Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





Pontiac Bonneville

1122123125127128142

Comments

  • tpkentpken Posts: 1,108
    I just read the R&T review of the TL and see what you mean Ice about the new gadgetry - looks like fun. I think the front styling is great but don't care for the back much. Too bland.

    The GXP looks to me like a winner from any angle! I wonder if the rear seat has more headroom than last year's models equipped with leather seating. When they brought the seats out of the Aurora they didn't compensate for the lower roofline in the rear compartment of the Bonneville. I can't fit my teenage son back there in an 03.

    I agree on the NAV - could be fun but also distracting for driver and definitely unnecessary for a MAN who can read a map!
  • evandroevandro Posts: 1,108
    Of course the TL's front-end is nice, it's been lifted from the Bonneville!!!

    But in this category the consumers expect some "must-have", like the Xenon lights. The NAV is a big flop in the US, nobody orders them: no wonder, for $2000 one buys 100 US maps or 10 portable GPS receivers. ;-)
  • theicemantheiceman Posts: 736
    Up here, a GXP will cost $CAN 47k all in (excl. sales taxes). A comparably equipped TL (dynamic package - e.g. incl. Brembo brakes) will sticker at $46.7k. (Note: this TL package doesn't have NAV but it does have Xenons) Price is pretty much a wash.
  • 14871487 Posts: 2,407
    If you include rebates I'm sure the Bonneville will cost about the same as the TL. I don't really care about NAV and its no surprise that the Bonneville doesnt have it. GM would have to totally redesign the center stack to accomodate NAV on this car. It has onstar which will help you if you get lost. NAV is basically a gimmick that will entertain you for a few months and then fade from memory. The TL is a good looking car but the GXP looks better and will be far more rare. I have seen at least 50-75 '04 TLs since it came out. They are getting more common every day. They definitely need to do a comparison between the MAxima, TL and GXP. I would take the GXP over the Maxima as well. I do not like the front or rear of that car and it has torque steer.
  • theicemantheiceman Posts: 736
    No question that I'd be able to get a GXP at invoice AND rebates AND GM Visa dollars. That'd easily knock another $7k off the price of the GXP. For me, the comparison's a no-brainer but I'll look at the TL all the same. I'm also thinking of the CTS-V but, at this point, it's probably more daydreaming than anything else.

    ice
  • theicemantheiceman Posts: 736
    A question: my 2004 Bonneville brochure cites the GXP's "largest exhaust pipes in its category" (whatever that means). Does anybody have any information on the diameter?

    Also, here are some decent GXP links:

    A a great link to some gorgeous, large, and decent-quality pix of the GXP: Maximum-cars.com (the same site's link to the Acura TL here: Acura TL

    a short Bonneville pdf brochure (love those flangeless GXP wheels!): Bonneville brochure



    ice
  • fantascpfantascp Posts: 175
    Hi everyone,
    just left my Pontiac Dealership( Northwestern New Jersey) with my wifes 2003 Grand-Prix GT- (Routine Service ETC)- stopped
    by the showroom for a 2004 Bonneville Brochure- asked when could I do a test drive with the GXP- the GXP was not available yet, was told not to expect the car in until the end of April!
    I'm on the "PLEASE CALL ME WHEN THE CAR ARRIVES LIST!!!!"
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,577
    One statistic / spec. that I had not seen before and caught my eye was the EPA city / highway estimate of 17 / 24.

    I guess the deeper (numerically higher) final drive is likely to blame, especially for the highway number. (The ’04 Caddy SLS is 18 / 26.)

    5- (or even 6-) speed trans would likely help here. I am still a bit surprised with the wide spread of ratios in that GM 4-speed automatic.

    I wonder how easy it will be to launch without smoking the front tires. (Traction control off.)

    - Ray
    Still expecting to drive one when they are available . . .
  • bunky36bunky36 Posts: 94
    My dealer (Kansas) has had a black one on order for a local doctor for some time, he has the build info and VIN, and says the expected delivery date is next week. We'll see. Dealer will call me so I can go look (but can't drive it since it's a customer order). Interestingly the doctor ordered it without a sunroof. I can't imagine that, but to each his own.
  • bigdaddycoatsbigdaddycoats Posts: 1,058
    A dealer in Redford, MI has received a GXP. I'm hoping the dealer right down the street will get one soon. I really want to test drive one. My family drove a 2001 Bonneville SLE on a vacation a couple years ago and it was pretty nice. The upgrades to the GXP should make for a much improved vehicle.
  • bigdaddycoatsbigdaddycoats Posts: 1,058
    The dealer close to me received a black GXP stickered at $38.7k. I think that is pretty much loaded. Unfortunately it was already sold so no test drive for me. The car was all cleaned an shiny and looked sooo sweet. Hopefully they get another one in soon.
  • bunky36bunky36 Posts: 94
    Ice: The GXP dual/dual round chrome tips are 2.5 inches in diameter. I haven't seen them in person yet--that's just what it says in the Bonneville brochure I have.
  • theicemantheiceman Posts: 736
    Bunky, does the brochure refer to the 2.5" as the diameter of the tips - or of the pipes? Big difference...
  • bunky36bunky36 Posts: 94
    Agree--big difference. The 2.5 inches are the tips. I haven't seen anything in any of the literature that gives the size of the pipes. Guess we won't know that until somebody sees a GXP and does some measuring.
  • theicemantheiceman Posts: 736
    No more recommended check for the Bonneville. Perhaps this isn't news - the last time I bought their annual car issue was '02 and they recommended the Bonnie back then. Further, the '00-'03 Bonnevilles are now listed as "used cars to avoid"! Yikes!

