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Comments
Aside from my beautiful, wonderful wife, my 2001 330xi (steel gray/gray, PP, CWP, CD) is the love of my life. A pure pleasure to drive. Fast as I could reasonably want, handles like a dream, looks like a million bucks.
I notice that BMWUSA.com has restated the 0-60 acceleration of the 330xi from 7.1 seconds for the manual tranny to 6.9. I find my baby's performance seems closer to AutoWeek's time of 6.2 seconds. I base this, in part, on the fact that my last car had a rated time of 7.5 seconds, and my 330 is WAY faster than my last car was.
I remember hearing about that kid wrecking a couple of cars in HS. Is that true?
Having owned 5 VW/Audi products in the past, I was a loyal customer until VW (in their infinite wisdom) cancelled the manual transmission version of the Passat GLX for 1999 only. That was the very year I needed a new car, hence the fact that I looked further a field and realized that because of the high residual values of the BMW 3-Series, I could lease a $38,000 328i for only $20 per month more than a $29,000 Passat GLX. The long and short of it was that I got kind of “Torqued-Off” at VW, while at the same time I thank them for their idiocy, which caused me to lease a far superior car in the 328i. I am not saying I will NEVER buy a VW again, however, it may be a very long time. Thanks for the heads up on the W8 Passat, it does sound like a cool car.
Genie1,
I will in fact have to test with real warm bodies, and given the medical reviews so far, the working prototypes should prove that my design cannot cause CTS. At that point, I intend to go shopping for money. ;-)
Denright,
Long time no Howdy! So, Howdy Do Sir!
Best Regards,
Shipo
Pat
Host
Sedans Message Board
Best Regards,
Shipo
Great selection of cars!!! Not just the BMW choices...I have to admit that if I were to vote, my choices would be the same in most categories. Feels like home here.
novcenthusiast: Don't know. I didn't know him well, plus I was only there for 2 years. We did make national news with parents charting a bus, so their underaged kids don't have to drink and drive during Homecoming (wasn't my class).
Whatever happened to Platypus, by the way? It's been too long since he posted here. Too busy driving his silver 330i, I guess
novcenthusiast: Don't know. I didn't know him well, plus I was only there for 2 years. We did make national news with parents charting a bus, so their underaged kids don't have to drink and drive during Homecoming (wasn't my class).
BTW, you think I could be the board's historian?
I don't like the looks all that well from what I can tell from TV ads and pics on the web, though I would want to see one in person and up close before drawing any real conclusions on the aesthetic issue.
What is the buzz among my fellow 3 Series lovers?
Enjoy
The exterior: took me a while to get used to the new lines on the car. Looks kinda plain, when compared to the aggresive stance of the 3-series sedan. From most angles it looks balanced with an organic rounded yet boxy look to it, but imho, it looks horribly ugly for some reason from the side profile with the bulbous trunk sticking out back. I tried hard to be open-minded and unbiased, but I really couldn't get myself to like that view at all. If the a6 exterior doesn't set your heart on fire, then ditto the a4 because it just looks like a 7/8th version of it. Oh, another thing, the very un-subtle black plastic lower skirting looks horrible with any colours lighter than gray or black.
The interior: on the other hand, is the redeeming part of the a4, because there are so many small and large thoughtful, elegant, and luxurious touches that add up to make this a true luxury sedan, even with base trim. Like standard 6 disc in-dash changer, 10 speakers with standard subwoofer, dual auto climate controls, etc. Also, one thing that the a4 has over the 3-series is that all the interior surfaces invite you to feel and caress the soft textures. And you get all this costing a few thou less than a similar 3-series.
Last but most importantly, the drive:
Driving position and steering wheel feels great. The shifter had short actions, however, it is "rubbery" and "distant" (now i know what the auto journalists mean when they say that in their reviews) when compared to the 3's. The first gear ratio in this 6-speed is also set quite high, so i had to shift into second almost immediately when accelerating hard because i was running out of room on the tach. I don't know whether that is something i can live with on a daily commute in rush hour. 2nd gear starts were possible, but i had to be careful not to stall the engine at a critical moment. With an aggresive right foot, the engine sounds a muted roar plus a little bit of the 3's "sewing machine" quality, but never did it approach the level of all-out aural delight of the 330's engine and exhaust. The non-sp suspension was soft with kinda tallish passenger tires: 215/55/r16. The grip going around corners was great especially when there were bits of loose gravel on the road. But on a straight, the accelaration was not as decisively forceful as the 330 due to the extra 300lbs it packs with quattro and luxury trimmings. The extra weight (and 60/40 weight distribution) also similarly affected the tossabilty of the a4 in attempting quick transient maneuvers. All in all, a safe, luxurious car, but not as sporty as a 330.
