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Honda Civic 2005 and earlier

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  • Re Changing exhaust on automatic Civic EX sedan – GHulet, your comments are plausible, but I do have some of the answers concerning this work-in-progress. Remember we all have our personal tastes and priorities. It’s a pleasure to listen to and learn from you and andyman73, (but ignore ill-informed sarcastic Old Blueeyed.)

    First, this car replaces my wife’s sedan. That’s why it’s a sedan and automatic, but I can’t keep my fingers off it since it’s a fun-to-drive car, and my wife is very tolerant. I just prefer the Civic to the Mazda3.

    Yesterday, the entire stock exhaust system, from the cat back of course, was unbolted, removed, and stored. Emissions are not affected. Also, warranty is not an issue because it says, “The warranties in this booklet do not cover: Any failure caused by modifying the vehicle, or installing accessories not authorized by Honda.” All the engine knows is that the backpressure is reduced. It’s serviced by a non-dealer Honda specialist – not the dealer, and just in case, the original exhaust can easily be bolted back in place.

    So, from the cat back, they replaced the stock system with 2-inch tubing, with a Series 50 Flowmaster muffler and a chromed megaphone tip. That eliminated the stock resonator (a small but restrictive muffler) as well as the main muffler. The manager recommended the new Series 60 Flowmaster muffler, which is intended specially for “imports,” which I take to mean small displacement four-cylinder cars. I listened to the 60 on his Nissan truck, but thought it too mild. I should have listened inside the vehicle under load and acceleration. My error. So I went for the less restrictive 50. Wow! You just want to wind it up on every start, and I’m convinced it has noticeably more power.

    As to economics, due to the lowered backpressure, Flowmaster claims 10% more horsepower, and 5-10% better gas mileage – so I figure it’ll pay for itself eventually.

    But, right now, it’s a bit too loud inside the vehicle. So I have an appointment for next Wednesday when (for an additional $75) he’ll add a small ”cherry bomb” resonator which, he says, will tone down the sound a bit but retain the “performance” - lowered back pressure, keeping the power and gas mileage gains. Had I installed the 60 in the first place, I’d probably be all set. However, there’s no question in my mind that I won’t get there eventually.
  • gregoryc1gregoryc1 Posts: 766
    Now that you spent all this money on an aftermarket exhaust system, I am just a little curious about your maintenance schedule for this vehicle. How often do you change your engine oil and filter? Do you use a high quality oil and a high quality oil filter? Are you concerned about the interior mechanical condition of the engine? Do you use a "upper cylinder lubricant" to keep the valves and piston rings free? ----or ----Are you just interested in a loud exhaust?
  • I know it says "sedans" but there is no general Civic board.

    Bought a 2002 Civic Coupe EX 5-speed with 28K miles, silver, from Cush Honda Escondido, CA. No certified program. Got the car for $13K, it was listed at $14.9K.

    Cush Acura was great; helpful, courteous, professional, knowledgable. Cush Honda downthe block was also good with the financing, servicing. As a whole, Honda service is horrible. Cush Honda service in Mission Valley is downright rude.

    Have owned, in order, 94 Sentra XE Auto (bought at 86K miles for $4900, sold at 106K miles for $4700), 91 Accord LX Coupe 5-speed (bought at 147K miles for $2600, sold at 202K miles for $1500), 99 Prelude 5-speed (bought at 22K miles for $17500, sold at 74K miles for $12,900), 00 Accord EXL 5-speed (bought at 30K miles for $13500, sold at 62K miles for $12800), and now the 02 Civic.

    The Civic interior is very nice, although I also like the Mazda 3s The Civic has higher quality materials but is not as sporty or modern. Typical simple but nice Honda design. Love the big dials and guages. Good visibility. Center radio controls are a bit high and far, but not a huge problem. But they do get really hot from the sun through the windsheild. Seats are least comfortable of any Honda Ive owned. No remote trunk release, no lighted visors (they should be on the EX), but power sunroof tilt and slide, tweeters in the A-pillars, and lots of storage space. Roomy in all positions for a compact car, big trunk.

    Steering is nice, good weight, decent feedback. Undertired, like all factory Hondas. Ride is decent, rear suspension has much more impact force than the front. Brakes have good feel. Handling is decent, but not as sporty as the Maxda 3. Good ride/handling compromise for the masses. Engine is ok with the 5-speed, power comes on past 4K rpm, smooth, quiet for a cheap car, could be quieter at high rpms. Could definitely use more low end power, although its not bad for a 1.7-liter. Fuel mileage is great. 34 in mixed driving, including a few redline shifts. Close to 40 on highway trips. Could use larger gas tank. Clutch is great, smooth, light, precise, don’t mind having it in traffic. The 6-speed in the TSX and RSX is a bit more precise and mechanically positive.

