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Honda Odyssey vs Dodge/Chrysler minivans

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Comments

  • badgerfanbadgerfan Posts: 1,564
    DC must have built 99 of every 100 minivans problem free and put all the problems into yours. My '96 has been fine, so I guess I got one of the other 99. :)
  • fezofezo Posts: 9,328
    Well, one thing it isn't is consistent with Consumer Reports. The DC vans, as well as the Villager did not fare that well in CR. Sienna did. Odyssey did.

    I have no idea how big the sample is for J.D.Powers and at times their reports seem way out of whack but take them for what they are - one consumer satisfaction survey.
  • steverstever YooperlandPosts: 39,984
    "no idea how big the sample is"

    Seems like this is a chronic complaint about the CR reliability ratings too. JD Power at least has a "national" base to select from rather than just subscribers.

    But I'm still mad at CR for steering me wrong on a canoe purchase in 1973 :-)

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  • uga91uga91 Metro AtlantaPosts: 1,065
    I have noticed on many boards here in TH that if any brand of car other than Honda wins an award or does well on a survey or something, the results are always trashed for one reason or another. Here it is [Well, one thing it isn't is consistent with Consumer Reports. The DC vans, as well as the Villager did not fare that well in CR. Sienna did. Odyssey did]. Had Odyssey been number one, then this poster would not have said [I have no idea how big the sample is for J.D.Powers and at times their reports seem way out of whack but take them for what they are - one consumer satisfaction survey.] We would have been told that this is yet another way to prove that Honda is the best. Typical. Go Plymouth!
  • crkeehncrkeehn Posts: 513
    When the Japanese first started importing the minipickups into the United States, CR reviewed one and tore it apart. They couldn't understand why anyone in their right mind would want a small pickup which couldn't carry a full sheet of plywood.
  • fezofezo Posts: 9,328
    Hey, enjoy your Plymouth.

    J.D. Powers receives their funding from domestic automakers; Consumer Reports from subscribers. Who do I think has more objectivity?

    I won't deny being a big Honda fan. Not only do they work well but after two years the van still holds almost all of its value. But ya know, if you count red circles in GR the Toyota actually did better. Heck, if back in the 02 model year Toyota offered a Sienna the size of the current one I;d likely have bought it.

    Go Plymouth? Already gone I fear. Yeah, I know - you can buy the same thing but call it a Chrysler or Dodge.
  • steverstever YooperlandPosts: 39,984
    Chrysler/Dodge is a German company!

    Sounds like JD Power will study anything for anyone, for a price:

    "Today, the firm’s clients include numerous Fortune 500 firms, as well as virtually every vehicle manufacturer and importer conducting business in the U.S. market."

    (Actually it sounds like they do the studies and then sell the results).

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  • andrewtran71andrewtran71 Posts: 840
    German company---sure Steve, but what kind of engine do they use? German engine? Or the same old Chrysler/Dodge engine?
  • uga91uga91 Metro AtlantaPosts: 1,065
    I don't have a Plymouth because your later statement was correct--Plymouth went away years ago. Even the models sold today as Dodge/Chryslers are not like the Plymouths of then as the 2001 re-engineering/redesign changed all that.

    None of this changes the fact that you never would have come here and said the first word about sample size or conflicting studies had Honda been number 1. You know it--don't deny it. If any brand other than Honda wins an award or does well, it does not count because we all know that no other car company in the world can come even close to matching the automotive excellence that is Honda, right? The same people that say this report means nothing for DC vans will also be the first people to say that this report proves Kia is junk because they came in last. Even though the Kia lineup of today does not match the lineup in question in this report. Either this report proves something or it does not.

    Finally, I like JD Power over Consumer Reports because CR uses subscriber input. JD Power uses buyers input. The difference is that when I bought my van last spring, I got a survey to fill out and it will show in the next report. I do not subscribe to CR so they do not care how I feel about my van. My feelings will not be included in the next CR car issue. I'm sure that most people who subscribe to CR believe everything it says. So, many subscribers will buy what they recommend and then report back that it is a great car. If you buy something they do not recommend and anything at all breaks, you will blast the car in the survey. How can cars like the Grand Am be listed as "Insufficient Data" when they sell hundreds of thousands of them each year? Because not that many read CR, that's why.
  • What is really remarkable about the survey was the U.S. carmakers--Ford and GMC anyway--have show great gains in quality and reliability. They still trail Toyota and Honda of course, but they have not only surpassed but continue to extend their leads on the European carmakers. Sooner or later people perceptions are going to catch up to reality and people are going to stop paying premiums for European cars like Volvo, BMW and especially Mercedes. Mercedes actually had the lowest or one of the lowest reliability ratings! To own a Mercedes indicates that one has more money than common sense!
  • fezofezo Posts: 9,328
    In the CR reliabilty Honda came out #2 to Toyota and that didn't bother me.

    Like what you like - doen't bother me.

