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Audi A6

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  • Petrie 3, Sorry I did not explain my comparison better. Yes the Volvo is a slightly smaller car, however with 60/40 fold down, there is lots of room for me. I drove the S80, and while it is larger, it does not handle as well - too much, heavy front drive feel. I was prepared to give up on the Volvo based on driving the S80. In my heart, I know the Audi is a superior automobile, but there is a considerable difference of $14,000 Cdn. The Volvo has every option but navigation and sport suspension. I opted out of the sport suspension, simply because the European standard offering is terrific on its own. My heart says Audi and my check book says Volvo.
  • ds2k1ds2k1 Posts: 101
    Thanks for the quick responses. The help is really appreciated.

    A few more notes:

    1. I thought the Legend's ground clearance seemed low, so I appreciate the insight of another Legend owner. While on the subject of the Legend, Tim, can you tell me what in your experience has been the greatest advantage in the A6 over it? I must admit that it's mostly the visceral tug of climbing into the 2.7T that is driving my desire to replace the Legend. Frankly, I'm virtually astounded at what a quality automobile the Legend is. It has 110K+ miles and I honestly don't believe it has EVER had a mechanical problem. Not anything. Pretty remarkable, I know. However, it is getting older and just doesn't "do it for me", if you know what I mean. I'm guessing that most participating here know what I mean or they wouldn't be here in the first place. I guess I'm looking for a little validation from a former Legend owner that I'm not insane for getting rid of a fantastic car for no good reason. Any comparisons between the Legend and A6, other than the purely obvious, that will make me happy with my decision would be great.

    2. As to Hammer Auto, they're located in Palo Alto and supposedly shop at least 25 dealerships to get the best possible deal for you. They charge $300 for the service and get the car delivered to their location and have all the paperwork ready for you to sign. After placing your phone call to them and telling them what you want, it supposedly takes all of 15 minutes of your time to sign the paperwork at their location, and you're off with your brand new car. I know someone who used them, and she was quite happy with the service she received, but don't necessarily trust that she would know if they got her the best possible deal. I think they do pretty good volume, so I thought someone here might have used them, or encountered someone who had.

    3. I used to live in Southern California so would have no problem getting a car from Van Nuys or Norwalk. Does anyone have any specific advice about those dealerships and the kind of deal they were able to get there? Any specific sales people to refer?

    Again, thanks for the help.
  • jim3039jim3039 Posts: 28
    Regarding Southern California dealers, I can't recommend Keyes Van Nuys. I leased my 2001 A6 on New Years eve from Beverly Hills Audi. I live ONE mile from Keyes Van Nuys and was so disappointed by their smug, superior attitude, I left my "negotiation" with the fleet manager there, drove 9 miles to BH Audi and leased my A6 from them an hour later at $1,100 over invoice. The difference in attitude and service was huge. They also seem to have a very large inventory - my exact options were hard to find, and they had 2 choices for me. If you end-up shopping in Southern Cal, I recommend David Wolfe at BH Audi.

    Regarding the 4Y/50K warranty, the dealer told me tires were the only thing I would be responsible for over the course of my 4-year lease!

    Good luck. You're goint to love your new A6...I can't stop smiling.
  • timcartimcar Posts: 363
    Mike, you asked the right question. (Or wrong question, if you like succinct replies.) I'm passionate about cars, and probably the two I've found most passion inspiring have been the 2.7T and Legend. I think you're making the right choice. When I got the Legend I thought it was the perfect blend of style, performance and luxury. The 2.7T is the same blend, only updated and superior in every category.

    I had my Legend for over 5 years and put over 80K on it in that time. It was nearly flawless. The only problems I encountered related the suspension and brakes. This wouldn't affect you in the Bay Area, but quasi-rural NW NJ where I make my home is typified by bad pavement and cold winter weather. I think '91 & '92 were the last two years for solid bushings in the Legend's suspension. Simply, the suspension was too rigid for the pavement and took a beating. After about 20K both ride and handling had deteriorated. One cold winter day I even broke a shock exiting a NY highway where pavement joints resemble speed bumps elsewhere in the country. The first 20K the feel and handling of the car was magical. After that, it was still good but not as smooth and a little tail happy. Toward the end of 80K the brakes had become less effective, and I once fried a caliper when braking hard with a full load.

