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Acura RL

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  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    The navigation system in the RL goes beyond providing basic directions to an address, however. I’ve a feeling that it once again sets a benchmark in providing conveniences (including Real Time Traffic Information and “Acura Link”), and with as many voice commands as it has, things couldn’t be easier. While spending some time at the interactive showroom at acura’s website, I noticed that during use, the screen even displays how to use the jog dial to accomplish a certain task. Small thing, but often overlooked.
  • ksomanksoman Posts: 590
    Thought I don't own any acura, i'd place the Acura Nav's as one of the best, if not the best one's out there. Their decision to put that on the TL in 99 was a big step in the near luxury or luxury class. TL's cheap NAV in my opinion changed the industry & consumer perception.

    ksso
  • igibanigiban Posts: 530
    From the showroom demo it appears that the new Nav does not do touch screen but you have to use the big dial. Is that right? Dial is fine but I usre hate to lose touch screen function.
  • >>From the showroom demo it appears that the new Nav does not do touch screen but you have to use the big dial. Is that right? Dial is fine but I usre hate to lose touch screen function.

    With the voice activation feature of the new Nav system, I doubt you'll miss the touch screen function very much.
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Posts: 10,897
    at the grocery store. . .most folks don't haggle over the price of something. It is almost something that many would just not dream of, not ever try.

    The same is true at department stores and hardware stores. Certainly it is true as gas stations.


    Sure, but they're missing out if they fail to do so on major purchases!! I am negotiation-averse, but when I purchase a big appliance or several at a time from a hardware or department store, I always bargain. Not vehemently, but I make an offer just like I would at the car dealership... "if you take $100 off the washer/dryer pair, I'll buy them right here and now." I've never had a single salesperson seem put off, and I've always gotten a discount of some sort that way.

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  • My point exactly! But to underscore the point and to ask a rhetorical question, do we plain just think that cars are "overpriced?"

    Cars (and houses) seem to be almost the universal "thing" that we disdain paying MSRP for.

    Even though I know it works, I usually don't haggle when I buy a pair of pants -- but just for fun I do haggle once in a while. Rarely do I feel that such behavior is appropriate.

    Maybe it is the price of the item, maybe it is that we think the "system" of car acquisition is rigged against us.

    Frankly, the savings on clothing (as a percentage) are far far more than the savings (and exceptions do happen, I'll gran) you can typically get on a car. Over a lifetime of buying, then, we should "never pay" retail for most items (gasoline and prescription drugs being two notable exceptions).

    I bought a suit a month ago, I was able to pay less than the tag and I got a "free" tie (which had an MSRP of $45). So I walked out of the store with almost $500 worth (?) of stuff for $400 including tax!

    I was just feeling a bit fiesty -- but the sales person was very willing to "take my money" even though I was unwilling to pay the amount on the tag.

    Cars and those of us who buy them just seem to be full of distrust -- in that we seem to think MSRP is "unfair."

    I wondered, out loud, how it got that way "I won't pay retail!" says one poster -- I wondered if he/she paid retail for other things.

    It was, as you would say, off topic. But I always believe that if I am happy with my purhcase at the price I paid, I don't really need or appreciate someone saying "you bozo, you paid retail -- I'd never pay retail!" or words to that effect.

    Somewhere, sometime, someone will write an article on our "comfort" in paying the asking price or negotiating. My experience is that most people just don't like to negotiate.

    "I can get it for you wholesale!"
  • Mark:

    Imagine going to Grand Union and getting the MSRP of a package of Purdue chicken, then getting the invoice price from Consumers Reports and striking a deal with the store manager! LOL!

    I agree with Kirstie. It's implicit that big ticket item prices may be negotiated without offending, but, I must add, as well, that on big-ticket dental work such as bridges, I do ask for mercy and usually get a 15% discount! I fully expect, and don't object, to paying MSRP for the new RL. I waited too long to resume another wait.
  • formulaformula Posts: 17
    The key issue on MSRP and how much of it you will need to pay is time. If you want the car now, you will pay MSRP, or close to it. If you wait until the end of the model year, you can get discounts, but you are buying a car with effectively 1 year of depreciation built in.

    The following is a link to a video that explains why it is often better to pay the high price at the beginning of the year rather than wait. The guy that is speaking is 001 from Autospies.

    http://cctvimedia.clearchannel.com/xetv/video/8-6-autospies.wmv
  • prophet2prophet2 Posts: 372
    People should remember that there have been some vehicles which even Edmunds deemed to have a TMV higher than MSRP. The most notable in recent years is the Honda Odyssey, which dealers often added ADM of several thousands. This held for over 3-4 years. I had no trouble paying MSRP for mine in 2001.

    My Odyssey EX was priced at $26.8K MSRP and had more features than the Toyota Siena XLE of that time at $28K+.

