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Honda Accord vs Toyota Camry

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Comments

  • blaneblane Posts: 2,017
    Sandy,

    Don't let yourself be sidetracked by Princess and The Pea concerns. With your radio on, you will never notice wind noise in either vehicle.
  • blufz1blufz1 Posts: 2,045
    Always buy the car you "like" best. You will tend to keep the car longer. The fewer cars you own in your lifetime the more bux you will have. Just my .02. :)
  • "The fewer cars you own in your lifetime the more bux you will have." Is that really true though? I guess it depends on what you call saving money.

    I guess its buy or lease a new car and not have to pay for any repairs (covered under warranty) VS. buy a car and pay for repairs and services after the warranty expires. And, generally older cars have more problems that newer ones.

    To eash his/her own..
  • blufz1blufz1 Posts: 2,045
    Absolutely true. A car is the 2nd largest purchase price item consumers buy,next to a home purchase.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    I guess its buy or lease a new car and not have to pay for any repairs (covered under warranty) VS. buy a car and pay for repairs and services after the warranty expires. And, generally older cars have more problems that newer ones.


    Yes, but even an older car like my 12 year old, 176k mile Accord only costs about $400 a year to maintain/keep running practically perfectly. Compare that to a month for a car payment every MONTH!
  • blufz1blufz1 Posts: 2,045
    Good to see you on,grad. Hope school is going well. Really,when you think of all the money we spend on repeated car purchases over a lifetime it can exceed a one time purchase of a home.
  • Many people aren't as lucky with a 12 year old car.

    I guess I just like to drive new cars for a few years and then get a new car. I like everything being under warranty and usually get bored with a car after a few years.

    When I was younger I dropped about $4,500 into a 1992 Accord, and I only owned that car for about two years.

    Whats the point of having money if you're not going to spend it...doesn't have to be on a car...and yes, planning for retirement is also important so thats where a lot of money goes too.
  • When I was younger I dropped about $4,500 into a 1992 Accord, and I only owned that car for about two years.

    Yes, one of my friends just had her 2001 TL w/ 65K miles head gasket replaced. She needs to pay from her own pocket b/c there's no warranty. :surprise:
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    I don't have a 12 year old car, but do drive a 10 year old Accord now with 183K miles.

    I considered replacing it four-five years ago with 100K miles on it. Then again around 150K with me "anticipating" repair expense on an old car. I figured, both times, that if there comes a time when I had to spend $300 or so on repairs every month, it would make sense to just buy a new car.

    I did buy an '06 TL but the Accord still gets more than half of the miles I drive each month. If I drove about 1000-1200 miles and didn't take my cars on road trips, I could have done away without the TL and saved hundreds/month while doing so.
  • bug4bug4 Posts: 370
    robertsmx -- perhaps it wont' be appropriate on this thread (but maybe on the TL v. Accord thread). I would be very interested to read a critical evaluation of your 06 TL. What do you like, what don't you like? The more critical (both good and bad), the better . . .
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    The chances that a 10 year old car would need repairs that come close to the expense of a new car, are very slim. That would have to be a lemon like I have never seen. If the repair bills on your old car, would get to the point where buying a new car would be cost effective, that make and model (I hope) would be scratched from the list of new car choices. There comes a point and time when every car owner feels the need for a new car, but repair bills, and the warranty running out, are not usually the real reason for it. Many people will use it as an excuse though. My uncle is one of those people. He says "I never pay for repairs on my cars, because I trade them in as soon as the warranty runs out" trying to imply that he's somehow saving money that way. I don't think so.
  • I think your uncle, like me, just enjoys driving new cars and only wants to keep them for a few years. Some people do not like driving old cars and enjoy newer technology, including safety technology. Also, new engines and motors, suspension, stereo, etc.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    It would be unfair to compare my 98 Accord to 06 TL. But as far as TL goes, the biggest surprise has been fuel economy and handling. I was almost set to purchase TSX for those reasons but don’t miss it at all. In fact, the TL gets me virtually identical mileage as the Accord. Both get me 25-26 mpg consistently in mixed driving (50-50). It is a different matter though that the Acura runs on premium. They both get me about the same mileage on highway too (32-33 mpg with an average speed between 70- 75 mph).

    The engine is whisper quiet during cruising and low throttle driving and under low throttle driving. But at the same time, produces a nice refined growl when throttle is depressed that I could hear all day.

    While the transmission is virtually seamless, I think Acura should go for a 6AT, with sport shift mode that affords greater control to the driver than the TL currently does. I would also like to see Acura being less aggressive with gearing around 40-45 mph. As it is now, if you drive only under 45 mph, you will never engage the top gear. A lower limit should be possible, and might help gain another mpg or two in real world (besides helping improve EPA ratings as well, since most of their tests involve speeds under 40 mph).

