Mazda Protegé

mdaffron

I change mine about once a year myself.

Meade

protege_fan

I have to clean my K&N panel....too cold out though

mdaffron

All this 3 madness has made us all neglectful of our current loves!

Meade

P.S. Nice to see that once again I've drummed up some activity in here, Larry and Dale notwithstanding!

mazdafun

My Pro could sure use a wash, but I'm afraid of freezing the doors and trunk shut. It's supposed to be nasty anyway, so I'll wait for the weekend.

At 47,000 miles, about 1,000 to the next oil change and tire rotation. Wow, almost time for the first big service at 60k. Yes, I'm still on my Dunlop SP Sport A2s (about 25,000 miles so far), but I'm eagerly awaiting Ray's report on the snow-worthiness of his Falken Ziex ZE-512s, as I'm considering them as the next shoes for my Pro.

boggse

Oil change and tire rotation scheduled for tomorrow. If all goes as expected, I will be ordering a set of 4 Toyo Proxes4 sometime in February or March.

protege_fan

I'm not neglecting my Pro! The K&N filter is outta my old LX and I haven't had a chance to clean it yet. I only have like 1800 kms on the new Pro!

chicagopro

I'm anxiously awaiting Raymond's snow report as well, since I just ordered the Falkens a couple of days ago.

Mike: Get up off your lazy butt and clean that K&N already!

ashutoshsm

... Falkens, Toyos and K&Ns. We're beginning to sound like a regular bunch of 'Mod'ers in here

Meade - just popped in to point out a flaw in your logic. Sure, your 30K service was at 33K, and you're only 35 past that. But that's ONLY valid for those items serviced at 30K intervals. The 60K interval items may not be as understanding and lenient

However, fear not, as our Pro engines are non-interfering types. A broken timing belt (is that not one of the 60K services?) can only result in a stalled car, which will need a tow and then the very same timing belt service you've been putting off.

lawman1967

Will a broken timing belt REALLY only result in a stalled engine on the 2.0L Protege? That's impressive, almost a impressive as a "last-forever" timing chain would have been.

So other than routine maintenance, are there any problem areas on these cars? I'm planning on taking mine overseas where parts will be a bit tough to get, so it will help if I bring along anything it might need.

the_big_h

so we have a nice layer of wet snow on the ground right now, which was just starting to stick as I leave work. By the time I reach the neighborhood there's a nice layer on the ground already.

the Falkens drove fine in the snow, only slipping out when I tried to do things that purposely try to make it slip (hard braking, extra gas on a turn for no apparent reason)

the big test will be when there's nice amount on the ground and I have to get rolling from a standstill :-O

but so far so good :-)

tomciviletti

What tires did you have before the ze512's? how does threi responsiveness on dry roads compare? How about hydroplaning resistance?

mdaffron

The items in the 30K and 60K services are the SAME. Bleeaaaahhhhh. So there.

And yes, I am well aware of the Protege's non-interference engine. Just one of the many, many reasons I like the car. But what does that have to do with the 60K service?

Meade

meinrad

Tom, I had the orignal sp5000's on my Protege5. I only remember them from when they were bald, which meant they stuck like glue when dry, but rain and snow was a dangerous mix.

The Falkens aren't the same on dry roads, but I wouldn't expect them to be. But they stick like glue in the rain. I have so much more confidence in the rain now, than with any car in my past.

My first snow drive this morning went well. About an 1" of snow thus far along with the slush that preceded it. I have a hard left in the middle of a big hill that always causes me trouble on the hill since I can't get a run at it. Last winter, with the Dunlops, I usually found my self sliding backwards, sideways, and generally praying my way to the top. Today, I managed to actually gain speed up the hill. I still spun, but I was able to control it and had no trouble getting to the top.

6-10" expected by tomorrow, so they will really get tested, but so far they have met my expectations. Not great in the snow, but not dangerous either. Don't think you can expect more out of a performance all season.

mazdafun

Depending on which state you live in, the manual states changes at 60k or 105k miles. I think CA, MD and NY are amongst the states that dictate the 105k interval.