    Most Japanese cars have problems with bad pavement. Most European cars don't. That's one of the things that drew me to the 2.7T. The 2.7T is better riding, better handling, faster, more luxurious and more comfortable than the Legend. I also think the A6 is the best looking 4-door sedan on the market. It reeks of style, yet it's not a status icon. Unlike the Legend, the 2.7T can be optioned so many different ways that it's virtually an entire range of cars from a fast, good handling luxury sedan to a luxurious, fantastic handling performance sedan. The interior can be luxurious understated black leather, or it can be vanilla leather with amber wood and royal blue carpets and dash. The first has a dark gray headliner, the latter is cream to match the seats. The first interior is snug and cockpit like, the second open and expansive. And these are only two of the interiors that are available. You can virtually custom design the car to order if you’re willing to wait 3 or 4 months. Tiptronic or 6 speed? Not fast enough? Add a chip and do 0-60 in less than 6 seconds. Bigger wheels, big performance tires, a sport suspension? Whatever your priorities are, you can slant the A6 to be more of what you want. My own preferences are toward the more luxurious end of the spectrum. But even there, it is still faster, better handling and more comfortable than my Legend was.

    Are there any downsides? Sadly, yes. The A6 is very well designed and beautifully manufactured. It is a very good car. However, it is not bulletproof in the way your Legend has been. Honestly, the electronics could be more reliable. The fanatical Japanese dedication to detail in the design of cup holders, etc. isn't there. Frankly, I think these things just aren't a priority for most German manufacturers.

    Secondly, Audi’s aren't sold by dealers where the "buying experience" has been designed from the ground up. Some dealers are excellent. Some aren't. Parts and technicians expertise can sometimes be problematic when compared to Acura.

    It's really a matter of priorities. I'd rather have a car that's wonderful to drive most of the time, rather than boring to drive all the time. So I'm willing to accept the lack of Acura or Lexus like support.

    Mike, you didn't say if you've driven the 2.7T. I think if you can spend a little time with it, it will tell you far more than I can. These are just my opinions. I hope they have been helpful.
  • ds2k1ds2k1 Posts: 101
    Your advice has, indeed, been quite helpful. It was my impression (and you've really reinforced it) that the visceral feeling I'm experiencing is going to have to close the deal, because logic probably won't. Logic, of course, dictates that if it ain't broke, don't fix it. However, I don't find myself perusing Acura catalogs every night before I go to sleep searching for my next car. It's the Audi A6 catalog that remains in the stack of reading material next to the bed (where it's been for 4 months!).

    And to answer your question, No, I have not yet driven the 2.7T. I test drove the 2.8 back in August at Rector in Burlingame (they had no 2.7Ts to test drive that day, unfortunately) and was actually close to buying it, but I really wanted to hold out for the sexier car. I figure if you're going to spend $40K, you should get something that excites every part of you. I thought the 2.8 was a fantastic car and I'd be totally happy with it right now if I had bought it, I have no doubt. With that said, I'm glad I held out for the 2.7T and am in that much of a better position to get it soon. I may even give Rector another chance at my business, if I don't use Hammer Auto.

    Anyone looking for a '91 Legend in perfect condition?
  • timcartimcar Posts: 363
    Mike,

    Glad you found my opinions helpful. Need a bit more logic? Hmmm - Even though your Legend has been perfect for 110K, no car is immortal. Soon you’d start having to put money into it to keep it on life support. OR, you could be driving a new 2.7T. Isn't rationalizing helpful?

    If you feel such a strong visceral desire without even having driven the 2.7T, I'm afraid you're probably a goner once you do. A crafty salesperson offered me a test ride without my requesting it when I really had no interest in the A6 because of my commitment to Japanese luxury. Afterwards, I had difficulty sleeping for about a week!

    By the way, if you’d like to interact with a few other Audi fanatics, try the link below:

    http://www.audiworld.com/forum/a6.html
  • mpuzachmpuzach Posts: 635
    Hi Mike,

    I just read your post (#682) and have a thought regarding the services of Hammer Auto, specifically the 15 minute vehicle delivery process. For what it's worth, a very positive component of my A6 buying experience was the delivery process that took place at Rector. David Leibenson took me through a wonderful presentation of the car that, once experiencing it, I wouldn't have wanted to miss. Keep in mind that I thought that I knew everything there was to know about the car and then some! To my surprise, I was wrong. David showed me things that were new to me. In addition, there's just something about the whole delivery "ritual" that makes for a very special experience, and David executed that ritual in grand style. It's not something that I'd pay $300 to give up!

