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Pontiac Bonneville

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Comments

  • bladeblade Posts: 21
    I have noticed a small amount of rust as well(similar to Bunky's pic) but used some Never Dull cloth to take it off. It didn't work real well or easy since it's a tight squeeze between spokes! If you guys talk to your dealers, let me know what they say and I will be visiting mine as well to correct this problem. No offense to fgeoge2, but that is a lot of rust to be showing through the spokes! Your eyes are supposed to catch that pretty performance red caliper not orange rust! Has anyone found a chip or any aftermarket parts for these cars yet? I am having no luck at all, I guess they are still too new. I did take Bunky's advice and purchased the performance Zaino kit. I am anxious to try it out but the weather will not cooperate.
  • bryanbryan Posts: 217
    Just bought my GXP and want to thank everyone who writes in. You folks helped convince me I needed this car since I already knew I wanted it! Anyway, I needed to add a long hauler to my "fleet" and decided after some 2-week research. Looked seriously at the Cadillac CTS and the GXP. I have always been a GM-man, and seemed partial to Oldsmobile, but have had Chevys, Buicks, and of course Pontiacs, including a 78 Grand Prix and an 87 Bonneville. I currently drive an 03 Aurora 4.0, a 96 LSS and 95 Cutlass Supreme Convertible. I am replacing the Convertible with the new GXP that I ordered today. Crimson over Taupe, every option but the engine block heater. Found dealer over the GM Buypower page, and it was a pleasure to make the deal. Without rebate, saved almost $3500 off list. Thought that was fair.
  • montanafanmontanafan Posts: 945
    Bryan, did you qualify for the Olds Owner rebate? Or did you use it when you bought the '03? Since it was issued a few years ago, it is commonly forgotten from posts I read. I think you had to have bought new ('96-'01) and still owned the car when the end of Olds was announced (Dec '00 I think).
  • bunky36bunky36 Posts: 94
    Bryan: Congratulations on the GXP purchase! I think all of us on this board are car nuts to one degree or another, and most are long time GM owners. As Bonnevilles go, this is a good board to hang out on to stay in touch with what’s going on with the older and newer Bonnevilles. Keep an eye on your GXP’s rotors when you get it! Hopefully we'll have a remedy by then.

    Blade: Since the LD8 Northstar that we have in our GXPs has been around for 10 years, there have probably been lots of mods made by various people over that amount of time. You might want to go to http://www.domesticperformance.com to see what they have to offer. That is a California company selling a lot of Cadillac engine performance parts—V6 Bonneville stuff, too. Some of it is pretty pricey, but they also custom build parts if they get enough committed buyers.
  • mlm4mlm4 Posts: 401
    For your reference, here is one of the rotors on my 2000 SSEi. The camera's flash actually makes what little rust that is there look worse than it really does in daylight. Mind you, this is a Florida car. Lots of moisture here.

    image

    image
  • fgeorge2fgeorge2 Posts: 15
    Thanks for posting the pictures mlm4. This will help. I'm seeing my dealer on Wednesday to see what they will do for me. I'm guessing my rust problem is caused by improper coating thickness on the rotor area in question. I'm hoping you other GXP owners don't see this rapid acceleration of rust. Will advise further.
  • bryanbryan Posts: 217
    Thanks for the heads up on the Olds Owner rebate. I used it in '01 and helped a long-time friend get into an '01 Alero that was his first new car ever! Bought the Aurora at 0% financing February 28, '03. With the extended 5-year, 60,000 mile warranty, and the off the top discount from the dealer, it was hard to pass up. I really like the Northstar V8, and that's exactly what drew me to the new Bonneville GXP. I'm looking forward to taking delivery sometime in mid to late May.
  • fgeorge2fgeorge2 Posts: 15
    Guys:

    Saw my dealer this morning. They are going to re-finish (repaint) all 4 rotors rather than replace them. It sounds like there may be a problem with the coating degrading over time. Although I'm without my car for 2 days, my dealer has supplied a rental, so I'm alright with that. I just hope that the fix turns out OK.
  • ezraponezrapon Posts: 348
    after the extended drive, I found the steering to be heaveir than my SSEi and a whole lot more torque steer. The exhaust note was a bit of a disappointment, more European than American. The power was ok, but again not remarkable. The rest of the car was nice but too much like the old 2000 SSEi to justify the 38,000 MSRP. Pulled the trigger on an Infinity G 35 coupe the same day. Probably the biggest disappointment will be the guys on this board are much more interesting than the Infinity board.
  • bunky36bunky36 Posts: 94
    You’ll like the G35C. What color? I have a couple friends who have G35’s—one coupe and one sedan—both black. They both like them a lot. I used to sell Infinitis a few years ago (before the G-cars arrived). It’s a well engineered car. My only concern about Infiniti back then was the high cost of routine maintenance through the dealership. The offset was supposed to be the Infiniti loaner car, but I don’t think that was a sufficient offset to the cost. In any event, I seriously considered the G35C myself before I bought the ‘03 SSEi. I went for the SSEi because I was coming out of a string of 6 Trans Ams and was just ready for a change to a roomy but sporty sedan, and I liked all the SSEi electronic gadgetry, the Monsoon audio system, etc. But that coupe is a cool looking ride, no doubt.

