Mazda Protegé

newpro4me

We have decided to just wait for the 2002 Protege ES to come out. I had Whatley Mazda in Orangeburg try to locate me one, but after two days, they said they could not find one. Rather than order one, we'll just wait for the 02. I will take advantage of the S plan and maybe some good financing when the new models come out. Good luck in your search!

hkchan

Your invoice is $560 less than mine. It's the moonroof discount. You won't get another $700 off for the moonroof.

It's highly improbable to beat the S-Plan price. Maybe if you wait until it's clearance time on the 2001's.

glideslope

Does anyone have any information on the 02 Protege'?

Regards,
Mark.

djmax813

You and i are very similar in that we are both Honda fans. I own a 97 accord and just turned in a 98 leased civic. Yes it is very difficult to make the change but i did. As you stated the new civics are bland and underpowered and Honda dealers are very arrogant because they have such a good product. So i made the leap to a Pro ES and i coulnt be happier. You may also want to check out a Nissan Sentra Se. That is another decent choice buy you will love this Protege!! Good Luck!

fowler3

You won’t regret changing to a Mazda Protegé from a Honda Civic or even an Accord. I bought 4 Honda Accords, 1 Civic, and 1 Odyssey over a period of 15 years and recently changed to a Protegé.

Honda isn’t building the cars they use to. I quickly came to hate a ’98 Accord and sold it back to the dealer in 30 days. The ’97 I traded for it was a much better car. The new Civics look like road toys and are still underpowered. Worse, the seats are so hard you can’t get comfortable and there’s no leg room in the back.

And you are right about Honda dealer attitude being arrogant. Test driving a 2001 Civic was a quick trip around the block and right into his office to figure up the price, which he quickly padded to over $20,000!

Go for a Protegé! You will like being treated nice for a change. And you will love the car if you get at least the 2.0 engine. It’s head and shoulders above the Civic. And you will join a great group of owners right here on Edmunds ready to answer any questions you may have.

fowler3

gdkarma74

hkchan: What is the deal with the S-plan exactly? How do I know if my dealer participates? What do I need to do to get it and what price does that put me at before rebates? Also can anyone clear up the moonroof debate - the dealer told me that Premium package is free, so that the Pro with premium is the same price as the Pro without? Is that right?

djmax813: so how has it been going from the Honda to the Protege? Did you find the engine loud at all? so far that is the only worry I have since engines tend to get slightly louder with age anyway. Did you get the premium package or the ES straight up?

fowler3

The engine isn’t loud unless you wind it up all the time, which you shouldn’t do for the first 600 or 700 miles.

Are you buying it to trash or to drive? If the first, then it will be BOOM BOOM for you instead of ZOOM ZOOM. LOL!

fowler3

gdkarma74

Thanks for the info. I have wondered about the build of the new Honda's especially the interior of the new civic, it just doesn't look right to me. I considered buying a used 97 accord or 98 civic but the dealer was coming up with prices that put me at new car payments anyway so what is the point.

I was at both dealers today and the difference was remarkable. I have been a many Honda dealerships and it always seems like you have to be making payments to be part of the "club", even the service guy was trying to get me to buy a new one because mine was "old". Today was my first time at Mazda and the salesman was polite and never even asked to talk dollars at all, which was a nice change. I left Honda feeling pressured to make the $200 over invoice deal by tomorrow night being the end of this salesmans month and I left Mazda feeling like no worries we'll get you that Silver ES in the next shipment, no order necessary. What a difference. I hope the rest of my Mazda experience goes that well. Just want to get the best possible deal is all. Thanks again

gdkarma

fowler3

My rule of thumb has always been -- buy a NEW CAR, even entry level if necessary -- before paying the same amount for a used car, out of warrenty, and with higher interest rates. You can always trade up later and get a better deal. A car payment is a car payment and you feel better paying on a new car.

But I doubt you will trade a Protegé for a long time once you realize what a great car it is. I’ve been buying, selling and trading cars for...geeze, I didn’t realize it’s been THAT LONG! Well, it’s been... uhmm...since you were born probably.

Put it this way, I come from a family of car dealers going back to 1917. My dad was a new car dealer and his cousins were new car dealers. A fouth generation is still selling new cars.

fowler3

hkchan

No. The moonroof is free, either as a stand-alone option or as part of the Premium Package. The discount is $560 off the invoice and $700 off the MSRP. The following prices on an ES with auto. trans. and Premium Package include the moonroof discounts. MSRP/$17,695 invoice/$16,461 S-Plan/$16,267. Take the $500 rebate (or low-rate financing but not both) and the $400 college grad. rebate if you qualify.

