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Subaru Impreza WRX

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Comments

  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I didn't realize the XT6 was so rare. I guess most were just XTs or XT turbos.

    Sway bars make the car corner flatter, but they also reduce the fully independent action of the suspension, and add weight and cost.

    -juice
  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    Yeah they have almost identical bodies so they are often conf00sed. The big difference visually is the 5-lug wheel on the XT6, and fog lights std from the factory.

    -mike
  • corkfishcorkfish Posts: 537
    Name a 4 cylinder collector car. The Mercury Merkur? The 240Z? BMW 2002? All lag significantly behind the value of 6 or 8 cylinder peers.
  • I'd love to have a 1955 Austin-Healey 100S in my garage -- heck, I'd just like to have a garage :)
  • lark6lark6 Posts: 2,565
    Hmm...ever hear of a Porsche 356?

    Ed
  • For a collector car, the real value lies in the rarity and condition of the car, not the motor configuration. The old MG TD comes to mind...the Willys Jeepsters in the post-war years, even cars as recent as the first generation Lotus Esprits.
  • see, someone else posted the same car while i was typing my post...how funny
  • ponmponm Posts: 139
    does it typically take for the turbo to warm up. I know weather effects the turbo, so I would imagine during winter months, a longer time is needed to warm up. I ordered a wagon, but didn't get the turbo gauge so any information anyone has would be appreciated.
  • hazdazhazdaz Posts: 56
    ... has anyone else noticed how 'grabby' the brakes feel in the morning? Its like you barely touch the pedal, and they grab hold pretty darn tight.

    Also, I have to state, that I think the stereo in the WRX (the base stereo anyways) is really bad. I actually ahve noticed in MANY Japanese cars, the stereos are sub-par. I would think that many (most? all?) of the stereo comapnies are Japanese, that the cars from the same country would be fairly good - guess not. I have a huge sub/amp that I had in my old car, that I just threw into the trunk of my WRX. Its not hooked up yet, but I can't believe how little trunk I have left. I could easily say that about 1/2 the trunk is gone (in the old car, It probably barely used 1/4 of the trunk). Atleast now my sister can't ask me to help her move - well I guess she can ASK (nothing stops her from asking), but I can always use that as an excuse.

    Anyways, I ordered the wing for my car today... Hopefully this time this coming Friday it will be installed on the car. ;)
  • Hi,

    New here to the board. I've been strongly considering a WRX as my next car (tho even if I got one, probably wouldn't be til summer), and have got some questions about the WRX (and manual tranmission). Any feedback's appreciated!

    My first and still current car is a Pontiac Sunfire GT. It's an auto, and I've only driven auto cars, so I guess a question I have is (kinda dumb to post it to this forum but ah heck) how tough is it really to drive manual. My friends say not too hard but heck they all have auto cars too! Plus I'm not very coordinated.

    I know that the manual WRX is supposed to waaaaay outgun the auto WRX, but I read from some post that all those great sub-6 0-60's were done from launching at high revs. How 'bout "normally", is the auto-WRX really that much slower than the manual? And if so is that deficiency such that it's not even worth considering an auto-WRX (as some of my friends have said)? I mean normal as in city driving...I mean, yeah I'll speed sometimes and sometimes I wanna outgun some guy at a light, but that's not gonna happen every single time I drive! Also I've noticed that sometimes guys in manual cars start out really slow and I can blast past them by gassing in my auto car..

    Last, any idea if they're gonna have a clutchless manual in future WRX's? I read that the Mazda RX-8 is gonna come with this, just wonderin if Subaru ever considered it for the WRX. I mean, have a manual WRX and stick the clutchless/sportshift/tiptronic in the auto-WRX...

    Thanx for reading this long schpiel.....
  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    Before AH jumps in here about how great the AT AWD system is... Depending on your driving, I say get whatever is going to suit your driving. If you plan on auto-xing or racing the car, get the 5-speed. If it will be a road car, used for city driving, then get the AT if you are more comfy with it. Once in the rev band, the AT will move out nicely, you won't notice a difference @ highway speeds although the AT is limited to 130 and the MT goes up to about 140ish (drag limited). You shouldn't be doing 130 for an extended period of time on public roads so that isn't an issue IMHO. Off the line you can always do a brake stand with an AT to give it the same effect as dropping the clutch from 4K rpms in the MT.