    I note, btw, that CR hasn't actually tested a Bonnie for four years (Feb. 2000) - it was an SE - and they still use that summary in their '04 car issue.

    Don't get me wrong - I'm not making excuses for the Bonnie - it has a number of "issues" but you have to read this year's CR. For the MY 2000, it reports the following being negative: electrical (could this be LEDs dying?), suspension (could be the vibration that many sense at 70 mph), body/integrity (rattles?), pwr equipment (windows dying?), body hardware (?).

    My own sample of one contradicts these findings and is hardly statistically significant. Still, I wonder if the Bonneville owners who do respond to the CR survey are over-represented by those who have an axe to grind. I just find it interesting that a car that sells as poorly as the Bonneville (what, 25k a year?), still has enough '03 MY owners to meet CR's 100 response minimum to list a reliability history for that model year.

    And yet CR had insufficient responses from owners of even bigger sellers: Chrysler Concorde, Chrysler Sebring, Lincoln LS, Pontiac Sunfire, Mitsubishi Galant, Dodge Stratus, Dodge Intrepid, Olds Alero, Dodge Neon, Chevrolet Cavalier (all outsold the Bonnie last year - most three to four times as much and ten times as much in the case of the Cavalier!) for CR to post a rating.

    Perhaps just as interesting, CR was able to get sufficient responses from owners of low volume MY 2003 sellers like the Toyota Prius, Audi A6, Saab 9-5 and 9-3, Infiniti I-35, BMW 7 series, Jaguar S-Type, Lexus LS 430, and the Buick Regal (almost on par with the Bonneville in terms of sales last year) to post reliability histories for the 2003 MY for those cars.

    Understand, as well, how CR's ratings work: it only takes 9.3% of this small sample reporting a problem to get a black half-circle; 14.8% or more nets the car a full black circle. CR doesn't publish its sample size for individual cars.

    I don't want to dismiss the findings but I do find it all a little curious. However, since I have long viewed CR's survey as less-than-scientific, I find that I cannot rely on their conclusions. That's unfortunate given the effort they put into this entire affair.

    ice
  • theicemantheiceman Posts: 736
    And thanks for the clarification bunky.
  • fantascpfantascp Posts: 175
    Need some info- anyone have their vehicle repainted by a major chain org like MAACO instead of local auto-body shops etc and if so was the cost and work satisfactory and are you happy with the results? I'm thinking of having my car re-done, but in Bright White, the car is presently colored Dark Cherry.
  • theicemantheiceman Posts: 736
    I wouldn't recommend that drastic a colour change by any of the major chains.

    My one experience with Maaco is about 20 years old so likely doesn't count any more. But I've seen a few of their recent paint jobs and they don't get in the door and trunk sills, under the hood, etc. IMHO, this is absolutely essential for any colour change - and especially so for an abrupt one. Perhaps Maaco will do it at an extra charge and the jobs I've seen are because the owners weren't willing to shell out the bucks.

    OTOH, if you're going to stick with dark cherry, I'm sure anybody will do. My instincts, though, would still lead me to a local, quality shop with a good reputation. After all, it's really hard to recover a car from a botched job or poor quality paint. Expect to pay about $3-4k for the job - a little less if you stick with dark cherry.

    I suspect this isn't what you wanted to hear.
  • fantascpfantascp Posts: 175
    I did get a price of around $3000 to do it in White from my local shop- based on just what you said- its very labor intensive to go from one colour to a different one especially going to White. I know having MAACO or a chain do it is the CHEAP WAY out and you get what you pay for, but I'm still not sure if I want to spend the extra bucks on a 98SSE with 86,000 miles or invest in a newer car. The car needs some cosmetic work on it- a couple of dings/door dents etc- the hood has the typical chips in it up front from pebbles
    hitting it etc- but overall its a good strong running car with all the bells and whistles except the Supercharged engine and Perform ride/Touring Ride buttons.
    Thanks for the info.
  • mlm4mlm4 Posts: 401
    Wasn't the dark cherry paint special for the Bonneville's 40th anniversary?
  • fantascpfantascp Posts: 175
    Originally I thought so also but I found out from
    members on Bonneville Club.com that the 1997 40th Anniversary was not exclusive to Dark Cherry-It came in a variety of colors- Black, Silver etc-not just Dark Cherry.
    As a matter of fact, Prestige Motors in Upstate New York was selling a Silver 40th Anniversary SSE Edition a while ago.
  • theicemantheiceman Posts: 736
    Three large is indeed a lot to pay for a six y.o. car that's worth maybe a tad more double that. Up here, Maaco is what you do when you want to spruce it up to sell it - not if you want to keep it and certainly not if you're thinking of going to white. I just wouldn't recommend it - although it is a crap shoot (I have seen 1/2 decent Maaco jobs - not many, mind you).