Join the EEA (www.eea.org) for $40 (one-year membership). You may then request a pin which you'll need. S-Plan participation is voluntary. Ask the dealer(s).

lindathomp2000

I am in Syracuse, actually Liverpool, a lot. Maybe we will see each other on the road. I'll be in my ES 2001, Seabreeze green zoom, zoom with a nose guard. I did get a ticket though -last week. First time in many years! Oh well. It's worth it!

protegenic

I just returned from yet another nice visit to my Mazda dealer, Roswell Mazda near Atlanta. I took it in for the usual oil change and tire rotation, but, while I was there, I decided to have them check out a little trim problem I was having. Since I had purchased this with an after market leather package, they are going to get that company to come to my office or home to fix it at my convenience! Doesn't get much more convenient than that. During this discussion, my salesman dropped by to look at it. While that in and of itself is not big news, the fact that I bought it two years ago and the salesman is still there surprised me!

Overall, I am very pleased with my decision to purchase a Mazda. The Protege has been a great car. The only drag is they keep improving it each year and tempting me to buy another! I don't know if owners of 2000 Civics can say the same.

jstandefer

protegenic, you are certainly right about the improvements year after year. I bought my '99 ES after seeing it at the LA International Auto Show in January 2000. I thought the '99 was great and didn't need improvement (plus, I figured since it was all new for '99, they wouldn't make any improvements for a few years at least...). I figured my '99 ES would be creme de le creme for a while. Boy, was I wrong!

For 2000, they added all the nice chrome interior handles and color-keyed the interior better, new steering wheel and gauge cluster plus illuminated driver window control and the side-impact air bags! I immediately wanted to trade up (alas, being upside down in a vehicle SUCKS!). Then, for 2001, Mazda decides the shake up the entire bag and give the Pro new headlights, grill, hood, suspension tweaks, body stiffening, modular audio system, 6-disc changer, standard fog lights (ES), and a rear spoiler (ES)! To make matters worse (for me), they added 16-inch wheels, 4-wheel disc brakes, and a bigger, quieter, more fuel-efficient engine!!!! And, of course, they add the awesome Protege5!

I just keep feeling like my '99 is falling behind the times. It is now old!!! :-(

jstandefer

Could we see the awesome Mazda rotary engine in more than one vehicle soon? If this article from The Car Connection is correct, we may see an awesome new Miata powered not by a engine that goes "boing, boing", but an engine that goes "hmmmmm"...

http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=3701

From owning an RX-7 (and wishing I never traded it in!), I can say there's nothing like the feeling and rush of a rotary engine humming to 10,000rpm with each shift with all of the vibration-free refinement that no piston engine can ever approach!!

roninjouten

My family has owned two miatas over the years and I pray they don't ruin wonderful, fun and most importantly reliable little car with a rotary engine. That'd be typical Mazda though...you've got a good thing but shoot yourself in the foot by installing a rotary engine.

maltb

The only negative I've read about the Miata is its lack of power. The roatary would be a nice option for those who want the ability to do 360s in their garage.

I for one don't want a rotary. Since my teen years, I've maintained a relatively clean driving record and one weekend in an RX almost ruined that. When you are going that fast, even patrol cars are a blur.

proteger

Sorry to send the message again. It is corrupted by the spell check.

tocan, thanks for the answer about fuel type. I just got my ES2.0 three weeks ago from North Toronto Mazda. I have already had 750 kilometers on it. I am still in honeymoon with it. Yesterday I was surprised again when I drove this little baby back from Scarborough cliff. It climbed the steep mountain like running on the highways.

I called my dealer about break-in, he told me that 110 KM/H on 401 was OK during break-in, is he right?

Also I wants to tint all windshield because my wife is sensitive to the July sunshine in Toronto.Do you think it is a good idea?

jstandefer

Myself, and many other owners I know from the San Diego/Socal RX-7 club have had many trouble free miles (mine had 137,000, others have 200,000+) on their rotary engines. The exception being the 13B-REW twin-turbo rotaries and the R100 to RX-5 early rotary engines. The twin-turbo's were generally reliable unless you modified the engine and/or increased the boost pressure, which almost everyone I know with one has done. However, there was a problem with inadequate cooling for those as well.