    -mike
  • The manual is always recommended on a turbo'd car because you have more control to keep it in the power band. This is so you can do things like drop it into 3rd before a turn so you can power out of it easily as well as downshifting to get immediate power for acceleration.

    My WRX has been my first MT car (my previous two cars were AT). That's not to say I didn't know how to drive a MT. I've driven my friend's 3000GT, 240z and his family's accord on several occasions (I actually learned how to drive MT on the 240z). It was enough to get the basics down, but it took me a good week to really get used to the clutch on the WRX. It seemed to catch much later and much more suddenly than any other car i've driven.

    If you have NEVER driven a MT before, i wouldn't recommend buying a MT car. It's just not smart to drop 25k on a car and then not know how to drive it off the lot. I was confident I could buy a MT because I could drive my friend's cars around town (abiet not very smoothly).

    I do have to say, this car wouldn't be nearly as fun in the AT version. The MT is purely a joy to drive. Get some new friends, ones that have MT cars, and learn how to drive on them. Then, once you are confident you can handle yourself, but the MT version of the car.

    BTW, why would you want to get rid of the clutch!! It's one of the best aspects of a MT.
  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    I do it in my ATs all the time, the only real advantages I see in the MTs is that you can better regulate the RPMs in the lower band of the spectrum. The 1-2 range on the ATs is a bit hard to control v. MTs. But once on the highway, you can drop it to "3" or "2" to get the extra punch you need w/o worries. Unless you are racing, or do no city driving, the AT is the way to go IMHO.

    -mike
  • After 6 years of driving an AT and one month+ driving a manual. IMO, the manual has been the easiest to control in traffic in the city. But that's just me.
  • wrxguywrxguy Posts: 51
    Well of course your gonna get a yes from me to buy a WRX. If not getting a stick because its new to you and you "feel" a bit awkwards then welcome to the world manual trannies. Addmittedly im bias,and i would say the only good reasons to get an auto would be one your wife demands it, two you are seventy eight (although my Dad wont own and auto tranny), three you drive from the edge of L.A. to the other side of it on a daily basis and like to read your paper, chat on yer cell and slurp starbucks in rush hour traffic,
    Get a stick, two cents please ;)
  • Thanx for the quick feedback guys.
    So looks like my prerequisite for making new friends is now based on, "Do you have a MT car?" LOL

    Anyway, just a question about the "brake stand" - doesn't that wear your brakes bad? I mean, of course I'm not talkin about doing this every time at a light but every time that's gotta be bad for the brakes...

    And the other thing, me being so clueless about MT, is that is being in neutral in AT the same as dropping clutch in MT? ie the engine is not "connected" to the tires? So would one be able to rev up in neutral, and then shift down to drive to get the launch off the line?

    That said, I find myself now getting the itch to go learn MT now...heh heh
  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    On AWD cars if you do a brake stand, you are not likely to break the wheels loose, so you won't do any damage or much damage to the pads (besides pads are a 10-15minute change job and maybe $30-$50) brake stands however will do damage to your torque converter and I don't suggest you do it at every light. I do them to launch my XT6 for auto-x and thus far doing it say 50-100x over 30K miles I haven't done any damage to my pads or my tranny.

    You wouldn't want to rev and drop the tranny in an AT car, probably wouldn't accomplish a fast launch. Dropping the clutch in an MT is how they accomplish fast launches IIRC. (I'm not a stick driver myself)

    -mike
  • hunter001hunter001 Posts: 851
    I know that the manual WRX is supposed to waaaaay outgun the auto WRX, but I read from some post that all those great sub-6 0-60's were done from launching at high revs. How 'bout "normally", is the auto-WRX really that much slower than the manual? And if so is that deficiency such that it's not even worth considering an auto-WRX (as some of my friends have said)? I mean normal as in city driving...I mean, yeah I'll speed sometimes and sometimes I wanna outgun some guy at a light, but that's not gonna happen every single time I drive! Also I've noticed that sometimes guys in manual cars start out really slow and I can blast past them by gassing in my auto car..


