available for the A6. You can still get all the parts a-la-carte for the same price, but just not as a package anymore. If you want a "package" per se, you have to get the S-Line. Is that worth the $2650 PLUS the $1050 for the Cold Wthr Pkg whish is required to get it? Absolutely not. It is nothing more than an appearance package with the sport suspension thrown in. You can get just the sport suspension for just $250 and save yourself $3450.

    Audi changed so much around during my ordering process that I became disgusted with the whole thing and just walked away from it. I ended up keeping my current car and buying an '05 Mustang GT. I'm now eyeing an M45 Sport.

    I drove an M45 Sport and non-Sport back-to-back and you'd be hard pressed to tell a difference during normal driving, other than the Sport having more road noise. However, I did have the opportunity to toss them both around a nice, curvy road with a tight switchback. That's where the Sport shined! The difference was night and day in that situation.

    Oh! To answer your question about the "sport package" on the A6, the real added value would be if you're like me and like to accelerate through a curve or on/off ramp until your tires squeal. If you're just the average driver, there's little added value in getting a sport "package" these days unless that includes better brakes and/or more precise steering.
  • nygalnygal Posts: 7
    Thanks for your POV!! And I hope they aren't going in the direction of BMW with the a la carte add-ons which I find to be a complete pain. Personally, both a la carte and packages should be offered to customers since many of us have a pretty good idea of what we want before walking into the dealer. The manufacturer/dealer should do the work to get us to where we want to be with their car without a ridiculous a-la-carte mark-up. As you can tell, I'm big on customer service. On the same note then: How is your experience with Infiniti thus far?.....and yes I too like to accelerate through a curve on occasion.
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    The staff at both Infiniti dealerships I've been too seem to be "pre-sale nice." By that I mean they seem like it's not natural for them to treat customers nicely. It's like they're out of their element and being forced to be nice to customers. It's just an odd atmosphere, but not a bad one. Both the salesmen I've had the (mis?)fortune to work with are nice guys, but know less about the new M than I do. It's funny that I had to show BOTH of them how to operate the rear DVD screen. Neither of them new how it works. To the second guy's defense, he said he'd only been with Infiniti for 3 weeks. The guy at the other dealership just doesn't seem to know much about cars in general.

    It's obvious in the staff that Infiniti is trying hard to make a turn around. In time, they will be there. Right now, the M45 Sport is at the top of my extremely short list. The thing is, I'm waiting for the Chrysler 300C SRT8 to hit the lots. I really like what I'm seeing and reading about that car! The only things thus far that would keep me from getting one is the horrible gas mileage, having to buy 20" tires when the time comes (ouch!), and dealer gouging.

    My drive in the M45 Sport was a very pleasant (possibly exhilarating) experience. It just felt like that's what I'm supposed to be driving. And the other half likes it, too.
  • nygalnygal Posts: 7
    Please...Gas mileage is the very reason I'm giving up my idea of getting a blizzard pearl GX 470....plus I think that after 3 years of my Eddie Bauer Ford Explorer I'm ready to really DDRRIIVEE. I'm not an environmentalist or anything but its just that everytime I go to the gas station I just laugh when the pump is done and I have to pay. So you probably know where I'm going with this on the 300C. It was created to target that specifc customer that wants that little Extra over the topness (20" wheels included) but doesn't want an SUV. It reminds me of when my Dad's old-school 1977-78 Deville with the wheel bump on the trunk. It was quite monster on road back then.

    In any event, sounds to me like the Sport Package for the A6 doesn't matter but for the M45 its definitely something to think about. At least you convinced me to test drive it before making a final decision. Good luck. ;)
  • rjlaerorjlaero Posts: 659
    The S line package includes the 5 arm alloy 18 inch alloy wheels. It would STILL cost you $1000 as a stand alone option to get any kind of 18 inch wheels for the A6.

    .
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,076
    I am biased, but who isn't? I wouldn't want one without sport if sport suspension and bigger wheels and tires were part of the package.

    The reasons are simple -- handling, performance, comfort and fun. But that is my bias. You might find the handling not sufficiently improved to offset what you might perceive as a reduction in comfort.

