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Acura RL



  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    Based on MSRP, the GS does “start” at $40K, but good only for them who are okay with having a Lexus with cloth seats, halogen lamps, no navigation system and a decent audio system. Getting heated leather seats, premium audio system, navigation system and HID pushes the MSRP to $46K for the GS300.

    Now, the GS430 starts at $49K, and has many of the items optional on GS300 as standard, except Navigation system and audio system ($3300). Upgrade from 16 inch to 17-inch rims is an option as well.

    Acura will come standard with these features, plus AWD. Even if Acura RL goes for $49K, it would sit squarely between the two Lexus GS trims (unless Lexus can somehow trim the price tag).

    On other grounds, if RL promises what it is said to, and if GS stays the kind of car it has been, I would go for the more athletic... RL.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    The subarus are better, but they arent even on teh same planet as the GS and RL. The Legacy is more comparable to the TL, and it loses to that car to. Subaru doesnt even offer a Nav system yet, and its only what, 2005 MY now?
  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,652
    Which is why it's $10 – $20K cheaper than a GS or RL. The original poster was asking if the new RL is worth the extra $10K over the GS. I'm simply asking is the GS worth the extra money over GT or Outback. Since I'm a firm believer in AWD over any other drivetrain, the answer for is for me a loud YES. If you don't value the AWD (as I do), then the answer may be no.

    No the Legacy doesn't compare to the TL, but it does compare to the TSX.

    As to navigation, it will be available for MY06.

    Bob <offering some very good AWD alternatives other than those found in European brands>
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    How do you feel about the '05 G35x with Nissan's 277hp 3.5L V6? The Subie engine is nice, but their also known for turbo lag, which isnt something you would necessarily want to pair with an automatic transmission.
  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,652
    I'm sure it's a great engine. There's no turbo lag in the 250hp 3.0H6, as there is no turbo.

    Speaking of turbo lag, on the 2.5 engine it's minimal. Yes there is some, but very little. Trust me, I've driven a number of them, 5EAT and manuals, it's not a problem.

  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    Perhaps my thinking is out of date (with all the recent advances in turbo-charging), but I've always thought that turbo power mixed with manual transmissions was the thing to avoid. IIRC, the automatic allows the turbo to spool while changing gears, but the manual does not (or something like that).

    As for the G35x, I love the drivetrain (and chassis). Not too sure about the rest of the car.

    GS330 without AWD? At $39K, that would be a bargain. But I agree that the car is essentially all show, no go at that price point. I'd probably get a TL or G35 and keep the change.
  • tls02tls02 Posts: 20
    My local dealer, in the NYC Area, has told me that he is going to Acura's "Ride & Drive" for the RL on Sept 9th. They do not expect to have the cars until the end of Sept but most likely in October.
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    If that was true, then cars like the WRX and Lancer EVO would all come with automatics. You cant hard launch with an automatic. With the real power only available at 3,000rpm+, you've got to keep the revs up, and you need a manual to do that.

    I still dont like that RL trunk hump
  • cericceric Posts: 1,093
    player4, great pictures. Thanks a lot.
    The dark color one looks very nice to me.
    They seem to have failed in getting rid of the roof-top antenna as the program manager has mentioned in interview.
    The 20" wheels are still on them.
    I noticed the CA license plates.
    Do you know where those pictures were snapped?
  • talon95talon95 Posts: 1,110
    "I still dont like that RL trunk hump"

    I don't know... I guess it pays tribute to the BMW 7-series design, but shows that it can be well integrated into the lines of the car, rather than looking like they took a piece of plywood, painted it the same color as the car, and plopped it on top of the "real" trunk lid. ;)
  • talon95talon95 Posts: 1,110
    "Perhaps my thinking is out of date (with all the recent advances in turbo-charging), but I've always thought that turbo power mixed with manual transmissions was the thing to avoid. IIRC, the automatic allows the turbo to spool while changing gears, but the manual does not (or something like that)."