    Although quiet for having sporty suspension, wide and low profile tires, it could use a little more noise insulation on old concrete surfaces. May be it is in the tires. I also think it is one of the best looking cars in sub-40K price class, with a fantastic interior design (being an engineer, I like industrial designs, and the nice aluminum/carbon-fiber trimming in my silver TL is just the kind I would design).

    The ride may be a bit firm for a typical Lexus buyer (Acura did soften the base model a bit in 2007 and apparently it handles just as well. TL-S handles even better and rides more like my 06 TL). If I had to do it again, I will pick the TL, again. I am curious to see how much more Acura can actually improve the car over the 2004-2008 version.
  • My uncle is one of those people. He says "I never pay for repairs on my cars, because I trade them in as soon as the warranty runs out" trying to imply that he's somehow saving money that way.

    It's true if he's a wise consumer. I won't try to waste my time to explain to people who have different thinking PLUS if everyone buys new cars. The market for old cars will be bad. :P
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    Please, explain this to me. :surprise: I'm looking for ways to save $$. Explain how buying a new car every 5 years costs less than buying a new one every 10 years. I'm on the edge of my seat here. I guess I'm not "wise" enough to figure this one out. :confuse:
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    think your uncle, like me, just enjoys driving new cars and only wants to keep them for a few years. Some people do not like driving old cars and enjoy newer technology, including safety technology. Also, new engines and motors, suspension, stereo, etc.

    Of Course! Nothing wrong with that. My dad gets bored with cars and changes every couple of years. (02 CR-V, 03 Accord, 05 Accord, 07 Civic - see a pattern? :))

    For those who do their best to spend as little as possible, keeping an old car that costs, say, $200 every quarter at the most to keep running makes more financial sense.
  • blufz1blufz1 Posts: 2,045
    Camry or Accord, the longer you drive 'em the less they cost. Plus it's more fun trading every 10 years or so. Then the new car seems much more,well,"new".
  • I don't say that it costs less but the number is very closed. The biggest misunderstanding with most people is that they think if they don't make any payments, their cars are not depreciated. The problem is a car is still depreciating at year 6 to 9, it's just at a lower rate. When a car is older than 10 years old, the depreciation is almost none but you're facing two problems now (1) how many more years can you keep this car running? (2) Repairs?

    You've been here for a long time and you can do the math.

    (1) If you trade in after about 5 years = 19.5K for a new 2008 Camry LE - trade in value for 2003 LE w/ 50K miles (10-11K?---edmunds = $10200) + 1 set of tires and brakes after 3rd or 4th year + minor repairs.

    (2) If you trade in after about 10 years = 19.5K for a new 2008 Camry LE - trade in value for 1998 LE w/ 100K miles (3-4K?---edmunds = $3400) + 2 to 3 set of tires and brakes + minor repairs + possible major repairs b/c you have no warranty from year 6 to 10 (Hopefully it will be less than 1.5K that you save instead of trade it in after 5 years).

    Actually, there' re people who are willing to pay ~1K just to extend the warranty to 7 years.
  • djm2djm2 Posts: 705
    Hi All:
    Friday,I had the opportunity to visit a Honda dealership. (A friend was dropping off his Civic for service,and I had the opportunity to look at some of the vehicles in the showroom.)
    The 2008 Honda Accord is very nice, and it is a big improvement over the 2003 Honda Accord that I owned prior to my 2007 Camry. But, there is still a "Big Issue" with the comfort of the seats. The seats seem to be higher than the 2003, but they are VERY HARD compared to the Camry. (The 2008 Accord had cloth seats, and my Camry has leather). I like the new Accord, and I would consider purchasing one in 2010, if Honda would make softer seats. I spend a lot of time in a vehicle and I need comfort! I do not want "road feel" on my bottom!
    Something very interesting is happening with Honda dealers in Northern New Jersey. They are no longer doing New Jersey inspection. (Too many problems with the State!) My friend had to take his Civic to a service station in town for the inspection, and then have his vehicle serviced at the dealer for specific Honda issues! (He would not use "state run inspection stations" because he feels that they abuse vehicles in the inspection process.)
    Best regards to everyone. ------ Dwayne :shades: ;) :)
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    The preference for seats seems to be the same as it is for mattress. Some like it firm (me), and you like it soft. I can take soft for short rides and all, but it seems to have an adverse effect during long/spirited drives.

    That said, sometimes cloth versus leather can also make a difference. The leather seats in my 1998 Accord have a softer feel to them compared to cloth trimmed seats in Accords from the same year.

    The seats in my TL are firmer than the Accord's, and I love it. It adds to sportiness (check out any sports/performance car, they will have firmer seats).
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    Not even Accord/Camry are expected to hold half of their original price after five years, and more so at trade-in. I would say, $8.5K (which would be right around 5-year residual per ALG). So, on the first car, the buyer spends $13K (taxes not to be left out). And again, after another five years. Total cost: $26K.

