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Audi A6

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  • lmgottslmgotts Posts: 15
    Thanks Mark,

    I have most of the same quibbles about the car as you; sure wish that I could have ordered a 6 speed, or at least had the tiptronic controls on the steering wheel. I read that the S6 Avant will be sold here beginning November, but am wondering as well about why no S6 Sedan. I'm also not perfectly happy with the choices available for interior's. I want a black interior, but was forced to order a stitching pattern that was not my first choice. I'm 6' about 220, so hopefully I will be happy as you with the seats. Also agree re the power steering and turns...

    Anyway, the general news about order/delivery times was pretty disappointing!

    So I wait.
  • With respect to traction -- the quattro system is All-wheel drive. You should not have any more concern about the traction issue than you did with your RX300. The only issue I can imagine is "with which tires" will you be making your forays onto the snow and ice? If you had all-season tires on the RX300 and you have summer tires on the quattro you may have some issues; the quattro should be ordered with ESP (if it is not one of the models that has that feature standard). You may find that you do not need winter or all season tires -- or, based on the weather, you may find summer and winter wheel/tire combinations a prudent choice. What would apply to your RX300 would, for all practical purposes, apply to the A6 quattro.

    With respect to the Navigation system: I have it, it works, it is excellent, it is NOT perfect. In fact it seems to use the exact same software (but not hardware) as the latest and greatest Sat/Nav system on the S class Mercedes (even the woman's voice is IDENTICAL).

    Audi Navigation Plus is, so far, only available in non-North American countries. I have never received an "intelligent" explanation why Audi sells the product with the nifty color, full graphical screen in other countries. Yet, the directions it gives, the commands it speaks ARE the same on "Audi Navigation-Lite" as they are on the full-blown system.

    I like it, I use it and I think for what it is (non full color screen, etc.) they should charge less. I would buy it again and I would buy the full color one if it becomes an option.

    But, unless you need (and I can't imagine why "need" would be the word) the full color screen, the Audi system performs the tasks of getting you from A to B impressively. Oh yea, I think the system should be DVD based, instead of CD based but since I would generally fly if I had to go beyond the map that I have, perhaps that too is just another nit that I am picking.

    I wrote a letter to Audi about the sat nav system "complaining" that we deserve the option of lite or full, but so far, no reply.

    If you need (want?) a navigation system, this one works well. If you want the nifty color system 'cause it looks cool and functionality is secondary, skip it.
  • rwishrwish Posts: 20
    I've heard quite a bit of talk on the ESP option lately from this board. I understand what it does and can tell from those with it that they are very pleased but am still a bit confused as to it's offering. During what year did this option become available and for what models? What is the cost of the option?

    Thanks,
    Rick
    00 2.7T Ebony Pearl
    Sport/Convenience/Cold Weather Pkgs
  • Rwish:

    Check out message #711 for a succinct explanation of ESP. The answer that is under the heading "normal" driver should be read with great care -- it is the reason that this technology is almost a miracle. Perhaps the following enhancement will help. This is a bit of editorial enhancement of message #711:

    Normal driver version (reality):

    ESP is a wonderful invention (one of the best, ever) that keeps you in control of your vehicle at all times in all conditions. In ice, snow, or rain, it prevents fishtailing and spinouts. It allows you to drive normally in very low-traction situations, and not worry that you'll wind up in a ditch. There's simply no reason not to have it. And, in the future, no EXCUSE other than a death wish, not to get it! You MUST have this technology from this point forward -- do not even consider for one second ANY vehicle that you plan to put friends, family or any living creature that you wish to live in a car without this technology -- riding lawn mowers do not need this technology, all other "road" vehicles need it -- it is in the same category as seat belts, air bags, crash worthiness and anti-lock brakes. Do not even bother looking (in the future) at any vehicle (trucks, mini-vans, SUV's etc.) without this technology. Clear?!?

    Technically speaking, ESP is simply an on-board computer that selectively brakes any combination of wheels when loss of traction is detected (it also can do this when the brakes are NOT being touched and can limit engine power, too). My take is that since it can be turned off, there's no reason to avoid it. Oh yes, even today on an Audi, BMW, Mercedes, Subaru, or Volvo -- the MSRP is about $500.00 -- next year, it will be cheaper -- it is inexpensive, that is.

    You just hit a button to disable it for spirited driving, but it's there if you just want an uneventful drive home when it's icy. Remember, though, that it's not a cure-all -- if you have zero traction at all wheels, nothing can help you.