    At the very least, consider the big wheels and tires if you won't go the extra $250 for the suspension.

    And even more to the point: take a test drive of the same car with and without the sports suspension (and for Pete's sake make sure the test drive is over the same roads, at the same speed and if you have a passenger once, make sure you have a passenger both times, etc. -- also don't listen to the stereo while you're doing this eval, either.)

    If you value one person's opinion, well, here it is: don't buy the car without either the bigger wheels and tires (18") and/or the sport suspension option. The sport seats, depending upon your configuration are very nice and do compliment the entire sport set up -- but at MSRP I think they run yet an additional $1500 in the 3.2. The S-Line probably bundles all this stuff together and is a very nice and attractive deal. Some don't see the value.

    I think it is a bargain -- and had I ordered my 28th Audi, I would have gone for it in either the 6 or the 4 had I elected another Audi. But that is just me (and my wife).

    Test drives are expensive and that is why most people refuse to take a meaningful test drive -- and if you are happy with this approach and happy to take the opinions of some of the rest of us, that is OK too.

    Half the fun of buying is in the choosing. Every person you date doesn't' have to become your spouse, but dates can be fun. But only if you work at them.

    Same thing with test drives.

    Perhaps we need a forum on HOW TO TEST drive a car for maximum benefit and fun.

    In conclusion, if nominated, I will not run, if elected, I will not serve -- if you want something done, do it yourself. Then, fully vet the process by reading what the "pros" say and what we "civilians" have to say. But trust your own bum first, not mine, not his, not hers and certainly not Consumer Reports.

    Spin cycle anyone?
  • rjlaerorjlaero Posts: 659
    The S Line is not a bad beal at about $2700. As of right now it's only available on the V8 model.

    If you priced out the springs, 18 inch 5 arm wheels, bought a front spoiler and painted it, and painted the rear spoiler like on the S Line, you'd easily hit $2500. So I don't know what all the griping about cost is about.

    From Mercedes, BMW, and such, some of their sport packages with bigger wheels and tires and a few ground effects can easliy run $5000.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    The V6 engine recently got a much needed upgrade this year on the Mercedes. But the body style really hasn't changed that much. Also, if you price out the 4matic and NOT the 2WD option for option with the A6 Quattro, you're over 60 grand for a V6 E350 4Matic.

    True, but it wasn't supposed to change for 2005/06, it was all new for 2003. Don't put too much on a comparo. BTW, the A6 4.2 won the same type of comparo in the May issue of Automobile.

    M
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,076
    The Audi winning is a good thing, but thus far it is the rare thing, too.
  • nygalnygal Posts: 7
    Thanks for the philosophical tip. Test driving cars OR dates - can be fun but its work alright. I always trust my own instincts but every now and then I like to get some "perspective". There are a lot of crazies in NYC, you know. I may be mistaken but it looks like the S-line is only available on the 4.2 for $2650, no sport seats. The 3.2 sport package is $1400 less and doesn't include the sports grille, bumber and badge. Whats up with that?
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,076
    Minus some trim pieces, you can configure an A6 3.2 with most of the real performance bits of S-Line by ordereing the Sport Package $1,250, sport seats with Premium Leather $1,500 and a rear deck lid spoiler (other ground effects, too, can be had that have been custom made for the A6).

    S-Line, then, is a relative bargain if you would try to recreate it piece by piece.

    The trim pieces look cool, but I think that S-Line is more about some suspension upgrades, ground effects & a couple of badges rather than an "S" or "RS" version. I always thought Sline or Ultrasport was something I would get if it is available. Of course if money were no object heck, I'd get an RS in a NY second!
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    In my opinion, the S-Line Pkg is a bad deal. It includes (in whole) some 5 spoke 18" wheels, front and rear fascia, flat black interior trim, some badges, and the sport suspension (and maybe, just maybe, a 3-spoke steering wheel like the European version). That little bit of stuff for $2,650. Keep in mind that the sport seats ($500) aren't included AND you HAVE to get the Cold Weather Pkg ($1050). So, when you break it down, the S-Line package (done right) will actually cost you $4,200. :surprise: Not much less than what Benz charges for about the same stuff.

