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Jaguar X-Type

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Comments

  • keyrowkeyrow Posts: 214
    As the owner of a detailing business I recommend everyone check out Leatherique, we have found their products provide the best cleaning and replenishment of vital oils of any product currently available. The Rejuvinator Oil also does not produce a slippery surface, as do some other products, so you will not be sliding all over after treating your seats. Lexol is good, but Leatherique is better!


    http://www.leatherique.com/Default.htm

  • jagboyxkrjagboyxkr Posts: 53
    Thanks for the information. I'll add Leatherique to my list of care products to look at.
  • lenscaplenscap Posts: 854
    I was mearly pointing out a fact: the X-Type, as a brand new model, is having more initial problems than many other new luxury cars. More than the Lexus ES 300 or SC 430. More than the Infiniti G35 or Q45. More than the Acura RSX or MDX.

    I also said that, of course, there is more to buying a car than just reliability. There is a lot of emotion involved. People buy cars for a host of reasons.

    As for the engine sludge, I've had no problem whatsoever. And if a day comes when there is a problem, I am confident Lexus would take care of the problem. Unlike your beloved Jaguar, which according to the previously posted article (a trade article for dealers no less, not a consumer article) has annoyed many customers by not responding to their problems.

    No car is perfect, or made for everybody. You need to listen to the criticism people have of the X-Type as well as the positives instead of getting so defensive.
  • desertguydesertguy Posts: 730
    One does wonder why you feel it necessary to get on the Jag. BB and post unflattering articles about the X Type when you admittedly "have no experience with the car whatsoever." And are not in the market for one as far as I can tell. Maybe you are trying to validate your choice of the Lexus? The ES300 is not comparable to the X.
  • lenscaplenscap Posts: 854
    Since I have access to automotive articles most people don't, I post lots of articles (good and bad).

    There are people reading these forums searching for information that do not know a lot about cars. By posting articles these people can learn more before buying a car. That's why many people go to Edmunds - for new info.

    Despite what you may think, I have nothing against the X-Type. I believe the more competitors the better.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    The Town Hall is about to take on a new look in an effort to make content more easily searchable and accessible.

    Have you seen the Letter from the Town Hall Manager on the Town Hall Welcome page? If not, you might want to follow that link to have a look.

    And hang on to your seats. Change is never easy - for any of us - but resolving the Search problems we've had will be worth the pain.

    Pat
    Sedans Host
  • jonty12jonty12 Posts: 101
    there are already 14 tsbs out on the 2002 es300. most are minor issues, much like the x-type issues. the notion that the es300 has less though is absurd. there are 6 tsbs for the x-type. the tsbs for the x-type cover everything people have complained about except the washer nozzle issue, with that there are 7 problems. still half that of the es300, and i'm not counting issues that lexus doesn't have an official tsb out for.


    if you doubt me, go to http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov and check for yourself. the difference is the way the manufacturer deals with the problems. where jaguar customers have to pull teeth to get jaguar to fix something, lexus does it many times before the customer even recognizes a problem exists. it's a matter of customer service, and yes, lexus does a better job than jaguar in that respect.


    as for problems with the cars though, the x-type does not have more than the average first year model, and in fact has half the problems the 02 es300 has.

  • lenscaplenscap Posts: 854
    Thanks for that piece of info.

    I was going by initial quality as reported by JD Power. According to that study, only the Thunderbird had fewer initial problems than the ES 300 in the entry-luxury class. I guess if something is wrong and taken care of before I notice I don't care about it.

    I appreciate the response.
  • jonty12jonty12 Posts: 101
    the only people who seem to like jd power surveys are those who end up near the top. the problem is that they are completely based on customer reported problems, not actually on problems. many lexus owners don't know they have it as good as they do, because lexus fixes the problems so quickly. they sometimes also seem to overlook minor issues that owners of other brands would report, simply becuase lexus has treated them so well.

    as a side note, i looked at the 02 camry numbers, there are already more than 20 tsbs.

    lenscap, i appreciate you taking the time to look at the data.
  • jagboyxkrjagboyxkr Posts: 53
    "As for the engine sludge, I've had no problem whatsoever. And if a day comes when there is a problem, I am confident Lexus would take care of the problem. Unlike your beloved Jaguar, which according to the previously posted article (a trade article for dealers no less, not a consumer article) has annoyed many customers by not responding to their problems."

