Honda Odyssey vs Dodge/Chrysler minivans

isellhondas

Laugh all you like. I'll give you a couple of examples of what I meant.

A few years ago some Accords were recalled for something to do with a wiring harness that needed to have some kind of a clip installed. Without that clip, the harness **could** rub against something which **could** cause a short which **could** lead to the car stalling which **could** cause an accident.

I think the fix was to install the clip and inspect the harness for wear caused by rubbing. I asked a couple of our techs who had done the fix on, literally dozens of Accords just how many harneses were found to be bad. ZERO!

Years ago I owned an Oldsmobile that got recalled for a power seat switch that **could** overheat and under certain conditions **could** start a fire. Being a busy person, I ignored the recall and several notices until one day they CALLED me and stressed the urgency. When I took it in for the ten minute fix, the Service Advisor told me they had replaced a ton of these and had yet to see a problem.

My comments have NOTHING to do with me being a sslaesperson. Please get that through your head if you can and "smugness" has nothing to do with this either.

My point was, the vast majority of recalls are pretty trivial in nature and were it not for lawyers eager to pounce on any problem would probably not exist.

And, yeah, the goal of carmakers is obviously not to have any recalls. They are a pain to deal with and cause great expense along with fear and concern by customers.

Maybe you are capable of building a very complex product consisting of parts from many sources and never having the slightest problem?

dennisctc

Laugh all you like. I'll give you a couple of examples of what I meant.

I'm laughing because you're spinning more than the Clinton Whitehouse, next you'll be saying "it depends on the meaning of RECALL" or something!!!!

No matter how minor a recall may be, you don't want ANY! Seeing that DCX probably builds twice as many Minivans as Honda and has 1/3 the recalls (and DCX's is minor vs Honda's) is quite good for DCX!!!

Maybe you are capable of building a very complex product consisting of parts from many sources and never having the slightest problem?

My company actually builds wiring harnesses and fuse boxes (PDCs) for ALL Automotive OEMs. My minivan's PDC is built by my company, along with the Engine Control I/O, Tranny I/O, Batter Terminals and Rear Seat Entertainment system. I know all about automotive PPAPs, quality standards, USCar etc... Everyone has issues.

What you're missing is the attitude over the past few weeks on the greatness of Honda and never having to return it to the dealer!!! Haven't seen DAE chime in yet????

isellhondas

Of course, car manufactures don't want any recalls! Maybe Honda is just fussier or more concerned than Chrysler...I don't know. No "spin" here either.

ANY make or model is subject to a recall. Recalls don't equate to the longivity of a car either. Never have I said in these forums that DC builds "bad" cars...they don't. Still, I'll take a 200,000 mile Honda over a 100,000 mile Chrysler any day.

I'm sure your opinion may vary and that's fine too.

And, personally I think DAE go's over the top. Don't lump me with him/her.

dennisctc

Of course, car manufactures don't want any recalls! Maybe Honda is just fussier or more concerned than Chrysler...I don't know. No "spin" here either.

Maybe Honda has poorer quality than Chrysler...I don't know. No "spin" here either.

Maybe Chrysler is just fussier or more concerned than Honda about their minivans before they leaves the factory.

marine2

ANY make or model is subject to a recall. Recalls don't equate to the longivity of a car either. Never have I said in these forums that DC builds "bad" cars...they don't. Still, I'll take a 200,000 mile Honda over a 100,000 mile Chrysler any day.


I see that's another slight of Chrysler vans. Let me remind you Isell, of the many thousands of first generation Chrysler minivans still on the road. I am sure they are way over 200,000 by now. Honda makes great minivans, but they're still to new to show the longevity that Chrysler minivans have shown.

marine2

For those that still think Chrysler vans are slow

Instrumented test numbers aren't typically the first item of concern when discussing minivans, but we feel it's important to mention just how quick the T&C feels for a minivan. At the track, it broke the front tires loose when punched from a dead stop, and the automatic transmission delivered positive upshifts above 5,000 rpm. Shorter, tighter gear ratios would provide even quicker acceleration

Unlike rattles from other minivans, Edmond says,

Past reviews on Edmunds.com mention the spotty unreliability of Chrysler and Dodge minivans, but Chrysler seems to have made some strides forward in this area, especially if build quality is any indication of the vans' long-term durability. Our test minivan in particular was tight as a drum.

fish8

My family also bought a new T&C Touring model. I haven't noticed any rust (but haven't really looked). Maybe tonight when I get home I will take a look and see if any rust is present. Which parts look like they have rust on them?