    On what are you basing the "waaaaaay outgun" comment, may I ask ? I would say that you are mis-informed, to put it mildly.


    I drive an Acura 3.2TL (0-60 6.7secs=Pontiac Grand Prix GTP acceleration), which will humiliate your Pontiac in acceleration and I can say honestly that the Auto-WRX would be as fast or maybe even faster than the Acura. All you do is step on the gas and feel the rocketing effect of the car (Auto-WRX). Do not be misled by all these anti-auto comments in these forums. You should drive the car extensively yourself and decide for yourself. It is your money. Also, at most the manual WRX should be about 0.5secs or so faster than the Auto-WRX. Both the Auto and the manual-WRX are dogs right off the line. Both of them rocket ahead once you cover about 50 ft from a standing start.


    Another factor most of us are ignoring are:


    a) The Auto-WRX has stiffer springs than the manual-WRX for better handling. This is a fact not fiction.

    b) The Auto-WRX has a waaaaaaaaay better AWD system when compared to the manual. This is a fact not something pulled out of thin air. This AWD distributes 55% of the torque to the rear wheels and 45% to the front wheels in normal driving. When starting from a stop (or when accelerating), the Torque-sensing Planetary gear center differential distributes 85% of the torque to the rear wheels. This ensures absolutely fabulous handling, especially while blasting along a curvy mountain road. The manual-WRX does not do anything of the above.

    c) The Auto-WRX is nearly as fast as the manual and is faster than pretty much all other vehicles on the road. And that is with a normal start not starting with high revs or any such abnormal way of starting.


    May I suggest that you go through the below thread:


    http://i-club.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=140498



    Below is a comment from a manual-WRX owner (on the handling of the manual-WRX in slippery conditions, something that will never occur with the Auto-WRX equipped with the VTD-AWD system):

    I have noticed that the VC does take awhile (especially when the WRX has just been started and the fluid is still cold) to engage. My first little snow traction test (with Arctic Alpins) was to goose it a little on a low speed curve in our lane. The rear kicked out like I was driving a RWD vehicle! No harm done but I was a little disappointed. My wife's RAV4 seems to do better, even w/o locking the center diff.

    Later...AH

  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    You should also note that the stiffer springs on the AT probably account for about as much handling differences as the difference in track of the wagon v. the sedan.

    -mike
  • dop50dop50 Posts: 162
    My suggestion is NOT to learn to drive a stick with your friends cars, and if you buy the stick, don't let them learn on yours! Clutches aren't cheap!! Go to a dealership and test drive sticks there, you won't offend anyone, and you won't lose your friends. :) Or have someone who has driven one for a long time go with you, and teach you. You won't learn the coordination over night, but get as much practice as you can.

    Not to mention, this method will not make anyone's insurance rates go up!

    This car, with the turbo, is not really a good one for the person who has never driven anything with a standard to learn with. It's just too easy for it to get away from you. The power band comes fast in low gears, and the steer is extremely responsive and very easy to "over-correct" for a beginner. Unless you really don't like the looks of the front of it, I strongly suggest that you get at least a little practice on some other vehicle, just so you get an idea of what happens when you release the clutch and press on the gas.

    I'm not saying not to buy the stick, quite the contrary, it's a total blast! Just get the inital experience on something else. And I'm not saying you "can't" learn with this car, you can, very easily. But if you do, be VERY carefull at first.

    Before everyone jumps on me for saying this, let me remind you, this person said they were'nt very coordinated. Plus the fact he's still driving his "first" car. Remember? :)

    Have a great day!

    Ken
  • Another reason for the stiffer springs on the AT is probably due to the weight increases (though it is only 60 lb's). Anyone who can say they can feel the difference between the springs is simply deluding themselves. Another reason is probably to keep the car more level since the torque distribution is different. Suffice it to say, there is a reason why they did what they did and it was not to give the AT an advantage over the manual.