    Another couple of options:

    1. Take what you would've spent on a decent paint job, add it to what you could get on your '98 and look for a decent '99 or '00 which is already white and in decent shape.

    2. Get the Maaco job but keep it the same colour (it is a nice colour!) - but don't let them skimp on the surface prep work and masking (those are their big weaknesses - them and that Scheib guy). If Maaco paint jobs turn out well initially, they usually don't look all that great beyond a year or two. So, plan to sell/trade it before then.

    My $0.02
  • fantascpfantascp Posts: 175
    Thanks again for the info- got time to decide which way i want to go with this.

    *check out the 1958 BLACK BONNEVILLE, with 9,697 miles on her, for sale on Ebay right now- its up to $32,200.00 and the RESERVE IS STILL NOT MET!!!) Beautiful pictures!!!
    IF ANYONE IS INTERESTED-YOU GOT 2DAYS, 2 HOURS TO BID!!!!!
  • theicemantheiceman Posts: 736
    That's one sweet '58 to be sure. I'd prefer mine in another colour but this one looks straight enough. I'm guessing that mileage is since a resto job but the description is silent on that issue. Interesting that the bids would go that high without a clarification that this is numbers matching and the tri-power was original with the car.

    Check out this one: '65 Bonneville CV. I'm mighty tempted as the '65 Bonnie is one of my faves. But "90% restored" 9 years and 20k miles ago means $$$ and Calif. is a long way for me to go kick tires...
  • fantascpfantascp Posts: 175
    Agree with you on this one- I also like the style of the 65/66 over earlier years.
    My all time favorite classic is the 59 CADDY!!!
    LOVE THOSE FINS!!!!!!!
    Owned a black 59 around 1974/1975- wish I still had the car now.
  • tjcwcostjcwcos Posts: 1
    Can someone tell me why I should buy a Pontiac Bonneville GXP for $36,000 when it doesn't have navigation as an option or Xenon head lights? Now I see there is a $3,000 cash back incentive and the car isn't even available yet in most of the country. I love the look of it, don't get me wrong, but there are numerous cars available that are better for less money.
  • theicemantheiceman Posts: 736
    I think we all agree that the GXP should have Nav available, Xenons standard and have upgraded switchgear but it does have that 4.6L Northstar, is good looking, comfortable and roomy, likely to be considerably more exclusive than many of its competitors, and a quite decent handling package.

    At the end of the day, Nav systems aren't all that used by most drivers (plus the Bonnie has an available OnStar service that will provide directions) and Xenons are nice-to-haves but the Bonnie's headlights are quite good. It's going to come down to where your priorities are - and, for some, a sporty, refined-looking V8-powered car is going to be attractive enough to overlook the shortcomings you mention.

    I've personally decided to hold off until the '05 model - in the hope that Pontiac decides to upgrade the Bonnie's interior. After all, if I'm going to change, I want something a little different.
  • bigdaddycoatsbigdaddycoats Posts: 1,058
    If Nav and Xenons are an absolute must then look elsewhere. I can't believe that a Nav system is worth an extra $2k, just my opinion. You could probably have a Xenon system put in as an aftermarket product? Not sure if one exists for the Bonneville.
    So like Ice said, the GXP does have the 4.6 Northstar, looks very sweet and is a pretty large and comfortable car. Most of the competition does not offer a V8. Onstar can be pretty cool. Exclusivity is a consideration since only about 4000 GXP's will be produced this year and I would imagine that number will remain about the same in subsequent model years.
    Incentives could be another factor as you mentioned. I believe you there is a $3000 rebate or you could chose 0% financing for 60 months.
    In the end you should go drive all of the cars you are considering and buy what suits your needs and likes best. There are many great vehicles in this price range and each one has their own unique personality. The GXP most likely has the edge in power and exterior styling. The interior is not as nice as many others, its a trade off.
    As far as the interior being updated for 05 I very much doubt that any upgrades will be seen. The Bonneville most likely will end production by the end of 2006.
  • evandroevandro Posts: 1,108
    One word (or two?): V8.

    No other car in its price range offers one.
  • jcz1jcz1 Posts: 36
    "No other car in its price range offers one."

       As a current Bonnie owner, it pains me to say that this statement is about to no longer be true. The 300C offers a Hemi with 340 HP and 390 torque, at $3K less ($32,000).
This discussion has been closed.