I personally think the 60k is conservative, but I figure better safe than sorry (even with the non-interference engine, I'd just hate to stall somewhere). I think 105k might be pushing it, but we'll just have to wait for some data to see.

mdaffron

Says so in my manual, and my service adviser confirmed it. When I questioned the belt's durability and whether I should stick with a lower-mileage change, he said he didn't change the one in his Civic until 105K and things worked fine. He told me not to worry about mine until at least 90K.

Great ... that'll be right around trade-in-on-Mazda3 time ... snicker, snicker.

Meade

the_big_h

I had autocross-worn OE Bridgestone Potenzas and some Yokohama all-seasons on my '00 ES.

big improvement over those, these 512's are :-)

looks like a good amount has piled up outside, I'm about to leave work, I will report back on the drive to work when I get in the office.

mdaffron

They're not wearing well at edge of tread; scrubbing a lot. Yes, we're rotating them every 5,000 miles.

Where do you live Ashu ...

Meade

dinu01

Woke up this morning bright and early before 8AM as I had to clean-up the PRO since my mom is going to Detroit for the wknd.

So while I'm washing the car while reminding myself to keep moving my fingers so they don't freeze and get stuck in some weird position, what do I see?

Just where the wheel well arches up on the passenger front side, there's this dent about 2mm deep and 2cm wide. A bit of the paint is scrathed off. Now I'll have to touch it up when she returns - ARGH!!!

It's not from a door ding, but rather from either a shopping cart or a car. Why can't ppl be a little more careful?

Dinu

boggse

What is the rotation pattern on the Dumflops? Is it front to rear or diagonal & front to rear?

Thanks,
Ted

the_big_h

meade, did you get wider tires than the OE spec for Tammy???

btw, I am in office now, and the verdict on the drive to work is...... inconclusive, because VDOT did a pretty good job cleaning off the major roadways, so there weren't any tricky spots to test out the tires.

bluong1

front <-> rear only, according to Mazda recommendation, eventhough the OEM Dunlop SP5000 is NOT unidirectional tires

ashutoshsm

... first off, Meade - you already know where I live

And uneven wear - are they all wearing that way? Or just one (trace back through your rotation pattern) - that may be a sign of an alignment needed at one corner.

Mine had edge wear on the inside of the left rear - which could be because of a required alignment, or because I always take left turns MUCH harder. And I did mention this on the boards. It was such a tiny difference in wear at the 5/6K mark, that I fiured it was inconsequential. Basically, wear was noticeable, but barely-there, unlike the other 3, which had NO noticeable wear.

And yes, folks, I agree with Hank's and Ray's analysis - you can barely expect to do better with a Performance All Season tire in the snow! I wouldn't expect them to be this satisfactory by next winter, though! I think such tires are 18-20 month tires. Buy a set JUST after winter ends, and use them through one winter, and replace just before the winter thereafter. If you're lucky, you could buy them at the start of winter, have satisfactory performance the following winter, and use them for around 28-ish months. But they're only warrantied 30K miles. And I get the feeling they should handle that well enough.

Thos Toyo Proxes4 look MIGHTY tempting too

ashutoshsm

When i considered these as an aftermarket replacement, I found they differed in specs from the OEM version on Pros. The aftermarket 195/50-16 (and the 195/50-15 I shopped) WERE unidirectional, Asymmetric and required a front<->rear rotation only.

I think the ones that come on P5s and ES'es are Asymmetric but NOT unidirectional. And have a MUCH lower treadwear rating.

Typical OEM-ization of good tires So they're good, but for FAR fewer miles than the aftermarket replacement. Bear in mind, of course, that not even Acura RSX'es (staying in the compact market,, but moving more up-market) come with tires this good - so we should still be glad Mazda made a pretty darn nice tire choice!

boggse

Does anyone know if there is a good jack point on the front of the Protege suitable for use with a floor jack? I don't have my manual handy, and I am trying to decide whether to just get a set of Rhino Ramps ($20) or go ahead and get a floor jack, jack stands, wheel chocks, 4 way lug wrench, creeper seat, etc. ($99).