BTW: We have almost 1300 miles on it now.

masterpaul1

In our 2001 DGC EX, we have the 3.8L V6 with 215 HP. I'm the primary driver and when starting from a stand still, I have to press easily on the gas peddle to prevent wheel spins on the pavement because of the low end torque. (This is with the overdrive on). Also, both front tires are only a few years old with very little tread wear. :shades:

dustyk

Just a guess but I'll bet it's the exhaust pipes. They will collect a layer of rust on the outer surfaces and it will build up over time. I've heard this complaint before, but I have never heard of a stainless steel exhaust system component on any Chrysler built car or truck that needed replacement because of a rust through. In fact a friend of mine has a '90 Plymouth Acclaim that still has the original exhaust system.

Dusty

dennisctc

I found some parts has rust on them.
in fact they are very rusted and looks almost like yellow.

What parts specifically??? All suspension pieces get rusty/dirty.

gonavybeatarmy

Davidsun -

My business is overhauling ships, so am very familiar with corrosion issues. All uncoated (i.e. unpainted or non-powdercoated) carbon steel exposed to the elements will develop a surface layer of oxidation (rust). Very typical of components such as leaf springs, etc. This is not necessarily bad. Actually, the surface layer of 'rust', once developed, tends to protect the metal underneath from further destructive elements such as salt. Several factors, such as constant excessive heat and/or an unusual electrolytic reaction cell can cause localized pitting corrosion of these components, and possible eventual failure.

Obviously, the ideal solution would be to paint everything (although underbody paint wouldn't last), or make eveything out of stainless steel or other very expensive, corrosion-resistant alloys. But the tradeoff is cost.

The bottom line is this: the carbon steel components that are devloping a surface layer of rust very likely have enough 'thickness' to well outlast the expected life of the vehicle. It is very unlikely you have a real problem.

Hope this helps.

badgerfan

I have experience dating back to the first generation Caravans, and can attest that they have been very good from a corrosion resistance standpoint. DC minivans were among the first to adapt two side galvanizing for virtually all their body sheet metal. Our 1985 while rust on some suspension and other components under the van, never did rust on the visible surfaces in 12 years of highly salted winter roads. Our 1996 is still looking like new after 9 years as well.

Interesting anecdote on our 1985 was that after about ten years or so, it developed a rattle at idle that would go away quickly as the engine warmed up. It turned out that one of the exhaust system pipe clamps had rusted so much that it was hanging loose. Once the engine warmed up, the exhaust pipe expanded enough to " tighten up" the loose clamp.

About three dollars for the new exhaust pipe clamp and a hack saw to cut off the old clamp was all we ever spent on the exhaust system over twelve years!

marine2

There is a rust warrantee on the van. If it's showing some, take it to the dealer and have it removed and have it painted. It shouldn't be any big deal.

jipster

Hows acceleration on the high end? Saying needing to go from 45mph on up...highway merging...passing.

marine2

If you read previous postings I have put up about other testers driving the Dodge GC, you will see they say there is plenty of power for highway merging,( that was mentioned) You can also see in the quarter mile, the Dodge is only less than a second behind the high tech engine Honda has. Not bad for an old engine and four speed tranny.

I'm out of here for awhile

jipster

Where ya going marine2?

masterpaul wrote of the ease of peeling out from a dead stop with his Dodge GC . I thought maybe he had added ram air or something....or has a bad oil leak. :sick:
I don't really pay a whole lot of attention to seconds in the quarter mile etc. More interested in real world experiences. Thanks.

masterpaul1

Passing is very good above 45 mph. The fastest I've driven so far is about 80 mph to which passing was no problem. (I was only going this fast to keep up with traffic). Also, when cruising at 80 mph with the overdrive on, the RPM's are between 2200 and 2300. (Not bad for an old push rod engine.) If I'm not mistaken, the new Ody, has about the same RPM's in this range as our 3.8L V6. Correct me if I'm wrong.

masterpaul1

"masterpaul wrote of the ease of peeling out from a dead stop with his Dodge DC . I thought maybe he had added ram air or something.... or has a bad oil leak."

