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Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall



  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 18,042
    Stanley Chesley files for class action suit against Toyota about runaway acceleration and slowness in reporting danger.

    Never one to miss a good class action opportunity, Cincinnati's Stan Chesley is now involved.

    Chesley is a Cincinnati attorney and the article is in the Enquirer, so most of the blog posts after it are from online Enquirer readers.

    In among the raucous posts by believers after the above-linked article, is this one, typical of what the class action is really about:

    This problem started before 2007. My daughter drives a 2005 Corolla and in 2006 she was pulling into a space in a parking garage. As she was pulling in and slowly took her foot off the brake the car shot forward and slammed into the concrete wall. She called me hysterical because the car shot forward so abrubtly, and the airbags did not deploy. She is actually lucky the wall was there and this hadn't happened on the expressway. We had the car towed to a Toyota dealership with $5,000 work of damage. We talked to several reps from Toyota and they claimed that they checked the computer to see if it indicated sudden acceleration, which "they say" did not, but NOW they are questioning the validity of the computer systems in the cars. In addition to this issue, the car didn't have floor mats on the driver's side. This whole story is sounding all too familiar and scares me to death because she still owns this car and drives her family in it. We have owned Toyotas since 1983, and this is totally unbelievable. There have been too many lives lost at this point. Something needs to be done NOW by Toyota bar all cost. Their reputation is on the line right now, and I don't like what I see.
  • dturrdturr Posts: 70
    A further 7,000 Peugeot Citroen cars are being recalled in the UK due to a faulty accelerator problem they share with the stricken Toyotas.

    The Peugeot 107 and Citroen C1 models were produced at the facility the company shares with crisis-hit Toyota in the Czech Republic.

    The move

    Read more: ds-father-family-died-Lexus-crash.html#ixzz0eThDCJfv
  • Many here have asserted that those european brands, BMW, MB or VW, have this brake override feature where tapping on the brake will disengage the accelerator. I stated earlier that I could confirm that such feature didn't exist on my 330 and C55.

    i would also add four names to that list of cars that supposed have but actually don't have this "feature", a 530 and a G37x. tapping on the brake does nothing to the accelerator at all.

    two friends of mine tried on their S5 and GL450 and none of those vehicles have this feature that they are supposed to have, per our resident experts here.
  • "If this pedal thing really winds up being stray electronics or something like that, it could cost all the automakers big bucks to fix their systems. "

    it depends on how the driving public wants to take this thing. All software is buggy. the only difference is that the more complicated, the buggier it is.

    if the driving public has zero tolerance for any bug in the software, and the manufacturers would have no choice but to test the auto software as they do with avionics, well, you will end up paying a 737-class price for your Ford Focus.

    if we take a reasonable approach and improve driver education, well, we will end up in a better place.

    my advice to anyone with no tolerance to risk is NOT to live. there literally is no other way out.

    the choice is collectively ours.
  • revitrevit Posts: 476
    it depends on how the driving public wants to take this thing.

    If this thing fixes the sudden accelerations where the pedals are not involved, who wouldn't "take this thing" one way and one way only?

    This is Toyota's problem that needs to be addressed.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 18,042
    >my advice to anyone with no tolerance to risk is NOT to live. there literally is no other way out.

    Are you suggesting suicide if someone doesn't have tolerance for risk?

    Are you suggesting if someone doesn't think software/firmware in a car computer shouldn't be failsafe, they have only one way out?

    I disagree. If there is a problem in the computer handling sensor input, there need to be checks that shut the computer's control down so it doesn't give full throttle acceleration from a dead stop with the accelator pedal untouched, e.g., such as during parking.
  • revitrevit Posts: 476
    Oh my...that is definitely not what Toyota needs right now.
  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,119
    Shoot, why not? They have cars they can't use but are still required to make payments on them. This is particularly troublesome if it's the only vehicle in the household.
  • mikefm58mikefm58 Posts: 2,882
    I know it sounds brutal, but it boils down to the cost of the fix versus the cost of litigation. The two best examples I can think of are the Ford Pinto exploding gas tank and the Chevy truck exploding gas tank. Those would have required significant vehicle redesign to fix, multiply that by all of those vehicles on the road, and they felt it was cheaper to fight the lawsuits than fix. Quite brutal indeed. Their reputation for quality or lack thereof was not an issue as that takes a hit regardless. But Toyota's hit is different as their reputation for quality really is what sets them apart. The long term fallout for Toyota will be interesting.
  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,119
    Well, a very brave or stupid stuntman could try to duplicate the problem. We can always take a stock ES350 and put a roll cage in it ala NASCAR and try to duplicate the problem with a race car driver at the wheel. I don't know if there are any NASCAR drivers desperate, greedy, or foolish enough to take on this task. I don't think Kyle Busch would want to upset his sponsor.
  • rockyleerockylee Posts: 14,011
    Agree Mike. Toyota built it's reputation on precision engineering and is the only reason why they stole so many customers from the Big 3. Hopefully the american consumer will realize that Japanese automobiles have flaws and faults just like the Big 3. If this story doesn't die down just maybe General Motors will once again be the worlds largest automaker!!!!! :shades:

  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 18,042
    >The two best examples I can think of are the Ford Pinto exploding gas tank and the Chevy truck exploding gas tank.

    Those two flaws in vehicles don't compare with the unintended acceleration and the ongoing coverup.

    The Pinto gas tank only caught fire (not exploded) if the car were hit in the rear, hard. Then there was no fire unless the car was hit again in the secondary impact which caused metal to rub and generate a spark which caught the gasoline the might, might be leaking out the rear of the tank through the intrusion caused by the rear axle differential housing.

    This didn't happen in every accident, and it didn't happen when driving your Pinto around and parking and going down the highway. It only occurred in that unlikely event of a severe REAR end accident.

    Same for Chevy truck fuel tank.
  • flxmomflxmom Posts: 24
    Another question,,,IF it is Electronic or the drive by wire theory..then what does it matter what pedal it is or does it? Can one pedal work well with the system and the other not and was the CTS pedal in ALL the cars that had accidents, I doubt it..They arent saying anything about that...My Sienna doesnt have the CTS pedal but it has had lots of complaints about over acceleration including crashes..its not on the recall,WHY?! I dont trust Toyota one bit, it makes me just shake my head because I thought I was buying the best for my familys saftey ! Also, WOT,,how fast would this be ? Do we drive with a WOT?
  • mikefm58mikefm58 Posts: 2,882
    The specifics on what brings out the flaw are not at issue. It comes down to statistics. The Ford Pinto had a significant number of serious injuries in rear end accidents as compared to other manufacturers in similar accidents. Same with the Chevy trucks with side impact accidents. Both vehicles were leaders in their respecitve category, when compared with other manufacturers. Now it's the same with Toyota in the "Unintended Acceleration" category.

    Alex, I'll take Side Impact Explosions for $200 please..... :)
  • revitrevit Posts: 476
    The two best examples I can think of are the Ford Pinto exploding gas tank and the Chevy truck exploding gas tank.

    More importantly, what year did both of those occur?

    This is 2010, the age of Toyota setting itself apart from all other automakers or are we comparing the Camry to the Pinto? :)
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,847
    The Pinto gas tank only caught fire (not exploded) if the car were hit in the rear, hard.

    According to witnesses of the San Diego ES350 crash, It burst into flames after rolling several times. Does that mean we should add poorly designed gas tank to the other recalls for the Lexus ES350? Toyota is the one in the hot seat now. The other auto makers have had problems and dealt with them. Now it is Toyota's turn to get their act together.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 18,042
    I didn't go back to read if I missed the point of your earlier post or not.

    >flaw are not at issue. It comes down to statistics

    The statistics are much more easily collected and collated now than when the Pinto was found to need a rubber diaper to prevent metal-to-metal contact if a rear collision were hard enough to move the differential housing into the tank.

    Also I don't recall Pinto being marketed as the greatest car with tremendous reliability and and perfect safety rating. I also don't recall that advertising and selling continuing even after early reports that fires did occur.

    I said many times in forums that the reputation leads by 3-4 years here over reality. Some reputations have gone up to better than people's perceptions and memories from friends and family give them; others have gone down and people still thought the reputation were much greater than is deserved.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,847
    Transportation Secy: Don't Drive Recalled Toyotas
    LaHood Called Automaker 'A Little Safety Deaf' During Probe Of Problem

    Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood is advising owners of recalled Toyotas to stop driving them and seek repair immediately.

    LaHood's warning came Wednesday in testimony before a House Appropriations subcommittee on transportation. LaHood says his advice to owners is to "stop driving it. Take it to a Toyota dealer because they believe they have a fix for it."

    If you drive a Toyota under recall and have an accident where someone is injured, you could be part of any lawsuit. The liability switches from Toyota to the owner that disregards the mandate.
  • revitrevit Posts: 476
    And what year was the Pinto issue?

    I know Toyota quality has dropped, but if the Camry is now being compared to a Pinto...oh my :sick:
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