    For another buyer who decided to go 10-years, and manages to sell the car for $2.5K, the cost would be $19K. We're looking at $7K in savings.

    Compared to replacements at 50K miles, 100K miles will basically add another set of tires, batteries, potentially bulbs potentially brakes (original front brakes in my 1998 Accord lasted 90K miles, and rear brake pads were replaced at 132K miles, and at 183K miles, those were the only brake pad replacements I have had to make). No modern car should demand $6K-7K in repairs between 50-60K miles, much less the cars that set the benchmark in durability.

    BTW, one of the reasons I can afford to have two cars in my garage (06 TL w/30K miles, 98 Accord w/183K miles) is that it has cost next to nothing in maintenance which wouldn't have been possible if I were still making payments on it. The insurance cost goes down too.
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    Although $19, 500 is way too low for a Camry LE, I will go with that number. So I am to believe that the $19,500 price of a second new car in a ten year period will be covered by the depreciation and repair costs between year 6 and 10. Those depreciation and repair costs would have to be $325/month. That's one heck of a lemon. Sure glad I didn't buy an 08 Camry LE. :surprise:

    Nice try, but the numbers don't add up.
  • 8.5K for a 2003 Camry LE? I think it's a bit too low. I just posted for an auction # and see what people can get at trade in.

    Tax? We only pay tax on the diff. in most states. So, 19.5K - 8.5K = 11K + 6% tax = $11,660 (not 13K).

    90K to replace brakes? You're lucky. I replaced my Avalon brakes at 38K miles, Corolla at 40K miles, Camry at 45K miles, and G35 re-surface rotor at 10K miles. I like to change my tires sooner even if it' in o.k condition b/c I live in the Northeast.
  • Although $19, 500 is way too low for a Camry LE

    Well, invoice for '08 LE = ~19.5K - 500 cash = ~19K

    I don't add tax here b/c we have diff. tax rate, tax credit on trade or no tax at all.

    Nice try, but the numbers don't add up.

    Show me your number...the only thing you can disagree w/ me is the trade in value which I'm waiting for the auction number.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    Show me your number...the only thing you can disagree w/ me is the trade in value

    About $800. This includes timing belt/water pump, front brake pads, battery and a headlamp may have been replaced ($12). In fact, with 183K miles now, it has had only one repair... a cracked radiator hose. That happened around 152K miles or so.

    If someone buys a new car, for that span, the cost would be several times over (and $800 may actually be equal to taxes paid).

    And we're assuming the person doesn't finance, but buys on cash. Otherwise don't forget to add interest.

    One of the appeals of buying an Accord or Camry is that you don't have to consider replacing it after 50K miles from fear of repairs. In fact, that was something I told the finance guy when picking up my Accord ten years ago. He was trying to sell extended warranty... told him, if I felt the need for it, I wouldn't be buying a Honda. Saved a grand in the process.
  • Again, I've never said it's cheaper to trade in cars more often but the # can be closed b/t 5 years and 10 years. However, you will SAVE a lot of $$ when it passes 10 years mark because you pay almost 0 depreciation.
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    Show me your number...the only thing you can disagree w/ me is the trade in value which I'm waiting for the auction number.

    The numbers were there. Pretty simple. Depreciation and repair/maintenance costs between year 5 and 10 would have to equal the price of the new car. That's $325/month or $4,000/year, however you want to put it. Cars do not depreciate much between years 6 and 10, like you mentioned, and tires, brakes, and batteries are going to wear just as quickly on a 5 year old car, as they will on a 10 year old car, so they don't count.

    My point is depreciation, repair, and the few extra maintenance items between year 6 and 10 will probably not equal $4000 (and that would be remarkably high). So that leaves you with $15,000 of extra costs for the new car. And that is extremely conservative. Not even close.

    Just say you want a new car every 5 years, because you want a new car every 5 years. Saying it is cost effective is poppycock, if you'll pardon my French. ;)
  • Well, I just got the trade in # and yes, it's 10-11K for the '03 Camry LE.

    link title

    So, here is my number again and I also assume that you have $0 repairs from year 6 to 10.

    (1) If you trade in after about 5 years = 19.5K - 10-11K trade + 6% Tax = $9K to $10K ( x 2 = 18 to 20K)

    (2) If you trade in after about 10 years = 19.5K - 3-4K trade + 6% tax = 15 to 16.5K

    I rather pay an xtra $300 /year to drive a new car. :cry:
  • blufz1blufz1 Posts: 2,045
    You left the time value of money out of your computations. :)
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    I rather pay an xtra $300 /year to drive a new car.

    You can twist the numbers all you want, but it's going to cost you a lot more than $300/year. Closer to $300/month actually. Believe what you want. :(
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