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Toyota Halts Sales of Popular Models - Accelerator Stuck Problem Recall

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  • steverstever YooperlandPosts: 40,154
    Wireless glitch? That'll be the headline in 10 years. :D

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  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    Well, I just went to a super bowl party where four people owned Toyotas. None of them had investigated issues at all, nor were they worried. And one has Lexus ES350 being recalled. This person that has Lexus did say she had hard time with fact - floor mat would interfere with gas pedal. She had checked.

    I don't have a genie to predict the fallout from the negative publicity Toyota has gotten. Lots of bad publicity. Toyota - conflicting release of info. Then the last recall for the pedal problem on a Friday, and it took them 5 more days to stop sales of their affected vehicles - even though it was against the law to sell defective autos off dealer lot..Sort of a big whoops! And not the best crisis mangement displayed. Yikes!

    We shall see.
  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    Funny! Am all set again, but must admit my typing fingers stray anyway. .
  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    Good info - would hope Toyota does too. Maybe there are laws for this - & service centers would have to have/need in future.
  • steverstever YooperlandPosts: 40,154
    We're all fluent in chat typo around here. My problem is that I'm always words out. Spell checkers don't catch those.

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  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    No, my bet is that a LOT of past sins are about to come to light.
  • revitrevit Posts: 476
    Terry Gardner - Rental agencies pull Toyotas

    You may have to look hard if you hope to get a Toyota from your favorite car rental agency these days. Late last month, as news of the recall heated up, Avis, Budget, Enterprise, Alamo and National announced that they would pull all affected Toyota models and GMC Pontiac Vibes (which share the engineering DNA of the Toyota Matrix) from their rental inventory. Hertz, Dollar and Thrifty followed suit.

    The vehicles won't be rented until they have been repaired. Because vehicles generally are reserved by car class rather than model (with a few exceptions such as hybrids), the companies think they can fulfill reservations. "We continue to rent the Toyotas in our fleet [that are] unaffected by the recall, as these vehicles do not pose any safety concerns," said John Barrows of Avis/Budget. "However, if a customer is uncomfortable with that vehicle, we will work to provide them with an alternative within that car class, if one is available."
  • revitrevit Posts: 476
    By DAVE CARPENTER, AP Personal Finance Writer Dave Carpenter

    CHICAGO – Toyota owners looking to trade in their cars have little reason to sing the carmaker's old ad slogan, "I love what you do for me — Toyota!"

    Recalls and a bungled response to safety questions are putting a dent in the resale values of their cars. For years, Toyotas have been praised both for high quality and maintaining their worth. These days, the Toyota in your garage is no longer like money in the bank.

    Some dealers are refusing to accept Toyotas for trade, while others are paying considerably less than they did just two week ago. Kelley Blue Book has dropped the value of recalled Toyotas by as much 3 percent. The auto research Web site Edmunds.com estimates resale or trade-in values could fall up to 10 percent in the short term.

    The decline will likely continue as long as uncertainty and defects continue to shadow the world's No. 1 carmaker.

    Toyota Motor Corp. has so far recalled more than 7 million cars in the U.S., Europe and China over a sticky accelerator and floor mats that can get caught in the gas pedal. Its prized Prius hybrid — which is partially powered by electricity — is under investigation for momentary brake failure. The company is expected to announce its plan for fixing that model this week.

    Kelley, which two months ago named Toyota the best brand for resale value, says recalled models are now worth $200 to $500 less per car. Another cut of the same magnitude is planned as soon as the coming week unless the recall controversy abates and demand for Toyotas stops declining, Kelley spokeswoman Robyn Eckard says.

    Similarly, since the first recall for sticky accelerator pedals on Jan. 21, Edmunds' estimate for the trade-in value of a 2009 Toyota Camry has fallen by 4 percent to 6 percent to $13,967 while the 2009 Toyota Corolla has declined 6 percent to $11,233.
  • Well no not entirely true. On more then a few cars that have had the park/brake safety switch fail I have manually tripped the switch by popping up the cover around the shifter and hitting the switch. That switch is usually on the driver side front below the shifter or directly in front of the shifter. You fumble around there for a few minutes and you can release it by hand.

    Not a common situation but you don't have to press the brake to get that switch to release you just have to hit the switch.

    Also on two occasions I just muscled the lever out of park by force. I couldn't get that switch to release for the life of me and I got tired of screwing with it. You pull hard enough and that switch will release by just destroying itself and shearing off. It didn't even take me two hands to do it just my right hand pulling pretty hard and bracing with my legs.

    Now the aftermath of that was the shifter wouldn't get back into park anymore because I mangled the mechanism but I also wasn't stranded anymore either. Dropped the car off at work and they fixed the shifter.
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Posts: 10,837
    Have any of you noticed the new TV ads by Toyota, addressing the recall issue and apologizing to customers for letting them down? I thought they did a pretty good job of facing up to the fact that they've lost trust.