    I wouldn't presume to put the 2005 RL in that category just yet, but I remember my sister looking at a 2004 BMW 525i last December. The $39K base price ballooned to $48K with the addition of a few option packages like automatic transmission ($1250), upgraded tire/rims, and leather and other luxury appointments. With the inane I-drive as a "deal-breaker" and the 184 hp output, no wonder the '04 Acura TL won the day at $34K.

    The Lexus LS430 at $54K? That's just a fantasy. Maybe a well-traveled "demo," but not "new." No price wars in my area as there's only one dealer (as is Acura) - the nearest "competitor" is 2500 miles away.
  • Great video!

    I have almost always purchased in the first 6 months of the "new year." This video gave me reason to continue.

    It almost seems counter intuitive though!
  • "The Lexus LS430 at $54K? That's just a fantasy"
    I had a quote from a Lexus dealer for a new Lexus with a Premium pkg and Smart Access for $54,528, and that was before any negotiation. I suspect I could have gotten the $528 shaved off if I said I was ready to write the check right then.
  • prophet2prophet2 Posts: 372
    Well, goody for you. You should have written that check instead of waiting to get another $528 (1.0%) off.

    Maybe it's aged stock. Or, an unpopular color. It may have been sold out from under you since then.

    Like I said, in my neck of the woods, only one dealer. And, they don't DEAL on "new" units. Only on demos and service loaners.
  • cericceric Posts: 1,093
    Well, actually I just priced it in northern CA for the 2004 LS430 (prem + smart access) = $55253 (fair market price). Invoice at around $50,000. MSRP at $58K+. An offer at $54K is entirely possible. But, I am talking about 2004 model here. Were you?

    Back to RL:
    Legend is released today in Japan. A lot of news on
    http://response.jp.
    You may use worldlingo.com to browse the whole site in "machine translated" English.

    The key news I found.
    Honda is projecting
    6000 units in Japan (1000 units already claimed for).
    20,000 units in USA. RL is to be released on the 14th in USA.
  • Here's the justification for knocking down the MSRP(emphasis on suggested): Assuming dealer cost of 10% less than MSRP on a $50k car, and the dealer only has the car in inventory(and thus a bank carrying loan) for 3 days--the dealer is making a whopping 1,366% ANNUALIZED return on his investment(ignoring his overhead costs). Change the scenario to 30 days in inventory, and the ANNUALIZED return drops, but is STILL 137%! Now: change the mark-up profit on dealer cost to, say, $1,500. The ANNUALIZED returns on the respective examples above are STILL 410% and 41%, respectively. The large volume discounting dealers understand the dynamics of this math, and that's why they keep getting BIGGER! It's simple inventory logistics of "turns". I don't know about you, but I don't make anywhere NEAR that type of return on any of my investments--and I don't intend to help anyone else achieve it, either!
  • "I'm talking about a 2004"
    Yes, this was in May for a 2004 that they would get in the color combo I wanted via dealer trade (so, not demo, unpopular color, etc.). I didn't do the deal because I just wasn't sure I wanted a LS430 with RWD in Michigan. We've had RWD and AWD vehicles and the next car we get will have AWD.

    The Grand Rapids Acura dealer has presold the first 7 RL's they will get and has started a "waiting list".
  • prophet2prophet2 Posts: 372
    Well, we don't have the kind of weather that will make the RWD vs. AWD discussion that critical. But, it would sure feel great to be driving the AWD-equipped RL - nothing like being up-to-date as far as technology goes. I'd definitely pick the '05 RL over the '04 LS430.

    That Grand Rapids dealer will deservedly make a lot of "coin" on those pre-sold RLs. The way I see it, the RL is a hell of a lot of car for $50K. There's a lot of "balance" in the make-up of the car. Honda has been known for that all these years. They don't always have the huskiest-sounding engine, the most HP, the quietest interior, the best MPG, handling and riding dynamics, etc., but seem to be near the top in all categories. Throw in the inoffensive though non-inspired (to some) styling and you've got a winning combination
  • shotgunshotgun Posts: 184
    Yes, I'm still suffering from a color conundrum! I talked to a dealer in Georgia who said that the Opulent Blue Pearl was a "gorgeous" color - almost black in appearance. Have any of you guys seen it? Your thoughts?
  • choe13choe13 Posts: 348
    I'll be honest, i'm not a honda/acura fan. I do envy the quality, craftmenship that go into these cars, but i despise their lack value for the price or extra price for name tag philosophy.

    But this is a serious car the RL. My friends dad ordered it and i got to ride in it on a test drive at the dealers, and i was truly amazed. With the TL theres this little stuggle off the line, and you just know this. But this car with its revolutionary AWD, this aint a problem no more. I think basically this AWD put this car and future Acura cars on the map.

    This car is twice the interior, refinement, gadetary, design the TL is, and the TL already is very good at those department, with some speaking that its overall a notch better compared to the likes of BMW 3 series or Audi A4. So with this i believe this car the RL will have orders more than they are capable of making them.