A naturally aspirated rotary engine with proper maintenance (read: check and add oil weekly, change spark plugs frequently, change oil religiously) should last a very long time. Certainly, don't make the rotary the standard engine, but make it available for those of us who want to attach wings and take flight!!! Besides, what would Mazda be without the rotary engine?

Sporin

Besides be unsafe, tinting you entire windshield is illegal most everywhere.

Buy her a good pair of sunglasses. Those can come off at night, windshield tint can't.

fowler3

How about a welder’s mask with a fullface Polarized plastic shield?
Or tinted contact lens? NASCAR drivers’ helmets with tinted face covers are right expensive, but...Hey! Go to an Ophthalmologist and ask for a disposable pair of cataract sunglasses. They protect your eyes from glare on top, front, and sides. Sunglasses made that way cost $60 at opticians and cheaper versions are available at Wal-Mart for $18.00.

fowler3

vocus

Since you all mentioned the RX-7 and (I think) someone mentioned about how much they missed theirs, I have a friend who has a 1986 RX-7 with stick for sale in the VA/DC area. Post here or e-mail me if anyone is interested.

roninjouten

I only hear good things from car enthusiasts about rotary engines - but from non-enthusiasts they seem to hate their RX experiences. Interesting. The turbo engine you refer to, is this the one in the last gen RX? I've read it was a nightmare. A friend of mine dumped his within 2 years of the purchase. By '97 it had become such a problem he moved on to a car with a normal engine.

BTW, a simple supercharger can put a Miata over 200 HP, thus making that little car a monster. Although from my experience with the little bugger's normal engine, if you've got a five speed, there's plenty of power and the handling is dream-like.

When I think Miata, I think fun, reliable and great handling. When I hear rotary, I tend to shriek in horror from all the stories I've been fed.

magilla

With the price of gas now being what it is and what it is going to be (gulp), do you really have to run 91 octane in the ES and P5? Doesn't it have a knock sensor that will take care of the detonation? Really don't want to deal with Honda on a Civic EX because I know what a great vehicle the ES is, but where I live there's about a .40/gal difference in 87 and 91octane. That translates to about a $200/yr difference just in gas price, not factoring in the difference in gas mileage between the ES and Honda (sorry for the foul language... ;-) Curious about real world usage.

vocus

I have a 2001 ES with nearly 7000 miles now, and have never used Premium gas in it. I use mid-grade about every 5th tank to keep the engine clean, but mostly use regular. I drive about 2000 miles a month, mostly highway. The ES does NOT require premium fuel to perform at its peak though. Regular 87 is fine for the engine. It has also been posted here before that there was a misprint in the owner's manual with the fuel requirements, so there is definitely some truth in it.

jstandefer

I'm not sure where everyone is reading that the P5 and ES require 91 octane fuel... although, I think I saw it on MSN's CarPoint where they also state the Protege is built in the U.S. (eeek!). The fact of the matter is that the Protege (sedan or 5-door) is built and assembled in Japan.

Also, the Protege's 1.6L, 1.8L, and 2.0L engines require 87 octane.

Oh... I see where the confusion is coming from... MazdaUSA.com lists the minimum required octane as 91 RON. Research Octane Number (RON) is a standard not used in the United States for retail purposes. We use CLC (Cost of Living Council) which is the average of the RON and MON (Motor Octane Number). You will see on your gas pumps that the octane number has been calculated using the R + M / 2 method. Basically, here's where it breaks down to:

Canada | United States
91 RON = 87 CLC (regular unleaded)
95 RON = 91 CLC (premium unleaded)

If you notice, MazdaUSA.com lists the Millenia S as requiring 95 RON. We all know that does not exist at your everyday gas station here in the U.S. All Protege's require 87 octane fuel. This even includes the MP3.

peregrine_11

When I checked out my owners manual this last weekend, I recall it said the 2.0L Pro needed 91 octane. There was no mention of CLC or RON. I'm glad to hear it doesn't need that premium gas, because it sure does pack a punch on the wallet...