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  • graphicguygraphicguy SW OhioPosts: 7,141
    kirstie....maybe a regional thing? I don't remember seeing anything from Toyota over the last few days.

    At least they're finally admitting their errors, though. That's a first step. I still think it's going to take more than that to get people into their showrooms, though.
  • lzclzc Posts: 483
    >>>None of them had investigated issues at all, nor were they worried.

    That's been my experience. One neighbor bought a Camry 4 days before the pedal recall. Still, he took off on a 800 mile round trip drive and complained about the media trying to scare everyone.
  • Saw it a couple of times over the weekend. It was pretty cut and dry and honest to me as well.

    Now, as far as it actually working is another thing...

    Checked out a few dealers in Southern Masachusetts on Saturday while I was down there. (2) Toyota dealers had lookers on the lot and a few tagged cars out front that had been test driven and a few customers at the witness stands, I mean negotiating tables :P.

    There was a Ford and a Government Motors dealer on the same strip as one Toyo dealer and another GM dealer nearby our destination.

    Ghost Towns, cemetaries, burial grounds... I am amazed that even on a Saturday afternoon with the sun shining bright and the weather somewhat cozy that these dealers can generate no traffic and still be in business. I know their dealer base buries Toyotas dealer count in quantity but is it really that out of whack? :sick:
  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,147
    That's kind of unfair because the old Toyota models were the better ones. I think they peaked with the 1992-96 Camry then started a slow decline which has recently turned into a quick one.
  • lzclzc Posts: 483
    Yep, the '92-'96 Camrys were the best. The '92 Camry preceded the Avalon and the Cresida was near its end. I bought a '92, thinking this was the replacement for Cresida, that Toyota intended the Camry to be its premo model.

    The vinyl, upholstery fabric, interior fixtures and, especially, the seats, were all higher quality than later years. We kept it for 15 years.
  • graphicguygraphicguy SW OhioPosts: 7,141
    This "trickling out:" of information...."we might recall the Prius/Lexus"....or, we're thinking about reflashing ECUs"....."we're not sure what we're going to do with the braking software"....an on and on.

    Toyota's not doing themselves any favors. They need to act...even if it's to say...."we don't know what the problems are, but are working around the clock to find them, and offer a viable fix."

    As it stands, they're bleeding themselves.....only, they're doing it with thousands of paper cuts.
  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    F/U Wireless Mouse problems yesterday I posted. New mouse today. Ha, seems past incident where my dogs tipped glass of water into where mouse was did finally kill it last night or ????.

    Here is link today - news report discussing politicans on investigation committee's, etc. and their connections to Toyota corporation.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35293626/ns/business-autos/

    I had posted earlier on politics. lobbyists, etc influence and effects. And I do know this news agency does trend more to left. Hope others address as well.

    Just "food for thought" and do hope "unbiased & fair" balance found. And is just behind the scenes look at government working. When we critque government positions & actions and Toyota stances and actions - consumers should be aware, consider, & evaluate.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,896
    Toyota better do something about the 2010 Prius. NHTSA ODI has 969 complaints of brake failure in that new model. I have never seen a vehicle with as many complaints as the new Prius. That is phenomenal. The Prius never was much good on snow and Ice. This may be the worst model yet.

    http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/complaints/results.cfm
  • dturrdturr Posts: 70
    I myself think that was a PR company $1 million dollar disaster.

    All the calming music and pictures from a stationary factory line.

    I prefer honest facts. Someone in power sitting in front of a camera admitting to a cover up and giving accurate details of the so called fix. sorry fixes.
  • graphicguygraphicguy SW OhioPosts: 7,141
    gagrice....I was hearing just last week that "Toyotas made in Japan are immune because they're made better". That kind of threw me, because that says that they're intentionally making products in other parts of the world that were inferior.

    Now, the Japan made Prius is on the firing line (as is the Lexus counterpart). As each day goes by, this "crisis" (As Mr. Toyoda called it) just keeps getting worse and worse for Toyota. It should be going the other way. I thought by now they would have had some sort of plan to help during "crisis management". But, it's clear now, they don't.

    I think it would go a long way if they'd at least admit they srewed up royally. Not point the finger at a supplier (CTS), not deny a problem exists, etc. At least Americans are a forgiving lot. Come clean. State..."Look, we messed up big time. Not only are we sorry we got caught (referring to them destroying incriminating documents), but we're even sorrier we don't have an ironclad fix for the problems. But, we will. And when we do, we promise to be better than ever."

