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Jaguar S-Type

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  • Let's take a look at some of these JD Power studies, as the results might surprise a few people.


    2001 JD Power study on long-term (5 year) dependability
    http://www.jdpa.com/presspass/pr/images/01102a.gif:


    Jaguar - 3rd
    Lincoln - 4th
    Cadillac - 8th
    Mercedes - 10th


    2001 JD Power study on customer satisfaction with dealer service
    http://www.jdpa.com/presspass/pr/images/0127a.gif:


    Cadillac - 3rd
    Lincoln - 8th
    Jaguar - 12th
    Mercedes - 13th


    2001 JD Power study regarding customer satisfaction with the sales experience
    http://www.jdpa.com/presspass/pr/images/0139a.gif:


    Cadillac - 2nd
    Jaguar - 5th
    Lincoln - 6th
    Mercedes - 8th


    Jaguar, Cadillac and even lowly Lincoln do better than MB. Lexus, on the other hand, is at the top of every list.

  • scottc8scottc8 Posts: 617
    "lowly Lincoln"? Oops, sorry, there goes that Underdog Mentality again.:)
  • I't was just a bit of jest. I actually like Lincolns. The LS is already a fine car, and should improve for 2003 if the new S-Type is any indication.
  • My parents just purchased a '00 S-Type here in Naples, FL. The car is absolutely beautiful with only 14K miles. It looks like it has never been driven on the highway. Anyway, I'm curious about the engine/tranny make on this model. I have a Mazda MPV and I've seen references on that board saying we have the same engine as the Jag. I realize the S-Type is using a duratec, but is it really the same? Also, did the '00 use the jatco 5-speed tranny, or was that incorporated more recently? Thanks in advance and I hope you all don't mind if I lurk this board!

    SC
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,668
    I assume you have a 3.0L model - the 4.0L model uses a Jaguar AJV8. The 3.0L is indeed a Ford Duratech block and while I don't know the details of the Mazda engine if it's a 3.0L Ford duratech then yes - they have the same basic block. However - Jaguar has their own intake and heads which boost the power to 240 as opposed to 200/210 in the Taurus/Sable and 220 in the Lincoln LS. The blocks are the same but everything else is different. Same for the LS V8 - it's the same Jag AJV8 block but different intake, heads, etc. The X-type also uses 2.5L and 3.0L duratech blocks but again everything else is different. So, same block but definitely NOT the same engine.

    As far as the tranny - it uses the Ford 5R55N same as the LS, Tbird and Explorer/Mountaineer. I think the 2003 switches to a ZF automatic. The S-type and Lincoln LS (and T-bird) all are built on the same DEW98 platform and share the basic chassis, suspension, engine blocks and transmissions and tires. You may find more relevant info on your S-type in the Lincoln LS forum or at llsoc.com (Lincoln LS owners club) which caters to all DEW98 based models.
  • fd1000fd1000 Posts: 47
    I'm so excited!

    I just purchased a Pacific Blue 2002 S-Type Sport V8!!! With nav and voice. Got an incredible deal, since 2003's are right around the corner.

    I'm having the Monaco wheels put on the car, should be just like the picture! (hehehe)

    I pick it up Monday!

    Saw it in clean up today, wow, what a color!

    Does anybody else have the Jag Monaco wheels?

    How do you like them?

    And, does anyone know if you can control any of the navigation with the voice recognition option?

    I will post some pics when it's parked safely in my garage!!!
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Congrats! :)