    This car is relatively cheaper than the 330i and 5 series, but the best part is, its somewhere in between it.

    I thought all along acura would finally build all their sedans RWD(like s2000), but they went beyond with this AWD add on.
  • legendmanlegendman Posts: 362
    >I don't know about you, but I don't make anywhere NEAR that type of return on any of my investments--and I don't intend to help anyone else achieve it, either!<

    A very adroit analysis, the conclusion of which echoes my sentiments exactly.

    Having said that, it may be that the new RL will command full MSRP for many months to come.

    I will be eager to hear car buyer's reactions when the car goes on sale NEXT WEEK!
  • legendmanlegendman Posts: 362
    >Cars (and houses) seem to be almost the universal "thing" that we disdain paying MSRP for.<

    That's true Mark. In fact, one gets bragging rights in some circles if you got a healthy discount on your car. On the other hand, here in the California housing market some are paying over asking price in order to seal the deal.

    >Even though I know it works, I usually don't haggle when I buy a pair of pants -- but just for fun I do haggle once in a while. <

    That's the point. It is fun. Anyone who's been to a garage sale or a flea market knows that's half the fun of going ... gettting that bargain.

    There are merchants around the world who fully expect to haggle ... and don't hold it against you. As long as there's something in it for them, most will bargain with you with a wry smile on their face.

    I have found that car dealers usually will bargain when it serves them to do so -- clearly supply, demand, sales goals and timing have a lot to do with it.

    As I said in the previous post, MSRP may be the price of the new RL for a while, or a long while. But I will still test the waters. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.
  • cericceric Posts: 1,093
    Just browsed through JDM Legend info and found many options that are available on Legends that are not on RLs.
    - backview camera (dealer-installed in Japan)
    - lane keeping
    - night vision
    - pre-crash(pre-safe)
    - laser cruise control

    I dislike the fact that Japanese always keep the best in JDM and let US have the 2nd rated cars.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    Backview camera is available in MDX for two(?) years, so it shouldn't have been a big deal in the RL. Perhaps it will be added as an MMC as could couple of other things (Intelligent Cruise Control and CMS).

    As for night vision and LKAS, they could potentially push the price quite a bit.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Posts: 9,359
    ...... That must be some math course your taking, except they forgot a few Itsy Bitsy items .. the cost of "doing and staying" in business.

                 Small stuff like workmans comp, the lights, the heat and air, property taxes, parts inventory, payroll taxes, office staff, gas, water, security, service building, employee benefits, salaries, commissions, liability insurance, floorplan, advertising, property maintenance, inventory control, service costs and lets not forget the price of the property and the mortgage payment, etc etc.com .. most dealers are trying to survive on a 3/7% net net profit ~ 41/410% ..? .. maybe on Saturn, tell me when the next flight leaves ..l.o.l....

                   Most import stores are not high volume stores .. so they survive on what they have, being a Ford/Chevy dealer and selling 400/450 units is a big difference than the average Acura store that sells 90/110 vehicles a month - new and used ............. ;)

                               Terry.
  • rroyce10rroyce10 Posts: 9,359
    ....... The back-up beep beep should have been made standard on the RL's, they been standard for years on the big SUV's and a superb feature .....

                                     Terry.
  • What about the ventilated seats? Has anyone heard if they are going to be offered in the US?
  • cericceric Posts: 1,093
    I agree. I guess Acura reserve some "extra" to introduce into RL as standard in a couple years. Mid-model refreshing. However, it always makes it tough to decide whether to wait a couple years or jump into it now.

    Have you guys seen the Mugen RL? The body kits and wheels are pretty nice.
  • jrock65jrock65 Posts: 1,371
    To me, the biggest oversight on the RL is the lack of height-adjustability on the passenger seat. A $50k luxury sedan should have at least an 8 way power passenger seat. Heck, just put in manual controls at least. The ability to control the height of the seat could make a huge difference in comfort for the passenger, especially on long trips. As far as I know, every car in this class has or will have this feature. Even the $35k ES330 has it.

    Also, does anyone know whether the passenger seatback heats up? It does not heat up in any new Honda/Acura out there. They cite some interference with the side airbag, but apparently every other company has found a way to work aroudnd this problem. Instead of "heated front seats", they should call it "1.5 heated front seats."

    Just personal annoyances with an otherwise fine car.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    Other manufacturers "get around" the issue by not using the extra airbags. Hondas and Acuras at this price point have both seat-mounted bags and curtain style airbags. Most other manufacturers use only the curtain bags.

    I agree that it's annoying, but my personal preference is to place safety above bun-warmers.
  • legendmanlegendman Posts: 362
    >Also, does anyone know whether the passenger seatback heats up?<

    If you you mean the front seat, yes. That's noted in the new '05 RL brochure.
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