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Mazda Protege5

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Comments

  • mazdafunmazdafun Posts: 2,322
    Hey, congratulations!


    1) Window rattle when not closed all the way. Not much to do here. Either open it more or close it. I note the same rattle in my sedan. I think it's the loose edge of the window glass hitting against the trim on the door on either side of the glass. If it really bugs you, you can attempt to apply some caulk or foam tape under the metal clips that hold these trim pieces in place.


    2) 6x8 or 5x7 (with a hole pattern that also fits 6x8) up front. Here are a few sites about speaker replacement in the P5:


    www.protege5online.com/Tech_Help/Audio/ [break to bypass the 115-letter limit] Speakers/speakers.html


    http://byrneweb.com/sunburn/newcar/install.html


    www.astolfo.com/p5/p5.asp


    To put anything else but round speakers in the rear doors would mean cutting away metal (not recommended as this would weaken them in side impacts), unless you pick speakers that are tiny enough so that you have to add metal to mount them.

  • sharonfsharonf Posts: 120
    I think I heard a rattle today for the first time also. It happened to be one of the few times I didn't have the radio on. I had both the right side windows almost completely open...and the left side shut...and seemed to be hearing a rattle from the driver's door?? I'm going to investigate it further tomorrow.
  • mudflatmudflat Posts: 47
    Needing a cargo tray to hold my messy chainsaw and hockey mask, but being too cheap to spring for a nice factory one, I started looking around and happened to come across an acceptable substitute at Lowe's for $12.96. It's a 36"x24"x8" semi-flexible black plastic tub that I found in the concrete section. It fits fine, with about 2" of clearance on each side between the towers, and about 6" back to the lower edge of the hatch opening. It's called a MacCourt all purpose super tub.
    I have't had a problem because of it sliding around, but plunking it down on a Natural Aire foam airconditioning filter (Wal-Mart) will anchor it nicely.
  • I've been reading this site for years and am finally doing by first post. Have some questions for the experts before I do the trade.

    1. I've seen pics here of P5 withoutroof rack but also without inserts (seems as though the guy who did this just used tape a glue to plug the holes -- not to my taste). Does anyone have pics of P5 with inserts as provided by Mazda?
    2. Will I notice that much of an increase in acceleration/power from the 1.8L to the 2.0L? (Was interested to read a posting here about someone who had both a 2000 ES and a new P5.)
    3. Just read Consumer Reports article on the P5 class of vehicles. Very confusing/frustrating. CR puts the P5 down the list, yet when the ones above it in the rates are examined P5's competition always fall short, whether it's reliability, mileage, warranty or fit 'n finish. CR's big beef seems to be noise and stiffness of ride, which finally brings me to my question: Is the ride all that different between the ES and the P5. Is the P5 all that much stiffer? I don't quite understand the suspension differences between the ES and the Pro5. (Were there changes made in suspension between the 2000ES and the 2002ES?) Secondly, I've never thought the road noise in my ES was all that great and I have OEM tires. Can't imagine how much quieter replacing my tires with those recommended on this board would be. Is cabin noise more pronounced due to a unified cabin in the Pro5 (even with a cargo cover) versus a separate truck in the ES? Your ideas on noise and ride in general would be appreciated. By the way, I have test driven a P5 and loved it, but when you're psyched about a first drive you miss things.
    4. Has anyone used a roofrack on an ES? I have one which I used on my old 92 Pro but am a bit reluctant to use it on my "pristine" 2000. Don't want any scratches.
    Thanks again for any input... looking forward to contributing more.
  • protegextwoprotegextwo Posts: 1,265
    This year was the 33rd anniversary of Cuyahoga River burning. The river was so thick with pollution that it caught fire June 21, 1969!
    The burning river mobilized the nation and the flaming Cuyahoga River became a rallying point for passage of the Clean Water Act. I was just a kid, when I lived in the Cleveland Heights section of Cleveland from 1968 thru 1971. I will always remember my dad taking me down to where the Cuyahoga merged with Lake Erie! A lot of dead Yellow Perch and Carp. At the time, there was a very popular T.V. commercial, a native American Indian in full dress surveyed the site of a polluted landscape and cried at the mess. Everywhere you went, people wore Ecology Now T-shirts. As you know, Lake Erie is vastly cleaner in the year 2002, however I've heard the Cuyahoga River is reverting to a badly polluted sewer? Jeeze,....to bad for Cleveland.

    -old head
  • sunbyrnesunbyrne Posts: 210
    I'm not sure they're really all *that* different. The ride in the P5 is about the same as in the ES--it's not noticeably stiffer, at least not to me.