    Now, to get the net performance effect, you can get the sport suspension ($250), sport seats ($500), and 18" wheels ($750). Total = $1500. That's a substantial savings of $2700. Even if you get the Cold Weather Pkg ($1050), you still save $1650. Keep in mind the S-Line has zero performance enhancements over this particular setup. So is it really worth it?

    That extra money can go toward Advance Key ($350), tire psi monitor ($250), Nav ($?), and Bose w/ satellite radio.
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,076
    The sport seats, as I read it, require premium seats as a pre req and are an additional $1,000.

    The sport suspension option is $1250 and that includes the upgraded Wheels and Tires (which are, separately, $1,000, not $750.) I do believe you get the "special" steering wheel and the trim bits.

    I agree, however, if all you want are the performance bits, heck, you could stop at the sport suspension option for $1250 and I do not think it requires cold weather. But I wouldn't get one without cold weather, so that, in my case is not disincentive.

    The S-Line is more about making a statement -- some do and some don't want to do that. And, the trim bits, as far as I know have nuttin' to do with performance, they just, to me, look cool.

    I say if you understand what S-Line is AND value the trim bits for any reason at all, that it is a bargain cause if you had to assemble it it would cost more.
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    Mark, I'm pricing out the 4.2, not the 3.2. I didn't realize that the 3.2 buyers were being jacked for so much money on the options.

    2005 A6 4.2
    Cold Weather Pkg - $1050
    S-Line - $2650 (requires Cold Wthr Pkg)
    18" wheels - $750
    Sport seats - $500
    Sport suspension - $250
    Advanced Key - $750
    Nav - $1500
    Bose w/ satellite - $1300
    Tire psi - $250
    Voice rec. - $350

    Realizing S-Line is a bum deal - $Priceless :P

    I'm getting my numbers straight from Audi's website (along with from the option sheet I did when I was ordering one).
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,076
    I was looking at the 3.2 -- and stand corrected. You do not value the S-line ground effects and trim bits and that is fine. If you tried to assemble S-Line from the individual parts from the XYZ Audi aftermarket or even from Audi if that is possible, the cost would be way more than $2650.

    As I kinda like the look, I still feel it is not overpriced.

    Realizing S-Line is a bargain - also Pricele$$ ;)
  • rjlaerorjlaero Posts: 659
    Just checked the 3 month sales total for the A6 from Autosite.

    Year to date sales thru March 2004: 2405 cars
    Year to date sales thru March 2005: 4149 cars

    Looks like the new body style 05 A6 is doing quite well.

    http://www.aicautosite.com/editoria/asmr/svsedan.asp
  • chef_jmrchef_jmr Posts: 41
    markincininnati,

    I've read many of your posts, and I respect your opinion and could have used more last week when test driving the 3.2 A6 and the GS300. You've mentioned that test driving is "expensive"..to whom? My time on research, including test drives, is valuable, but is it not worth the time to make the correct personal decision on which model to buy?

    The test drives were fun, but I am not sure what to look or feel for. The Lexus, with its ventilated seats and extra bells-and-whistles, had the "oh, that's cool" factor, but the Audi (in Arctic White with Sports suspension) had the "this IS a luxury sports sedan with less fluff and more fun" factor.

    So if you could breakdown some of your "How to test drive" tips, it would be much appreciated. One thing I did notice, is that the Audi's side view mirrors are so small. Perhaps this is because I am used to my Lexus RX300's large mirrors, but I could barely make out what was going in those areas...

    Desparately waiting for the "S-line" 3.2 A6 to be announced.
  • ctorreyctorrey Posts: 64
    how do they compare for previous years? As a model nears the end of of its lifecycle (e.g., 2004 A6), sales figures tend to drop. Similarly, a new model tends to have better sales figures.
  • bargamon1bargamon1 Posts: 110
    I'll jump in with my two cents........

    Lexus strives for perfection. Part of it is isolation. While I admire the cars, I find they lack an enthusiastic touch for those who like to drive. Feedback is minimum.

    I have read that Lexus is for people who don't like to drive. They numb the experience. High quality, quiet, smooth driving. Not a thing wrong with that at all, just preference.

    I love my 03' manual tranny allroad. Part of it is I like shifting myself.

