Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





Lexus ES 300/ES 330

16566687071174

Comments

  • Well my mom just received her new 2002 ES 300 (mystic sea opal/ivory) and I bought her 1994 ES 300 for my wife. It had only 30,000 miles on it and not a scratch, always Lexus dealer maintained. Well now that me wife drives it, she seems to feel that the brakes could be more responsive and less play in the pedal feel. I've driven it and seem to feel there is some lack of responsiveness when it comes to the pedal.

    Anyone out there know of any up-grades to a 94 ES's braking system. Does Lexus offer different brake pads or rotors to it's car line? It just had it's 30K service in which they flushed out and replaced the brake fluid. Any ideas if that might be causing the brake pedal play (approx. 2-3 inches before any reaction to the brakes). Does it sound like it needs new pads or is there an upgrade fix.

    Any help or advise would be appreciated, thanks.
  • While the ES 300 scored highest overall among the cars tested, the report scored it fourth overall in the entry level class. First was the BMW 3301, second the Lesus IS, and third the MBZ C320.
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    about the Consumer Reports article is that they judged the 5 speed automatic (something along the lines of) "less responsive than the 4 speed it replaces". Also, I was rather struck by the emergency handling judgement on the Acura TL-S.. it only posted 49.5 MPH and they judged it to be tricky to keep the rear end in line, even with stability control.
    ~alpha
  • well I am an ardent fan of Lexus and this is my third one
    so I am not some disgruntled owner of another brand trying to downplay my darling lexus-but it is like a child to me and no "parent" would like their child to have flaws

    I love my ES but absolutely feel very dejected at the mileage I get--thereis no justification for the 21/29 and claims that mileage improved--I think that is all false marketing to get people to buy it and justify the status quo on horsepower
    I think teh ePA is more like 15/23 and Lexus should apologize and issue a correction like infiniti did when they could not meet the 260 hp claims on I and G-35
    Facts must be true
    from the mileage data on this board I don't think others are getting the 29 on 100% highway either
    my vaerage is usually around 20 with 80% highway and 20% city-On my 100% highway trip for 6 hrs I got 26
    any comments

    Can we hold Lexus own their mistake--is this a consumer misinformation?

    Experts here must know the answer
  • kreativkreativ Posts: 299
    I have to agree with you in that the biggest complaint about the '02 ES I've heard so far has been MPG. When a person gets much better mileage with his '01 ES than his '02 ES, there's something wrong...especially since driving patterns are the same. I don't know how Lexus can refute that, but they deny ever hearing about the problem.
    Someone here posted about a Lexus service tech saying that he knew that poor MPG was an issue with the earlier '02 ES cars. Of course, when the ES owner wanted it in writing and the service tech went to the service manager, you know what happened.

    I'm getting bad mileage, but I'm not going to know how things stack up against the 21/29 claim until I start using the '02 ES as a daily commuter.
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    in the aforementioned Consumer Reports test, the ES 300 averaged 21 MPG and according to their testing (which I'm not exactly sure how they do it) about 14 MPG City and 34 HWY, both comparable to the competing cars. Check out the issue: March 02 on newstands now.
    ~alpha
  • Comparable my butt! My girlfriend has an I30. She's never gotten less than 19 mpg on a tank, and gets 25-26 all highway.

    How is that comparable to 14 mpg?
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    If you read the CR report, you will see that the numbers for the ES are comparable to those measured for the other cars, and since Consumer Reports is the reference to which I spoke, your girlfriend's I30 is irrelevant. Consumer Reports measures economy for all cars in the same manner, hence my direct comparison based upon the March 02 issue. Like I said, check it out. If you aren't experiencing numbers that match those, or numbers that are suggested by the window sticker, COMPLAIN, COMPLAIN, COMPLAIN, but not to me, and don't reference your butt, I could care less about it. Write a letter to corporate stating your disappointment under the circunstancias you do not see an improvement, and/or your dealer will not help or refuses to compensate. Wow I am really procrastinating writing my Spanish paper. Gotta go.
    ~alpha
  • lenscaplenscap Posts: 854
    My friend took his car in for a routine service and the loaner was a new ES 300. Just thought it was interesting they're using the car as a loaner (this dealer mostly provides RX 300s, with some 2001 ES 300s thrown in occasionally).
  • Don't try and drag the competition down with you. That's too bad that you only get 14 mpg in the city in your ES, but that doesn't mean that's what the competition gets, too. She has a 2001 I30, so it's most certainly comparable to the ES, and most of her driving is stop and go in the city.

    More HP for the I30, it's faster, (and especially now that it's the I35) AND better mileage to boot?