    Lots of fluff there. But, it sure beats what they're doing to themselves, their dealers and their customers now.
  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    Actual cost for development/engineering to work out all the issues is not enormous cost for a corporation. But could involve modification of other systems - not engineer. But each year many of these other systems are updated, changed anyway for new models. Since other auto manufacturers have already implemented these systems, and have good UA stats - does reveal excellent safety feature. Consumer Report auto demonstration comparing four autos for stopping continuous full throttle acceleration - two with brake override & two without brake override good. Just have not seen any reports for any demonstrations where vehicle traveling at higher speed, and then a UA incident strikes, increasing speed even higher. California freeway driving speed limits many times above 60mph. Would be a very dangerous demonstration - I personally think.

    So far I am leaning towards this vague description possible government/Toyota crisis management plan in approaching Toyota issues/problems & possible outcome. Toyota has 40% of all manufacturers complaints for UA, 19 deaths, and have long history of increase UA complaints since implementing DBW 2002-2003 with prior attempts to address/stated corrected in past. And I may change too as all unfolds and we see what happens in the future
    1)Floor mat recall - shows public action taken. - claims of no electronic problem -corporation liability issues addressed. - DHTSA can protect own turf - claim they are acting & may be./?
    (2)Toyota announcement November 25, 2009 brake override system to be installed all models 2011. Installation brake override systems on some present recalled models.
    (3)Pedal Recall. shows public action taken. - claims of no electronic problem -corporation liability issues decreased. - DHTSA can protect own turf claim they are acting & may be?
    (4)2011 - Etc. - Toyota can claim success recall action taken - statistics for UA improve and drop to where many other auto manufacturers are with low stats... Brake override "whitewashes" any intermittant computer/electronic difficult to prove bugs, since auto computer does not record these bugs.
    (5)DHTSA looks good - safe face - can say they are doing good job -
    (6)Owners/consumers happy.
    (7)Toyota will regain position. We shall see what effect issue has upon sales, and if it has difficulty - how long it takes to regain consumer confidence and future ability to make autos with good reliability.

    Bottom line. If safety improved great. Guess we shall see.
  • obyoneobyone Posts: 8,065
    What is the DHTSA?
  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    I know what you mean. But do like spell check to help my own personal typing faults. I leap before checking.

    As I just posted earlier today - it totally went dead last night. Had past incident recently where one of my dogs had spilled glass of water stealing a delicious goodie at back of desk. Seemed to recuperate ok, but then finally died last night??? New one now.
  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    What is DHTSA? Governemnt adminstration department/agency that oversees, investigates, takes action, takes consumer complaints on autos as well as other products, etc. Etc, etc.

    Here is link to DHTSA
    http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/
  • xluxlu Posts: 457
    Here are some more:

    Toyota, moving forward and can not be stopped...

    Toyota, we stand behind our products (not in front)...
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,896
    I think some article misquoted NHTSA (National Highway Transportation Safety Administration) with DHTSA. I have seen it repeated several times. It could be an agency in our federal government. Lord knows we have about two times more than we need.
  • sharonklsharonkl Posts: 660
    Yes, they do appear to be now. I wish they would have pounced with this statement immediately/sooner though. Modern day technology and news media publicity can/does create huge factors to consider in present day crisis management. Public access is good to assure/actually see/make sure integrity of government and corporate .approaches/actions present. Unfortunately many of the behind the scenes involvement/documents/stances/interractions etc. are not public.

    Safety is always a must. And this particular complaint, UA, in and of itself, is cause of higher human safety risk exposure + all the other cost risk exposures/effects that owner/driver is subjected to as a result of a UA incident..

    UA complaint causes result effects(injury,death, etc), and is not result effect(accidents.injury, etc) causing the complaint (auto defect apparent and dangerous). What does complaint cause? What is complaint caused by? That is what it is, just plain and simple. Can it be resolved to prevent/decrease? How I seem to view issues. I am medical professional so will always keep pushing/being advocate on this issue.

    UA complaints have continued over many years despite approaches/actions taken in past claiming resolution of problem, and would like to now see that is undeniably addressed/actions taken to decrease UA incidents in all auto manufacturers models. Some other auto manufacturers presently have higher complaints too. My research indicates UA could be decreased, and other manufacturers have addressed already and safety feature implemented.

    Hope all ends well for Toyota, US government, and consumers/owners/future owners Toyota is at the plate now. I'm hoping they can hit the ball, move to all the bases, & achieve the winning final score this time. No more of the past moving to the bases, but not scoring..
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Posts: 10,837
    our discussions are topic-oriented, and we do expect members to stay pretty close to the topic indicated in the discussion title. Funny manufacturer acronym meanings isn't related to the recall.

    Several off-topic messages have been removed.

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  • obyoneobyone Posts: 8,065
    Since Toyota has implemented the pedal fix are they now allowed to sell those vehicles on the dealer lots that have been repaired? Start manufacturing again?
  • tomjavatomjava Posts: 136
    Car and Driver article about UA and Brake:link title

    Also about media circus surrounding this matter: link title
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