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Kia Spectra Sedan

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  • air filters in their new Spectra's include information in this thread, OK? Even if it's on a car other than a Spectra, for instance an Elantra.

     

    If your new Spectra does have the filter put in some information in here out of your manual about it, if you don't mind. I'd like to learn more about them. I wonder if the new Scion lineup has them standard. Some more research is required. I know they filter out cabin air but St.Louis has one of the three worst air quality's in the nation. When you're driving you suck in air from the outside, if you want to. This may be a nice option to have in there, eh?

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,748
    iluv, these cabin filters won't take the smog out of the air. At best they'll catch pollen and stuff like that, to help people with allergies. Maybe they can screen out soot from diesel exhaust, I don't know.
  • (or at least a percentage of them)and some of the diesel exhaust, or any other allergens I would be interested in them. The thing about allergies is that you have to aggressively keep your home clean and your workplace or you'll still be bothered. Still, having the filter in your new rig is better than not having it. I'm gonna see if Scion installs them at the factory in my spare time, too.

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • Spectra. Apparently our neighbors to the north have their heads sufficiently screwed on straighter than jokesters like Clodsumer Retorts do. Imagine that. Take a look.

     

    More evidence Kia is on a large upswing in building value into their rigs.

     

    The 2005 Cerato to be considered for overall Canadian Car of the Year.

     

    - Cerato exports reach 87,120 units through first 11 months of 2004

     

    The Automobile Journalists Association of Canada (AJAC) has just crowned the sporty 2005 Kia Cerato sedan -- known as the Spectra in some markets -- as the Economy Car of the Year for 2005. The Cerato will now be considered for the overall AJAC Canadian Car of the Year.

     

    The Cerato topped a tough field of competitors, defeating the Chevrolet Cobalt/ Pontiac Pursuit, Hyundai Accent5, Smart fortwo CDI coupe and cabriolet.

     

    The AJAC meets every year at Shannonville Motorsport Park near Belleville, Ontario, for a four-day automotive ‘TestFest’ based on real-world back-to-back testing to select the best new vehicles in various categories, as well as an overall Car of the Year and Truck of the Year. “For Kia, winning the AJAC "Economy Car of the Year Award" will prove to consumers that Kia is a quality brand,” said Gordon Sadler, Public Relations and Brand Manager, Kia Canada Inc.

     

    “In the five short years in Canada, Kia has delivered on a promise to offer Canadian consumers a range of high-quality, competitively priced vehicles that are equipped with an impressive array of standard equipment. This award will provide the consumer with third party validation to consider both Kia and the Spectra as Best in Class in a highly competitive market segment,” said Sadler. This year's category winners represent the best among an excellent group of new cars and trucks for 2005. The results of the voting for the overall AJAC Canadian Car of the Year award will be released in February 2005.

     

    The Canadian Car of the Year (CCOTY) Awards is an annual AJAC event that has a significant influence on Canadian consumers. Survey results of previous Car of the Year buyers determined almost 70% (69.6 %) were influenced to purchase their car because it was chosen the "Canadian Car of the Year". Through the first 11 months of 2004, a total of 87,120 units of the Cerato 4-door and 5-door have been exported globally.

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    If you are going to quote something in that length, you must provide a link to the source ... please do so, otherwise we have copyright issues and your post will have to be removed.

     

    And to tell you the truth, while I understand that you place no credibility in a particular consumer's publication, your distortion of its name detracts from your own credibility. Just fyi.
  • http://www.kiamotors.com/

     

    I just find that publication to be so slanted in their journalism. I feel that we must use our own brains to decide which sources are helpful and which ones are bought off...I, I mean lacking in their research. They have repeatedly made so many oversights of vital manufacturing updates as well as putting outdated photos in to accompany their reviews that I seriously find their credibility to be very lacking. That's as crisply nice as I can word it. Toasters and blenders but not car reviews from them, please!

