Honda Civic 2005 and earlier

crazygrrrl

You say it as if it's a bad thing.

The Civic IS a chick car, and so is the Elantra, and the Miata, and the Corolla, and the Sentra, and the Neon...

Just about EVERY car is a chick car, especially in the economy car class.

About the only exceptions are low slung sports cars and exotics like Corvettes, Vipers, Ferraris, and McLarens. Reason: they're kinda hard to get into and out of when you're wearing a skirt.

I have seen lots of women driving SUV's. Not just the RAV4's but also Denalis, Escallades, Sequoias, Xterras, Trailblazers, Excursions, and even Navigators.

Auto manufacturers have to market to women as well as men because women make up 50% of the buying force. Any manufacturer that markets just to men are not going to do well in sales volume.

According to the recent issue of Motor Trend, the Civic was the best selling compact car in 2002. The market share was 14%. It didn't mention how many of those buyers were women. (If anyone knows, please post it.)

The Elantra is a better car for certain people, but not for the 14% who bought Civics. Honda must be doing something right to attract the largest market share.

anonymousposts

The Civic was 4th .. not exactly far back. I will admit that this generation Civic is not perfect. However, were I buying an economy car it would have to be the Civic. The Civic has more headroom, more rear seat leg room, and a larger trunk. The Hyundai is wider so I guess that suits the expanding waistlines of some Americans a little better.

Corolla: nice design BUT it has a rear axle and my 6'6 boyfriend can't drive it because the seat track is too short.

Neon: It's a Neon. Enough said. Poor safety, poor reliability, no power rear windows?

Protege: Had one. Great driving car BUT the engine sucked.

Elantra: It's a Hyundai. I do not like the exterior or interior styling. MPG isn't that great, and Hyundai can't seem to decide how many HP it really has.

The Civic is MUCH safer than the Elantra according to www.hwy-safety.org.com.

http://www.hwysafety.org/vehicle_ratings/ce/html/0103.htm

http://www.hwysafety.org/vehicle_ratings/ce/html/00031.htm

And I always hear people say how much cheaper the Elantra is. While that may be somewhat true initiall over the long-term it's just not the case.

carsdirect.com prices used, edmunds trade values.

03 Civic LX: $14000
1.9% financing = $244 p/ month for 60 months
Total payments: $14640
trade value after 5 years/60,000 miles: $5982
Total cost: $8658

03 Elantra GLS: $11,200 with $1500 rebate (can't be used with special rates)
5.9% financing: $216 p/ month for 60 months
Total payments: $12,960
trade value after 5 years/60,000 miles: $3465
Total cost: $9495

So the Civic that costs $2800 more initially is actually $837 cheaper after 5 years. So why should you buy the Elantra? Safety? Obviously not. Reliability? To early to say. Guess that's why the Civic is the top-selling compact.

backy

The Civic LX was fifth I believe in C/Ds comparo, behind Protege, Elantra, Corolla, and Focus. I lost my magazine (darn kids!) so I can't cofirm that, but I'm pretty sure of it--maybe someone who has the mag can verify. Also I remember distinctly C/D's summary of the Civic LX: "Something new from Honda: a loser." Ouch.

As far as interior room, the Civic is very good for a compact, but I sat in both yesterday and any differences are pretty minor. Both are roomy up front and in back. The Civic's trunk is a bit bigger, but if I'd have to give up the Elantra's rear-end styling to get it (one of its best features IMO) then I'll pass.

The Corolla is a fine car, IMO the best compact overall, EXCEPT for the problem with seating position that you mentioned. I'm only 5'10" and I can't find a comfortable seating position. I guess it was designed to be a chick car--for short chicks at that. ;-)

Hyundai has figured out the hp on the Elantra: it's 135 (BTW, that's 20 more than on the Civic LX). FWIW, I was at the local auto show yesterday and asked a VW rep why the 1.8T is rated at 170 hp on the Passat and 180 on the Jetta. I asked him if it is exactly the same engine. He said it is, and the difference is due to "marketing" reason. Okayyyyy...