    You are right about the GXP’s power not being a quantum leap over the SSEI, but the power difference has been pretty noticeable to me. And I agree that the engine/exhaust sound is not as “American” as the raucous sounds of my former Trans Ams or some Mustangs I’ve heard, but it is to my ears clearly a familiar V8 sound, and when I punch it, it produces a nice, refined “rap.” Of course, if I ever get to missing my Trans Am sounds, I can always tweak the GXP exhaust a tad to make a little more noise, but I doubt that I’ll do that. I think Pontiac got it about right given the nature and character of the car. And on the GXP torque steer, maybe you got hold of one with a funky transaxle or something because mine exhibits almost none—less than my SSEi did. I was impressed with that on the first GXP I test drove. I was expecting something worse, but I concluded that the Northstar and the 4T80E transaxle combo must be a better match for the Bonneville than the supercharged V6 and 4T65E combo. I’m not an engineer by any stretch, but the torque steer difference between the two was slight but noticeable.
  • snicklesnickle Posts: 147
    As used to be a regular poster,I thought I wouldsay good-bye. I havethe replacement for my 2000 SSEi on order (2005 Dodge Magnum RT). I loved my SSEi, but the $20K in repair it got before the extended warranty company went under and the $5k it needs now, tells me to try a different vehicle.

    Good luck with you Bonnie's
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,515
    Other possible causes:
    Front tires with different tire pressures.
    Different rolling diameters - within specs but 1 at each end of allowable limits.
    - Ray
    See both cause such . . .
  • jeffbogjeffbog Posts: 63
    I really have to wonder what was in need repair that is roughly 80% of the purchase price of your car. If you really want to help those of us that still have these Bonnevilles, how about sharing some of the problems that are up to 25K? I can understand wanting to get a rear wheel drive 300 hp new car, but what went so terribly wrong?

    Although I have considered moving on, you gotta love the ride and the realized 29+ highway mpg at 80 on my recent 800 mile trip. Sure I have had a few issues, but with just about 40K, none have been out of pocket yet. If you come back, how about sharing some of the history.
  • snicklesnickle Posts: 147
    Random dump from memory:

    Alternator (twice)
    Two transmisions( 1st one lost 4th,2ndonelast 3rd a month later).
    Power steering rack and lines (That needs to be replaced again.)
    Both rear window motors
    Front passenger caliper seized
    Driver lumbar support
    Driver heated seat
    Radio

    Can't remeber what else. I love the car, but ... I realize my experience is not typical.

    Oh and the Magnum RThas 340 hp and 390 torque :-)
  • bunky36bunky36 Posts: 94
    fgeorge2: How did the repaint turn out?
  • fgeorge2fgeorge2 Posts: 15
    I'm pleased with the job. The technician did a great job in masking off the braking surface. From what I'm told, all the rotors came off the car. The color is very close to OEM. Can't figure out what they used, as the work order just says "NPN - Paint" for material. I was worried about them chipping the red painted calipers, but they're fine.

    Did you see your dealer yet? I know that your car was not as bad as mine.
  • cglassercglasser Posts: 3
    Hi everyone. I've had my GXP since March 31, and while I love the car for the most part, I am alarmed by the very poor gas mileage I'm getting. My 2002 SSEi averaged about 23 MPG for me, but my GXP is only averaging 18. More disturbing is that I took it on a 300 mile road trip this weekend, and it only averaged 19 MPG in pure highway driving - well short of the advertised 24 MPG on the window sticker. Had I known this car was going to drink so much fuel, I very likely would not have bought it.

    Are you other GXP owners seeing this type of fuel consumption? While I understand that I may not get exactly the mileage advertised on the window sticker, I have always gotten within 1-2 MPG of that figure with other cars I've had (like my '98 Regal GS and 2002 SSEi). I think that 5 MPG less than the advertised figure is excessive. What do you guys think?

    Thanks for your input!
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,515
    "19 MPG in pure highway driving - well short of the advertised 24 "
    That is very disappointing.
    How many miles do you have on your GXP?
    - Ray
    Expecting it to equal EPA - if highway driving (in your case) = less than 80 mph and light traffic . . .
  • fgeorge2fgeorge2 Posts: 15
    Same here. I traveled from Detroit to Cincinnati and got 19.3 MPG for the trip. My average around the city here is about 18.5 MPG combined city/hwy.
  • evandroevandro Posts: 1,108
    Are those GXPs broken in yet? It does take about 1000mls...
  • fgeorge2fgeorge2 Posts: 15
    3,200 miles on mine. Really haven't seen any improvement since day 1. Had 2 SSEi's prior to the GXP - knew the V8 would be a bit worse in the city.
  • montanafanmontanafan Posts: 945
    Did you exceed 48mph average on these trips? That is the average speed in the 10 minute EPA highway mileage test. Was the car fully warmed up when you started? It is in the EPA test. Did you do the run without having to idle the engine? It dosen't idle in the EPA test. I think I even recall that the EPA figure is arrived at by measuring the exhaust output, not the gas used. The EPA test isn't intended to give you and idea of the gas mileage you may get on the car the numbers are on. It is so you may compare the relative gas mielage of different cars, knowing they were tested under the same conditions. And I wouldn't consider it "advertised", as much as post per federal regulations.