    There is more wind noise in the P5, but most of that is because of the roof rack. I don't hear a difference in road noise, but I'm not very sensitive to road noise.
  • pciskowskipciskowski Posts: 155
    I saw this on another board where someone was talking about their Millenia versus an Accord, but I think we can all relate:

    "I also don't have to try my remote on every car in the WalMart parking lot to figure out which one is mine because it looks exactly like the other 5000 cars parked there. I just look for the best looking car on the lot, start it and drive off."
  • mazdafunmazdafun Posts: 2,322
    Look on the sticker and you'll see the P5 is listed as an ES-5. That means their trim level is essentially the same. The only real differences (IMO) are:

    Sedan has a stiffer rear end (because the speaker deck is a brace for the two rear strut towers, whereas there isn't anyplace to put one in the P5).

    P5 comes with a front strut tower brace.

    P5 comes with MP3 body clad-ons (front bumper & fogs, side sills).

    P5 antenna is a flexible whip (removable for when you go through an automatic car wash -- I wouldn't) while sedan's is a manual pull-out.

    P5 2002.5 has side marker lights on the front fenders.

    P5 rear speakers are in the rear doors and are round v. elliptical.

    P5 rear doors have small map pockets (still no cupholders).

    P5 has more rear head-room.

    P5 rear outboard seats have adjustable headrests.

    P5 is shorter by 3-4 inches (to minimize effect of more sheet-metal in the rear on handling). Great for anyone with lots of junk in their garage.

    Since the P5's cargo area is more open to the cabin, you'll hear more road noise from the back. All hatches and wagons are like this versus their sedan brethren.

    2.0L v. 1.8L. I don't think you'll note any real difference in 0-whatever times. If anything, the P5 will be slower due to its additional weight (more sheetmetal and bracing for the wagon shape...I think about 200lb). The consensus seems to be that the 2.0L makes more torque down low for faster starts in daily local driving, but seems to run out of power at a lower RPM than the 1.8L. The 2.0 is harsher-sounding at elevated RPMs (think 5000 and up) than the 1.8L. Economy seems to be the same.

    I use a roof-rack on my '99LX. I take it off when I'm not using it to avoid the wind noise and the hit on my economy (I notice a loss of about 2mpg with it on, even with the fairing). It also minimizes scratching due to dirt accumulating where the rack contacts the car. Since the rack clips onto the door frame, your door weather seals are also compromised when the rack is mounted. This leads to additional wind noise and water seeping in between the doors and the door frames.

    Once your rack is "tailored" to your ES, it should take only a few minutes to remount it. It takes 2 minutes to remove my roof rack (Mondial) and about 10 (inlcluding cleaning) to remount it. The hardest part is putting it in or taking it out of its storage spot in my utility room.

    Also, before I mount the rack, I carefully clean off both the rack fairing weatherstripping, footpads and clips and the areas on my Pro where the rack touches to avoid trapping grit.
  • hurler4hurler4 Posts: 104
    lovemy2000es1, What were the top picks in Consumer Reports? Was the P5 really near the bottom?
    I was at a bbq yesterday and my friend who was hosting it just bought a Pontiac Vibe. I took a good look at it inside and out, and it is very impressive. I had rented a P5 in southern California a couple of weeks ago and loved it, but the Vibe seems more solidly built. Was the Vibe at or near the top of the list in Consumer Reports?
    What other hatchbacks were listed? I really want a hatchback, but don't want to jump in too quick until I compare them all.
  • mazdafunmazdafun Posts: 2,322
    Read the various articles (including those on Edmunds, who really like the P5) and then take them for real test drives (local, freeway, hard stops, tight turns etc.) before making your final decision. They're all affordable, but then again, $15-$22k (or higher, depending on brand and model) is still a big chunk of change.
  • mazdafunmazdafun Posts: 2,322
    ...Edmund's own test drivers and reviewers really like the Protege/P5 as well. I find their reviews pretty well-balanced (considering value, fun-to-drive, economy, reliability and overall design). Automobile magazine's reviews almost always include comments on design. While the look of a vehicle is pretty subjective, it's still interesting to read their comments.
  • silver_bulletsilver_bullet Posts: 1,339
    Car & Driver recently did a comparo that put the P5 at the top, and the Vibe near the bottom. They aren't Consumer Reports by a long shot, but you might find their reasoning interesting.
  • sunbyrnesunbyrne Posts: 210
    I was recently talking about these two with a friend of mine who just bought a Matrix. I think it comes down to this:

    If you're a driver first and a general consumer second, read the C&D review. The P5 has the best driving experience and if that's what you care about, well, that's what C&D cares about, so that's the most appropriate review.

    If you're a general consumer first and a driver second, read the CR review.