    Ok, Remember, all new cars are great cuz they got new tires!

    Of course, as mark says test on the same roads. I like to test my commute. I can get a feal that way. Drive in highway with radio off. kick on AC also. Listen and learn. Find an area and break with hads off wheel. See if its straight. Check airpressure before test, they usually too high.. Car will be crisper that way, but nobody keep them 10lbs over recommended use in real life!

    Play with radio and make sure treble is not set all the way up. The ear likes the high tones at first, set it the way you would. Take along a familiar cd.

    Take wife for second drive. Make sure she likes it. :( Not worth the trouble if she does not. If you have a girlfriend, make sure she is impressed. :P If you have both, make sure you get a popular color and model that blends in will otherwise wife will get the car in settlement when caught! :confuse:
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,076
    Test drives, undertaken in a fashion that allows you to make somewhat to very meaningful comparisons are expensive. What I mean by this is that they are darn near gruelling in terms of time and procedure "if" you are really attempting to evaluate one car against another.

    First, in "my idea" of a meaningful test drive, I map out a route that I will take in my current car -- the assumption being I will be familiar with the car that I currently drive and can use that as the basis for tactile, muscle and emotional "memory." After I have mapped out the course, I take the course in my current car twice. Once in silence and once with the sound system on (playing a CD that I will take with me on my test drives). The reason I take a CD, rather than playing the radio -- for instance -- is to not be influenced one way or the other by random music. The last few times I have taken Brian Wilson's latest album "Smile" and U2's latest, "How to Disassemble an Atomic. . . ." My wife likes opera and classical.

    OK, then you go to the dealership and get the car you are going to test. I assume it is not unreasonable to inform the dealer of the approximate intended duration of your test drive (I would suggest 30 - 45 minutes is a reasonable minimum).

    Then "do your test loop" -- twice (once in silence and once with your tunes -- and if you want to test the radio's reception or sound, this is the time to do it, but your own CD will provide you with the "I know how I am used to this sounding, and I know this song or these songs, so I will be able to test the highs and lows of the system because of that familiarity.) Hopefully if you have two dealers that are one hour apart, you will establish a test loop that is about 1/2 way in between the two.

    I would use the equipment (as much as you can possibly use) -- the A/C or the Heater (depending on the time of year), the lumbar adjustment, the nav system or whatever the bells and whistles of the car you are testing might have on it -- I made certain I could use the voice activation of the A/C and radio when I tested an Infiniti, for example. Turn the wipers on and off. Do "normal" stuff, that is. And do it on every car you test.

    If you test alone, always test alone. If you test with 150 pounds of another human being in the car, always test that way. It effects the ride, handling and braking.

    What is expensive about all of this is the time it takes to do this as objectively as you can -- and I am pretty much convinced if you do not do something at least "in spirit" like this that all hope of objectivity will be dashed.

    Most people take a rather superficial test drive and since the car is new and different it almost always feels better than the one they currently have. So they buy the car and a bit later on they say "I never noticed there is no way to turn off that FRONT parktronic or that every time I mean to release the parking brake, I pop the hood and have to get out and slam it shut. Or, I didn't open the hood when I test drove the car, I had no idea it had a hood prop and that the damn hood weighs in at 250 pounds," and on and on and on.

    See where the spare tire is, see if it takes a technician to figure out how to change a tire, just do "normal" things with your demo car -- and do the same things over and over as you attempt to fully vet your potential new car.

    If acceleration is really important to you, clock yourself from "0 to whatever" (twice) and do it in all the cars you test. If just an overall sense of the car's power is sufficient, well be guided accordingly.

    Parallel park the car.

    Try a somewhat hard stop -- if the car has under 150 miles on it, this may not be all that meaningful. I actually like it when I am given a true demo to test -- if I like it enough to consider this brand for further investigation, I then at the final moment ask if I can "drive THAT one."

    Some other tests involve entering a turn and accelerating out of the turn and noting the "feel that the car is (or isn't) on rails)."