    Another variation sometimes would be using a trip computer vs. actual calculations.
  • bunky36bunky36 Posts: 94
    Nothing had changed on my rotors when I took it in to the dealer--they looked the same. I showed them the photo of your rotors. They said your rotors obviously didn't get coated properly and they would do the same as your dealer did--repaint them. They said the coating on my rotors was fine and that what I had was a little surface rust mixed with brake dust that was coming off the new braking surface. They said it won't get any worse now that the braking surface has been established, and that some acetone would remove the surface stuff that I didn't like. They put some acetone on a rag and sure enough it came off. So I went home and removed it all using my wife's nail polish remover (acetone). That was a week ago, and everything looks fine so far.

    While I was at the dealership (a Cadillac, Buick, Pontiac dealership), I checked out several cars on the lot. I found the same thing on all Pontiacs and Cadillacs, but, interestingly, not on any of the Buicks. They also had a GTO in the showroom that showed no rust on the rotors, but the area coated silver on the GXP was black on the GTO. That might be another solution if the rust comes back--the black also made the GTO silver wheel stand out pretty well. We'll see what happens over time.
  • bunky36bunky36 Posts: 94
    I have 1,200 miles on mine but all I've done is city driving so far. I get between 17-18 mpg. Not as good as the 21 I used to get on the SSEi, but about what I expected. I have some highway trips planned for the next couple of months. I am expecting 24-25 @ 70-75. Sounds like I might be disappointed.
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,515
    GXP highway mileage

    Looking at some numbers . . .

    GXP final drive: 3.71

    4th gear O/D ratio in MX0 / 4L65-E? (also used in new ‘Vette): 0.70

    Optional (performance) final drive ratio ’06 ‘Vette: 3.15
    (I wonder why a 3.5 to 3.7 is not even available on the GM performance flagship?)

    Hmmm . . . 17% deeper overall ratio, assuming similar sized (rolling diameter) 18” tires = significantly higher rpm at cruise.

    Corvette EPA highway: 25
    (And anecdotal evidence suggests that number is attainable.)

    The ‘Vette weighs less and is more aerodynamic.

    17% less fuel mileage than the ‘Vette would equal approx. 23.25 mpg.

    Still not as bad as you are reporting.

    But does make a case for a 5-speed automatic – with a wider ration spread.
    Curious.
    - Ray
    Wondering if no 5-speed automatic for high torque FWD applications means GM has decided that all performance cars will be RWD / AWD – and what that might mean for future of the G6 and GP / GTP???
  • evandroevandro Posts: 1,108
    The final drive ratio doesn't help the mileage and it might be the actual culprit (plus lower efficiency around town of a V8).

    PS: FWDs use the 4T65-E, not the 4L65-E.
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,515
    "The final drive ratio doesn't help the mileage"
    Exactly.
    - Ray
    Still hoping 24+ mpg is possible on the highway . . .
  • fgeorge2fgeorge2 Posts: 15
    Has anyone tried this stuff? I just bought some - they have a website at www.langka.com. Anyway, the first stone chip just appeared recently on my hood. You use the manufacturers touch-up paint to create a very slight blob at the site and after it dries, smooth the area with the Langka liquid applied to a t-shirt rag wrapped around a blue "credit card" in the kit. After some patience, the recess is filled and the surrounding area is untouched and blob free. According to them, only works on lacquer touch-up paint - doesn't work on OEM clearcoat.
  • bunky36bunky36 Posts: 94
    I have used it for about three years now. It works very well--not so well that you can't tell where the chip was, but a lot better than just putting a blob of paint in the chip and calling it done. It does a good enough job that someone looking at the car who didn't know where the chip was would likely not see it. And it doesn't affect the surrounding clearcoat like they say. One lesson I learned: when they say let the blob dry, they mean it. So I let it harden for a couple days before I use the stuff. If you don't, it will just take the whole blob out of the chip and you are back to square one. I found that depending on the depth of the chip, in a day or two the touch-up paint usually settles into the chip such that it requires another blob or two to eventually get the blob a little higher than the surrounding surface. So it's not a fast process if done right, but it looks pretty good when you're done.
  • fgeorge2fgeorge2 Posts: 15
    Appreciate the post - gives me some comfort now to try it.
This discussion has been closed.