    I guess another piece of this is that, in the unlikely event that you discover a problem with the car at delivery, it's far better to do so at the dealer who will ultimately be responsible for making it right.

    Finally, I have great confidence in your ability to negotiate a deal that's BETTER than the best one you'll get from Hammer! Now, with that vote of confidence, how can you possibly go wrong?!

    Good luck.

    - Mike
  • I just purchased (ordered) a 2001 A6 2.7T and am still looking at various financing options. Has anyone used the Audi Premium Purchase financing plan? I would prefer to buy vs lease and am curious if the Premium Purchase plan's advantage over a strait lease is that you can "buy-out" at any time without a penalty. Any info is appreciated.
  • I will be replacing my GS300 in September 2001. I have been looking at the A6 2.7T.

    According to the Audi dealer, "cosmetic" changes will made to the 2002 A6 due out in the fall of 2001.

    Has anyone seen the new 2002 A6? Where can I see some good pictures?
  • timcartimcar Posts: 363
    Sorry, haven't seen it. FWI new new model year for Audi starts during Summer. Think cars start showing up as early as July. I suspect any pictures would start showing up sometime between March and May. In the past, AudiWorld has been one of the first with new pix.
  • I have a 1998 A6 Quattro with about 30,000 miles. About 3 weeks ago I had my fourth oil leak in about 2 months time, I brought it back to the dealer and they fixed it, but then the check engine light came on (while Audi still had it) so they didn't give it back to me. They said the engine was miss firing. They did tons of stuff to the engine (changed belts, spark plugs, etc) and nothing seemed to stop the miss firing. My car has been in the dealer for over 2 weeks and today they are calling Audi for help, b/c they don't know how to solve the problem. Has anyone else had any engine problem with their 2.8 engine??
  • petrie3petrie3 Posts: 47
    I've been away for the weekend and didn't see your post until today. I agree with your comment on the S80 handling; good but not in a league with the A6 and quattro. I haven't driven the S60, but I can imagine that it feels a little tighter and quicker. If it has enough room for you and is that much cheaper, can't blame you for going with the S60. Volvo has certainly put lots of R&D in that car too and I'm sure you'll like it. On the other hand, if that size is OK with you, you might want to wait until the NEW A4 is released in the U.S. Great looking redesign (something like the A6) and lots of new stuff. Others may know, but I think it is coming here this summer (2002 model). Either way, you'll have a great car!
  • mosi1mosi1 Posts: 12
    Like islandlog I'm considering utilyzing the Premier Purchase option. I'd like to put down a substantial amount and not have a monthly payment for three years and then pay off the baloon, or refinance at that time. Does this make sense? I'm told the residual on 2.7T's and 4.2's are in the neighborhood of 57% after 3 years. I suppose I would have to pre-pay the 36 monthly payments to make this work. Any other ideas?
  • bxbybxby Posts: 1
    I am new to this discussion and haven't spent the time going thru past postings so I apologize in advance if I am repeating a question. I am considering buying my wife an A6 but am torn between the 2.8Q and the 2.7T. Specifically, I am concerned that the 2.8 may be underpowered. However, I would certainly like to avoid paying the additional $5k for the 2.7 if I wouldn't always feel like I made a mistake. I would appreciate hearing from 2.8 owners as to their experiences.
  • tubeytubey Posts: 39
    I am a very happy owner of a '99 2.8 and, as I've said on this forum before, it's fast enough to get me in trouble with the law.

    Around town acceleration is a bit leisurely, but can be improved somewhat with use of the Tiptronic feature. Out on the highway, it has good mid-range punch if you downshift to at least third and will certainly fly from 70 on up.

    It all depends on your needs. Some people feel they really need the extra acceleration for entering freeways, etc. My driving situation must be tamer, I guess. I had a Taurus SHO that was a really accelerator, but that was about the only thing I liked about the car. But I like so many things about my Audi that leisurely acceleration is hardly a concern.

    When I bought mine the 2.8's were more heavily equipped than they are now (there was no 2.7T or 4.2)so mine stickered at $42,225. I know that now they are cheaper than that, but, I don't believe, have the same option choices. Mine has everything but a phone, but, since it's a '99, it doesn't have ESP, sidecurtain airbags, or steering wheel controls.