On an unrelated note, I also noticed on my MSRP sticker (and on my car, shortly thereafter) that they'd added "colored outer mirrors" as a no-charge option on my Pro. Have other people gotten this? I thought I'd heard this as a minor gripe and wish-list item from people--that the mirrors were still black. I wonder if this is another mid-model-year "improvement" Mazda's making to the ES...kind of like the free moonroof? Any thoughts?

mazdafun

Wouldn't that be a cool option?

Can't wait for the RX-8.

roninjouten

For 2.05 one can get 87 octane or for 2.25 get 91 octane. On a ten gallon tank we're only talking about a 20.50 v. 22.50. Hardly noticeable. But then again we're getting screwed for 87 octane!

hkchan

Yes, I took delivery of an ES seven days ago and it had the colored mirrors. It's more like end-of-model-year improvement. They still need to get rid of the pillar-mounted antenna and maybe a valet key.

maltb

I agree with the silly pillar mount antenna, but a valet key? I didn't notice the three pointed star on the grille of the Protege. Did I miss something?

jstandefer

oh malt... could you perhaps confirm this for me...

I was just reading a Mazda (Japan) News Release regarding the MazdaSpeed Familia (our Protege MP3) and the MazdaSpeed Roadster (perhaps a Miata MPS?). Both are equipped with MP3 players, custom tuned suspension, exhaust upgrades, body kits, etc. Is it coming?

Hey, that's not fair! I just did the calculation from PS to HP. The MazdaSpeed Familia (MP3) gets 172HP!!! Why do we only get 140??

maltb

140hp: Thank the EPA...

Jerry, Jerry, Jerry...only public knowledge makes it on here. Besides, I have no clue.

tocan

Just a (I hope) helpful suggestion. If you send a message again you can delete the original one, so that only the better message will be read by others.

Nomi

tocan

Here is a link to the FAQ from Petro-Canada. It discusses the fact that what shows on the pumps here in Canada too is referred to as the Anti-Knock Index (AKI) which is the average of MON and RON. This is the same as in the U.S. They also state that some foreign car manual's recommend RON instead of AKI, and they suggest that you subtract 5 from RON to get AKI.

http://www.petro-canada.ca/eng/canada/retail/fuels/gasolines/gas-faq.html

We have 4 big gas companies in this country. All have regular gas at 87 AKI, midrange at 89 AKI, and super ranges from 91 to 94 AKI.

I hope this clears a few things up.

Nomi

hkchan

Didn't know it was a luxury feature. (All?) Toyotas/Hondas/Subarus have them. What about the rest of the Mazda line?

edmund2460

GDkarmaa , I believe HKchan, said 16,267 for ES/Auto/Prem for invoice and then 500 off of that for a rebate. I've confirmed that several times in talking to dealers. Now for the next most confusing part, which I could never get a good answer from MazdaUsa. Do I stil get the special dealer financing (1.9/36 or 4.9/48) on the 15,767 price ? Or do they take away the 500 rebate. I told customer service that most car mfrers offer rebate OR special rates not both. I think the answer I heard was that u get both. Does anyone know? (I still don't have a car yet - no dealer will offer to order one - they say they can , they'll check with the boss and then never call back -WHY? do they lose money ordering?(

edmund2460

If the dealer says that he can get an ES for u from 200 miles away,but he needs to send a driver, should one worry that they'll send some leadfoot who'll redline it all the way down. Isn't there a break in period for new cars nowadays? What do u guys have to say?

hkchan

I always thought it was "or", not "both", but if even MazdaUSA itself can't give you a good answer, I'm speechless.

I would stay away from getting a car that's 200 miles away (unless it's trucked to your local dealer). In fact, I would prefer to buy one with fewer than 10 miles on the odometer.

panamaltd2

My 1997 Toyota RAV4 Limited has a valet key. It is pretty common now, but I NEVER use it.

hboyd

I had a silver valet key in old '95 ES along with TWO full nice, plastic/metal keys; Mazda is being cheap again. Now they only give you ONE, nice plastic/metal key and a cheap, plain silver key !! ... Oh well... not complaining... just laughing! I really like the keyless entry pads on my '01 ES; Mazda cut a small corner by NOT adding a trunk release button!! Even my friend's '00 Saturn SL2 has a trunk release button!! Oh well.. not complaining... just laughing;

One more tiny design gripe: Those darn manual door lock levers on the '01s are not COUNTERsunk inside the top paneling!!! I liked the old '95 design much better. My elbow has no place to rest comfortably. Ohhhh well... sometimes old designs are still the best... like the new larger radio buttons/switches.... a landmark improvement over previous models!!!