    On te European cars note - you don't buy them for reliability - at least I hope you wouldn't. Loads of folks liek how the drive and the ones I've driven have indeed been nice but the price added to the cost of maintenence and repair has kept me away.
  • uga91uga91 Metro AtlantaPosts: 1,065
    Did you Honda folks notice where the Accord ranked in long term reliability? It was not in the top 3. What?? The 2000 Accord beaten by the Chevrolet Malibu, Plymouth Breeze and Chrysler Cirrus? Well, that proves that this whole report is wrong, huh? Even years after its death, Plymouth is kicking (rear end)!
  • tomtomtomtomtomtom Posts: 491
    a few years ago, you can find Mitsubishi engine in a Chrysler/Dodge/Plymouth/Eagle product, ie. Laser, Talon, Stealth, Colt and now I think the engine used in the MB SLK is in the Crossfire.

    Some people will only buy car has a Japanese brand badge on it. I believe the Eclipse outsold all the Laser and Talon combined even though they are exactly the same. The same case as the 3000GT outsold the Stealth. And now, some people would pay more to get a Toyota Matrix instead of a Pontiac Vibe.
  • dtownfbdtownfb Posts: 2,915
    Accord competes is in Premium midsize category not the entry level mid size car.
  • fezofezo Posts: 9,328
    Some people will only buy car has a Japanese brand badge on it. I believe the Eclipse outsold all the Laser and Talon combined even though they are exactly the same. The same case as the 3000GT outsold the Stealth. And now, some people would pay more to get a Toyota Matrix instead of a Pontiac Vibe.

    And those people are either nuts or not paying attention.

    Lonng term reliability of Accord? Again, if you look at CR Accord is much better than average while your other three there are average. This is no big crime to be average.

    In JD Powers - I played on their site to compare all 4 head to head and got a very odd result. It rated teh Breeze ahead of the Cirrus on feature and accessory quality even though a Breeze is a deconted Cirrus. They claim to have no data on mechanical reliability on anything but the Malibu. If there is any sample size at all, how can this be? These are high volume cars. There's all sorts of numbers that don't add up. They give the best in class to the Plymouth despite the Chrysler being the same car with more features.

    Odd stuff. I did compare the vans yesterday on that and tehy gace the awards to Ody and Sienna despite what they said in that release. I'm confused.

    As far as kicking butt, I really don't care. Not like most folks buy a minivan to kick butt. I'm very happy and comfortable with my choice.
  • andrewtran71andrewtran71 Posts: 840
    Buying brand name--isn't that how most of us are if the price is right?
    I remember the Corolla was the same as a Prism, except the Corolla was made in the Toyota plant and Prism was made in a Chevy plant. And I recall the Corolla had better reliability records, which was interesting. I guess Toyota has has better controls in the manufacturing process and Chevy doesn't.
    The reason a lot of us buy "Japanese" is because they have a very long history of excellent reliability. You could buy the most reliable car the Lexus LS430 and if you are unlucky, it might break down before your Chrysler Town and Country.
    However, chances are, the T&C will have problems first according to JD Powers and CR.
    Which would I trust more? Hmmm. I would trust them both equally. None are perfect.
  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 7,742
    Actually Corolla's and Novas/Prisms were made side by side in a plant in in Fremont, CA starting in 1986. That same plant also makes Toyota trucks.

    http://www.autointell.com/asian_companies/toyota_motor/toyota-nao- - - -mfg.htm

    http://www.nummi.com

    Today they still make the Corolla and Tacoma as well as the Pontiac Vibe. Further, they build the Toyota Voltz which is exported to Japan. And to top it off, they are a UAW plant.

    I'm no chest beater for the UAW and the Big 3 at all, but if an American plant using American labor can build a competitive vehicle, so be it. Difference between Corolla and Prism reliability numbers should be perception only - I doubt the quality standards changed just because they affixed a different label to the car.
  • tomtomtomtomtomtom Posts: 491
    Andrew, it is like the third time you have posted incorrect information, I think TH only allows the max of 5 times :-) I hope you didn't buy and pay more for a Toyota Corolla instead of the Prism or a Honda Passport and found out it really was a Isuzu.
  • andrewtran71andrewtran71 Posts: 840
    If I post 100% correct infos, there would not be enough good heated debates and stuff :-)
    I just realized myself that the Prism was a Geo Prism, not Chey :-) My bad.
    Yeah, actually I did buy the Corolla over the Prism, but I did not buy any SUVs.
    After the Corolla, I went with a Camry.
    Then I went with the Avalon.
    Then I gave that to my wife and bought a Lexus.
    Then I bought the Odyssey.
    But interesting info by robr2. If these cars only differ in the names, then it has to be pure perception in terms of reliability. Interesting.
  • andrewtran71andrewtran71 Posts: 840
    If D/C can gets good numbers on reliability as Toyota and Honda, I probably still wouldn't buy one just because I don't like they way they look outside and inside. One quick example, Honda and Toyota has a nice 7" NAV screen while D/C has a 4 inch NAV screen? Just doen't make any sense to me.
This discussion has been closed.