No oil leaks or added ram air or something. Daimlerchrysler's 3.8L V6 215 HP engine is well known for their low end high torque. In 2001 when Daimlerchrysler came out with this engine, that's what everybody talked about in their reviews. At that time, I believe it was the biggest engine for a minivan in the market. From what I've read, the high low end torque was to accomodate those that towed trailers or boats. Making it easier to start off from a stop with that added 3000 lbs plus.

davidsun

I am not worry about the rust any more, I went to dealer yesterday they showed me other vans with the same situation, and they will paint it when I do my first maintain.

I think all parts are related to suspension, because they are thick metal connect to tires.

talking about my feeling, my first response after I saw this rust is this car had been dipped in water for some time. that is why I feel very bad before I know the truth.

I don't know why almost all my friends believe that Jappeness car is more reliable than American car, and I don't think they have ever had an American car. I live in SanJose,ca

I really like my Touring, and it is $4000 cheaper than Toyota van with compareble equipment. but if I saw this rust before I bought it, I might miss the chance to post the question here.

I am going to drive my Touring carefully, and see how long can it last.

Thanks again for your reply, I feel happy again now with my Touring.

David

marine2

"The 3.8-liter V6 available for the Grand Caravan delivers strong power. This big V6 is responsive when merging into fast freeway traffic, accelerating from intersections, or passing on two-lane roads."

Enough said about the power of the Chrysler engine?

marine2

I don't know why almost all my friends believe that Jappeness car is more reliable than American car, and I don't think they have ever had an American car. I live in SanJose,ca

For many years they were. But outside of a few models, American cars are on a par with most Japanese cars, Toyota being the exception. They are king of the hill yet. But you are going to pay for that extra quality.

I think where most of the Japanese excell now is, in design more than anything. I think they have some great designers. But I think in most cases, not all, American vehicles can stand toe to toe with many Japanese vehicles in quality.

jipster

Thanks. Didn't realize DGC had such good low end torque and high low end torque. :confuse: Surprised mackacava(sp) hasn't traded in his Ody for one. He enjoys those high spirited minivans from what I've read. Personally I couldn't tell the difference when driving both(Ody vs DGC). I've yet to see a minivan with ram air...but it's only a matter of time. Mac probably get the first one off the line.

marine2

I think Mac is putting people on a lot. No one buys a minivan for speed. You want it to be able to keep up with the crowd and Honda does a good job at that. But even though the Dodge is not quite as fast, it's far from being a dog. A manivan is for hauling people, things and for comfort. They do a pretty good job of all of that.

hansienna

But the Ody seems to have more power for passing at speeds above 55 MPH. Haven't tested them for acceleration at speeds above 70 MPH.
The 2005 Ody was quicker accelerating and quieter at low speed accelerating than my 02 T&C LX with 3.3L V6. Another benefit of a 5 speed AT.

badgerfan

"A manivan is for hauling people, things and for comfort."

But what about those people who want a "girlievan"?

Sorry, just couldn't pass up commenting on your typo!

dae

Since DC has THE MOST POWER in reasonably priced sedans: Chrysler 300C and Dodge Charger.

Marketing black magic in action.

You cram a 5.7l monster in some model (even so almost every buyer gets the 250hp V6 - a very decent engine, but far from beeing unique in the segment) and buyers of the rest of your lineup feel all giddy and warm in the pants.

Same with having a slightly better engine in the top-of the line van used in comparisons, not the same good one across the whole lineup.

Not that it is specific to Chrysler in any way.

dae

No one buys a minivan for speed.

Indeed. You buy it for safety that comes from having power in reserve for passing and accident avoidance, and for comfort and safety when you travel on roads that have long climbs.

Such as many roads in California. Almost every long family trip I make involves driving up 7000 vertical ft.

marine2

No one buys a minivan for speed.

Indeed. You buy it for safety that comes from having power in reserve for passing and accident avoidance, and for comfort and safety when you travel on roads that have long climbs.

Such as many roads in California. Almost every long family trip I make involves driving up 7000 vertical ft.

"The 3.8-liter V6 available for the Grand Caravan delivers strong power. This big V6 is responsive when merging into fast freeway traffic, accelerating from intersections, or passing on two-lane roads. The 3.8-liter engine is rated at 215 horsepower and 245 pound-feet of torque and employs a traditional overhead-valve design rather than the more contemporary overhead-cam setup found on many imports. We recommend anyone who regularly carries a heavy load of passengers get the 3.8-liter engine."