On your pricing comparison, I think to be fair you need to: 1) reduce the price of the Elantra. Since you are using a rock-bottom price on the Civic (I've never seen a '03 LX advertised for under $14k), you should do so with the Elantra. I frequently see the base Elantra GLS (which I assume you are pricing here) advertised for between $9850 and $10,500, after rebate and including destination. Also, I assume you added side airbags to the Civic LX, to make the cars more comparable. 2) All the Hyundai dealers in my area are offering 3.9% financing for 60 months, even with the rebate. So please knock the rate down a couple of points on the Elantra. 3) Please add cost of non-warranty repairs to the Civic for the final 2 years and 24,000 miles. I have no idea what those would be, but the probabilities say they will be non-zero. How does it figure now?

I don't know how you can take one test and make the blanket statement that the Civic is "much safer." What we can say for a fact is that the Civic has much better IIHS frontal offset crash test results than the Elantra. But NHTSA results were comparable. The Elantra has standard side air bags (note how they helped keep the dummy's head away from the B pillar in the tests) and available ABS; the LX's side air bags are optional and ABS is not available.

As far as "it's a Hyundai", I did the door-slam test yesterday at the auto show. The Civic's door closed with a tinny, rattly sound. The Elantra's closed with a solid "thunk". Shoot, even the Accent's door shut more solidly than the Civic's. The seat fabric on the LX seemed cheap to me. The Elantra's fabric seemed more expensive and durable. One more thing I noticed yesterday: an Elantra GT with moonroof, leather, 15" alloys, side airbags, six-speaker stereo, and lots of other goodies cost hundreds less (MSRP) than the base Civic LX.

Why buy an Elantra over a Civic? With the Civic, you get better mpg, better resale percentages (offset by higher price), and a better IIHS crash test score. If you go with the Elantra you will have a car that has better performance (per reviews and personal experience), a more comfortable ride (per reviews and personal experience), more equipment (especially in GT trim), and a more comfortable driving position (personal experience). You also have the option of a 4-door hatchback configuration if you want it. So it depends on what your preferences are.

anonymousposts

I was using the prices off of www.carsdirect.com because anyone can access those numbers and purchase the car for the prices listed on their website. So I'll stick with my prices.

Even at 3.9% and including the $1500 rebate the Civic is $222 cheaper. Probably more than enough to cover any repairs the Civic will need before the 5 year/60,000 mile mark.

As for performance, most people buying Elantra, Civics, Corollas, or Proteges aren't doing so to be the fastest car on the road. If they were they would buy a Civic EX which only has 8 HP less than what Hyundai claims the Elantra now has. And if they want to go even faster they can opt for aftermarket parts, a market in which Hyundai is almost non-existent.

As for the safety ... the Nhtsa results combined with the iihs results would lead one to believe the Civic is the safer vehicle .. with or without what you say are "tinny" doors.

"The seat fabric on the LX seemed cheap to me. The Elantra's fabric seemed more expensive and durable."

Again, those are opinions.

backy

Just like "I do not like the exterior or interior styling" is an opinion (yours, re Elantra). There are several more of your opinions in the previous post. How come it's OK to freely give your opinions here but you pick at other people for stating their opinions? For example, your statement that people looking for the fastest car on the road would by a Civic EX. Are you making a statement of fact there (I hope not, because the EX is clearly not the fastest car on the road, even in the compact class) or stating an opinion?

BTW, my note about "tinny" doors was related to quality, not safety. The Civic's doors clearly do the job as far as crash tests.

FWIW, there is quite an aftermarket for Hyundais, particularly the Tiburon.

Can I take by your previous post that you believe that the Civic and Elantra 5-year costs are a wash, assuming repair costs on the Civic are no more than $222?

pat

Uhhh, backy and ap -- this conversation belongs in Honda Civic vs. Hyundai Elantra. Why don't you meet each other there.

Thanks.

anonymousposts

I said that people wanting the fastest car would opt for a Civic EX not a Civic LX.

vocus

I thought the Elantra had 140? Did they drop it again?!?

The 1.8T in the VW is rated at 170 in the Passat because it's tuned with a different computer. Anyone who knows anything about VWs will tell you that.

lovetosavegas

No, it is not a bad thing. Also it is true that all the cars in economy class have mostly inoffensive styling, but for some reason different cars appeal more to one gender or another. In case of Civic, Honda marketing admitted that they were primarily targeting a professional women, if so they probably studied certain taste and created a styling according to their studies plus made the car resemble the last model. I think that SUVs are much more masculine looking, though a lot of women like it and therefore drive it. I guess the same goes for Civic as well, that it may appeal to some men:)
Now, the fact that 2002 Civic sold the most cars in its class doesn't say that it is a better car then the others, especially when a respectable car magazine calls it a 'looser'. The fact that its platform is less advanced and cheaper then Civic 2000 model would explain it. Another example would be ~100 thousand americans have 401K plans or some other form of equities. For the last 2-3 years almost all of the equities had negative returns.
IMO the big reason that Civic sold a lot of cars last year is its reputation for the last 10 years.
Any forthcoming predictions will be speculative at this point.

crazygrrrl

What does "FWIW" mean?