    Pretty color too!
  • My 2002 S Type had a wheel shimmy from day one.The dealer eagerly balanced all wheels three times with some improvement but it was not 100%. The dealer admitted they did not know how to fix it. They drove my car and admitted it was not perfect over 60 MPH. They called "the factory" and the answer was "it's normal. I called and got the same answer and a factory rep would come and drive my car "next month" Not being satisfied, I met with the dealer management and insisted on some resolution. Within days FIVE new michelins were on my car and the problem is solved.
    Now comes the surprise. Shortly after the dealer agreed to put on new tires I hear from a Bridgestone dealer I had consulted. Bridgestone Tech. people admitted that the Turanza EL 42 tires, original equipment on the 2002 S Type 3.0, are "not compatable" with that car and they would replace them under warranty with any other Bridgestone tire.
    I told my dealer this and he called the same Tech. office and got the same answer. I do believe the dealer did not know this, however, I am not convinced that the factory did'nt know it.
    Bridgestone claimed it is not a recall or a safety problem but "if there is a concern" they would relpace them.
    This could be the answer to some of you guys "shimmy" problem. My tires were replaced at 3500 miles and I must say the dealer tried his best to please me.
    I have had two other problems that the dealer took care of immediatly. The control Module for the anti-lock brakes went bad and the drivers window motor squealed and that was replaced.
    I recently turned in a 2000 Lincoln LS with 40000 miles and very few problens. If my S Type was'nt 40% Ford I would not have gone near it.
    I hope you guys with the wheel shimmy look into the tire solution, a $49000 car should drive as smooth as silk.
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    When these cars came out we were wondering about the tires.. I mean, they were the first Jags sold in America in like 20 years without Pirellis...

    Bill
  • beachnutbeachnut Posts: 291
    My dad's new S-type got a brand new set of Michelin Pilot's for the same reasons. Fortunately, he didn't have to go through the hassle you did.
  • jagboyxkrjagboyxkr Posts: 53
    My father got the sport package on his S-TYPE, and it came with Pirelli P-Zero tires. They're very good, and he's had no problem with them on the S-TYPE.
  • I understand that the Perelli tires are very good and I do beleive they come with the sport package and 17" wheels. One complaint I have heard from several sources is that they "flat spot", especially in cold weather. I looked up Perelli on the internet and somewhere I saw their components include a nylon like material. Years ago nylon was used in a lot of tires and flat spotting was common.
    The replacement tires the dealer put on my S Type are the Michelin Pilot XGT H4. Nice tire and it does the trick for me. No more "shimmy".
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,668
    I heard the 2003 Stypes will come with Michelins instead of the Pirellis. The 2003 LS will also come with Michelins.
  • jerrym3jerrym3 Posts: 202
    Anybody do a drive comparison between a 2002 and a 2003 with the 4.2 "almost" 300 HP and six speed trans?

    In my opinion, the new dash makes the car much more classy, but the rear end could still use a few styling tweaks.

    Anybody getting the Ford discount on a Jag S purchase? One dealer said yes, but only on the 3.0. Another one said yes (to the 4.2) but only if I buy from stock. (Northern NJ area.)
  • I test drove one, and was very impressed. I've never driven a 2000-2002 S-Type, however, I can't say how it stacks up.

    The up side:

    It's a fast fun-to-drive car. The engine and transmission are smooth as silk. That ZF tranny provides wonderfully smooth shifts with very little lag. In sports mode it seemed delightfully aggressive, but maybe it was just my imagination running away with me. When I found an open road, I opened up the throttle. Before I knew it, the car was zooming along in the triple digit range of the dial. It handled superbly in the twisties, and at the same time was very comfortable for everyday driving. For me, the car struck a perfect balance between comfort and handling.

    I've never closely examined a Jaguar finish before, but I did when I test-drove that S-Type. Few manufacturers, if any, make as smooth a finish as Jaguar. Almost no detectable orange-peel texture -- it looked like glass. The Sapphire blue made the car even more beautiful. Unfortunately, the salesman told us that color was being discontinued. What a shame.

    I thought the interior looked very elegant. The wood was tasteful, and I much preferred the Jaguar interior's swoopy lines more than the sharp angles used in cars like the CTS.

    The down side:

    It's interior dimensions felt a bit cramped to me (I'm six feet tall). I found my knees touching the dash when the driver's seat was pulled up far enough to ensure rear passenger would have sufficient leg room. When the front seat was adjusted back to where I was comfortable, rear seat leg room disappeared. For my needs, this was unsatisfactory.