    The "option" has been available -- in some form -- since 1995 (but not on Audi's this early, Mercedes had it first according to the Bosch literature available on the www). 2000 was the first year Audi's had this technology in the US -- I thought the 1999 USA A8 had it as well, but I can't get confirmation of this "fact."

    With thanks to message #711.
  • len13len13 Posts: 5
    Hi,
    I've been reading all about A6's here for the past day or so. Having just bought one, I wanted to make sure I got a good deal. I came here originally to make sure the inv prices the dealer quoted me were accurate, and I got hooked on the chat board, and I thought you could help me. I bought a 2001 A6 2.8Q with the celebration Lux pkg, cold weather pkg , Bose stereo(I now know it was a mistake, but it came in the car I liked), and rear side air bags. It was a demo model with 3000 miles(test drives, etc). All warranties are in tact. I paid 400 over invoice for it. It has no dings, etc. When I picked it up, it looked brand new inside and out. I guess I just want to make sure I did the right thing by buying a demo and saving some money. What do you think?

    Also, the rear side air bags. If I put a car seat back there, are they going to be dangerous? Do I need to disable them? Can I?

    BTW, its silver, with black interior and looks GREAT. At first I didn't like the body style, but it really grew on me, and now I love it!!

    Thanks for your input. I look forward to participating in these discussions as I drive my A6.
  • mpuzachmpuzach Posts: 635
    Especially if you got a car that's equipped the way you want, $400 over invoice for a 2001 demo sounds reasonable to me. As vkj said, dealers are typically commanding anywhere from $1200 to $1800 over invoice on 2.8s.

    At this point, you have a great car that you like. Enjoy it, and don't look back. You won't regret it.
  • It was I who asked about 2.7T vs 4.2. I really couldn't see much on the issue scanning this thread. I did however get some great help and info from one or two people off the board.

    I'd be grateful if you would add your opinion. I have not driven the 4.2 but have the 2.7T. I found it to have all the power I needed and be a very smooth car in most respects. Engine noise was not intrusive ( my fear for the smaller engine ) and most everyone has reassured me on turbo reliability at Audi. However there was significant - to my mind excessive - wind noise on the demo ( 1200 miles ) at 70mph and up. All doors and windows were tightly closed. That and a slight rattle and squeak coming from around the rear seat armrest were the only flaws I could find.

    Now from what I can tell the 4.2 would give me little extra from an equally equipped more or less 2.7T and cost about 6-7K more but the opinion of a current owner would be appreciated. Ironically my decision may get even trickier as I discovered the allroad is about two inches wider shoulder room ( I'm a large fellow and this makes a difference to me although I found the A6 very accommodating ). I like the practicality of a wagon too but being a NVH freak I have my doubts about the open space and roof rack.

    I intend to drive the 4.2 and the allroad this weekend and any tips would be appreciated especially as to why you see the value in the 4.2.

    Incidentally are you by any chance connected to a screw machine company in N Kentucky ?
  • gs4rx3gs4rx3 Posts: 25
    I traded my Lexus GS400 in for a 2000 A6 4.2 about a month ago. I also have a Lexus RX300. Here's a few answers to some of the questions I've seen on the board, especially gjo11's.

    My GS400 was horrible in snow and wet weather here in Chicago. Fortunately, we've had 3 mild winters in a row until this year, so it wasn't an issue. However, this year has been terrible, so I traded the GS400 for a less than 1 year old used, fully-loaded (including Nav) 2000 A6 4.2, without ESP.

    I tested both the 2001 with ESP and the 2000 without it and, no offense to markcincinnati, but I really didn't think it made a significant difference. I even took both cars to large parking lots filled with 6-12+ inches of snow for test drives and found that while it is nice that power can be cut and brakes applied without driver intervention, the benefit was not great enough to purchase a newer model. If you can get ESP at no extra cost, then get it. I just think it is much more valuable on rear wheel drive cars than all wheel drive cars.

    As for traction control vs. an RX300, the quattro system is shockingly similar in performance. In fact, with the exception of the extra clearance the RX300 provides in deep snow, an A6 performs the same in the snow. FYI: I have the stock 16" Dunlop 5000's.

    As for the rides, Lexus and Audi are very different. I am convinced that no Audi is as quiet and smooth as comparably priced Lexus models. I notice the cabin is noisier at all speeds (including wind/air flow noise). The transmission is also not as smoooth. But you do get a better sense of the road and handling with an Audi, which is entertaining having driven the cushy Lexus suspensions for the past few years.