" Like the Accord it's based on, the Odyssey gives the feeling that it can be tossed around corners a bit. Taking it up on the offer ruins the illusion, however, mostly because the capsizing feeling that comes with any aggressive turn reminds you of how high you're perched. That, plus too-slow steering, plus the Odyssey's not-so-mini measurements, make mountain runs a nervous affair. It's probably best to be content with the Odyssey's feel in the city, and best to keep it there."

dae

Cherry-picking quotes will not make any difference. Odyssey can run circles around any DC van.

Cold. Hard. Numbers. Any way you slice it, truth is a stubborn thing.

And notice how nobody dared to compare DC vans to a passenger car well know for its great handling.


We recommend anyone who regularly carries a heavy load of passengers get the 3.8-liter engine."

Except it is available only on the top trim levels. Oh - that was the price advantage going out of the window.

macakava

For those of us(Dae and I included) who drive our vehicles energetically like C & D does, the June 2004 C & D minivan comparo using the same 3.8L V6 engine in a DGC described that engine as "gutless and won't cut it" in this group that included the Ody, Sienna and Quest.

However this 3.8L V6 DGC engine would be satisfactory to those whose driving styles are more skewed to that end of the driving spectrum belonging to those "ole retired farts" in Florida communities.

dennisctc

OMG dae lives!!!!

Speaking of hard numbers.....3 recalls in less than a year??? It appears the Odyssey runs back to dealership more often than a DCX Minivan!!

Even with top level trim, the price advantage of the DCX vs. the Honda is considerable!!

Seems some people only want to look at a few select numbers, and ignore others!

marine2

And notice how nobody dared to compare DC vans to a passenger car well know for its great handling

Driving Impressions


These are smooth, quiet vehicles, particularly when measured by minivan standards. Additional sound-deadening measures have been added for 2005 that reduce wind noise. We found carrying on a conversation to be easy and pleasant (though that varied somewhat with whom we were conversing with).

Ride quality is supple and well-controlled on the highway. The rack-and-pinion steering responds nicely and provides good feedback through the steering wheel. The Grand Caravan tracks true at highway speeds, so there's no need for constant, minor steering corrections. Indeed, the Dodge Grand Caravan offers superb driving dynamics. Grand Caravan rides more softly than an SUV, gliding over potholes rather than trying to beat them into submission. It's an excellent choice when transporting passengers on beat up freeways and bumpy urban streets.

marine2

Indeed, after a gentle break-in following owner's manual recommendations, we took the van down Skyline Drive in Virginia, and found that it always had more than enough power to make the ride enjoyable. Passing uphill with a moderately heavy load (two adults, two children, and a surprising amount of baggage) was easy and quick, a testament to the 3.8's torque and the transmission's quick and smooth downshifting. We never seemed to be straining. When you consider that the original, much smaller, four-cylinder minis didn't get this kind of mileage or acceleration, and that even mid-sized SUVs without anywhere near the same space would find it hard to match, the Grand Caravan seems like even more of a bargain. It sells for far less than comparable SUVs, is more convenient, and provides a more enjoyable driving experience as well.

And notice how nobody dared to compare DC vans to a passenger car well know for its great handling

DODGE
Cornering is better than in many cars, and better than most SUVs. The massive minivan can be thrown through sharp turns without losing its composure, yet the driver has a commanding view of the road, and there's plenty of headroom.

Odyssey gives the feeling that it can be tossed around corners a bit. Taking it up on the offer ruins the illusion, however, mostly because the capsizing feeling that comes with any aggressive turn reminds you of how high you're perched. That, plus too-slow steering, plus the Odyssey's not-so-mini measurements, make mountain runs a nervous affair. It's probably best to be content with the Odyssey's feel in the city, and best to keep it there.

dae

Those are better:

Consumer Reports:

Odyssey (rating 91): "Handling is agile and precise, and the ride is supple and steady."
DCG(rating 59): "The Dodge rides well enough with a light load and handles securely, but it shows its limitations on bumpy corners"
I guess you never ride over bumpy corners.