I got the Car & Driver magazine (Nov 2002 issue) and here's the top 10:

10. Kia Spectra LS
9. Suzuki Aerio GS
8. Nissan Sentra GXE
7 & 6 (tie) Dodge Neon SXT,
(tie) Mitsubishi Lancer O-Z Racing Rally Edition
5. Honda Civic LX
4. Ford Focus SE
3. Toyota Corolla LE
2. Hyundai Elantra GLS
1. Mazda Portege LX

I don't know if this could have changed the outcome of the Civic any, but it looks like C&D tested a 2002 or 2001 Civic? The picture taken from the rear of the car shows solid red tail lights. On the 2003 model, the back up lights are white. On the earlier models, the back up lights are pinkish.

backy

I suggested many a post ago that we take this to the Honda Civic vs. Hyundai Elantra thread. No one took me up on that suggestion then. I agree, this board is for Civic stuff--but when you get Honda sales reps starting threads on Civics vs. Hyundais, well, anything can happen. ;-)

vocus--where have you been, Paul?? Hyundai announced months ago that they overstated hp on several models, affecting the Elantra to the tune of 5 hp. I won't go into detail here because this is the Civic board ;-) and it was covered ad nauseum in the various Hyundai boards at the time. A quick search should get you all the details, if you want them.

lovetosavegas, that's very interesting! But I think another reason so many people buy Civics is that it has no major vices. Most small cars have some major flaw that takes it off a buyer's list. For some, it's poor fuel economy; for others, it's lack of quality; for others, it's lack of interior room, or lack of safety, or odd styling, or a poor seating position. The Civic doesn't have any of those vices. It's a well-rounded package that offends few people and satisfies many.

crazygrrl, "FWIW" means "for what it's worth." It's one of those many abbreviations often used in emails and forums like this to avoid having to type. Also good point on the C/D comparo. Given the lead times on mags like C/D, it's likely they tested '02 models (except for the Corolla, an early-introduction '03 model). There were some small trim improvements in the '03 Civic that could have helped its score a bit, but IMO the editors had more basic issues with the car. Also, this would explain why they chose to test the Elantra GLS instead of the Elantra GT sedan, which was new for '03 and probably not available when they ran their tests.

vocus

Sorry, thought the HP wars affected the older cars, not the Elantra.

lngtonge18

Your value equation comparison is taking into account that the average consumer would be approved for the best interest rates available. This is not the case, especially in the economy car class. Move those interest rates up to 7.9-9.9 and watch the Civic's higher price kill its value.

anonymousposts

lngtonge: But that's a double-edged sword. If one gets a higher rate on the Civic they would also get a higher rate on any other car they buy. Therefore, the Civics higher interest rate would only make a marginal, if any, difference.

lngtonge18

What I meant was, the higher price of the Civic would cause more interest charges at the same interest rate, thus reducing its value. You were comparing the lowest rate possible on the Civic to a higher rate on the Elantra. The average consumer will not be approved for the best rates. Do a comparison with the prices provided and a 7.9% rate. The large price difference up front between the 2 cars will make a noticeable difference when interest is taken into account.

anonymousposts

Assuming you got the Civic LX for $14000 and the Elantra GLS for $11200 @ 7.9% the Civic would cost $900 more at trade-in time. So the Civic has made up a $3000 difference intially and narrowed it down to $900. Factor in the fact that the Civic's insurance will probably be less and should you decide to sell the car private party you will have a much easier time selling the Civic.

lngtonge18

Ah, but you just proved the point many have been trying to make for years....Honda's famed higher resale value does NOT even out its initial higher selling price. You proved the Civic will still end up costing $900 more after 5 years of ownership even though it is worth more. And that's not even taking into account possible repairs. Example: the distributor in my mom's former 92 Accord failed at the 85k mark. This occured around the 5 year mark we are talking about. The normal consumer would have had to pay $400-600 to fix it whereas the Hyundai would have been free. By the way, Honda's are usually more expensive to insure, particularly in larger cities due to the high theft rate and expensive repair costs.