    Why pay $5k for the L on the hood? Tell you what - pay me just $2,500 and I'll get you an L to go on the hood of whatever you want.
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    So actually, I never said I own an ES, because I don't, I am just a fan of the platform and its proliferations. Nor am I dragging the competition down "with me", I am simply referring to a press article in which the ES has comparable MPG specs to those of its competitors. READ the ARTICLE, I'm not making things up.
    ~alpha
  • Well my mom just received her new 2002 ES 300 (mystic sea opal/ivory)
    and I bought her 1994 ES 300 for my wife. It had only 30,000 miles on it
    and not a scratch, always Lexus dealer maintained. Well now that me wife
    drives it, she seems to feel that the brakes could be more responsive and
    less play in the pedal feel. I've driven it and seem to feel there is some lack
    of responsiveness when it comes to the pedal.

    Anyone out there know of any up-grades to a 94 ES's braking system.
    Does Lexus offer different brake pads or rotors to it's car line? It just had it's
    30K service in which they flushed out and replaced the brake fluid. Any
    ideas if that might be causing the brake pedal play (approx. 2-3 inches
    before any reaction to the brakes). Does it sound like it needs new pads or
    is there an upgrade fix.

    Any help or advise would be appreciated, thanks.
  • You insinuate that if the ES gets well below EPA estimates that the competition will, too.

    Sadly for you, that's not the case...
  • kreativkreativ Posts: 299
    Dude, he was just referring to the Consumer Reports article. He has no personal stake in an '02ES. I don't think he really cares about how your GF's I30 stacks up to the ES.

    If you want a more entertaining argument, tell hk2la her '02ES sucks. Now that'll be interesting. =)
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    A major newspaper is looking to interview folks who learned how to drive stick in their adulthood, and either fell in love or hated it. Also welcome is any input on why people love to drive stick, and any unusual anecdotes about how you learned etc.

    Hope to hear from you before Feb 22 via the Talk to the Press discussion or at jfallon@edmunds.com with your thoughts and contact information.

    Thanks as always,

    Jeannine Fallon
    PR Director, Edmunds.com
  • But I think it's terribly overpriced vs. the competition.
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    thanks amigo. I thought maybe I wasn't making myself clear, so I kept restating my argument, but apparently I was, thanks for the confirmation.
    on to more interesting ES arguments.
    :)
    ~alpha
  • mjs4mjs4 Posts: 8
    This is all very interesting... I'm getting 21 mpg, mostly in the city. Maybe it's not that important to me . I just like the car . It's not a sports car ,but an entry level luxury car and it's all of that. It's dependability is outstanding and also great resale from what I've seen from past Lexus's. I have 1600 miles on the car now. I think it is real smooth and pretty quite. I'm sorry , but the Infinity does not compare in my book. Not nearly as quite. It is cheaper tho. I kinda like that L in my Lexus. I love to read this site. Everyone has an opinion and thats how it should be. If you do have complaints about your car , you should definately tell Lexus . That's the only way things will change. If WE don't tell them about our concerns they will never know. I recieved a survey from them the other day and told them I thought they should have made more cars that offered the upgrade to the ML without the nav. instead of having to special order them. Well have a good day and keep me smiling.......mike
  • Okay, I now have 750 miles on her, latest mileage info: average speed 50.4 mph, avg mileage 25.5 mpg. The best I've been able to get is about 26.7 doing about 65 mph. I think this is very good. Love the ride and looks. my 99 I30 avgs about 25 mpg in same driving conditions, although the I30 will get an honest 30mpg on road trips, non stop doing 75 mph with ac on. No buyers remorse here, I love the Lexus.
    Clark
  • kreativkreativ Posts: 299
    In answer to "Why pay $5k for the L on the hood?"

    The ES is priced higher than the I35, yet is outselling the I35 by more than double.
    If Infiniti made the I35 more appealing:
    1. They could raise the price to the ES level without fear of not being able to sell any cars.
    2. Lexus would lower the price of the ES to better compete, and we'd all win.

    I drove both when shopping for a new car.
    I35 had a power advantage. I liked the feel when I floored it. And I could've gotten the I35 for below invoice.

    ES had the advantage in: Luxury (higher quality leather and interior), noise isolation, ride quality (fully independent suspension, AVS option. I35 still uses outdated rear beam suspension), 5-speed automatic (vs. 4-speed in I35), reliability rating, design longevity (first year in new generation, will stay current for the 5-year design cycle), the design itself (the ES stands out, the I35 blends in), brand appeal, and supposedly better mileage (21/29 vs. I35's 20/26...can't determine true mileage in a test drive).

    I expect the next-generation I35 to be a great car. That's probably when Lexus will release the ES350 to keep pace.