    Having driven the Matrix XRS, the Focus ZX5, and owning a P5, I have to agree with C&D, of course. :-)
  • silver_bulletsilver_bullet Posts: 1,339
    A good friend, who I would consider a serious car guy, recently bought a Vibe, but I think it came down to availability rather than driving dynamics (he lives out in the sticks in Iowa). I'm looking forward to his reports as the car gets some miles put on it. I did my best to get him to drive to a nearby town with a Mazda dealer, but he opted for the Pontiac due to better access to dealer service.
  • seminole_kevseminole_kev Posts: 1,722
    still think it looks better than the Matrix...but what do I know ;-)
  • hurler4hurler4 Posts: 104
    I kind of wish there were more choices in the hatchbacks. I was in Ireland during the winter, and they have all kinds of great hatchbacks. Even Fiat has a pretty nice 5-door over there. The Focus 5-door seems much nicer over there than the one here. Seems more solidly built...
    Has anyone heard if Honda or Nissan is going to come out with a hatchback?
  • silver_bulletsilver_bullet Posts: 1,339
    A neighbor just bought a Matrix (XRS?), and it is, er, different ;-)
  • dsm6dsm6 Posts: 813
    Honda Civic Si.
  • seminole_kevseminole_kev Posts: 1,722
    Go over to the "Vibe/ Matrix v. PTCruiser v. Focus ZX5 v. Protege5 v. Elantra GT" hatchback topic to see a 5-door Civic. Catch a look at the Honda Jazz if you want also.

    To tie this into the topic, I don't think the 5-door Civic would steal many sales for the Pro 5. Two different buyers.
  • jas9297jas9297 Posts: 26
    Wow, the UK site gives an idea of the Honda 5-doors that could conceivably be developed in the US. http://www.honda.co.uk/new.html. My impression is that the number of different 5 doors is actually confusing. (Not to mention the many engine size options common in Europe).


    With respect to Consumer Reports, can anyone with access tell us what is says, at least the main points?


    Thanks

  • feijaifeijai Posts: 17
    Consumer Reports rated (in order of preference) the Jetta Wagon, Matrix, Vibe, Focus CX-5, Protege5, and Impreza Outback Sport. All the cars were in the Very Good category -- the race was tight. In their larger ordering, including similar cars previously reviewed, they had it as Jetta Wagon, RAV4, Forester, Focus Wagon, Matrix, Vibe, Focus CX-5, Honda CR-V, Protege5, Impreza Outback Sport, and PT-Cruiser.

    You can see the trend: CR ranked the cars based roughly on how much they had the characteristics of an SUV. Specifically, big interiors, bigengines, soft quiet rides, high-up seating, and cargo area were more important than handling, reliability, and gas mileage! Times have changed for CR apparently.

    Despite it having both the best reliability (often by far) AND the best tested gas mileage (the Matrix got less!) of the group, Consumer Reports knocks the P5 down because the ride is too stiff and because it has the seating position of a regular car rather than an SUV. Odd. Because those are two of my favorite features of the car.

    CR liked the Jetta Wagon best, despite its mediocre reliability and transmission. As for the Ford, CR a while back rated Focus models highly, only to discover later that they have absolutely dismal reliability. What's funny is that CR haven't owned up to their mistake yet. They are STILL top-rating the Focus highly despite the killer reliability problems. They actually rated the Focus higher than the Protege5, even though they're on the opposite *extremes* of CR's reliability rankings.

    The real fight is between the Matrix and the Protege5. Matrix gets slightly better: transmission, rear seat comfort, controls, and better: ride and tall-person access (. The Protege5 gets slightly better reliability and emergency handling. Odd that CR specifically noted the problems with the Matrix's driving position and rear seat visibility but didn't mark the car down for it. Yet it was the Matrix's upright driving position, tiny rear window, and loose handling that led me to pick the Protege5 over the Matrix in the first. That and the fact that the Matrix is hideously ugly, though that was a minor nitpick.

    Talking points:

    Jetta Wagon
    Hi: ride, quietness, fit and finish, turning circle, safety, cargo room
    Lo: power delivering, rear seat room, premium fuel, fussy to fold rear seat

    Matrix
    Vibe
    Hi: interior flexibility, access, rear seat room, transmission, availability of all-wheel drive
    Lo: noisy engine, awkward driving position, rear seat visibility

    Focus CX-5
    Hi: handling, ride, offset crash results,
    Lo: reliability, noise, luggage space

    Protege5
    Hi: handling, breaking
    Lo: ride, noise, access

    Impreza Outback Sport
    Hi: AWD, Offset crash results
    Lo: ride, fuel economy, cargo volume, break pedal feel

    Ratings:

    4=excellent 3=very good 2=good 1=fair 0=poor. The Vibe gets marked the same as the Matrix except as noted.