Am I saying the Elantra is a better car? No. But I do believe it is a better overall value and the owner saves money on the purchase.

anonymousposts

Once all factors are taken into account according to intellichoice the Civic LX sedan costs $3800 less over 5 years than the average econo-car while the Hyundai costs $800 above average. As for insurance, according to intellichoice the Elantra will cost $700 more than the Civic, it will use $450 more in fuel, and cost $500 more to maintain. And even with it's longer warranty (it would be under warranty for the entire 5 years) it only undercuts the Civic by $70 in repair costs. So in the end, according to intellichoice, the Elantra will cost you $2700 more than a Civic LX.

pat

Okey-dokey. The hijacking of this dedicated Civic discussion is over.

To anyone who is interested, please continue the Elantra vs Civic comments in Honda Civic vs. Hyundai Elantra.

That is the logical place for this discussion. Folks who are interested in the comparison should be able to find the comments in the logical place.

And folks who are interested in talking about the Civic without the "vs. Elantra" argument should be able to find that here.

I guess I'm going to have to start removing posts if we can't stick to the subject.

dunworth

Wow is this board ever quiet.

I have a 2003 Galapagos Green Civic which I love. My only problems so far have been a few dashboard creaks which the dealer has mostly addressed. Other I absolutely love this car.

Any other new owners out there?

jcomesana

We just bought a 2003 Civic LX manual, and we love it so far.

There is something that is by no means a problem (on the contrary), but that took a little for us to get used to: when it is stopped, the engine is so silent that you might think it stalled.

gbriank

I bought my Civic last month.... Was driving through the neighborhood and rolled over an empty trash bag. I looked through the rear view and didn't see anything come out the back. So I stopped only to find it had started to melt up against the exhaust manifold! Burning smell and other nastiness that I have never seen before. Took it to the dealership to have it removed. $88 to clean it up! I guess it is better than having a fire.....

dunworth

Thanks. It is good to meet some new Civic owners.

jcomesana, You are right that the engine is quiet. My Civic is also a manual. I think the best manual gearbox on any econ car in the business. I also have a 2002 Corolla (auto)which is even quieter, but not as much fun to drive as the Civic. My most resent cars prior to these two were a 2001 Saturn SL and an 1998 Hyundai Elantra - both good cars but the added refinement in the Civic and Corolla is a welcome surprise.

GBrianK Sorry to hear about the near fire on your new car. I bought my car at the end of 2002. A week or two later, we had the mother of all cold snaps here in Toronto. On one sunny cold day, I decided to wash my dirty (and salty car)with a bucket of warm soapy water - bad idea. It went down to -32C with the wind chill shortly after and my driver's side mirror cracked.

imidazol97

The plastic probably wouldn't have caught
fire. It just melts and sticks. You probably
could have just shut down the engine, pulled
away the plastic, then let the part that
stuck to the exhaust melt away. It would have
decomposed after a few hot minutes and been
gone along with the smell.

dunworth

The Civic seems to come with a lot more colours this year than before - actually a lot more than what is on offer for the new Accord. They even have this nice light blue which I have never seen before. The dealership where I bought my car actually had the nice green one I ended up buying. I always choose in the interior colour first (I preferred the cream/beige interior) and then select the exterior I like best.

The Civic and the more expensive Acura 1.7EL verion(Canada only) is the best selling car up here, but most are silver or that light sand colour. I think the car looks good in any colour.

Anyone else buy a Civic in one of the newer colours?

gbriank

Yeah imidazol97, you're probably right....but I didn't want to take a chance. Does it ever stink (plastic smell)! Not to mention, there is still some of the bag still on the manifold, after three days of driving it (tough little sucker!). "Don't get mad, get Glad!" LOL..... :-)

Dunworth: Howdy from Texas! A friend of mine lives up in your neck of the woods.... He was telling me about the famous Canadian winters. Aren't your malls underground? Back to cars.... I have a 2003 Civic EX 5-speed (assembled in Canada) with Side Impact Airbags and I must say I was mighty impressed. Having owned a Saab 9-3 SE with the notchy shifter, it was refreshing to drive a car with very smooth shifting action and clutch. Not many folks drive "stick" here in the States, but it is definitely the way to go with small displacement engines. At my last fill-up, I am clearing 34.1 MPG in mixed driving. Pretty good considering my lead foot!