Thanks,
Ted

the_big_h

ramps and jack/stands eventually

ramps are just so much easier to use for things like oil change. but jack/stands are necessary for tire/brake related work, or just have the whole car off the ground.

there are couple good jacking points for the stands, I can't describe where it is, but if I have a pic of the undercarriage of the car I can point it out to you.

lawman1967

My car is brand new, so obviously wear isn't an issue (yet). My question is, are the stock Potenzas so bad that everyone is eager to replace them? My car handles fabulously with the stock 195/55/15 Potenzas, has little to no tire noise on most surfaces and the ride is smooth, without tracking rain grooves. Are these tires disliked for wearing out too quickly or are the aftermarket alternatives just that much better.

To compare, my last car came with Goodyear Eagle LS was while quiet, wore quickly. I replaced them wtih Pirelli P4000s and was happy with their ride, handling and noise, but they tracked rain grooves too much for my taste.

the_big_h

but they are pretty bad in the rain, compared what the ZE512 can do.

snow I can't say, as by the time some real snow has come around, the Potenzas have been autocross-worn for a whole season, and are basically undrivable in anything other than a small drizzle.

lawman1967

I'm hoping that having just written a check for the car, I won't have to buy tires for a little while.

Since I plan on taking the car overseas in a year or 18 months, I'll be looking for new tires before I go, something decent in the rain (moving to Seoul) but with very long life. Might even consider doing a -1 and going with a 185/60/15, if that opens up more durable options without taking away too much from the handling.

mazdafun

They always recommend front-rear rotation for radials. Something about changing direction of rotation may reduce longevity or whatever, possibly causing layers to separate. I don't completely buy it, but that's what I've read.

Up to then, I'd always done the diagonal forward and straight-back pattern. Maybe that was left over from bias-ply tire days, but I recall that was the pattern recommended for my '89 323, and it was equipped with radial tires. Perhaps they have more data now that suggests an improvement for keeping the same rotation direction.

bluong1

I found this little article http://www.mgdriversclub.com/tech/rotating.radial.tires.html

Believale?

protege_fan

Ouch! That sucks! Is the dent something that you'll have to get professionally fixed?

mdaffron

Oh, did you just open a personal can of worms. Everyone else, go get a Coke or something. You've all read this. (And Pat's heaving a huge SIGGGHHHHH right now.) But in the interest of Town Hall hospitality, I's got some larnin' to do to this man.

(I oughta save the following as a text file so I can cut-and-paste every time this comes up -- I'm getting "tired" -- bu-dum-dum -- of rewriting this!)

My first Protege was a '92, shod with Bridgestone Potenza RE92s. At 10 months and 28,000 miles on the odo, I totaled that car and sent my passenger to the hospital for a week with a snapped leg due to those suckers in a rainstorm, causing a big "HOWDY!" meeting with the back of a stopped Volvo station wagon. (Talk about performance specs -- 45 to zero in .0023 seconds!!! LOL)

After my insurance check came in and I replaced the car with exactly the same car (basically), I monitored those tires very closely. At about 20K I swapped them for a set of Toyos which lasted all the way up to 83,000 miles when I sold the car.

When I bought my current Protege, a 2000 ES, I was shocked to see that Mazda was still using that tire. This time, my third forced experience with these lousy tires, I did a little grass-roots study. At first, they weren't too bad in the rain. I kept them rotated every 5,000 miles and kept my alignment checked. By about 8,000 miles they were starting to lose grip as I took off from stoplights on wet pavement. By about 18,000 miles there were still OK on dry pavement but were scary as hell in the rain, and by 25K (should've replaced them by then, but a new kid makes you spend money in other ways) I was starting to creep along like granny in the right lane -- in fact by that point I was actually planning my trips by the weather forecast. More than once I got caught in a summer storm on I-95 between Richmond and D.C., and actually would head for an exit when I saw the clouds coming. I'd slide over to comparatively lightly traveled U.S. 1, a four-lane road parallel to I-95 where I could ooze along at 35 mph in the right lane and not get rear-ended by a tractor trailer. But most of the time, even after that maneuver, I'd find a McDonald's or some other place to stop until it passed. Believe me, they were that scary. You could feel them constantly leaving the road surface and coming back again depending on the wetness of the pavement (and I'm not talking about puddles here).

I actually pushed those tires to 33,000 miles, but by then two of them were almost completely bald from one side to the other, and one was even showing some steel belt.