    Yes, I have absolutely no regrets. Nor have I had any problems in 15,300 miles.
  • I agree -- with the remarks made by "tubey." If you want a stick shift, however, you must go with the 2.7T as Audi dropped it for this year's 2.8's.

    No matter what you end up with, make certain it has ESP (about a $550 option on those that don't have it standard, yet.) My dealer claims that those with ESP will command much more on the used market, especially as ESP is getting to be more mainstream -- not quite as much as ABS -- yet, but next year, for example ALL Audi's will have ESP -- ALL US Audi's and probably elsewhere. One other thing, the sport package makes the car handle better -- I don't know if it is available on the 2.8 -- if not and there is a wheel/tire upgrade that will make a difference -- go for that.

    I had a '99 A6 2.8Q loaded to the gills -- other than OFF THE LINE, the car was a pleasure to drive and had very few maint. problems. I would recommend it -- unless you really "need" the quickness that the 2.7T will supply -- and supply big time.

    New Subject:

    I am starting to get a real good case of the "ick" for Pirelli P6000 Z rated tires (I now have 1,500 miles on my 2001 A6 4.2 'sport') -- they are not good in cold weather at all (notice I did not say wet or snowy weather, I said COLD weather); they are also noisy -- this is mostly an FYI as I am going to put Dunlop SP 9000's on the car in a month or so. Why bother, Audi? These tires are merely "good" -- you have put Michelen's and Dunlop's best on several other Audis in the past -- it seems like I just "got unlucky." Not to blame Audi alone, seems like the manufacturers of some of the best European cars "undertire" their cars from time to time -- so I guess it is not just an Audi thing.

    Anyway -- the difference in price (on line retail difference is about $60 per tire) is worth it and if offered the choice, I would pay for something other than Pirelli P6000's -- any thoughts, anyone, Bueler, Bueler. . . .

    There, I feel better, now.
  • rjsenrjsen Posts: 30
    Well, I had an A4 2.8 non-sport, and now I have an S4 (2.7T engine). I certainly couldn't say that the 2.8 was underpowered (at least in the A4), but the S4 is definitely a lot more fun. I think it mostly depends on how you like to drive -- if you generally drive fairly "normally" in the city or on highways, the 2.8 should be fine. If you like to drive on twisty mountain roads and take your car to the track occasionally, get the 2.7T. Go drive both and see what you think. My guess is you'll probably be happy with the 2.8.

    I have the P6000's on my S4, and I don't think they're all that bad. True, they don't handle like S-02PP's or Pilot Sports, but for a stock tire on a non-sports car (even the S4 isn't a pure sports car), they're quite acceptable. Make sure they're sufficiently inflated (mine are at 45psi). One piece of advice -- the SP9000's aren't going to be any quieter, and won't handle *that* much better. If you're going to bother changing tires (which I probably will too, in spite of what I just said), go with Bridgestone S-02 Pole Positions (1st choice) or Michelin Pilot Sports (2nd choice). FWIW, the P6000's are vastly better than the stock ContiTourings that were on my A4.
  • nszabonszabo Posts: 19
    Recommend the Dunlop 9000's
  • petrie3petrie3 Posts: 47
    I've got Dunlop SP9000s on my 2000 2.7t(PSK)and I love them. I think they are very quiet and smooth riding. Performance in the rain is fantastic. I'm in SoCal so don't need all-weather tires. In the heavy rains last week, I felt like I was driving on dry pavement.
  • We bought a 2.8Q for my wife about two months ago and I think we both feel the acceleration is just fine. I am, however, a little disappointed in how the tiptronic transmission handles the power of the 2.8 engine. With some real time lags in how it shifts, in both auto and tip modes, it seems to be somewhat less responsive than I'd like. Don't know if that improves with age or not. Whatever, I do suggest that between you and your wife, you should make an honest assessment of what's important in the car that SHE is going to drive. It's possible that acceleration is not really one of her "hot buttons". I kind learned that lesson the hard way. I spent tons of hours researching new cars only to find out that the attributes I held in high regard were not what was most important to her. What sold her on the A6 was the absolutely gorgeous interior. That little oversight on my part cost me about $10K more for her new car than I thought I was going to spend on the car I had chosen. I'd like to say that I'm learning to love the A6 but I don't get to drive it that much, and until this transmission thing is cleared up, I'm reserving judgment on whether it was the right choice or not. Oops, there I go again! It's not my choice!!
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