One thing i did notice after the drive, was that during the whole 40 minute trip, never once did my mind wander from the task of driving to the pleasure of appreciating the finer luxurious offerings of the interior. What does it say about me?
My $0.02 conclusion: in this competitive market for entry level luxury sports sedans, the a4 is built with heavier emphasis on luxury, whereas the 3-series is built with heavier emphasis on sports. So, in choosing one car, it really boils down to one simple question (to which there is no right or wrong answer): am i a passenger or a driver?
Oops... sorry, didn't realize it was going to be such a long post
Are you sure you weren't testing the A6 instead? :-)
Were the nominations announced only on the BMW boards? That may explain the results.
We own both the '01 A4 and the '01 325i and although the 325i is sportier, I would never think of the A4 as a passenger's car. Quite the opposite: I love driving and I could be very happy with the A4 1.8T. The 325 has the edge in sport and especially feel category but they are closer than a lot of people think. Everything in the A4 is softer in a good way and there are times in everyday driving when this is an advantage. If I'm driving on a dry road by myself, I'd take the 325i. If I'm driving in the wet and especially with my 6-month pregnant wife in the car, we always take the A4. It's still a pleasure to drive the A4 and it still feels sporty but in a more muted, luxurious kind of way.
Pat
Host
Sedans Message Board
Now that I look back at the comparison, maybe it would have been more fair if I had compared the A4 3.0 quattro to the 330xi. If anyone has done so, can you help us out with your thoughts?
Parnola :
Another note about ride quality you really need to drive the sport im telling you its still a VERY comfortable ride , other then maybe the lowest profile rims getting bent if your in an area with Horrible roads.
good luck
DL
Well aware this is a minority opinion around here...so be it...
-Chris
As for reliability, I get the impression that BMWs can be just as reliable as the Japanese but I can't seem to find any relevant stats other than the anecdotal failures sprinkled liberally throughout various message boards like Edmunds. Suggestions?
On the issue of what's cheapest to fix, again I'm not sure. I do know that with most of the work I've ever had done on my cars, it's labor cost that usually kills me more than parts ever do. My Nissan dealer charges nearly as much per hour as my Mercedes dealer. But what about BMW parts? Can any of you who do your own maintenance speak to that?
Finally, after many years I'm realizing that maybe I should have taken auto shop in high school all those years ago instead of some of the useless scholarly stuff that I forgot the day after graduation. I can change oil but that's about it, so attention gearheads: Can you offer any advice on how a person can increase their abilities in the DIY auto-maintenance department? Maybe community college or adult ed classes? Anyone in the DC area want to trade auto maintenance lessons for PC maintenance lessons?
"Mechanics: Horror Stories." I bet all of you have had at least one bad run in with a dishonest mechanic. Please post your horror story under my new topic. Here is the link: easyrider300m "Mechanics: Horror Stories" Oct 28, 2001 1:54am ---Ok, Guys--start your postings!
cctoenj - please note that I'm not looking for a soft ride, per se - if I were then I'd just get another Lexus. I'm ready for a fun to drive car, I just don't want to jump all the way to the other extreme.
I'll test drive them all and let you know what I choose. The 330xi is attractive, because I'm in Ohio where snow does become an issue, but I think I'd rather save the weight and just switch to winter tires for part of the year.
At first I was going downhill in third gear about 40 and the car just took the corner like a cat with claws in loose loop carpet. On each succeeding switchback I came into the corner a bit faster, without my foot on the gas or brake. I got the summer Conti's to squeal at first and then the next time they didn't squeal but both the front and back were sliding a bit. I could feel, and hear, the tires sliding (scrubbing) on the pavement but they were not squealing. And the DSC never kicked in. So the next time, with the tires sliding again (just a bit) I tapped the brakes in the middle of the corner and the DSC immediately kicked in. It braked the car rather hard and stayed engaged for a second or two. I didn't really like the feeling. The car was very much in control but not under my control. The point is that DSC never came on until I forced the car to get a bit unsettled by tapping the brakes.
I turned around and went back uphill through the same switchbacks. A fast corner with light throttle and little tire squeal was just fine - no DSC. In driving school I learned to throttle steer the car coming out of a corner. It was great fun and very safe. If the front gets sliding a little too much coming out of a corner under heavy throttle, just let up a bit on the throttle and it steers right out of the corner, sweet! At the track I never had DSC turned on. So I tried the same thing this morning, and as soon as I accelerated hard to get the fronts sliding a bit, DSC came on. This time it's just like someone turned off the ignition - your right foot does nothing to the car for a second or two. No problem, but it just took some of the fun away.