    Markcincinnati and Imgotts are on the money with respect to the nav and other nits. One thing to remember with the color maps you get on other cars is that not all the streets are labeled on the map, making it less valuable than you might think. However, having a basic map layout for reference is nice. I do commend Audi w.r.t safety in that looking at the info on the dash is much safer than down by the radio. A DVD based system would be much more efficient.

    Hope that helps. I will say that I am satisfied with my Lexus GS400 for A6 4.2 swap, even though I've lost almost a second in 0-60 speed and the comfort of Lexus reliability. It's just not practical driving a RWD vehicle in Chicago winters.
  • len13len13 Posts: 5
    Thanks for the input on the deal I got. I didn't mention that I bought it in Greenwich, CT, where everything is overpriced, so I feel doubly happy with my deal. I have one other question. For some reason, I thought that the 2.8 came with ESP standard. Wrong. Is there a way to install it at the dealer, or did it have to be a factory install? I would really like to have it. I know you guys love it, but is it that imperative that I get it? Also, any info on the safety of the rear airbags with a baby seat would be appreciated. While I don't have kids yet, I plan on keeping this car, and babies will be in my future.
  • gjo11gjo11 Posts: 7
    Thanks for the info on the comparison. The one thing that I have been impressed with on the rx is the fit and finish of the components. I have had mine for about 3 yrs and have not had a single rattle or squeek. I am wondering if I can expect the same satisfaction with Audi. Also, anybody out there have feedback on overall reliability on A6 4.2. Consumer Report blast it for poor reliability and can't recommend. I don't want a car that is in shop every month! Does Audi service have same pampering that Lexus thrives on?(i.e. loaner vehicles, p/u and deliver, etc)
  • No, ESP cannot be installed on a car that does not have it "from the factory" -- or better said, it is not available to be installed on a car without it from the factory -- Audi did offer a retrofit on TT's -- but financially they had to take it in the shorts. It is complicated, so they say, to retrofit this technology and since it is only $500 MSRP(from the factory) -- it would be hard to justify the "real cost of a retrofit" for Audi (or for you).

    ====

    In spite of my "passion" for ESP, I somewhat agree agree with gs4rx3 on his/her comment that it is less important on an AWD vehicle. It is tough, however to "appreciate" ESP on a test drive, even in a snow covered parking lot -- I still believe it is right up there with ABS -- kind of like a "super-ABS." But, even though my wife and I both traded in 2000 model Audis on 2001 Audis primarily so we could have ESP, we were able to do so with "very minimal" financial consequences. The lack of financial consequences made this ESP acquisition a virtual no-brainer. Make no mistake, I am not endorsing the product so much that I would advise anyone to take a huge financial hit (more than $1,000) just for this technology.

    If you have just purchased a 2000 A6 4.2 and it does not have ESP, keep the car -- unless you can get one with ESP with no $ penalty. ESP is important -- and my "prediction" is that in 2002 or 2003 at the latest it will be "standard" equipment -- but enjoy your 4.2, you HAVE chosen wisely.

    =====

    In my case, I ordered a 2000 A6 4.2 sight unseen -- and in September 1999 it came in (5 months after I ordered it). At that exact moment, there were no 2.7T's to compare it with, and I had had a 1997 A8 with 17" wheels and an S8 suspension kit (from Joe Hoppen) previously. The A6 4.2 seemed to be better in every way to my A8 (except size, but in my case I thought the A8 was too big, so in a reverse sort of way, I thought the A6 was better in size, too).

    When I decided to order a 2001 A6 (because of my desire to have ESP), I test drove, extensively, two A6 2.7T's -- one Tiptronic and one 6 spd manual. The 6 sp manual was fantastic -- but it lacked the "solid feel" that I had come to enjoy in my 2000 4.2. The 4.2 feels like it has more muscles, a sturdier skeleton (since we are anthropomorphizing for the moment) -- the 2.7T feels like super-boy and the 4.2 feels like super-man.

    The only reason, I personally would get the 2.7T over the 4.2 is to get the 6 spd manual. Before the !@#$ hits the fan, let me clarify the other issue on the table -- MSRP. What I found was that for some reason, there appeared to be (at that moment in history) better deals on the 4.2 than on the 2.7T. Deals that minimized the LEASE PAYMENT differential between the two cars. And, since I was lease-payment shopping more than MSRP shopping, I just couldn't NOT justify the price difference. So I went with a 2001 A6 4.2 instead of the 2.7T.