The tires I replaced them with were Dunlop SP Sport A2s, which I'd read so many good things about -- but I hadn't heeded the fact that the tires were brand-new for everyone and all those reviews at TireRack were from people who'd only had them a few months. The SP Sports sound like the best thing since sliced bread -- and they are for about the first 10,000 miles. Grip like glue and quiet as a mouse. But I guess they grip so well because they're soft, because the Dunlops had to be replaced merely 20,000 miles later at 53,000 miles.

At that point I took the advice of several fellow members here and tried the BF Goodrich Touring T/A VR4 on my car. I had to go to 205/55/15 (plus zero for the 195/55/15s that were stock in 2000), just as I'd done with the Dunlops. And the tires were attractive for more than their ride and wet traits; my local Costco sells them and I got a great price, plus lifetime rotations and balancing for free.

To date those tires have 15,000 miles on them, remain nice and quiet, do well in the wet (not quite as well as the SPs; they do slip a little leaving stoplights with my 5-speed, but then again I do push things a little), and after this many miles I can't see any appreciable wear. They've still got at least a half-inch of tread on them from sidewall to sidewall. Needless to say, after my tire experience with this car, I'm impressed with this tire.

Good luck with whatever you choose. Just one piece of advice, not that you asked for any -- keep in mind that most of those Tire Rack reviews, if you read them, are from people who (a) usually just bought the tires, and (b) bought the tires to replace tires that had worn out. So who wouldn't praise a new set of tires, compared to the tires that just came off the car?

I find it interesting going back to their reviews lately and seeing how many of those at-first SP Sport A2 praisers have come back to say how short-lived they were. Some really got bitten by their excellent first-5,000-mile traction, though, and have vowed to keep buying that tire every 10,000 miles for their car. Hey -- it's their money. I think they're nuts.

Good luck! But just don't push things in the rain with those Poortenzas after about 15,000 miles; you and your car might be sorry!

Meade

bluem6i

Just my 2 cents, they are bad in the rain, IMO, and have been right from the beginning. At 22K + miles, I am starting to plan for their replacement. It is the dry season in FL right now so I will probably keep them on until April or May (the PRO will be 2 yrs old in May and should have around 30K miles by then).

This way I'll have new (and better wet traction) tires in time for the rainy season (and it rains almost every day in FL from May - September). When it rains here, we usually get an inch or so in a half hour (very conducive to hydroplaning).

boggse

" They've still got at least a half-inch of tread on them from sidewall to sidewall."

You still have 16/32" left after 15k miles?! How much did you start out with? Most passenger tires only come with 10/32 to 12/32 of tread when new. ;-)

Ted

boggse

Well, I just got a set of ramps for now. I got Rhino Ramps from Sears for $20. AutoZone wanted $30, so I didn't get ripped off too much anyway.

I will eventually get the floor jack as well, but I really want one of the portable, aluminum ones with a carrying case, and they aren't cheap (~$180). That means I will be rotating the tires on the P5 the old fashioned way this weekend.

Ted

the_big_h

darn i guess I got ripped from Pep Boys :-(

oh well, It's been very useful, so I have no complaint :-)

dinu01

I won't get it fixed b/c it will require a little painting too, so I'll just leave the dent as it is and do my own touch-up. It's hald dent, half scraped.

Will take a pic on Sunday.

Dinu

meinrad

to get fed up with ice in my wiper blades.

So I stopped by Costco and picked up some winter blades with the big [non-permissible content removed] rubber boot around them.

If these don't help, then I'm replacing my washer nozzles with flame throwers!

the_big_h

and have a nice burnt windshield while deicing it??? ;-)

dinu01

http://www.wipershaker.com/

Dinu

protegenic

Nothin' like it to bring this place to life, huh?

On that subject, my Yoko Avid T4's (that Meade talked me into before he bailed and went another route) have been performing well, but after only @25K miles, there is not to much tread depth left. I am getting them rotated again this weekend and seeing if it is time to replace them. At least I would get some prorated credit since they are supposed to be 60K mile tread life.

Now, how 'bout them drum brakes?

bluong1

what's that?

mazdafun

I think a set of winter blades would be cheaper.

And I thought that the taboo against cross-rotating non-unidirectional radials sounded like a load of nonsense. I'd been doing it for years without any problems. Of course, dropping the cross-rotation makes tire rotations a bit easier, so I'll continue doing the front-back pattern unless I see excessive wear on one side (which would only serve to indicate a suspension issue).