    As for being able to kick the rear end out on a turn, the ability to dial in some oversteer IS NOT A BAD THING. It's one of the things I really like about this car, it will behave like a RWD vehicle on demand. It may take a little more discpline from the person behind the wheel, but I don't simply want to get in a car and push some buttons to make it go forward.

    I have driven the Auto WRX, and I can say that the manual is much more enjoyable (at least to me). In fact, when I bought mine, there were two used Auto's sitting on the lot. Two seperate people decided that after 3 months of owning their auto wrx, they would rather have the manual.

    You will also note that the edmunds review of the auto sport wagon said that without a brake start, the best they could get is a 8.3 0-60 and the best they could get with a brake start was 6.7. Compare this to the 5.4 0-60 that Car and Driver was able to do with the manual.
  • beanboybeanboy Posts: 442
    "The Auto-WRX has stiffer springs than the manual-WRX for better handling. This is a fact not fiction."

    I'd like to see your sources that prove that the automatic WRX handles better than the manual WRX.

    Learn to drive a manual for the joy of driving a manual.

    -B
  • hypovhypov Posts: 3,068
    dop50 Jan 29, 2002 6:28am

    Or, find a Driving School that offer classes for stick shift and have their own cars for lessons. Beat up on their car ;-)

    -Dave
  • hunter001hunter001 Posts: 851
    bull3964:

    This person did not intend to "kick the rear end out". It just happened due to the AWD not reacting quickly enough. If fact he was disappointed that an AWD car behaved as poorly as a RWD car would behave in slippery conditions. He was not praising the "rear end kicking out" as you seem to imply. Also, I suppose you meant the Auto-WRX behaving like a RWD car, right ?? Because, the manual WRX cannot behave like a RWD car due to its Viscous coupling AWD, which always splits torque 50/50 unlike the Auto-WRX, where it behaves like a RWD car in pretty much all good weather conditions due to the kickass center torque sensing differential and it behaves like a kick-[non-permissible content removed] AWD car when conditions are slippery !!

    In fact, the stiffer springs on the Automatic-WRX is, I believe, due to the presence of the brutally fast and rapid VTD-AWD system in the Auto-WRX. Due to the immediacy with which it is able to transfer torque to the wheels that need it, it is able to take advantage of the stiffer springs than the manual-WRX, that is unable to transfer any torque even nearly as fast. Not due to the 55lbs or so of extra poundage in the Auto-WRX when compared to its manual counterpart, as someone seemed to have stated (most probably a bit of hot air). In fact, in the Lexus IS300, the manual-IS300 (which is lighter than the Auto-IS300), has stiffer springs than the Auto-IS300, which blows this funny theory into the boonies, I might add !!

    Another thing with Automatic cars is that you should drive the car around for a couple of miles before really letting her rip. The Torque converter present in Automatic equipped cars will need some time to warm up to operational temperatures. When taking a test drive, always make sure that you drive around gently for a few miles before really testing her accelerative prowess.

    In my neck of the woods, Auto-WRXs do not remain on the lot for even a couple of days. They get snapped up by buyers on the first day or so. Can't say the same about the manual-WRX however. Also, at the time of resale, a manual car almost always is tough to sell. You will have to search around for a buyer who is willing to take it off your hands. Just a heads-up. When I bought my car, our dealer received 2 Auto-WRX silver wagons during the evening. The next day in the morning, we confirmed our order over the phone. In the evening when we went to pick up our Auto-WRX, the other Auto-WRX was already sold, dealer prepped and gone !!! Does not stay on the lot for too long.

    Later...AH
  • hunter001hunter001 Posts: 851
    Without dumping the clutch (as auto-magazines do), the manual would probably be able to manage about 7.5-8.0 secs 0-60. With dumping of the clutch at high rpms, the time would drop to about 5.5-6.0 secs depending on who is test driving it and also the humidity/altitude/heat etc on that particular day.

    The Auto-WRX should be about 0.5secs slower than the manual-WRX (under the same conditions), but if you were to floor it, it would be able to consistently get the same timings. With torque braking (the Automatic equivalent of the clutch dumping), drivers from Car and Driver would have managed a 5.8-6.0 secs 0-60 on the same day/time that they obtained a 5.4secs for the Manual-WRX. Any car that comes within 7.0secs 0-60, is plenty fast in my books !!!

