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Honda Odyssey vs Dodge/Chrysler minivans

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Comments

  • dustykdustyk Posts: 2,931
    I think DaimlerChrysler should have kept the Plymouth brand as the entry level instead of diluting the Chrysler brand with a low priced model. And they should have also kept a full featured model under the Chrysler brand name. Let Dodge have the mid-priced versions and a sport model, but keep the deep luxury models to the Chrysler nameplate.

    Dusty
  • hansiennahansienna Posts: 2,312
    AGREE 100 %. When I was young, a Chrysler was a very upscale brand in the same strata as Cadillac and Lincoln. ;)
    My 02 T&C LX is in reality a well equipped Plymouth Grand Voyager SE. For me, it is nice to be driving a CHRYSLER even though I know it is really a Plymouth. Dropping Voyager watered down Chrysler T&C even more.
    The PT Cruiser and Sebring should also be Plymouth. ( I think DaimlerChrysler was more stupid to drop Plymouth than GM was to drop Oldsmobile and Ford was to drop the Edsel).
    It is difficult to think of the Odyssey as a luxury vehicle since Honda made so many cheap little econo boxes for many years. However, the Odyssey EX-L looks more luxurious inside to me than the Chrysler T&C Limited. Sad that DaimlerChrysler cheapens the Chrysler label while Honda upgrades Honda vehicles. :blush:
  • sebring95sebring95 Posts: 3,225
    I think Plymouth was the right move. But they should have left the entry/mid-range to Dodge only, and then left Chrysler as the Lincoln/Cadillac competitor. As-is, DC has nothing until Mercedes which is not a domestic luxury brand competitor (IMHO). They could have had a high-end Town & Country that they could fairly put a domestic luxury brand name on. As-is, the Odyssey/Sienna are both smooth/refined enough to get the Acura/Lexus moniker with just some small upgrades. It appears the folks not price conscience tend to lean toward the Honda/Toyota brands because they bring more luxury features/refinement to the table. I suppose that's alright if DC is content to just sell on price, but everyone knows that's not what they REALLY want to do. They're just stuck doing it to move inventory.

    It will be curious to see which way DC goes on the next minivan redesign. I think it's clear the minivan has started to garner a lot more attention in the semi-upscale market. I read in Automotive News that Ford has no intention of developing a class-leading minivan. They basically admitted they're content selling mediocre minivans because they don't feel there's any future in minivans. Probably true if it has a Ford label on it, the brand doesn't exactly draw a paying crowd beyond the rental counters. Chrysler certainly has Ford and GM by a long-shot.
  • Don't think I ever got a response to my question (probably because all the bickering :) ) so I'll re-post. Since my original email, I've found the Odyssey would actually cost me a few hundred more than MSRP where I can get whatever deal Chrysler is currently offering so the difference between the two in cost will be substantially more than most of you in the States. The cost is not as big as a issue to me as being happy, but would those who prefer to Honda still take one if you were faced with the same dilemma?

    I'm currently in the market for a new minivan and the Ody and T&C are my top choices. I love the conveniences & price offered by the T&C, but being passionate about cars, I prefer the performance and perceived quality of the Ody. There are some interesting and very passionate discussions here and I've found most the info useful, but my situation is a little different than most. I'm currently living overseas where I am only able to get about $1K (if that) off of MSRP on the Odyssey, but I can get at least EP on the T&C (if not more). From my calculations, an Ody EX-L with DVD, would cost me at least $3-5K more than a similarly equipped T&C Touring, especially with the new Signature series being offered. Is this difference in cost similar to what most of you are weighing when deciding between the two? After a few years, is the Honda going to be worth that much more than the T&C?
  • aaron_taaron_t Posts: 301
    I believe you have the general consensus: Ody & Sienna are better than DCX twins, but at a price premium. In my case, the price delta was more like $6500 to buy. Each person has their own price premium based on local markets, equipment and who they know. So, is the extra money worth it? Each owner on here has evaluated that and so should all future buyers.

    The Signature Series T&C is a great package. I prefer skipping the Nav unit, so the DCX SXT Special Edition would be an even better package (same equipment as T&C Sig minus Nav).
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    . The cost is not as big as a issue to me as being happy, but would those who prefer to Honda still take one if you were faced with the same dilemma?

    I am very happy with my Odyssey. I paid a few grand more for it because bottom line it had what I wanted. VSC, VCM, good looking interior with the flexability I needed, and the handling/acceleration/braking advantages. DCX Stow and go is the most flexable interior. I like the seat comfort better and also the DVD screen size. The resale on the van should be better than the DCX vans. There are a few problems I keep see popping up on the Odyssey (brake grinding and wind noise from the windshield area) I don't have ethier but the 2006 may be better. Looks like the brake issue is due to the brake pads. Don't think they have released a new material yet.