    Well, back in my "true" talon95 days, when I drove an Eagle Talon TSi AWD, I had the manual. And I remember that the enthusiast magazines criticized the automatic versions of those turbocharged cars, because the shifting and the turbo kicking in never seemed to coordinate well. That phenomenon can be kept under control to a pretty good degree with the greater control of the manual.

    Back then, well before the era of 255 hp. family/pseudo sports sedans, that car's 210 hp. was pretty much up there. And I remember that while the turbo coming on in an engine that powerful was quite the rush, the "indirectness" of the power flow sometimes make it feel like I didn't have much control over the acceleration. That's why I'm such a fan of the Accord V6... similar power with much smoother power delivery.

    But then, with the Accords, I also made the transition from many years of driving only stick to an automatic. I was spending way too much time in stop and go traffic while commuting, and it got to the point where the degree to which the stick was a pain started to outweigh the degree to which it was fun.
  • jeff88jeff88 Posts: 94
    Stop and go traffic also soured me on manual trannys, that's why I like todays' semi-autos. Almost as nice as a manual and fully auto for stop & go. However currently, my commute is mostly backroads and I would love to have a 5sp again. The 1st auto I ever owned (for me) was the rl.

    Back when I bought an '87 saab 900s I was initially looking at the 900 turbo and after a couple of test drives, decided on the slower 16v 4 without the booster. It was not at all a fast car; one had to keep the revs high to move along. The handling and daily driving characteristics were much less of an adventure though. Today's turbos, particularly mated to diesels, don't have that sudden blast of power, that sometimes occurred when you weren't quite ready for it in the older turbos. Recall that the turbo on the 900 kicked in around 2500 to 3000 rpm. 0-20 pretty much stunk, 20 to 60 was a rocket ride!

    For me, it's never been about the raw performance #'s, it's been more about how the car runs and performs over the daily experience. Having a bit extra on tap for those time we want to let loose, then absolutlely yes. For some reason, I've always been more attracted to lambish looks with a bit of the wolf underneath.

    As for the hump on the rl, if it means more trunk space then great! I'm definitely a fan of the new looks and specs, will be interested to read about the 1st test drives.
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    "If that was true, then cars like the WRX and Lancer EVO would all come with automatics."

    Obviously, there are other reasons for offering manuals. I didn't mean to suggest that the choice is black or white.

    I was speaking to the issue of spooling the turbo, which may happen faster in an automatic (assuming what I recall is still true of today's turbos). While things like hard launches, the driving experience, and drivetrain efficiency may be enough to compensate for the slower spooling, my understanding suggests that turbo lag is less significant with an automatic.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    I wouldn&#146;t call the rear end styling in these BMWs &#147;humpy&#148; either:

    BMW 645Ci
    BMW 745i

    The only issue I have with those rear ends is the way trunk lid sits on the top. The gap distracts from the &#147;flow&#148;. (Similar issue with new 5-series).

    Here is a side view of the 2005 RL&#146;s rear end
  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Posts: 5,049
    Turbo lag certainly is real -- however, several of the Europeans and Japanese have virtually eliminated the lag.

    In my experience, the "drive-line lash" of automatic transmissions (or the lash that CAN be part of an auto's characteristics) does not mitigate turbo lag, it exacerbates it.

    The turbos that have the torque start low and stay for a long time are often virtually undetectable as being turbos and thus can be used with little fanfare with both autos and manuals.

    Some cars have massive turbo lag and sloppy slush box auto transmissions -- mate these two traits and driving can be quite, shall we say, unnerving or as we used to say in college "a rush!" (but not in a positive way).
  • lexusguylexusguy Posts: 6,419
    Right, usually by pairing larger engines, with smaller, twin turbos, or superchargers. The trouble with mating small fours with essentially no torque down low with a big turbo that needs to spool up (WRX) is that with an automatic, starting at idle, the car really wouldnt go anywhere until it hits 3,000 rpm or so.
  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,652
    Which is one reason the WRX is rarely sold with an automatic. That car just screams for a manual tranny.

  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    May be &#147;hybrid&#148; is in the future of turbocharged engines. :-)

    Spool it up using a tiny electric motor, until the exhaust catches up.
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