MARTIN

browntrout1

I went in for an oil change today and various other things and the service guy at Mazda said that that the protege requires 91 octane becuase of the catalytic converter. Over time, 87 octane gas will limit the performace of the catalytic converter from what I understood. I also asked him if 91 octane will give better has mileage and he said yes. I think it's the oxygen sensor that is used to determine how much gas to use weather it's 87 or 91 octane.

fowler3

My 2001 LX 2.0 came with a valet key, plain silver. The regular key has black plastic on it. Unlike the Honda keys, which have soft black plastic and a nasty feature combined with the auto door locks. When the key is in the ignition (on Hondas) and the ignition is ON (or for accessories) but the engine is not started, it automatically locks the doors. One can easily get locked out if he steps outside and closes the door. I did! Fortunately, the righthand door lock was broken.

Some times it pays NOT to get things fixed right away.

I wonder if Mazda’s Anti-theft feature works like on Hondas? That black soft plastic covered key has a chip in it that has to match a chip in the car’s computer. Or the car won’t start and it can’t be hot-wired.
There is no chip in the Protegé’s key on regular models such as LX and ES.

fowler3

hkchan

I only know I received two keys: one with plastic and one in plain metal. Both keys, as stated on page 3-2 of the owner's manual, operate all locks. I take it that your "valet" key doesn't open the trunk.

vocus

I don't get it. They provide you with two keys, one with the plastic on it and one without. What's the point of having a "valet" key if it still provides access to the glovebox and trunk? Makes no sense to me. They need to change that feature. At least the 2001 models have locking seatbacks and a lockable trunk release. I like those features for when I park my car downtown in Baltimore.

vocus

Is there a Protege chat tonight? I was just curious, because I logged on last week and it was not on. Is it going on this week? Did it go on last week or not? Maybe I was just having trouble logging on. Oh well, someone let me know today. Thanks!

ZOOM ZOOM

protegextwo

Today,... my wife's Protege gets the "2nd Annual Summer Show Car Bug Splat 2 Step Glaze & Wax Treatment". Hehe!!! Get this, she made me mow the lawn before I'm permitted to "play with the cars". Well the darn lawn is mowed and her Emerald Mica PRO-ES is about to get one of the best detail jobs in Lancaster, Pa. If any one "wants" to stop over and help, I'll buy you a couple of beers when were done, hehe!!!

Step #1 complete hand wash.
Step #2 3M Imperial Hand Glaze.
Step #3 Meguiar's #26 yellow wax.

Should only take me about 3 1/2 hours. I'll let you know how the job goes, later this afternoon, lol!!! Zoom Zoom Zoom!

Respectfully,
Larry

maltb

browntrout1:
The dealer was blowing smoke. If anything, the additives in the 91 octane are more likely to cause problems for the cat, but like I said, it's not likely. The oxygen sensor only measures exhaust temp which allows the PCM to determine the amount of fuel in the exhaust. If the engine is running rich, the exhaust temp goes down. If it is running lean, the exhaust temp goes up. Some cars will "hunt" at idle while the mixture is being adjusted by the PCM.

fowler: The Protege (to the best of my knowledge) does not utilize a chip in the key. If the plastic fobbed keys had a chip, the silver key wouldn't start the car.

bjewett

I have read in both consumer reports and car and driver that the deal of improved
mileage from high octane fuel is something of a myth. You might need it to
avoid engine knock, but for most cars the lower octane works just fine (I believe
there are some exceptions, but the manufacturer should specify that you need
premium if so).

Brian

panamaltd2

Valet keys really only work on vehicals with locking glove-boxes and rear trunks that can only be opened from the outside. My RAV4's "trunk" can only be opened from the outside but if the valet REALLY wanted to get back there they could just climb over the back seats and steal the priceless gems I carry with me at all times (J/K). So the only really security it gives me is knowing that I can lock my phone in the glove-box and the valet won't use it. The Protege does not come with a valet key. The silver key is simply a spare. Hope this ends the mystery that seems to shroud valet keys in this discussion. The real truth of the matter is valet keys have really no good use!

fowler3

That’s what I said. ‘There is no chip in the Protegé’s key on regular models such as LX and ES.’

There may be a chip in Mazda’s Anti-theft optioned cars.

fowler3