    From my calculations, an Ody EX-L with DVD, would cost me at least $3-5K more than a similarly equipped T&C Touring, especially with the new Signature series being offered. Is this difference in cost similar to what most of you are weighing when deciding between the two? After a few years, is the Honda going to be worth that much more than the T&C?

    Residuals are very hard to figure out I looked at 4 sources and 3 of them had the price differance lower than the resale differance another KBB had the price differance higher than the resale differance. The honda should resale pretty close to the differance in price after 5 years @ 15K per year. So you save 4 K up front and get it back at resale. Now after about 7 year and 100K miles the DCX van is probably a better bet cost wise since both will be very depreciated. I hope you've spent so time in both since much of a car buying experience is subjective. My idea of handling/seat comfort/looks/functionality may be diferant from yours. Enjoy your car buying experience! Take your time if you can the 2006 Ody will come down probably after the new year.
  • sebring95sebring95 Posts: 3,225
    I once got lured into buying something that wasn't EXACTLY what I wanted, simply because it was a screaming deal. It cost me a lot more in the end because I traded after less than 12 months. I've spent a lot of time in DC vans, my mother has had several, we had one many years ago, and I've had a couple rentals in the last year or so. The performance and overall tight feeling the Ody has made it well worth the money in my book. Sure, there are a few items that are better in one over the other, but it's hard to discount the driving feel of the Ody. There are tons and tons (look at the sales numbers) of folks that wouldn't notice (or care about) the difference between an T&C and an M5 bimmer in terms of response, tightness, etc. Some folks turn the radio on and just drive obliviously from point a to b and wouldn't notice if a helicopter landed on the roof. I'm not one of those people and I enjoy owning the better handling/driving/feeling vehicle, even if it's something mundane like a minivan.

    The cost difference for me was only about $2500. I gave the T&C a look; the NAV was not worth $1 and was something I wanted on this vehicle. Maybe they've improved that for '06 but the '05 was a joke. Other than that, there wasn't anything glaring that made the T&C a bad choice. But they feel very different out on the road. The Sienna is similar really, I would think those would be more comparable if someone really liked the driving dynamics of either. I really can't put a cost on where I would have picked the T&C over the Ody. I'm not sure I would have bought it at any price difference, simply because I'm not a bargain shopper and the NAV was a total disappointment in the T&C. And I've learned my lesson buying something that's a bargain but not exactly what I want.
  • hayneldanhayneldan Posts: 657
    Anyone considering buying a Odyssey should read the Edmunds Forum titled "Honda Odyssey Owners problems and solutions" all 5,644 posts. Posts now up to 5715 as of today 10/18
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    OHhh come on hayneldan, I hope you don't mean this in a negative manner? You might alienate other posters who want to talk about the pretty color of their Honda, or how thick the steering wheel is.

    It's obvious Honda owners are just much more computer literate, hence the 5715 posts! Whereas most DCX owners are probably too busy taking their inferior products back to the dealership, and have no time to post!!! It's that simple!

    See, the "VS" stuff is bad news!!!!!
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Do all Chrysler owners carpool to the Sarcasm society together, or go seperately?

    Any word on when the next gen DCX vans will be released? Any words on engine size/hp, interior trim levels?

    It'd really be a contender if they put the 3.5 out of the Pacifica/300 series, but that may cost too much. Maybe at least a top line option for Limited models? It would be a greatly improved competitor for the Odyssey, and blow the current Sienna/Freestar/GM vans out of the water (all under 220 hp)
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    Do all Chrysler owners carpool to the Sarcasm society together, or go seperately?

    Now I don't speak for every DCX owner, but in Detroit (The Motor City) the Sarcasm Society holds sessions at the dealership while our vehicles are being completely rebuilt to go another 1000 miles before something else breaks!
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    Anyone considering buying a Odyssey should read the Edmunds Forum titled "Honda Odyssey Owners problems and solutions" all 5,644 posts. Posts now up to 5715 as of today 10/18

    Did you see the recent post from 05 Ody owner, who's getting an 06 Sienna? Of course this means every 05 Ody owner will be trading in on a Sienna!! (at least that's what I'll be accused of implying anyways, so might as well go on record actually typing it).

    Remind me to send that guy a xmas card!!!
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    Did you see the recent post from 05 Ody owner, who's getting an 06 Sienna? Of course this means every 05 Ody owner will be trading in on a Sienna!! (at least that's what I'll be accused of implying anyways, so might as well go on record actually typing it).