I learned a few things. One, leave the DSC on when you are driving on the street. I've read where some people turn it off all the time. That would be dumb. You can still have great fun in the corners and it helps you from doing something stupid. Two, my tires actually quit squealing when they really slid, but you can still feel (through the sterring wheel and your backside) when they are sliding. Maybe this also had something to do with the pavement. I was on a very rough concrete surface (but not bumpy) this morning. I never noticed this on the track, but our track is asphalt.
Finally, before anyone accuses me of being an idiot (or I have to give the disclaimer of "don't ever try this at home kids"). I never came near the total control limits of my car. I have had the car in driving school, on the track and around a skidpad several times where I learned the limits of both the car, and me. I always made sure they was no oncoming traffic (never pushed anything on a blind corner). I never left my own drivng lane, even when sliding a little. Lastly, I slowly increase speed through a number of corners so I can tell when I'm nearing the 7/10 limit and I never go beyond that on public roads or at the track.
I sure do love this car! Wish I had a 330i though, especailly at altitude. In MY 2000 the 13% increase in HP (to the 328) didn't seem be different enough, IMHO, to spend the extra $5,000 (sorry shipo). Now the HP differnce is 22%, and that would make me think twice (of course only if you have the extra $$).
Have fun, but be safe!
I think that under normal driving conditions, the DSC is there to get you out of trouble in cases of extremely bad driver judgement. It still allows the tires to slide maybe an inch or so before it kicks in but for spirited driving on a back road with no traffic around I'd definitely switch it off.
One of the nice things about having the 330 would be that due to the added power, you can make the back end come out more easily when the DSC is switched off and have fun with modulating that power. The 323/325 SP are pretty hard to slide on dry roads.
BTW, not only do I think you are safe - I think our roads would be much safer if everyone put in an effort to find out their car's limits as well as you do.
Your post and a previous one have jelled at least one idea: for normal street driving, the (RWD) car seems to be setup for slight understeer with recommended tire pressure. As you noted, if the car understeers into a corner or during acceleration out of a corner, you correct by lifting the throttle. DSC could do that. If the car were setup for neutral or oversteer response, throttle and brake would only aggravate the problem.
I'm a little concerned about your comment that under heavy cornering, when you tested DSC by intentionally applying the brakes, DSC applied them more. I would have preferred DSC to reduce braking so that the tires would have better grip to maintain the turn.
I have been probing the limits of AWD and so far have come away with the feeling that it is very neutral under power - the front definitely feels like it is being pulled around rather than (in my previous RWD cars) of being pushed straight ahead. As I go incrementally faster, I feel the back begin to lean farther than the front; however, I'm not close enough to any limits to know if both front and rear will nibble together or if the rear will break before the front.
Sounds great.
I was impressed by the 4 cyl kompressor and front end torque. Acceleration was smooth and quick.
Curves felt a little sloppy compared to the Bimmer but I think the power compensated well. Visibility was not as good as in my coupe (which is about perfect). The C(?) pillar is quite wide.
The panoramic sunroof is amazing. I still don't like the chubby rear, but the car fit me fairly well. It was fun to drive. I would consider it as an option when its time to trade. (A used SLK would be nice too)
My brother has decided to order one in Capri blue, oyster leather, heated seats, and panoramic sunroof. He preferred it to the 325 we looked at. The MB worked out cheaper, once all our options were added up. (Everything is extra on the Bimmer, a lot of things are standard on the MB)
This car is not for everyone. It works for someone like my brother with his personality and current situation in life (24, single, needs sporty with functionality of a rear seat that folds FLAT for deliveries).
Besides he said I could drive it any time.
I'm not comparing the 240 sedan to a 325. I think I would hands down prefer the Bimmer in this situation. But for fun the 230 is quite nice.
There are also not as many in Toronto as the ubiquitous 3 series.
Speaking of which, I was at the dealer this weekend and started hitting my salesman with a laundry list of questions about Munich and German driving in general. He's from that part of Germany and had some excellent tips. Anyway, his opinion was that 85mph could be safely exceeded during the break-in period as long as the RPMs don't kick up too high. He recommended not exceeding ~4000RPM up to 500 miles or so (which jives with what others here have said) but without regard to speed. Then no more than 4500RPM from there to around 1000 miles, and anything goes (within reason) from there on. What speed is a 330i going at 4000RPM in 5th gear? 100mph or so? Anyone think this is bad advice? It sorta makes sense to me in that you're really breaking in the engine, and all the engine cares about is how fast it's running, right or wrong?
I believe the owner's manual says the same thing. You can always download a pdf version off the BMWUSA web site.
4000 rpm will do nicely...