    It would be foolish and amatuerish to compare the timings from 2 different sources (C&D and Edmunds) driven on 2 different days with 2 different drivers in entirely different conditions as someone above seems to have done !! If the same drivers had driven the Auto-WRX and the Manual-WRX on the same day/same time within minutes of each other, those figures make sense. Otherwise, they are just amusing statistics.

    Later...AH
  • The manual WRX WILL behave like a RWD car on command. All it takes is a little punch from the throttle when going into a turn and you can make the back end drift. What that person was complaining about was his own fault. He misjudged the amount of power he was applying in the turn and the car reacted accordingly. It was a simple matter of him not knowing how his car will behave with the current road conditions. Whether it was intentional or not, it was the driver fault, not the AWD fault. If the AT does not behave in a manner that would cause the above to happen, that's all the more reason in my book NOT to drive it. AWD is not a cure all to allow you to take turns faster than you should, it is to provide traction when accelerating in a straight line or to provide the stability to start going in a straight line once you have completed your turn. It is not to prevent the front or back end from flying around if you outdrive the road conditions.

    I say again, the MT is very easy to coax into becoming a RWD car. In fact, it is easy to make the manual drift on dry flat pavement. You just have to be in the appropriate gear when going into the turn in order to get enough power to break the rear wheels free. I DO NOT want some computer and an electric clutch making that determination for me. I want to be able to do it by feel and knowledge of my car.

    In MY neck of the woods, the autos sit. They continue to sit. Some have sat for months while the manuals fly off the lot. Many dealers I've spoken to say that they will actually stop ordering auto's to put on the lot because they are in such low demand. And with this type of car, having a manual is an asset when selling used due to the type of driver it will attract.
  • hunter001hunter001 Posts: 851
    I believe that you are aware that the World Rally conquering Subaru Rally cars are equipped with a setup that is similar to (but in a much lighter duty form) what is available in the Auto-WRX, right ? Also, you may be aware that no rally car can hope to be competitive with the kind of AWD that Subaru has equipped the manual-WRX car with. It would be way out-classed by the competition, to put it mildly, much as you may want to drive around with it.

    Also, out of curiosity, would you drive around with the VC-AWD, if the VTD-AWD were available in the manual-WRX ??? Just because it is not available, you are trying to portray a weakness of the manual-WRX as a virtue, which to me comes across as funny.

    Again, I reiterate what I have always stated. Everything else remaining the same, I would prefer the manual-WRX to the Auto-WRX for the driving pleasure. For example, if both the manual and the Auto-WRX came with the Viscous Coupling AWD system. Or if both the manual-WRX and the Auto-WRX came with the VTD-AWD system. I would have absolutely no argument about which is better. But in this particular comparison, "everything is not the same". Far far from it. There are wide differences in the setup and the behavior of the 2 cars in various conditions. It is not the difference between the slushbox vs stick-shift alone as a lot of us are implying.

    Later...AH
  • paisanpaisan Posts: 21,181
    The Rally Diffys are very different than any one used on the street, you can't keep pulling that arguement out, since they are not at all the same as whats in the AT WRX. Sorry, I'm an AT fan myself, but there are limits, and you are being a bit over the edge here... Just my 2 cents. I forgot though, eveerything *YOU* buy is better than anything anyone else buys (like your acura GPS unit...)

    -mike
  • hunter001hunter001 Posts: 851
    Yes, the differentials (enabling side to side transfer) are different but the AWD setup that enables the transferance of torque front/back back/front is very very close in a much lighter duty form in the road-going version (Auto-WRX). Again, I pointed this out, since the fellow seemed to be un-aware that the "electric clutch" which he mentioned (and the torque sensing planetary gear which he did not mention), makes its presence felt in the Rally cars too but is un-available in the manual-WRX. So by the fellow's logic, the Rally cars do not meet his standards, since it is equipped with the "electric clutch" !!!

    I edited my previous post, so read it again.

    Later...AH
This discussion has been closed.