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BMW 5-Series Sedans

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  • microrepairmicrorepair Eastern MassachusettsPosts: 508
    I also had bad luck with the Yoko AV db tires on my E320. Yoko gave me a prorated trade (at 12K miles) and I have had their Avid V4 for over 20K miles and am very happy with them. If you look at Tirerack's website you'll find lots of comments on most tires and right now people are filing lots of good words about the Continental Extreme Contact tires.
  • riezriez Posts: 2,361
    joatmon... I've never leased a car. Have studied it and looked into doing it for a specific car or two, but not for me. I drive too many miles a year and I deduct my cars for business on actual expense basis.

    Issue discussed was depreciation, not leasing. All I'm reminding people is that depreciation is the difference between what you actually pay when you buy something less what you receive when you actually sell that same thing for later in time. You have to look at actual selling prices--both at time or original sale and later resale. Not MSRPs (unless it was sold at MSRP). Nor can you base it on what the dealer resells your trade for. You likely got wholesale; dealer sells at retail. And projected lease residual is not actual depreciation.

    Market, vehicle, and other conditions all impact what your realized depreciation will be.

    BMWs tend to depreciate less than many (most?) other marques. But most BMWs do depreciate and more than we'd like to think. And the deep lease subsidies, rebates, discounts, financing deals, and other incentives out there today, at or near record levels for many marques, have worked, on average, to lower used car prices in today's market.
  • joatmonjoatmon Posts: 315
    My post has nothing to do with MSRP. My figure was based upon selling price of the vehicle, which was the same regardless of my lease or purchase decision.

    I agree that with a lease you really don't own anything. But, few BMW owners seem to own their BMWs for a long term. Hence, my suggestion to "cap" the cost (AKA depreciation) via a lease.

    Now, a lease is not for everyone, but a large percentage of BMWs are leased. For the record, I am the exception to the rule. I recently leased a BMW, also recently purchsed a BMW, and just sold a BMW after 17 years of ownership. I've experienced it from many angles, and I think leasing may be worthy of investigation.

    Happy Motoring,

    Jack
  • riezriez Posts: 2,361
    Sales for 5 Series holding strong. Would be interesting to see how many E39s vs E60s. New 7 still having trouble.
     
    Make Model September 2003 August 2003 YTD 2003 YTD 2002

    BMW 3 Series 5,515 5,526 53,491 50,667
    BMW 5 Series 2,911 2,061 33,129 28,932
    BMW 7 Series 1,457 1,817 14,410 16,296
    29,394
    BMW M5 64 28 1,356 1,248

    Mercedes-Benz E-Class 4,499 4,113 38,629 23,226
    Mercedes-Benz C-Class 4,131 3,537 38,871 34,646
    Mercedes-Benz S-Class 2,025 1,622 15,981 14,534
  • bmwsellerbmwseller Posts: 200
    Your contention that a BMW depreciates 50% in three years is what started this whole discussion/debate. Admit you're wrong or present evedence showing otherwise. It's not a leasing question. Leasing, or conventional finance has nothing to do with depreciation. The car depreciates all the time in some sense, but a five doesn't lose half its value in 3 years.
  • riezriez Posts: 2,361
    bmwseller... You have me confused with lazura's post at 7624.

    If you re-read all my posts on this subject (7589, 7596, 7606, 7627, 7634, 7637, and 7644), you'll see I did NOT mention 50%. Please read them over.