    Overall, I like the car a lot. It fits well. I am adding a AEM cold air intake, Eibach Pro-Kit lowering springs, and 16” rims with 205/50 tires. Will post later to share the results of those additions.
  • bd21bd21 Posts: 437
    Ouch, 13K for a 3 year old Civic! For not much more than $1000 you could have bought a new 2004 Civic EX with a 5 speed. I hope it was Cherry.
  • Paying $13000 for a used Civic EX coupe saved him $3000 over a new 2004 Civic EX coupe (with no options added). I'm not sure of Edmund's price for a used 3-year-old Civic, but Edmund's new price is $16000.

    Of course, these are True Market Value (TMV) prices and I used my own zipcode in the Southeastern USA to arrive at the new Civic price. Your mileage, er dollars, may vary.
  • bd21bd21 Posts: 437
    You were closer than I was. I was using figures from when I bought my Civic earlier this year. I paid $700 under invoice. I thought the coupe was less than it is, so he saved about $2,300 on a 3 year old car. It's a personal decision, but I would have gone for a new one if I could have afforded the extra money.
  • Since it's kind of slow here (compared with the Future Odyssey forum), I'll say that I had quite a pleasant test drive of an '04 EX this weekend. My wife okayed my testing a CRV (which she'd let me buy on the spot) and a Civic. We're trying to find a solution to two needs:

    (1) our 15-year-old is in Driver's Ed at High School and he's supposed to get a number of hours driving in. We have two 5-speeds, and he's slowly learning how to modulate the clutch pedal (very unsuccessfully).

    (2) if we replace my '99 Accord with an automatic, it would be a bonus if we had the occassonal storage capacity of a hatchback or wagon. My wife sees a lot of Home Depot / Lowe's soil, mulch and potted plants filling up the back of the CRV. I see a couple mtn. bikes filling the same space on weekends.

    So after taking a CRV out, I had a fun time winding the EX up along some twisty little roads. Much more fun than the CRV.

    (Wishing for a 5-door Civic or a compact-sized Scion xA.)
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    Check out the Si, this is as close as you can get to a 5 door Civic sold in UK. Although it is a 3 door, it is very roomy, and very peppy. Most are sold at or near invoice. Most people don't like the styling nor the fact that there is no optional auto. All it took for me is one test drive and I was sold.
  • Thanks, blueiedgod. The auto trans is a must-have. I have a couple boys that are a couple years away from learning to drive. So I'm anxious to get away from teaching clutch again.

    I wonder how many Civics would've sold if they'd made a "regular" version of the Si--same high-MPG engine as the sedan and offering an auto trans.

    Next year, when the Jazz/Fit arrives, it will probably take care of any need for a 5-door Civic, at least in Honda's thinking. Too bad...
  • In my opinion, everyone should know how to drive a manual tranny even if they are becoming extinct. The Si is actually very easy to learn to drive on
  • I thought about getting a new 04 Civic EX also. Edmunds TMV on my car was 12800, so 13 isnt too far off. The TMV on a new one, same zip code, color, etc, was around 15900. It is just about 3 years old, but its build date was feb 02, it was in mint condition, and it still has8 months left on the warranty. Maybe not the best deal, but not too bad either.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    I agree with annony, everyone should know how to drive stick, unless they have a medical condition. Anyone can "point and shoot," but to be connected with the car, to be involved is something that most people these days don't posess or want to even think about it. They are too wrapped up in their own world that they have hard time paying attention to the road. By driving manual, one is forced to monitor vheicle's engine and speed. I remember a few months back someone posted that they were driving overheated car without noticing and were pissed that Honda would not cover it under warranty. This was a prime example that the person was not paying attention at all.

    Teaching a kid to drive stick on a brand new car is not a good idea. Get a $500 junker to teach and then graduate to newer car, but still, not the brand new Si. Maybe after 5 years of driving junkers, your sons can try the new car, which will be 5 years old by then.
  • I have my 1998 Civic DX for sale in the newspaper.

    No calls so far...I thought that the phone would be ringing off the hook. I used KBB to price it, and mentioned in the ad that the car has 1 owner with all maint records. It has 93k miles, auto , a/c, newer tires & brakes & I am asking $5,000.

    Thanks in advance for your thoughts-
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,744
    Well...

    The bad? It's a DX. Most folks want the extras.

    The high miles aren't helping you a bit.

    On the good side, it has A/C and automatic and you have it priced fairly.

    Be patient, it should sell quickly. a lot of "back to school" buyers out there now.
  • My 2000 honda civic lx 5 speed seems to be making weird noises everytime I hit 2000 rpms in 1,2 and 3rd gear. Any idea on what might be wrong?
  • moparbadmoparbad Posts: 3,842
    $14,500 is the current price for a new 2 door 5sd Civic EX. A new 4 door EX automatic is $15,950.
    If you want to pay $16K that Edmunds states as TMV I'll happily accept the $1500 difference!