    I have a turn in my test loop that is a sharp (banked) 90 degree right hand turn that is marked 15MPH. The speed limit on the highway (a secondary road) is 45MPH. I have found that my Audi allroad can approach the turn at 45MPH enter the turn off throttle and accelerate hard at the apex and power out of the turn with a turn terminal velocity of 50MPH (3x the posted sign). I use this as my guide to the "hunker" factor (body lean, or roll). If the car I am testing cannot take the turn with the same degree of aplomb as my allroad, I note that as, essentially, a demerit.

    By the way, I made up all these test drive tips -- I think the key is repeating them after you have a basis. My wife likes to go to a parking lot and her test is driving in figure 8's faster and faster and faster (until I feel I am about to hurl, sometimes). To see how the car feels in what she imagines imitates emergency lane change situations.

    My test methods are my own, yours should be yours -- and if any of mine have any merit, use them with my blessing and encouragement.

    Just "get a routine" stick to it and repeat (rinse, lather, repeat)!

    It is hard work and time consuming -- hence the statement it is expensive.

    Of course, I would submit that NOT doing such is even more expensive as you may end up buying a new car that seemed fine on secondary roads but road like a washing machine on the Interstates. Or, one that drove great under 60 miles per hour, but that felt downright scary at 75 (and unless you never drive 75, I would say that is a critical oversight on your part).

    I do usually take cars to at least 85MPH on one part of the test drive loop -- since this is the normal maximum I find myself driving on the freeways that circle and weave through Cincinnati. The fact that most of the time I usually am about speed limit +5 - 10mph is not lost on me either.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    I was following your posts in another forum, I think the M35/45 forum and you indicated you ordered an Infiniti, but you made that post on April 1st and I didn't keep up with the thread to see if you were joking. Did you really leave Audi after all these years?

    M
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,076
    It was no joke. the car should be here in July. I ordered Infiniti's version, more or less, of an Audi A6 3.2, an Infiniti M35x with Journey, Technology and a rear deck-lid spoiler.

    Nothing pained me more than the sense that I had to do it or I would feel that I had not been true to my "ideas and ideals" that I have formunlated over the past 3 years -- in part because of my participation here on edmunds.

    I would have chosen another Audi for a little bit more money (if I could have configured the Audi "pretty close" to the Infiniti). Such was not possible.

    The Inifiniti is my first ever non German car, since 1977. The Infiniti is my first ever Japanese car, period.

    I have deliberately rented Japanese cars over the years (including the Lexus models that were available from Budget rent a car), and never found them to be bad or undesirable, but also never found them particularly to be "driver's cars." One of my fellow co workers has an Avalon and another one has an Acura. Nice cars both -- bland, blander, blandest.

    The Infiniti impressed me as being a car that must have come from a mixed marriage -- part German and part Japanese. It drives very much like an Audi (with a little bit less understeer). It accelerates like a car with a small V8 (placing its power in between the A6 3.2 and the 4.2). It has the features and options that, at this stage in my life (I like gadgets), are fun (not that the Audi doesn't have most of them, too).

    And the warranty was better, and the price was comparable at MSRP but much lower at the lease per month cost.

    Nothing against the Audi -- if someone would let me have one competitively with the Infiniti, I am confident that would have been the way I would have gone.

    Ditto my wife, the A4 3.2 vs the X3 3.0 Bimmer -- the BMW aced out the A4 (she wanted stick, bluetooth and a reasonable price, to name just a few reasons).

    Audi lost out on almost $97,000 in car sales to captive customers who have been (and mostly remain) Audi advocates.

    I would guess that "we'll be back" to check out Audi in about 3 years from now.

    That's the story.
  • bargamon1bargamon1 Posts: 110
    Oh my! Very detailed!

    Painted spoiler! We did not think the aircraft aluminum would work on the M35.!

    Oh my!
  • I can certainly understand going with the Infiniti - I was very close to doing the same, after driving an allroad for the past 3+ years. But the Audi A6 3.2 with an MSRP over $53K, actually leased at the same price as the M35x with an MSRP of $50,360 (after the $1,500 Audi Loyalty was applied). Both are beautiful cars.
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    All I can say is that the regime is falling if you've left Audi. I still can't believe it!!!

    Thanks for the reply though, like others have said very detailed and one could see why you did what you did.

    M
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