    There was also some tire noise on rough roads. On smooth roads, however, the car was as quiet as can be.

    What to do?

    My wife loved the car. It was just what she wanted, and she was willing to overlook the shortcomings I mentioned. For me, the car scored enough positive points for me to overlook its flaws. What the heck. If it makes her happy, then why not?

    When we got around to negotiations, however, things didn't look so good. They were completely unwilling to budge from retail, and tried to lowball my trade, so I walked away. Maybe they will be more reasonable in the fall when there are a few sitting on the lot.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,668
    What do you mean by "almost 300 hp"? Are you thinking about the S-Type R that Jag advertised at 400 when it's really 388 SAE? I don't think that was the case with the NA S-type HP rating. I think it was 300 SAE all along. I think they used the DIN for the R because 400 sounds a lot faster than 388 in the press releases.
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Talk to Paul DeBlois at Montclair.

    Bill
  • jerrym3jerrym3 Posts: 202
    check specs on www.jaguarvehicles.com
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,668
    I'll take your word for it. You know what happens when you assume things!
  • jerrym3jerrym3 Posts: 202
    Thanks for the info. Spoke to Paul. He'll apply the discount on an ordered vehicle. Will definitely use him if the other local dealers won't.
  • im_brentwoodim_brentwood Posts: 4,883
    Cool. He's a very straight shooter. No BS kinda guy.

    Figured you two would get along :)

    If you do the deal, tell him Bill Weismann says Hi.

    Bill
  • jerrym3jerrym3 Posts: 202
    Sure will, but I hope my two local dealers come to their senses first. Montclair is about 16 miles away and it's not a straight, no traffic highway drive. (But then again, in NJ, what is?)
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Folks, this is not the place to get into issues with topic management.

    Please email me with your concerns and we'll either work them out or I'll give you other resources to pursue if necessary.

    Thanks!

    Pat
    Sedans Host
  • hyper4hyper4 Posts: 1
    I have a 2000 S type Jag. At 4500 miles I had no shifting from 1st to 2nd gear and had the transmission replaced. At 14,000 miles the transmission light went on and the dealer said the trans had to be replaced again. (it took 30 days to do). Being upset I asked for an extension of my warranty or a trade assist. They offered me $1,000.00 for my trouble. (customer service was not very polite and took a long time to return my calls)
    The dealer said he would give me a good deal on a 2003 trade, but I have cold feet. Does this problem should familar?
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,668
    The 2000 Stype shares it's tranny with the Lincoln LS and we have had very few reports of tranny problems on the LS. I can only remember 2 or 3 replacements/repairs at the most in the last 3 years.

    It's possible that the dealer screwed up the replacement. If it's any consolation, the 2003 Stype uses a totally different tranny than previous models - a ZF 6-speed automatic. If you otherwise like the Stype I would go for the 2003.
  • jagonejagone Posts: 39
    The 2003 Mercedes Benz E-Class makes the 2003 S-Type look 20-years behind the times in the luxury segment. From the state of the art suspension to the Distronic Cruise Control to the Electronic Power Trunk. If Jaguar ever seriously expects to make a run at Mercedes or BMW they have a long ways to go!

    P.S. Before you decide to attack! I own a Jaguar S-Type.
  • jagboyxtypejagboyxtype Posts: 241
    Those features all seem kind of like gimmicky techno items (like the S-TYPE's new electronic parking brake) that don't really do much. Have people really become so lazy that they cannot set their own parking brakes and must rely on their Jag's computer to do it for them? Can one really not close his or her own trunk without the aid of an electric motor on the Mercedes?

    The 2003 S-TYPE has voice activated controls(with many updates), the latest in the advanced computer controlled CATS suspension system, height/distance adjustable accelerator and brake pedals, a new manual transmission option, or the first-in-class ZF 6-speed adaptive automatic transmission that it shares with the new BMW 7-Series, a supercharged R variant, DOHC engines with continuously variable valve timing (Mercedes still only uses SOHC engines), and many other new features that compete in the technology department. Even its beautiful grille now automatically moves-in a few inches in the event of a collision as to not sustain damage in the crash. Many of those items are standard on the S-TYPE, where as all of the features you mentioned on the E-Class are high-priced options. The S-TYPE doesn't seem to be lacking in equipment at all.