    The A6 4.2 is subtly more refined, subtly more agressive in appearance and just plain feels simultaneously like it is a solid block of steel (strong and heavy) while also feeling very light and agile on its "feet." When you option out the 2.7T to get it close to the 4.2 (in features and options) and factor in discounts off MSRP and lease "deals" the differences financially are perhaps not so great. Then, I once again get down to my major "complaint" -- no 6spd manual option available on the 4.2. Other than that, I'll take the 4.2 (with the above "deal" factored in) any day.

    All this being said, if a loaded 6spd 2.7T dropped out of the sky into my garage -- I would proudly and gladly drive it.

    If you "go with the 2.7T" -- I would strongly urge you to consider the Sport Package option that contains -- the sport suspension and seats and 17" wheel/tire configuration (with the 6spd transmission, of course).

    Finally, you will not be unhappy no matter which one of these A6's you choose. Just don't think that the 4.2 is financially unjustifiable -- if you ask for a deal on the 4.2, the worst they can say is "no." Superboy, is STILL faster than a speeding bullet, able to leap tall buildings in a single bound, etc. You really can't go wrong.

    Oh yea, on the reliability issue -- I kept my 2000 A6 4.2 for 23,000 miles -- changed the tires at about 19,000 miles (the factory Dunlp SP9000s were showing their age -- and yes, I put SP9000's back on it) and had three sets of front rotors put on the car (the ones that came in were warped and were replaced within 1,000 miles and they were replaced with a "good set" at around 16,000 miles). Other than that, the Audis I have owned (24 of them so far) have been more reliable than my friends American and European cars and somehwhat less reliable than my other friends Japanese cars. This appears to be changing since the 1997 models however, as my Audis are not in the shop any more than my friends Toyota, Honda or Nissan producs (including Lexus, Accura, etc.) So I give the Audi's an "OK" and a comparable to virtually anything else I know of (but then again my personal experience since 1978 has been exclusively with Audis).

    That's my story. . . .
  • During my test drives (I only considered the 2.7T with 6 speed and the 4.2 tip) I too felt the 4.2 to have a much more solid feel. This feel was IMMEDIATELY apparent, just cruising slowly down the road. At one point I took two friends out on a test ride and they both commented on the ride quality difference as well. I suspect that this feeling has partly to do with the extra weight of the car, but it still cornered very well and I'll live with the weight - it may even smooth out those many freeway miles. It may also have to do with the modified suspension parts that are different from the other A6's. [Comments?]

    The sales person which I drove with was really great, I was (and actually encouraged to be) as aggressive as I wanted on the test drive(s). As well, the test models did not have the sport suspension as I will have on the car I ordered, so I expect the handling to be excellent when I get it.

    I'll really miss the 6 speed in the 4.2, but again, the tip works well if you want to deal with ratios while cornering, and I know that I'll not miss the shifting while waiting in traffic. I also love the subtle fender flares on the 4.2, they almost make the other models look slab-sided when compared next to each other.

    Probably the biggest nit I had with ordering the 4.2: I'm not at all happy about the center seating position in the rear. I think that the 'rear buckets' are kind of cool, and 4 passengers will be the most I'll have most of the time, but on those occasions that there's a fifth person...if they're sitting on a hump that's one thing, but to not have a three-point belt is really, really bad. I will be reluctant to take 5 people as it's pretty silly to brag about all of the modern safety features of the car when one person is - not.

    My wife really, really wanted the 6 speed and center belts in the 2.7T, but as this is going to be a lease through my company, she deferred to me for the final decision. I love her! Did I mention that I told her we could probably get a TT or some such (Boxster?) for her someday...?

    Any comments about the rear air-bags and their use with a child seat in the rear? I'm in the same boat in that there are no kids now, but may be before the lease is up.

    All trade-offs considered, I'm still very happily going with the 4.2. My friends will just have to drive themselves, and we'll simply have to get an S6 Avant when the kids arrive. :-)
  • gs4rx3gs4rx3 Posts: 25
    My RX300 is also a 1999 and it has had no problems, squeaks or rattles. My GS400 also had minimal problems. One of my main concerns moving to Audi was the reliability and service issue. I took comfort in reading all 700+ posts on this site and the many posts at Audi World that the number of problems that arise have significantly diminished over time. It appears Audi now makes a fairly high quality automobile. However, I do not believe the fit and finish will ever be as tight as that of a Lexus.