    Only numbers I gave were based on my actual experience. My loaded '98 540i6 had an original MSRP around $57,000. She was built in 11/97 and originally sold in 2/98. I bought it CPO at about 52,000 miles in 11/01. I paid about $35,000 for it (but there was a trade-in involved). When I sold her at about 79,000 miles in 9/03, I received about $17,500 for it (but it was a trade in so that isn't exact). So I did lose 50% of what I paid for it in less than 2 years. Since I do not know what the original buyer paid, I cannot calculate depreciation over the first 79,000 miles. I can roughly say that comparing original MSRP to recent sale, she lost around 69% of her value. That was since 2/98 and over nearly 80,000 miles. The next buyer likely will pay over $20,000. That will restart their calculation.
  • bmwsellerbmwseller Posts: 200
    my fault. Pricing and value are part of my business. It's not a hobby. I'll bet that 540 was a joy to drive. I'll be more careful next time. sorry
  • The brochure I received from the dealer and Edmunds both list rear seat side airbags as an option of the new 5. However, when I "build my 5" on bmwusa.com I can find no such option. Three years ago, I was in an accident in which I hit my head on the window. I swore I would never buy another car without side airbags. I have two little kids and would like full protection in the rear seats, in addition to the curtain bags. Do you know how you order these?
  • Ok...so I finally got a chance to see the new '04 530i, up close and personal....It just so happened to be in the same color scheme as my '03 530i (Toledo Blue/Sand Beige int.)......I chose the '03 back in Feb. based on my views and reviews of the (upcoming) 5'er....I really tried to like her (the '04), but from the outside looking in, she just didn't do it for me......am so glad I bought what I did, when I did.......:) BTW, I read in my manual that there is a first aid kit under the passenger seat, but none exists.......What's up with that?
  • bmwsellerbmwseller Posts: 200
    I'd get the rear side air bags for the safety of my children also. www.bmwusa.com is not right on the money all the time for such things and I'm not really all that surprised to hear of such an omission. Rest assured, however, that this option is available (option code 261, $385).

    I might also add that head protection system which is standard on the car will protect against head injury. It's a tubular balloon that extends from the A-pillar to the C-pillar and is wrapped in a "sail" type of cover. It's brilliant.
  • jb_shinjb_shin Posts: 357
    Well, it is a well known "feature" that is missing from US spec. cars. If you did ED, then you would have had it while you had the car in Europe, along with the warning triangle. They are then both taken off before being shipped to the US. The first aid kit has something to do with not meeting FDA, or some other Federal regulation. The triangle, I don't know. They are both required by law in Europe.
  • lazuralazura Posts: 43
    bmwseller,
       I don't use the BMWFS residual numbers to figure depreciation. Those are subsidized leases with bloated residuals (although I will admit these BMW subsidized residuals lower the lease payment to the first owner). I just checked the latest 'unbiased and non-subsidized' residual numbers (via ALG) for a 2004 530i (E60) and it is 52% for 3 years at 15k miles per year (I would never sign up for less than 15K miles per year on a lease). Therefore, at the end of a non-BMWFS finance company lease, I would be able to purchase the $50,000 E60 in three years at $26,000. This can easily be done by finding a leasee that is near the end of his 3-year lease and offering to buy him out by paying the residual (or a little over). Sites such as leasecompare.com and leasetrader.com are great references for this type of transaction.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    The Finance, Warranty & Insurance board right here in the Town Hall is also a great reference for all things leasing, and in fact, is where this conversation needs to be taken.

    Thanks.
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,468
    I undestand how you wouldn't want to own another car w/o side impact airbags, but they are an option for a reason. I'm not so thrilled with the idea of something coming flying out at a child at speeds around 200mph. Now don't get me wrong, I'm a huge supporter of air bags. There is a reson they tell you not to put children in the front seat in the event of a front end collision and an airbag deployment.