    If you would like, I could post the many articles that I have found both for consumers and dealers about the Toyota/Lexus "oil gelling" (as they call it) problem. It took a colossal amount of unhappy and annoyed Toyota/Lexus owners to finally get Toyota/Lexus to even admit that there was a flaw in the design of their engines, a problem which dates back to 1997! So for five years, Toyota/Lexus said that it was the car owners' fault for having engines that sludged! Yeah, you are right, they give great service, if you can call that service. I'm glad they have your confidence.

    Jaguar may have a few initial problems related to unwanted sounds on a few of the brand new, new-technology X-TYPEs, but they have engines that function properly and they do not blame their problems on their customers. I have had NO problems whatsoever with my Jaguar X-TYPE, and I have full confidence that Jaguar will work out the problems in all of the few cars that have them. I even found some articles where some surveyed X-TYPE owners who actually had problems came back for a follow-up response after Jaguar responded to them, and they had nothing but praise for the service they recieved and thier cars.

    As for your remark about service from Jaguar, I have had nothing but good experiences with my dealer and the Jaguar company itself. I also must say out of experience from ownership that Jaguar makes some of the finest cars the world has to offer. Since you have no experience with any of these aspects, you have no basis to make any valid statements about Jaguar's service, ownership experience, how they treat their customers, or even the cars themselves.

    You would not have come here and posted unflattering articles about the X-TYPE had you not had, "nothing against the X-Type". In your message addressed to desertguy, you make the statement that you "believe the more competitors, the better". This establishes that you believe that the Jaguar X-TYPE and your stylistically challenged Lexus ES300 are competators with one another on the market. Then, in that same post, you state, "There are people reading these forums searching for information that do not know a lot about cars. By posting articles, these people can learn more before buying a car". This establishes that you are trying to educate the unknowlegeable public with the information that you post on these boards. By posting only unflattering information about a car that you consider a major competator to the car you are trying to promote, you are attempting to make it appear to the "people who do not know a lot about cars" as if that competator is horribly unfit for them, and as a car in general. Your true intentions seem to be to try and sell the ES300 to the public over the X-TYPE, not make a fair and unbiast observation about any car.
  • jonty12jonty12 Posts: 101
    i am very happy with my car. i have a 12/01 build 3.0 manual sport. i think my dealer has done a great job, but i have not been completely satisfied with my service or with jaguar north america. there are many x-type owners who agree with me. see this board, the xk8.net board, and jagtalk.com. my dealer went out of it's way to get me the tires my car was supposed to come with, others have been less fortunate as Jag corporate refuse to replace them. i reported the whining noise to service several months ago, and they claimed to have never heard of the problem (we know this to be untrue). i asked for them to program the remote for global close, they claimed it to be impossible (we know this to be untrue). i reported a creak/knock from the rear when turning on an incline, they claimed to no be able to reproduce (we know this is untrue, there's a tsb on the problem). i have NEVER received a response when using myjaguar.com to contact jaguar. jaguar corporate also repeatedly has failed to return my calls when I have called them.

    these are all experiences that generally do not occur when owning a lexus. as i pointed out earlier, lexus does have problems, and the new es has had FAR more problems than the x-type. the difference is the lexus responds to the problems, and does not deny them until they can no longer do so. the one exception is the toyota/lexus engine issue that you've pointed out. that is a biggie, and yes, i am glad i do not own a toyota or lexus with a version of that engine right now.

    i hope you take this as intended, i love when you post enthusiastically about the x, as i love my car too, but to cheer blindly is not always a good thing. jaguar service and customer support has quite a long way to go still to be ranked up there with lexus. a lot of it is a dealer to dealer thing, but some of the biggest issues are with jaguar north america, not with individual dealers.
  • lenscaplenscap Posts: 854
    Some responses:

    1. While some owners of Toyota/Lexus owners have reported engine slude problems, according to a recent article in Automotive News (a dealer trade pub) the number of affected engines was less than 1% of those produced since 1997. So, while there does seem to be a problem it is also an isolated one.