Motor Trend:

Dodge: "But the Caravan has soldiered on with a pushrod V-6 almost as long as Wayne Newton's been using hair dye, and the current 207-horse, 3.8-liter took more than 10.2 seconds to reach 60 mph and an even more painful 5.6 seconds to simulate a 45-to-65-mph passing maneuver in our performance tests. It didn't help that the Dodge still uses a four-speed automatic to Toyota and Honda's more up-to-date and flexible five-speeds. Braking tests showed the Caravan to have the longest stopping distances and the least roadholding ability of the three. Though the Grand Caravan works just fine around town and as an Interstate cruiser, it's now been upstaged by two newer entries."

And that is with an optional "performance" engine.

Toyota Sienna: "Yet, at part throttle, the Sienna feels like it's stuck on flypaper, waking up only when provoked by stomping on the gas pedal. The brakes also seem to require ever increasing pressure to maintain stopping distances and are not confidence-inspiring in stop-and-go traffic or high-g drop-anchor stops. Steering is Camry mushy."

Honda Odyssey: "Despite carrying 200 to 300 pounds more girth than its Dodge and Toyota rivals, the Honda easily bested the other minivans to 60 mph and in the 45-65-mph passing test. And the Odyssey's four-wheel discs halt the seven-seater from 60 mph in a carlike 123 feet."

Car and Driver (in review naming Odyssey best minivan): "Like its predecessor, the latest Odyssey is just about the only vehicle of its kind that we regard as rewarding to drive, and its quality index is higher than ever."

I guess other they regard as not rewarding.

So it is not just numbers. It is every single comparison award out there.

marine2

Honda goes a little faster and stops a little sooner. Just don't take it around any sharp mountain turns. It's best suited for the city.

marine2

Make sure you tie the side doors shut. They seem to open up in crashes.

dennisctc

Car and Driver (in review naming Odyssey best minivan): "Like its predecessor, the latest Odyssey is just about the only vehicle of its kind that we regard as rewarding to drive, and its quality index is higher than ever."

I guess other they regard as not rewarding.

So it is not just numbers. It is every single comparison award out there.

I guess this was written prior to all the recalls (3 serious ones so far) and quality issues? (steering issues, poor gas mileage, power door issues) i.e.."quality index is higher than ever"???

I'm soooo upset here, my minivan isn't as rewarding to drive That's the only reason I bought it in the first place Isn't that the main purpose for buying a minivan???

You can pick and choose "numbers" all day from the auto rags.....some have the performance closer than others, some further apart, but in the end it comes down to these being MINIVANS - hauling families, "stuff" from shopping trips. I have the latest CR here in front of me.....I don't see the quote above DCG(rating 59): "The Dodge rides well enough with a light load and handles securely, but it shows its limitations on bumpy corners" and have never seen CR asign ratings to vehicles??

This number I know this is fact though.....I paid $10k less for DCX vs an equivalent Honda. Ohhh my DCX is missing some things std on Honda, but the Honda is missing some things standard on my DCX. I have had no problems with any of my 3 caravans beyond normal service items.

Best of luck with the Honda, according to the ownership experience just on this site, you'll need it

dustyk

Good point. Despite being able to "run circles" around a Chrysler mini-van, there is something that makes the Chrysler-built versions so much more popular than the Odyssey, and that is perceived value. Most of us common people that are absent huge egos and superiority complexes are not motivated by the mystique of Honda ownership enough to fork down another 10K for something that is as reliable, pleasant to drive, and as viable a people mover as a Dodge or Chrysler.

Dusty

marine2

While many are knocking the age of the Chrysler 3.8 engine and transmission, no one can say it doesn't do the job and do it very well. Almost every article I've read says the DGC has plenty of power for merging into freeway traffic, to passing on hills. Going from Phoenix to Prescot two weeks ago, is almost all up hill with some big mountains to cross. My van had no trouble breezing up them with little to no down shifting.

One only has to read these boards of the people who have 2005 Honda's and 2005 Dodge/Chrysler minivans to see where the biggest and worst complaints are. Even with Chrysler selling more vans, there are very few complaints on their vans. Most of the people that knock them, are people who haven't driven them. Dodge/Chrysler owners aren't complaining like Honda owners. No one that has driven one can say they don't have enough power, that they aren't smooth or quiet. That they aren't as tight as a drum with virtually no rattles at all. That's almost amazing considering what's involved putting in seats that can be stowed under the floor.

fish8

These are MINIVANS people. Who really needs or wants their minivan to go 0-60 in 7.0-7.5 seconds? I really enjoy driving my 2004 Passat because its comfortable and fairly quick. When I drive my wife's 2005 T&C, I have ZERO urge to drive fast. Even if it did have the get up and go of a Ody.