    2001 Honda Prelude Type SH/ 2011 BMW 328xi / 2011 Honda Pilot EX-L w/ Navigation

  • The '04 530i that I test drove had a first aid kit in the trunk along with the tool kit.
  • am looking for '04 530 or 545ia ED. Does anyone know if there are any leasing incentives going on right not. Not in a hurry, want ED in May, 04
  • bjoyebjoye Posts: 35
    joatmon,
    Please tell me you put down some cap cost reduction on that lease. $446/mo. for a 530 with those options and 15k miles a year? Holy cow. I have an '01 525 with just the convenience pkg. and I've been paying $667/mo. You're killing me.
  • bjoyebjoye Posts: 35
    Just for the record, my car retailed for $39,9k and I got about 1k off. It's now worth $26k private party sale by kbb, but I see it with comparable mileage for $30k+ at dealers.
  • mtn723mtn723 Posts: 2
    Dealers are quoting MSRP on the new 5 series. I found one will to sell at $500 off of MSRP. Would like to know what other are paying.
  • erickplerickpl Posts: 2,735
    My 02 325xi has the rear air bags. If you opt for them, they will probably arrive depowered. If your kids are rather young still, you probably want to avoid using them at this point. They will be more effective if your children are older/bigger. I've had to teach mine that sleeping with your head against the window is a BAD thing. It took a quick demo with an air tank, a balloon, and a ball to show them would could happen to their heads.

    I was able to have mine activated as both of my kids are older. If you get them with your small kids, you could power them later when they are older. Not much assurance now, but something to consider. If you only have one, you should put them in the middle seat for safety.

    -Paul
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Try reading some of the recent messages in the discussion at this link: BMW 5-Series: Prices Paid & Buying Experience. They should be helpful and that's a great place to ask.

    Welcome! Feel free to drop me an email if I can help you find your way around.
  • Can anyone tell me when the navigation and the head up display will be available on the new 5 series? any help is much appreciated.....thanks in advance
  • I was told that they would be available in March.
  • dv8eddv8ed Posts: 17
    I would like to have the Bluetooth option on my new 5 series. What does it take to get it installed? The next cell phone I purchase will be a bluetooth capable phone. Any help is appreciated.
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    If you are willing to go the European Delivery route, you should be able to get $1,200 - $1,500 over the ED invoice on the new 5-series. That works out to about $6,000 under MSRP, not including your travel expenses.

    A friend of mine here in DC is doing just that. He was planning to pick up the car in January, but is now considering postponing to April (spring break) so he can take his kids and wife on the trip and also get the nav system.

    Going the ED route makes even more sense with a "hot" car that dealers are unwilling to discount for US delivery. My dealer readily admits that he will discount an ED 2004 530i to $1,200 over invoice, but the best he could do for US delivery is $500-$1,000 under MSRP. That is a whopping difference of over $5,000, n/i trip expenses. The ED cars do NOT come out of his precious US allocation, but DO count towards their sales volume/bonuses. That's the best of both worlds for a BMW dealer, hence the willingness to discount.
  • I am in DC also, what dealer did your friend go to???
  • srfastsrfast Posts: 138
    Are you talking E39 or E60? I have BT installed in my 2003 530i.

    Regards....JL
  • ksomanksoman Posts: 590
    if your car is not bought yet, get it installed before delivery, because the expense of getting a bluetooth set up is much more than the 1000 odd bucks BMW is charging. I have been using BT technology phones and PDA and various other things such as wireless handsfree devices for over a year now and they rock. However, its ridiculous what it costs to make my wife's bmw convertible bluetooth ready... 1000 bucks? the damn sony phone was not worth 200 bucks last year when the technology was blazing new in the market... anyway, it is cool and i think the BT used in the Acura TL is better.

    ksso
  • dzubadzuba Posts: 159
    It is also available on the 02/03 530 in a "kit". I need to find the article in Roundel from a few months ago - think it was about $600-750.00.
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    My friend lives in PA (Erie) and is going through the local dealer up there, who we know well.

    Here in the DC area, according to others, Passport will go to $1,200-$1,500 over ED invoice. I would likely go with VOB or Tischer if they could match that deal, as they are closer to me. I also stopped in Arlington BMW last week to look at the new 5-series and they indicated they would ddiscount ED, but we didn't get into specifics. I'll know a lot more when I actually get ready to buy, but that may not be until next spring and I am not yet sold on the new 5.

    Many BMW dealers will not volunteer that ED prices are negotiable. But once they know that you know they are, the pencil comes out.
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