    Sorry Honda guys, but I smell a rat - no, not you socalawd!!! I went back to check this Hondaconvert guy's recent postings....and find it odd that an actual Honda owner would be posting soo much in the Toyota areas?????
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    Sorry Honda guys, but I smell a rat - no, not you socalawd!!! I went back to check this Hondaconvert guy's recent postings....and find it odd that an actual Honda owner would be posting soo much in the Toyota areas?????

    No I think he's on the up and up. I remember him looking for a car. He was having doubts before he bought! So after a few issues(I think it was door noise?) I think he has buyers remorse. But he's still not buying a DCX so don't get that card yet!!
  • hansiennahansienna Posts: 2,312
    One son bought NEW 2001 Ody EX while his brother got a used 2002 GC Sport. After the long comparison, I bought a used 2002 T&C LX clone of the GC Sport.
    DC minivans are quieter, smoother riding, more comfort items while the Ody has the "Magic Seat".
    Fast forward: 2006 GC SXT interior looks cheaper than Ody interior but is more attractive exterior than Ody, both have separately controlled temperature for driver and front passenger, both have 60/40 split fold into the floor 3rd row, both have cast wheels, both have power sliding doors both sides...but DC power doors are much better designed than the Ody. The Ody has power windows that go up and down while GC SXT has power rear side windows that open and close. (Sienna has both).
    The Ody has a 5 speed AT while GC SXT has only 4 speed. Ody theoretically should provide better gas mileage but in the real world, my 02 T&C LX has provided much better gas mileage than my son's 01 Ody EX.
    GC SXT also has a nice, complete overhead console with compass/outside temperature and trip computer. Ody EX has outside temp indicator.
    Ody EX will cost $ 4,000 MORE than the GC SXT from dealers in my area.

    Just checked Edmund's Used Car pricing of 2002 Odd EX and 2002 T&C LX for my zip code and 37,000 miles. T&C LX trade in $10,794 vs Odd EX $16,125. At 4 years age, the Odd trade in difference is $ 5331. I paid $14,000 15 months ago which is $3,206 depreciation. The original owner paid just under $24,000 while a buyer of a new 2002 Odd EX would have paid about $28,000.

    According to Edmunds, an Odyssey depreciates fewer dollars at 4 years of age than a DaimlerChysler minivan. If kept forever, the DC minivan will depreciate less since it cost less to purchase new. :blush:
  • socalawdsocalawd Posts: 542
    Anyone considering buying a Odyssey should read the Edmunds Forum titled "Honda Odyssey Owners problems and solutions" all 5,644 posts. Posts now up to 5715 as of today 10/18

    Yep thats a fine waste of time. Most aren't even problems. There are like 10(see cabin filter/ phil griffin) of the last 20 about air cabin replacement, now is that really a problem??. Some are post involving dennisctc(33 posts), hansienna(8),hayneldan(6), socalawd(12) and I don't even have a issue!! There are also 11062 post about buying price and experience. That compares to 6060 for Toyota and 77 posts for DCX vans. I gues noone cares if you buy a DCX van!
  • hansiennahansienna Posts: 2,312
    Waste of time but one does not need to read very far to read about the 2005 Odyssey Transmission failure. (Althought the fact that the Odyssey driver's door unlatched in the side impact crash test has not been widely discussed). ;)
  • hayneldanhayneldan Posts: 657
    minicoopercat asked for advice. If you ask for advice you will get it. If I were to consider an Odyssey I sure would want to know what problems owners have run into. I resent the remarks about DCX owners not being able to or caring to post about their problems.That is really a poor assumption. I read both problem forums, and only post when someone deliberately slams DCX vans. Maybe the Odyssey owners should read both too. My answer to why are there so many pricing posts on the Odyssey prices paid forum is not many Honda dealers want to deal, so if you want a Honda you have to search to find the "best" price. DCX dealers are willing to discount so you don't have to chase all over a city or states to get a "fair" price. Value is in the mind of the purchaser.
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    The Ody has power windows that go up and down while GC SXT has power rear side windows that open and close. (Sienna has both).

    I wonder how many people actually use the sliding door windows on the Honda/Mazda/Toyota? Seems with windows open and passengers in place, it's be windy and noisy?
  • dennisctcdennisctc Posts: 1,168
    Some are post involving dennisctc(33 posts), hansienna(8),hayneldan(6), socalawd(12) and I don't even have a issue!! There are also 11062 post about buying price and experience. That compares to 6060 for Toyota and 77 posts for DCX vans. I gues noone cares if you buy a DCX van!

    How did you find 33 posts for me in the "Honda Ody Owners Problem" area?
This discussion has been closed.