    2. "I also must say out of experience from ownership that Jaguar makes some of the finest cars the world has to offer."

    While your comments are highly valued, they must be placed in perspective. At 16 years old your "experience" amounts to a whole few months of car ownership. I certainly have a different view of the world of cars now than I did when I had my first Honda at age 19. Similarly, somebody who has bought ten cars in their lifetime has a lot more experience than me (I've only purchased three cars).

    3. I clearly stated I have no experience with owning a Jaguar. All I did was post an article. I did not provide any personal commentary with that post. I believe it is valid to discuss what the press says about cars. I'm sure your reaction would have been different had I posted a car comparison article from, say, Motor Trend, in which the Jaguar came in 1st.

    4. While some people inevitable will cross-shop the ES 300 and X-Type, I do not consider them competitors. And I am not out to promote the ES 300, as I do not think it is suited for all types of drivers. Check out some of my posts on other boards. Several times I have stated my dislike for the IS 300 (which is an X-Type competitor), particularly the interior. Further, I have also praised the Acura TL-S as a great car. And that car does compete with the ES 300. So, posting a negative article on the X-Type is in no way promoting the ES 300.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,622
    I think the issue was how Toyota responded to that 1% of owners who had the problem. They told them it was their own fault for not changing the oil often enough and refused to cover the repairs under warranty until it was forced out in public. Not sure how much of that came from Lexus vs. Toyota but you get the picture.

    The problem seems to be that the auto dealers have far too much power and the mfrs have virtually no power over the dealers when there are dealer problems. Ford tried to fix that with Blue Oval certification with monetary incentives but the dealers hauled them to court and took all the teeth out of the proposal. Most dealers just don't care and the mfrs seem powerless to fix it.

    OTOH there are isolated pockets of dealers, mfrs and vehicles that do seem to care. We had a Lincoln LS owner who had a problem that the dealer tried to fix with the help of the factory engineers for a few weeks with no success. Lincoln offered him a new 2002 LS to replace the 2000 without him even asking. Even kept his payment the same (not sure if the term was extended or not). This guy will probably be a Lincoln/Ford owner for life now. Then again we've had Lincoln dealers who wouldn't replace a license plate holder because he said it was a wear item and Lincoln wouldn't pay for it. I've heard of Mercedes dealers who gave out Camry and Accord loaner cars. Dealers today have far too much discretion in warranty matters.
  • goolappergoolapper Posts: 27
    Heck, m a bit embarrassed to admit that I actually kinda like the looks of the Toyota ECHO...
    so today was shocked to see what I thought was the new Toyota UGLY!!! Until it got a head
    of me & saw that its badging alleged it was a Lexus ES300...must be the 2003...talk about
    stylistically challenged...
  • jagboyxkrjagboyxkr Posts: 53
    I'm sorry I was so harsh. Your posts were just bugging me, because as everyone knows, I love my car and I've only had good experiences with it. I was being a bit immature, and I appologize. I just don't think that people should be criticizing these cars so badly, and I am also sorry about any remarks I may have made about your car. Your Lexus really is a nice car, and I honestly hope you don't have any problems with it and enjoy it as much as I enjoy my X-TYPE.
    _____________________________________

    jonty12-

    I am really glad that you are happy with your car, but as far as service goes, I truly have had superb service from Jaguar North America, and especially from my dealer. I have used both the "myjaguar.com" and the normal service on Jaguar's United States website to request information and make inquiries, and every time I have received responses within two weeks of the time I originally posted, usually much sooner. I have even been unverified as a Jaguar owner by not entering my VIN number when making some requests on the Jaguar U.S. website, and they still have answered me. I cannot imagine why your service has not been up to these standards, and understand how this would be frustrating for you. My father has mailed Jaguar North America before also, and each time received very courteous letters that made Jaguar sound even eager to help solve any mysteries or answer any questions. We also have received letters from the new head of Jaguar North America, and she encourages any Jaguar owner to mail her if they require assistance directly from her, along with many complementary issues of "JAGUAR" magazine with each letter.