imidazol97

Do you mean it's still smelling???
You might try fingernail polish remover on the bag on the manifold to decompose it --
 ONLY ON A COLD ENGINE!!!! Other solvents
that might break down the plastic could be liquid sandpaper for prepping walls before
repainting or just plain acetone from a paint store -- that might be strong enough to do it. I assume it's in a place you can reach
without getting a rag against other parts.
Good luck.

dunworth

So not all Texans drive trucks exclusively. We have been hearing all about Texans and their vehicles now that Toyota is building a big pickup truck plant down there. We saw a few of the new Toyota Tundras that they will build down there at the autoshow and they are really really nice.

Trucks are not as popular in my province because of the high cost of fuel - about CDN$ 3.00 per US gallon these days. Also about half of the province lives around the City of Toronto where a Civic is a better choice than a truck. Trucks are more popular in Alberta which is kind of like a Canadian Texas with all the oil and gas, and of course the big annual Calgary stampede.

Speaking of underground shopping malls we do actually have one under downtown Toronto which I use to get to work when it is too cold outside. It has several miles of corridors.

So is your Civic the one with the 127 Hp engine?, How is it on really hot days with the ac blasting. I bought my car in winter so I have not had a chance to try the ac yet. Oddly, we do get very hot summers up here - it was over 40 C sometimes last year. My car has the smaller 115 hp motor (the only motor available in the Civic sedan over here). We have to buy the Canada-only Acura 1.7EL version to get the 127 hp engine. Both are really nice small cars.

What colour did you get?

mdriver

As you would expect the A/C reduces power quite significantly to the point of being just adequate. Actually, the 115HP would probably be better at handling the A/C load as that engine produces more torque at lower rpm.

The A/C itself is not as good as it used to be (as are many of this generation's attributes). Part of the reason is that the fan/blower output is so feeble. High speed on the Civic seems to be equivalent to about the 2nd or 3rd (out of 4) setting on many other vehicles. Indeed, there seems to be little output until you reach almost 3/4 of max. Honda seems to have a history of building inadequate A/C systems and the newest Civic is no exception.

gbriank

Thanks for the advice, imidazol97. I'll try the acetone first and see what happens. I'm guessing this was one of those drum liners I hit. Heavy plastic bags suck! The plastic odor is finally subsiding, but it is still there.

Dunworth:
Nope, not every Texan drives an SUV or a pickup. Although if you came to visit, you might think otherwise. I can't remember the statics for the state, but it is darn near 1 out of every three vehicles are some form of pickup. It is very unnerving driving down the highway and have one cut you off. I must say, SUV/pickup drivers have gotten safer here. The rash of explosive tires had a real impact down here. I drive on one of the major Dallas highways everyday and have seen three people die in SUV's here. Tire blew out and it flipped. The roof on those things can't support the weight of the vehicle, so it crushes like a tin can.

As for the Civic, I own the 127 hp EX version in Satin Silver w/grey interior. We had a few days last week in the eighties (27 degrees C) and the AC worked just fine. The average temp here in Dallas during summer months is 36 degrees C. Some of our hottest days have exceeded 50 degrees C. If we have any, i'll let you know how the car holds out.

anonymousposts

mdriver: Having had a 93 Civic, a 96 Civic, a 98 Civic and a 02 Civic I have to say that the AC in the 02 Civic was WAY better than the AC in the 96-98 Civic. But if you want ice cold AC you would be better off with a GM or Ford.

dunworth

I have noticed that you do have to use the 3/4 setting on the Civic to get adequate heat in the winter. I am assuming the ac is the same. Our '02 Corolla is much better in this respect. I had two Saturns and two Hyundais previously which both had excellent heaters/fans.

GBrianK: You have the Civic we get as the Acura then. That silver is a nice colour and the most popular up here.

That must have been awful to witness that carnage. I heard (NHTSA) Dr Runge's speech in January that he gave on SUV rollovers where he shared some scary statistics. I am not a huge fan of SUVs in general although I like the looks of the CR-V, Pilot, Rav4s as well as the 4Runner. The new Ford/Lincoln ones look good too - gorgeous interiors! Despite living in a cold country, I have never found any need for a 4wd vehicle. FWD and good driving habits are all I have needed and I have been driving for 20 years up here. Heck I have not even had ABS on my cars

anonymousposts:You have owned basically the last three generations. What do you like about the current one versus the others and what was better on the old ones. Which one is best overall?

anonymousposts

We also had a 89 Civic wagon, so I guess we have had the last 4 ... gosh we buy too many cars ....