If you like driving your vehicles like they do at C&D(as was stated above), then hop in a sports sedan/coupe and go!!! But, in a minivan? PLEASE!!!!

Our Chrysler van has enough power to safely get us to and from where ever we need to go. But I will say I will be outgunned by the Honda next to me.......but I'll let him waste his gas....

marine2

Our Chrysler van has enough power to safely get us to and from where ever we need to go. But I will say I will be outgunned by the Honda next to me.......but I'll let him waste his gas....

Absolutly. So many Honda owners complain of bad mileage they are getting with their new vans. Maybe it's because of a lead foot. I don't even try to beat anyone from the turning of a red light. I try and drive as if I have an egg under my foot. Keep the RPM down and get as good as gas mileage as I can. But I know if I need to floor it to pass, it's there. I also didn't buy a 2004 Civic for the ride or speed. I buy my vehicles to do the job I want them to do. Both do the job I bought them for, very nicely.

1997montez34

Listen, we're talking about Minivans. Most, but not all, minivans are driven by families with young children. The last thing I would want to do with my infant daughter in the van is test cornering limits or crack off full-throttle acceleration runs. I try to drive safe and smooth.

Yes the Ody is a great van. It should be...it's the most recently designed. One would expect the newest design to be the "best".

BUT the DCX vans have so many nice things about them that the Ody and Sienna don't have for a similar price point, or even at any price. I have never once regretted my decision to get the Dodge. In fact as time passes I like it more.

dennisctc

According to CR, we're talking 1.5 seconds!!! Honda vs. DCX (8.6 vs 10.1). 1.5 sec is not worth thousands of dollars to me!!! My lowly V6 returned 25mpg too!! that's in conjunction with my 4 spd auto!!! She's not even broken in yet....4000 miles only!! I see on the Honda boards people whining like crazy about poor mpg!!!

marine2

Yes the Ody is a great van. It should be...it's the most recently designed. One would expect the newest design to be the "best".

I disagree. I think the Honda is a very good and nice looking van. It should be because it has the latest design, but it's far from being a great van. What makes a minivan a great van, is that it looks nice, does all the things you want it to do and does it better than any other, with little or no big problems. Honda is a good looking van and does a lot of things well, but is far from doing everything it's designed to do and do it without a lot of problems. The complaints on this board concerning gas mileage, rattles, wind noise, doors that won't close right, prove it's not a great minivan. But it is a very good minivan.

socalawd

Hey this is a forum I have alot of iformation about. I owned a 2001 Dodge Caravan for 52 months until I bought a Ody EX-L with RES for $29,500. I configured a 2005 Town&Country and the cars direct price was 28,500 and still no VSC. I bought the Dodge Caravan because they said withe the new design it would score a good in the IIHS offset crash tests also it was very inexpensive. Wow was I surprised that it scored a POOR!!! Seems that the gas tank disengaged from the body and spilled fuel(water). They fixed this but not on mine. Only ones made later!!!Than it only scored a acceptable. The 3.3liter engine was a slow pig and I got 16.5MPG. First tank on the Ody 20MPG. I think people think they'll get 28 MPG causing alot of discontent I will be happy with 20-22MPG. Also on the side test(on the dodge)the door opened. I had 7 non maintenece/recall service trips on this van in 50,000 miles. Ranging from weatherstripping to strut problems to airbag light on. Also the front brkes where bad( replaced at 27,000 miles) my wife drives it and on or last car 1995 intrepid got 50,000 miles before a brake job. The car also felt like it wasn't gonna stop when I applied the brake. Also when getting on the highway I had to really be careful because both accelleration and braking where suspect. The odyssey isn't perfect(no stow and go, no passenger power seat,but the safety good ofset 5 stars ( I know the door on the driver side opened but still it scored 5 stars and I wear my seat belt)all around stardard VSC, Side air bags(Mercedes did a study of there E series with and without and it seems the single vehicle crashes where reduced by 20%+ with the VSC compared to without) IMHO the best way to be safe is to be able to aviod a accident. The dodge braking and lack of acceleration made me afriad for me and my family. We all make choices in our life. The outcome of them is what matters. My choice may be flawed but I'd make it agian with all the information I have now because safety and comfort is what I,m looking for not 0-60 speeds. I think overall I have owned 5 dodges the quaility is better and the reliability will be better too,maybe not by much because dodge is a more mature(been out since 2001/ small update 2004) product and has been much better. Even the famed 41TE which I had to replace at 44,000 miles on my Intrepid seems to be better if only it was smoother shifting.

isellhondas

I really do. People should buy and drive what THEY like and not what someone else thinks they should.