My take on the Dunlop SP Sport A2s: they wear before their warranty. I've got over 25k on my set. I'll probably replace them shortly after putting 30k on them (I don't like wearing tires down too far). They may conceivably make it to 40k before exposing a wear bar, but I'm not pushing it that far. I don't mash the accelerator or brake, but do go quickly around corners.

And actually, worn, bald tires grip much better on dry surfaces than new tires, unless the rubber compound changes (as it does on some tires...gripper, softer rubber to start, then harder, less-grippy rubber to finish...many winter tires are made this way). A touch more torque too, since the effective moment arm is reduced; not that it'd be enough for my "butt-dyno" to notice with the 107lbft my Pro engine puts out.

meinrad

I don't know how that would work too well. When I shake my wipers they still always have ice and stuff in them. It takes some effort to keep them clean.

What we really need are heated wipers. Couldn't be too hard to create a piece of heat tape like those used on water pipes and in gutters.

Warm wipers would be awesome. In my old Cicic you could tap the wipers and have them stop a few inches up the windshield. Then the defrosters really heated them up and kept them working.

protege_fan

You guys have to see these...
http://www.microheat.com/

Aynway, I don't think it solves the problem of ice buildup on the wipers themselves though.

moparbad

BF Goodrich Traction TA/V 195/55/15 OEM size. Any experience with these? Or Continental ContiExtreme Contact in a 205/55/15 size (plus zero?)
These are two types I'm considering for my 03 LX when I get rid of the Potenza's. And the sooner the better.

claytondennis1

This is in response to post #22820, 11/30: I've had service done by both Wescott and Hine (I was working in San Diego at the time), and bought my daughter's '99 ES at Hine in March of '99 (while she was at UCSD). Your problem is that you went to the wrong dealer. Hine is a great dealer that I would recommend to anybody. BTW, Diablo Mazda in Walnut Creek is also an excellent dealer.

protegextwo

I purchased two 2000 Mazda Protegé ES's in March of 2000. One vehicle, I drive and the other is for my wife, Trudy. Both cars have automatic transmissions and came standard with the 195/65R15 All-Season Performance Bridgestone Potenza RE92's. I loved everything about the Bridgestone Potenza RE92's, except... they slipped badly at launch on wet pavement. I replaced my Bridgestone Potenza&#146;s at 35,744 miles and Trudy's at 36,308 miles. They had a tad less than 4/32's. I had no issues with safety with either set of Bridgestone Potenza. I rotated them every 5,000 miles and the tread wore evenly and I could have driven them legally until 2/32's, however my local BJ's Warehouse Wholesale store was having a tire sale and I replaced the Bridgestone Potenza RE92's on both cars with BF Goodrich All-Season Touring TA 205/55R15's at a excellent cost of $82.00 per tire. The $82.00 price included sales tax, new valve stems, mounting, balancing, old tire recycling, and lifetime rotation and road hazard tire repair. BF Goodrich lists the BF Goodrich Touring TA 205/55R15&#146;s original tread depth as 10.5/32&#146;s. I have rotated the BF Goodie TA's every 5,000 miles on both cars and they still 7/32's remaining at 65,150 miles after about 28,800 miles of driving. I like the BF Goodrich All-Season Touring TA very much. Not as cool or exotic as Falkin's, Yokohama's, Toyo's or Pirelli's, nonetheless; the BF Goodrich TA's are quiet, comfortable and composed on dry or wet pavement and do a pretty dang good job in the snow. Best of all the entire installed price of $82.00 per tire for the TA&#146;s was more than fair. IMHO, the BF Goodrich All-Season Touring TA 's are a workingman's version of the $165 per tire Michelin Pilot Sports.

Respectfully,
Old Head

meinrad

I think you'll like the new Falken's in the snow Dale. While they will never be confused with snow tires, I was able to get around pretty darn well Friday after work in about 6" of snow.

Meade can attest to how steep my driveway is at work and I had little trouble getting out of it. There were times last year that I couldn't get out until I had completely cleared it.

chicagopro

for the info, Raymond.

Jeez...now if only my tires would GET here!!!