    Jetta Matrix/Vibe Focus CX-5 Protege5 Impreza
    Acceleration 3 2 2 2 2
    Transmission 1 4 3 3 3
    Routine Handling 3 3 4 3 3
    Emergency Handling 3 2 3 3 2
    Braking 4 4 4 4 3
    Ride 3 3/2 3 1 2
    Ride (Full) 3 3/2 3 1 2
    Noise 3 2 2 2 2
    Driving Position 3 2 3 3 3
    Front Seat 3 3 3 3 3
    Rear Seat 1 3 2 2 2
    Access 3 4 3 2 2
    Controls 3 4 4 3 3
    Fit and Finish 4 3 2 3 3
    Cargo Area 2 1 0 1 0
    Reliability 2 3 0 4 3

    Mileage 23 24 24 25 22
  • taddisontaddison Posts: 99
    >They actually rated the Focus higher than the
    >Protege5, even though they're on the opposite
    >*extremes* of CR's reliability rankings

    FYI, Reliability is not factored into the C.R. "overall score" for a car. The reliability >does< affect whether a car gets a "recommended" check mark. Look at the list and you'll see that even though the Foci are quite high up the list they don't get the check marks because they are unreliable.

    In general, I think you are correct in noting that CR likes "family friendly" features like high seating positions, soft and quiet rides etc. They definitely don't care much for enthusiast cars, unless it's specifically a sports car review (a rare occurrence).

    I prefer to read the full report and take the overall rating with a pinch of salt. The full report contains good information that allows me to draw my own conclusions based on my own preferences, ignoring CR's "family" bias. If you like the firm ride of the P5 then that's great, CR has confirmed that the P5 has what you want!
  • mazdafunmazdafun Posts: 2,322
    As noted, CR ranks them and then recommends them if they're at least average in reliability.

    At least their physical measurements of cargo space are done in a consistent manner, resulting in figures that make more sense than those given my manufacturers. Unfortunately for Mazda, they seem to have stuck to their ethics and quoted figures for cargo stacked up to the lower sills of the windows while everyone else seems to have derived their numbers by stuffing their vehicles up to the roof. You'll note that the actual cargo volume of the P5 is quite close to that of the Matrix/Vibe. Also note the difference between the figures for the cargo floor length to back of front v. rear seats. This indicates the relative space in the rear seats. The CR-V has a delta of 19in (cramped), the P5 has one of 25. I think only the PT Cruiser has a figure that's significantly higher.

    Anyway, CR has their bias. So does every other reviewer. Just read a bunch and find ones that best match your priorities. CR reflects more realistic cargo and turning circle values, and give a good indication of projected reliability. Their mpg figures tend to be higher than more auto-oriented mags since they don't seem to push them as hard. I look to CR for value, reliability, physical measurements, C&D for sound measurements, fun-to-drive quotient and driver-oriented things like comfort and ergonomics, Automobile for most of the same as C&D, with more of a view towards design.
  • cooner2cooner2 Posts: 3
    My girlfriend is considering buying Protege5. We test drove one this weekend and both of us were impressed. My only concern was it's winter driving ability with the standard tires, we live in Michigan so that's a potential problem. I'm interested in owner comments who live in northern climates.
  • protege_fanprotege_fan Posts: 2,405
    I have an '01 LX 2.0. It performed great this winter. I will say definitely get a real set of winter tires if you get a lot of ice and slush on the streets.

    What are you concerned about? Handling? Starting up in cold mornings? My Pro handled great. Also, I've seen a lot of P5's running around up here in Calgary and they all seem to get around with no troubles either.
  • cooner2cooner2 Posts: 3
    My main concern is with traction and handling with the standard tires in snow and slush
  • protege_fanprotege_fan Posts: 2,405
    I think any all-season tire offers sub-standard winter driving capabilities as compared to a true winter tire. However, if your area doesn't experience much ice, then I would think an all-seasone would fare well for the first winter.

    My Pro only had the Potenza's and those did fine for most of the winter, but you could really tell when there was ice on the ground. Traction was almost nil.

    I can't say for the stock tires on the P5 though. Anybody else?
  • SporinSporin Posts: 1,066
    I run a set of 15" steel wheels with 195-55-15 Michelin Arctic Alpins for winter. Living in Northern Vermont, I'd bet our weather is similar. Not only was I concerned about traction, but I din't wan to bang up my nice alloy rims if i did slide into a curb or something.

    I ran those tires last winter with great results. Amazing traction, and no drama. The whole thing cost about $550 from Tirerack, delivered to my door. I do the change over myself too.

    Just make sure to put a bit of litheum grease on the steel hub as they rust up to the hub a bit over the winter.
  • reitrofreitrof Posts: 122
    I did the same as Sporin. Same tires, worked out well. I was more concerned with damaging the finish on the mags.
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