That said...I think a couple of things are being overblown here quite a bit...no big deal, happens in these forums a lot. Trouble is, some people read and believe these words.

First of all, how is there a 10,000 prive difference between comparable DC vans and Odysseys? Take another look and see for yourself.

And to the poster who continues to harp about the recalls he calls major...get over it. Honda simply spotted a POTENTIAL problem and jumped on it. You love to beat this to death it seems.

Finally, consider LONG TERM reliability and LONG TERM resale values. DC vans die at the auctions and Odysseys are in high demand. People are especially afraid of a high mileage DC van. I deal with this on a daily basis it seems as I try to get acceptable bids on DC vans.

Finally, I don't think the 0-60 times mean much to a minivan buyer. Both are more than adequate. Stopping distances are much more important and the Odyssey has a definate edge in that catagory.

dennisctc

First of all, how is there a 10,000 prive difference between comparable DC vans and Odysseys? Take another look and see for yourself.

I am probably an exception....but I got all rebates ($4.5k total), employee price ($4k) and check out the price of a dealer install tow package for a Honda!!! But even at $4500, the DCX van would have been a winner. Compare to the typical Honda attitude of "here's the price, take it or leave it".

And to the poster who continues to harp about the recalls he calls major...get over it. Honda simply spotted a POTENTIAL problem and jumped on it. You love to beat this to death it seems.

That would be ME!! and I'm going to keep pointing this out but since dae wants to just talk certain beneficial numbers and can't comment on 3 recalls, i'll continue to monitor the recalls of both. Sooo Honda, out of the goodness of their heart issued the recalls instead of quietly notifying dealers i.e..service bulletin?? And these "potential" problems aren't minor if you read them....all could result in CRASH! Hardly Minor. You're "recalls are a good thing" spin doesn't sell here.

I don't know what you base your long term reliability on but all 3 DCX vans have been very reliable, with nothing more than normal upkeep. As far as resale value, I'll take the money I save over the Honda, put it in a bank for 4-5 years with interest, add that to my resale value and see who comes out ahead.

According to CR, Honda has a whopping 4ft 60-0 stopping advantage, but the same as the new Uplander tested. It's not like the DCX has no brakes!

socalawd

Well the 2001 Dodge which is really the first year of this version. Had 6 safety recalls. Please inform us when Honda catches up. So far none of these issues have caused a accident . They seem to not look at the smoke Dodge waits for the FIRE!! The 2004 had a power steering line that was rupturing and causing fires/Loss of control. Looks like the recall was for alot of calls better to catch something fast than after you already made a half a million cars. I'm suprised you've had no issues with your Dodge products but hell someones gotta win the lottery. The resale was horrible on the van. Seems that none wanted it. I will be keeping this car for 10+ years so I liked all the features. On the IIHS web site you can find the drivers deaths per 100,000 cars registered. The Odyssey(old model was top of the heap) My Caravan was the middle of the crowd.

isellhondas

ALL Honda dealers have that attitude. I know I don't.

I'm glad you've had such good luck with your Chryslers. When I say long term I'm talking about driving one 150,000-250,000 miles without a bunch of things going wrong. Hondas are vdry good at doing that.

Lastly, if you've even driven 70 MPH on a crowded Calif freeway and had to stop quickly that 4 feet could make a big difference.

dennisctc

Well if you wanna play that game.....go to intellichoice.com and look up the recalls for 1999 Oddy. According to them the 2001 DCX had 3 recalls. The 1999 first year Oddy had 7. I'm really sooo confused here.....we all know that Hondas are so superior???

And you can have "opinions" like waiting for FIRE....but I know Honda denied issues for years. No different than DCX. Honda still doesn't have issues with the 5 spd autos from the last generation do they???