89 Civic
Pros: low dash, great highway ride, nearly indestructable
Cons: No sunroof available, kinda slow with the AC on.

93 Civic EX coupe:
Pros: great ride, great interior, quick once the revs got above 3500, great gas mileage, reliable, great shifter
Cons: Could barely get out of a snails way with more than 2 people in the car and the AC on.

96 & 98 Civic EX sedan:
Pros: Great ride, great gas mileage, great interior, reliable, smooth engine, great shifter
Cons: AC is weak when stopped or in traffic

00 SI:
Pros: Handled like a champ, engine was incredible at 4000+ RPM, adjustable seats, still got decent gas mileage
Cons: Have to rev it to get max power

02 SI:
Pros: great seating position, great shifter, great engine, great highway car
Cons: revs pretty high on the highway, although still smooth

I think the Civics throughout the years have had smooth, efficient engines, great manual transmissions, and great gas mileage in common. I would put the 93 version at the top of the list simply because of what it was for it's time. It had sunroof, cruise, soft-touch dash materials, 4-wheel disc brakes, and even today the design looks fresh. The newer Civic has gotten bigger and safer and even more efficient but admittedly it is starting to lose that sporting flair the Civics before it had. Probably has something to do with the slightly higher dash and loss of the front/rear wishbones.

However, with that said I would still buy a Civic if I had to have a NEW car under $17,000. I have several issues that I can't overlook with cars it competes with. But overall I would rather have a 93-95 or a 99-00.

dunworth

Great overview - thanks.

I have driven every generation of Civic except the original two, although this is the first one I have ever owned. Each of them have been as you say smooth and very good cars for their day.

The only other car I like as much as my Civic is our Corolla although it is a totally opposite car (softer ride, quieter, but not as engaging to drive), but quality, reliability and economy of operation are comparable.

sandman46

You are lucky to be able to change cars so often. The wife and $'s only let me do this every 8-9 years or so. And I have a real passion for cars, been that way since I was 4 or 5!

The Sandman :-)

anonymousposts

Corolla's are nice as well, especially the new ones. But my fiance does not fit in the new Corolla and as unhappy as I am with Honda going to struts/wishbone I would be even unhappier with struts/axle. That said, the new Corolla is a classy car with a nice interior. Haven't driven one yet though.

We are lucky enough to work for a car dealer so we usually get deals that are too good to turn down. We have settled down for a while now I think.....

crazygrrrl

I'm thinking about getting some splash guards for my 2003 Civic Sedan.

Does anyone know how much the parts cost and how much a dealer typically charge to have them installed? I got a dealer quote of $200 for parts and installation, which I think is too high.

Would it be easy or difficult to install a set on my own? Any drilling required?

Also, for those of you who already have splash guards on your cars, do the splash guards scratch or rub the paint where the edges of the mudflaps touch the outside of the fender?

Thanks!

gbriank

crazygrrrl: No drilling is required to install the mud flaps. Go to www.handa-accessories.com and check out their prices and installation guides. I have installed the mud flaps on my 1999 Accord and the hardest part were the rear ones. Make sure to get a short screw driver and have the car washed before hand. Shouldn't take more than 30 minutes to install.

TO ALL OUT THERE IN HONDA LAND, the horrid cries you hear Saturday night were eminating from my house. A MAJOR hailstorm came through North Dallas and made my seven week old Civic look like a piece of swiss cheese. Hurts even more so since I had the windows tinted earlier the same day. I'll keep everyone posted on how much the repairs will cost. Does anyone have a tissue?

rivertown

Hail! Bummer! Watching that come down on my new car would drive me nuts. I sure hope the fix goes well.

I'm glad you had the handa-accessories.com link for crazygrrrl. I'd have said the same thing, if I'd had the link.
Crazygrrrl, "what he said."

pat

If you haven't already, check with your insurance company....

So sorry to hear.

dunworth

So sorry about your car - I feel your pain.

It sounds like you do not keep your car in a fully enclosed garage. My parents lived in Baton Rouge LA for 5 years and their garage was closed on three sides but open on one (into a partial court yard). One of their cars were damaged by flying debris during a bad storm -I think it was a write-off.