    My dealer has also given service that is absolutely magnificent. The people working there are very polite and interested in fixing any problems with the cars that are brought in no matter how minor or major they may be, and all of the mechanics wear white gloves and cover the interiors of the cars as to not get any smudges on the cars they work on. Every year since having Jaguars in the family, we have received very nice Christmas cards from our dealer, and through out the year they have different social gatherings which owners are invited to participate in. They'll even bring money managers and stock brokers in and provide money managing courses at some of these events - all free of charge of course.

    We still receive mail from Jaguar North America as well as our dealer every month or two, making sure that we are still very pleased with our cars, and encouraging us to bring our cars in if there is anything displeasing about them. When the car is in the shop, they always provide a Jaguar and a driver to take you to work or where ever you needed to go that day. When you require a rental car, they give you a choice of a Jaguar, Land Rover (they are only a Jaguar dealer, I don't know where they get the other kinds of vehicles as they are not part of an automall either), or SAAB. If there is minor work to be done on a car and it does not need to be performed in the shop, then the dealer will sometimes even send someone out to your house to fix the car.

    This is why I have had nothing but positive things to say about Jaguar's service.
  • jonty12jonty12 Posts: 101
    i can understand with the service you have received that you are very happy, but please understand, you are not in the majority. i wholeheartedly encourage you to visit www.jagtalk.com or www.xk8.net to read about some other experiences. you will see that part of what you're saying makes lenscap's point. with lexus it doesn't matter which dealer or service department you choose, you get consistent quality treatment everywhere, with jaguar it's like playing russian roullette, or as forrest gump used to say, it's like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna get. i really hope you continue to receive the service you get, and that many more jaguar dealerships give that sort of response, but as i said in an earlier post, the problem is higher up than the dealer, it's at corporate level. which reminds me, i still haven't received a response from myjaguar.com to a note i sent out early last week (they assured me 48 hours), and my representative has still not called me back after i had to call her back due to non-response.

    it makes no sense for me to harp on this on a public board unless there is a problem (it lowers resale value if demand is low), but unfortunately, except for the lucky few such as yourself, there is a problem.
  • jagboyxkrjagboyxkr Posts: 53
    Although I have had outstanding service, I have heard of the responses from Jaguar sometimes being slower than they should or could be; give them a little time before you totally decide condemn them though, as you'll probably get a response just as you feel all hope of getting a response is lost. There is a problem with their response system if you get no response or if your response comes later than at the most two or three weeks, but I have a feeling one will turn up in the meantime. Good luck.
  • lenscaplenscap Posts: 854
    No apology necessary. You have a great car and just enjoy it.
  • Kirstie@EdmundsKirstie@Edmunds Posts: 10,676
    A major daily newspaper is looking for people who bought used luxury cars with the idea of moving upscale at discounted prices only to find out that the cost of parts and service was greater than expected. Were you surprised or shocked by the cost of routine maintenance and common repairs like mufflers, brakes, shocks and struts, transmissions, headlight replacement, etc.?

    If so, please send an e-mail containing your contact information and vehicle description to jfallon@edmunds.com no later than Wednesday, June 12.

    Need help navigating? kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.

  • allisonmoallisonmo Posts: 1
    Wanted to know if anyone has any suggestions beyond edmunds TMV on making an offer on an X-type. The salesman has said he would take $2000 off the list over the phone, so I would think we can do some better.

    Also, can someone please explain to me the value of the stabilization feature on the weather package? Is the weather package helpful? Thanks!
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