    $14K for a used 2 door EX is no bargain at all.
  • When I run the Edmunds New Car price calculator on a 2004 Civic EX 2-door coupe, with a 5-speed manual transmission, I come out to $15,892 (TMV). MSRP is $17350 and Invoice is $15900.

    I don't add any options (Edmunds doesn't seem to let me, anyway), I pick Taffeta White for color, and plug in 35758 as my zip code.

    So if chillenhonda bought his 2002 (?) Civic EX 2-door coupe for $13,000, he saved about $3000 over a new Civic at TMV.

    I'm not sure where the "current price" of $14,500 comes from.
  • I was thinking the same thing about back to school. Got two calls today, one wanted a standard & the other asked a lot about scratches & dents. He might call back if his son is interested.

    Maybe more will call once the Sunday paper comes out.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,728
    You might try one or more of the Internet car selling services also. Some of them let you place an ad for as little as $5. Lots of people look on the Web nowadays instead of the newspaper for cars.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    Put it in http://www.carsdirect.com used car section. I have heard good things about it. Also, the type of paper you put it in makes a difference. But, internet should be your next approach. You may want to try ebaying the car as well. Just be ware of the scams where people will send you a check for more than the price and ask you to wire the difference back.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    There is a "Sell Your Car" link on the left side of the page that's worth investigating, as well. :)
  • mcap56mcap56 Posts: 48
    I also agree with the stick statement. I drive in NYC and am often stuck in a bit of traffic. I was about to get an automatic. However, I am a much better, more connected safer driver with a 5 spd. My mind wanders too much with an auto. I think a lot of others out there have the same problem.

    I will say though, that the civic clutch, although very smooth, is a bit of a pain to operate. The wheel well seems to force your left foot over to the middle more than is comfortable. Anyone else have this issue?
  • moparbadmoparbad Posts: 3,842
    The pricing quoted in my earlier post ($14,500) is advertised and verified pricing (via phone to make sure there is no catch) at Grand Honda in Chicago area.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    I have an Si, so I can not comment on the wheel well issue. But, I find it easier to modulate speed in stop and go with a manual than auto. With auto, you have to switch from gas to brake to do a 5 mph crawl. With a 5 spd, 5 mph crawl is a piece of cake, as you only modulating the gas and if the cars stop completely, you just clutch, using your other foot. Rather than taking the same right foot of the gas to place it on the brake pedal.
    For all "traffic impared" "bumper-to-bumper" does not really mean you have to ride the bumper of the car infront of you. Leave some room to coast and you will see the benefits of manual over auto.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,728
    With any automatic I've ever owned, I could modulate a crawl using only the brake, except for going up a steep incline. It's the constant clutching in stop-and-go traffic that I find tiring (and wearing on the clutch). I prefer a stick shift and my daily driver is a 5-speed, but if I had to navigate stop-and-go traffic every day I would go with an automatic.
  • So far, I'm going with the theory that if I can get him used to operating the clutch pedal, then we'll be over the hump. Our high school has quite a lot of parking lot and service roads wrapping around the building. There's some uphill, but mostly level areas.

    What has worked was to have him plant his heel and then pull the toes backward, letting out the pedal. Much smoother for him, but not perfect...yet.

    Out on city streets, I'm concerned that there'll be a lot of situations where he'll have to drop into neutral and then get into gear, like approaching an intersection with a yield or with blocked visibility. So know what you can do with the pedal, and getting into neutral, even temporarily, is my goal.

    Unless, as my wife wants, we go out and spend a fortune on a CR-V (which, as she says, is the perfect vehicle for her).

    Where's that Civic 5-door?
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,744
    When they ask a lot obout scratches on a cheap used car, these people usually aren't that serious. I wouldn't worry. that Civic should sell in a hurry.
  • Received 2 calls today...college kids that do not currently own a car but want one. I took the car to one person for a test drive. After that experience I thought about just trading it in tomorrow.

    My worry is that some college kid will be calling me a month down the road if there is some problem & I don't want the head ache.

    I lve in NYS & as far as I know, the rule used to be that a private party could sell as car as is & not have to worry about the buyer expecting any kind of warranty ( express or implied ).

    I don;t know if you can shed any light about this...I was gonna call the dealer tomorrow to see if they could give me some advice or a place to get the answer in NYS.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    With any automatic I've ever owned, I could modulate a crawl using only the brake, except for going up a steep incline. It's the constant clutching in stop-and-go traffic that I find tiring (and wearing on the clutch). I prefer a stick shift and my daily driver is a 5-speed, but if I had to navigate stop-and-go traffic every day I would go with an automatic.

    If you keep a little bit of a distance between you and the car infornt of you, you won't have to clutch as often. So, what is the difference between pressing on the clutch or the brake contantly? I see none. Honda clutch is not any more stiffer than brakes, so the effort is almost equal. At least with the clutch, you get both legs/feet working instead of just the right one.
  • blueiedgodblueiedgod Posts: 2,797
    Where's that Civic 5-door?
    The upcoming Honda Stream.
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