It must have been a bad weekend all over since the Toronto area got pummeled with a two-day long ice storm. My car got stuck in the driveway and I needed a bag of salt to melt enough ice to get it into the driveway (most of us in the Toronto area have small yards and driveways). Fortunately I was able to put my car inside before I had ice damage. Actually most of the damage happens as ice chunks melt off of big trees and come crashing down on things. No doubt lots of damaged cars here as well.

Again my condolences.

micweb

I had to take my new 2003 Civic in for a C pillar rattle. Service was excellent, much better than what I would have expected in a mid-grade car. Much better than Ford or Dodge.... Detroit claims the number of defects in cars is pretty comparable these days. I tend to agree with them, base on recent ownership...but service at American dealers is a nightmare.

dunworth

Saturn dealers are the exception - they are superb (I have owned two).

That said, it really depends on the dealer.
My father got excellent service from the Ford dealer where he bought his Mercury and drove it for 190,000 Km. Sadly Mercury products are no longer sold here in Canada (except the Grand Marquis).

I have also owned two Hyundais as well from a local dealer here in greater Toronto and received excellent service. My current Honda and Toyota dealers are also very good. On the other hand my Volvo dealer was appalling and I vowed never to buy another European car due to the service. Local VW are also really really bad judging by the number of bad experiences my friends are having (too bad I love their cars).

I have had a number of dashboard rattles on my 03 Civic which the dealer is still trying to resolve. They have fixed most of them and fortunately it is nothing major.

kukareka

Car manual doesn't recommend RR. However, I've seen lots of cars with that. I guess it's not a problem to carry light staff such as skies or surfboard, etc.
Does anyone have a roof rack on Civic 02? What is the haviest load it can hold?
Thank you!

gbriank

Still waiting to get into the body shop.... backup of over a week.

Hey, what are y'all getting economy wise?

dunworth

I bought my car in winter and drive about 60% in the city. I have been averaging between 35-40 mpg (imperial gallon) which works out to 27 to 33 in US gallons. We have had the coldest winter here in Toronto in recent memory. I have about 7,000 km/ 4,400 miles on my car.

I have gotten 47 mpg imperial/39 mpg US gallon on a straight highway run on a day that it averaged around 0C or 32F with my wife and 5 year old son in the car. This is what the 115 hp engine with 5 speed is rated for in Canada. I expect fuel economy to improve dramatically as it warms up here. As a rule I am very gentle with my car. On my previous Saturn, a 2001 SL, I could get 56 mpg imperial/46 US on the highway which is 3 mpg higher than it was rated.

trigred

Just got a new 2003 Civic 4 door LX with automatic. The last Honda I owned before this was a 1976 CVCC. At that time it was unusual to see a Honda on the road. Times obviously have changed. One question--sticker says green tinted glass--there is no tinting on top of windshield. Is this the way they come now? Also what problems are common to this years Civic Sedan? Hope I enjoy this one as much as the old one. Love it so far.

eternalblue

my 02 automatic sedan does about 75% city driving and I astonishingly get around 30-33mpg (on an automatic!!!).

My first tank of gas after purchasing the car got 37mpg - and occasionally I do highway trips (500 mi roundtrip) and sometimes get up to 40mpg on those.

I'm in awe over the gas mileage on this car!!!

dave210

I have to say I almost do 100% city driving and as a result, I get about 27-28 mpg in the summer, and 24 mpg in the winter when I drive my son's car.

Now I drive at about 75-80 on the highway so that may affect my millage somewhat but the best I've ever gotten on a long road trip was 34 mpg.

Is my city millage lower because of varying city conditions and is Honda just optimistic with their high mpg estimate, or do I have a small problem? I mean the sticker says I should get 32 mpg in the city and I've never gotten above 28.4 mpg in the two years we've had it and that 28 mpg has been like a three time thing so even that isn't easily attainable.

My Acura MDX says I should get 17 in the city, I get 16-something according to the computer. My Avalon says I should get 23 in the city, I get 21-22 something.

So my other cars are much closer to the actual city milage estimate on the sticker than my son's Civic. Just wondering if I should mention this when it goes in for it's 15,000 mile serivice. He's now at college...

trigred

Just got my 03 civic sedan 2 weeks ago. Before I need maint. would like to know if the 10k miles between oil changes they recommend is realistic? Is there a special break-in oil Honda uses that I would not want to take out too soon? Love these economical wheels so far.