    The upcoming Infiniti G35 looks to be a winner. It's the only Infiniti model so far that I would purchase over the Lexus equivalent (IS).
  • I think except for Kreativ, everyone else sidetracked the issue by entering into the famous comparison game- where is lenscap--our wise Oracle of Lexus:)
    again I adore my Lexus--I think the issue is they claimed a number-the reality fell far short of it
    and the car has worse mileage than my 2001 which I also owned so I can compare accurately.
    with premium gas I get avg of 19-20 with 65% highway-that is not what was claimed

    All I am saying is this may be consumer misleading case and maybe as consumers we can make a stronger case to lexus and have ourselves heard

    Lexus did not pay much attention to my claim and said I should wait and watch--For lower grades of fuel, no mileage impact-slight decrease

    So I bought the car, paid a damn good price for it-but my issue is just the principle of the matter
    How can you as a billion dollar ( I think!) corporation make a claim, boast total quality management and then fall so short of your claim
    So any car manufacturer ca start doing this and ethics will be at stake-you can lie about 0-60, slalom, etc
    What is the recourse

    what can we as current and potential consumers do to help each other as a group
    Let us address the issue at hand tahn digressing

    Lexus wants us to digress so we do not bother them
    Let us not fall in this trap and ask ourselves-if I am getting 20% less mileage than promised, did I not get misled
  • kreativkreativ Posts: 299
    I'm not able to accurately gauge mileage on my '02 ES yet (local only, low avg. MPH), but the most extreme MPG cases I've heard of seem to be from those who purchased their cars early on (10/01 production and earlier).

    I don't know if this means it only affects early production '02 ES or not.

    When was your car made? (It says on the sticker located on the driver's side door jam).
  • Any good deals in the New England Region on 2002 ES300s? A friend of mine has been looking for a 2002 ES300. So far both dealers he went to are willing to give a discount of $0 off of MSRP. Would like to know if anyone has bought one in the Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island area for lower than MSRP. Dealer name, and salesperson contact info. would be appreciated.
  • mrrogersmrrogers Posts: 391
    Over in the Edmund's Townhall Maintenance & Repair section, there is a topic called "Engine Sludge?" Over the last several days, it appears that Toyota may be admitting a bit of a problem.
  • lenscaplenscap Posts: 854
    I've read before that the 1997-01 ES 300 shared about 15-20% of their parts with the Camry, not 60-70%.

    Also, the powertrain is different now since the ES 300 has a 5-speed and the Camry only a 4-speed. Further, on cars like mine with the AVS the suspensions are different (they may different without AVS but I'm not sure).

    Speaking of ads, Lexus actually ran one about 10 years ago that was great re: BMW. It said something like: "Owning a BMW is a once in a lifetime experience. For most owners, once is enough." The ad referred to the fact BMW had one of the lowest loyalty (repurchase rates) in the luxury car class, while Lexus was the highest.

    I'm not knocking BMWs. I think they're great for people who like sportier cars. But that ad had a fantastic headline.
  • toyo_ztoyo_z Posts: 47
    Had my 2002 ES300 for a couple of months now; it's been fantastic, until today.

    When I tried to start it this morning, I couldn't turn the ignition key. I jiggled the steering wheel, as the 'roadside assistance' folks suggested, but still, the ignition key wouldn't turn. Finally, after jiggling the wheel some more, it totally locked up. And i still couldn't turn the ignition key.

    I gave up. They are coming to tow the thing tomorrow morning. Not a good sign. In my 20+ years of car ownership, i've never had a problem like this before :-(
  • Well I just pulled out the past four years of the April issue of Consumer Reports. It seems that the I35 has the better reliablity record(in the years that they are both included). It was better than the ES300 in 1998,1999 & 2001. It was not included in the results for 2000.(due to new model)

    I guess perception and reality aren't always the same.

    I wonder if that Toyota/Lexus engine sludge problem has anything to do with it???
  • My factory warranty on my 98 ES will expire within a few months and I would like to hear opinions on whether I should purchase an extended warranty if I plan to keep the car for
    2-3 more years? They can be had for approx $800-1200 range. I have already had the
    A/C compressor replaced under warranty, speaking of which, the dealer put in a re-furbished
    unit...is this normal?
  • I had one of the earliest batch of cars made late Sep 2001 so perhaps that explains--lucky me:)
    well don't know what Could do unless it becomes a known issue
  • toyo_ztoyo_z Posts: 47
    See my post above about problems with the 2002's steering column locking.

    I had the car towed to my local lexus dealer. The techs were stumped, they've never seen anything like that before. It may be a design flaw.

    if anyone else has had the steering column lock up, and subsequently couldn't turn the ignition key, i'd like to hear about it. It looks like my car will be out of commission for a few days.

    As an aside, they gave us a 2001 ES300 as a loaner. There's no comparison between the two cars -- the new ES300 feels much more "luxurious", and a bit larger/boatier. I can see why old ES owners felt a bit perplexed by the new model. They are radically different machines.
This discussion has been closed.