    Doesn't Cadillac have a feature on its cars that close the trunk automatically, and Lincoln (heck, even the GMC Envoy) have air-ride suspensions like the one on that 2003 Mercedes? Mercedes-Benz must have gotten its motors for the electric trunk-lids from parent company DaimlerChrysler's Chrysler/Dodge minivans with electric hatches. Big-rig trucks on the highways have "distronic" cruise control, and have had it longer than any luxury cars have. If you want really new technology in a car, the Cadillac Deville has the option of night-vision (but like most all of these features and gadgets, most drivers will barely use them).

    Technology aside, leather and wood are all standard features on the S-TYPE, where you have to upgrade from pleather/vinyl and plastic in the Mercedes for it, and even then it isn't the same fine Connolly and birds-eye maple and there still isn't nearly as much of it as in the Jaguar, which also has a starting price almost $8,000 less than the stripped Mercedes. Not to mention the terrible reliability problems M-B is having (it makes Jaguar's past reliability problems on the older XJ's seem like normal wear and tear!) Besides, the S-TYPE has a bigger hood ornament than that gunsight on the E-Class :-)
  • cartesiocartesio Posts: 36
    I think you are overlooking something in your comparison of the 2003 S-type with the 2003 Mercedes, namely, that the Jag is SUPPOSED to look not 20 years behind the times, but 30 years behind the times.

    We have a 2002 new E-series MB now, and have put only 1000 miles on it so far. It is a magnificent machine. I have driven both the 2003 MB E-series and in fact rented a 2002 S-type 4.0 L for four days. The Jag is magnificent, too, but is vastly quieter than the MB. In fact, it was a bit disconcerting to step on the accelerator and have the Jag move forward briskly with no sound whatever from the engine compartment.

    Oh, yes: I will be ordering a 2003 S-type Jag in September. The dealer tells me to wait until then because there will be favorable promotions.

    Cheers, and happy motoring!
  • jagonejagone Posts: 39
    I doubt anyone waiting until September for a new 2003 Mercedes Benz state of the art E-Class luxury sedan will see any favorable promotions going around! That says it all about the new 2003 Jaguar S-Type its On Sale before it even goes on sale. The new Mercedes will be available with an all New Panoramic Sun Roof for both front and rear passengers to enjoy a little sunshine now and then. The Distronic Cruise Control doesn't seem gimmicky to me, it seems essential for long trips out on the open road, guess Jaguar engineers can not do Distronic Cruise Control? You're right the Retro look of the S-Type from the 1960's is really neat, too bad the S-Type's automotive technology is 10-years behind the game. If Jaguar is serious about becoming a player in the luxury car segment of the market, they better get on the ball. Because if I'm going to spend $50-60,000 on a luxo-boat I want the latest technology not just a pretty face! I remember when the S-Type went on sale in the 2000 model year here in the U.S.it was like buying a 1990 Mercedes or BMW as far as the automotive technology went. They got me with the styling and retro look, but not everyone falls for a retro.

    P.S. I own a S-Type and still love my S-Type, but in a few years if Jaguar can not or will not move into this new automotive millenium. I'll be rolling eyeballs and opening my wallet to a New Mercedes Benz E-Class! Whether you like it or not this New 2003 Mercedes Benz E-Class is King of Hill in the mid-size luxury segment by a 1,000,000 miles, that Sweetheart is pure sugar!!!
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,505
    Does anyone know if there are 2003 S-Types in the Hertz 'Prestige' fleet yet? I am renting one for a day on a business trip next week.
    Thanks,
    - Ray
    Who enjoyed driving a 2001 S-Type V8 Sport in Arizona last Summer . . .
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