    As for Audi service pampering, you'll have to negotiate that with your dealer. I was told by dealers in my area that they provide loaners for ANY service so long as you buy the Audi from them. Otherwise, they claim they follow Audi warranty guidelines, which I believe doesn't allow for loaners unless your car service takes at least [2?] hours or more. To ensure my dealer's loaner and pick-up and delivery service does not suddenly change during my ownership tenure, I had them write the loaner privilege into my contract. You should do the same.
  • I'm new to this forum, but would really appreciate some help from anyone out there. I have reviewed 750+ postings, and have seen no mention of the problem I am experiencing. I recently purchased a preowned 2000 Audi A6 2.8 Quattro with 9400 miles. Car is like new. During the test drive at the dealership, I heard some intermittent clicking and creaking noises (like plastic on plastic)that seemed to be coming from the driver side dash area. They seemed to disappear when the car warmed up, so I attributed them to expansion and contraction. Previous owner said they never heard anything. Dealer was confident the noises could be eliminated, and purchase was contingent on this. Dash was reset, and problem appeared to be eliminated when I drove the car prior to purchasing it. I heard nothing for the first couple of days, and now the sounds have started again. I did some checking on the AudiWorld website, and read several similar complaints, but not much in the way of answers. There was some suggestion of fixing this problem with felt, but no details were provided. Has anyone out there experienced this, and if so, what have you done about it? I am totally happy with the car in every other way, but this is very annoying! Any suggestions would be appreciated!
  • To randiy:

    I have a '00 A6 2.7T 6M with 14,500 miles and had a small vibration coming from where the headliner meets the windshield (right in front of the driver's face). I wedged a small piece of black foam rubber (which is imperceptible) into the spot where the liner meets the windshield and, presto, the problem is gone and has not recurred.

    Regarding the dash noise, I occasionally get a creaking noise from what appears to be the dash area, but like you mentioned, it seems to go away once the car is warmed up. I have no permanent solution to offer you. You're not alone.

    QUESTION FOR EVERYONE: I have the standard seats in my A6 (NOT the sports package). Does anyone experience a slight rocking sensation when first accelerating or when coming to a stop? The dealer checked it and found that all seat connections were tight and normal. I doubt they even checked anything! I'm going to ask them to check again at my 16,000 mile service.

    Eric
  • timcartimcar Posts: 363
    Eric, I have about 1,050 on my 2.7T. The seats don't rock. Rockings is NOT normal, though I've heard of this defect from other posters. Can't remember what the fix might be, but it must be a pain for the dealers, as these other posters were told the same thing.
  • mpuzachmpuzach Posts: 635
    I had the same annoying vibration as Eric. It was in the area around the visor vanity light. All I needed to do to stop the vibration was put my thumb on the headliner in the vicinity of the light. At first I thought that its source was the metal clip vibrating inside the plastic light lens. I wedged some heavy paper between the metal clip and its slot, but the vibration soon returned. I then tried groping inside the roof area behind the light, but couldn't find the source. Out of frustration, I tried a less sophisticated version of Eric's solution: I jammed a wad of terrycloth wash cloth material into the headliner and snapped the light back in place. Problem solved. Of course, I try not to tell too many people that I fixed my $40K car by jamming a rag into it.
  • Did you guys see the photo of the A6 in Automobile Magazine, March issue? It looks basically the same with a little bit of touch-up. Unless you own one, it is hard to tell the 2001 from the 2002. The article says it will be on sale this June. I'm waiting for more details, i.e. engine, features, etc., from the dealer. This BBS is great. I never thought I'd learn any thing more about this car, other than by reading technical manuals, publicity releases, or car magazine articles. This is real life, as best we can get it. Enjoy the ride.
  • My friend owns a '98 A6 Quattro. She spends a lot of time driving and her 6 has recently developed a very troubling problem.

    After a drive of about 30-45 minutes she will park the car and shut it down. After the car sits for a few minutes if she tries to restart it it will not start. The engine cranks and she has fuel and power but there is no ignition. The engine light sometimes comes on, but not always. She has verified that the gas cap is secured.

    The car has been brought to Audi deals repeatedly (four times), but every time they try it it starts fine. (It has usually been sitting overnight by the time they get to it) This car is still 15K miles inside of the warranty and she would like to have the problem solved before the warranty expires.

    Has anyone seen a similar problem? Please help.

    Thanks
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