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,748
    FWIW... I recently read a case of a couple who made disparaging remarks about a company on the Web. The company sued them--and won. Not every company is that aggressive about protecting themselves, but it's a cautionary tale about being sure of your facts before you rip another company by name on the Web.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Here is a direct link to the material quoted in iluvmysephia1, "Kia Spectra Sedan" #133, 11 Dec 2004 5:31 pm - http://www.kiamotors.com/UVehiclesNewsWeb/KmceVn01_VehiclesNewsRe- ad.aspx?Idx=245

     

    Now we need to move on and get back to our subject. Thanks.
  • Hey all:

     

    Just a quick update to say that the new Spectra EX is ready to flip over 5,000 miles soon, and I've experienced no new problems.

     

    The only repair I've had since purchasing it in August was to have the 3rd LE brakelight replaced due to two bulbs in the array not working.

     

    As far as a cold weather update goes, I can report that the heater works VERY well in the new Spectras. I enjoy the many variations of air direction that the selector provides.

     

    The car also is still quiet and squeak free even in 25 degree (F) weather.

     

    Traction and stopping capabilities were extremely good in the two light snowstorms I've encounterd. My Spectra doesn't have ABS, but in the one panic stop I made from about 45 mph, the car stop straight and in a short distance.

     

    So far so good!

     

    -SM
  • Spectra Winter Alert for 2004.5 / 2005 Spectra LX/EX owners:

     

    Be warned that if you wash your car in below freezing conditions, there's an excellent chance your fuel filler door WILL NOT open afterwards.

     

    After spraying off my car this week, I proceeded on to fill up my tank. To my chagrin, when I pulled the fuel filler door handle, the door stayed firmly shut. It sounds like the release is working properly, but water must have collected in the hinge area and froze solid. After several taps on the door and utterance of several swear words, the door final popped open enough for me to get a grip on it and open it.

     

    Next time I think I'll try opening the door several times *immediately* after washing it. That may cause the trapped water to drain... or so I hope!

     

    Stay tuned...
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,748
    Small car from Kia is a disappointment: "The Spectra has several problems that added up to a poor rating," Lund says. The structure is rated acceptable because of too much intrusion into the driver footwell area. The dummy's head bottomed out the airbag and then went part way out the open side window and hit the door frame. High forces were recorded on the dummy's head, and there were possibilities of injuries to the neck, chest, and both legs.

     

    "There are many better choices for buyers," Lund says. "Eleven small car designs now earn good ratings in the Institute's frontal offset test, and nine of these also are designated 'best picks.'"


     

    http://www.iihs.org/news_releases/2004/pr121904.htm

     

    This result is incomprehensible, for a new design based on another car (Elantra) that got a Good rating, and despite the SACs on the Spectra. Kia had better get to work on this and fix it FAST or they won't sell too many Spectras.
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    How would the fact that SAC is standard on the Spectra play a significant role in the frontal offset? Im just not sure I understand the correlation there. Also, there doesnt seem to be a significant issue with the Kia's structure, so thats a good thing. It seems that the major factors in the Poor rating are the fact that the dummy wasnt well protected by the seatbelts/airbag. For me, it would seem that if the dummy's head is bottoming out the airbag, there may be a deployment timing issue there. With the proper deployment and resulting better control of dummy movement, the rebound hit that the dummy in the Kia experienced... might be significantly mitigated. And while the Spectra and Elantra are on the same platform, it took Hyundai basically five tries (with this generation) to get a "Good" rating (Two when the original of this generation was tested, and three this time). I bet Kia can make the fixes if they want to, thats all Im saying.

     

    ~alpha
  • and I think they will. Yeah, I saw the Lund report on one of the TV news shows. The dummy was thrown awkwardly and received too much head trauma. They'll need to adjust the thrust forces of the airbag towards the driver, indeed.

     

    Why the dummy's head went out the window is another part of the equation. They best make sure the side airbags that are standard equipment on the new Spectra's are fortified or sped up or something. This can be fixed but they best hurry up on it!

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,748
    I thought the SACs would help reduce the trauma from rebound injuries, e.g. hitting the B-pillar. But maybe the SACs/SABs aren't designed to go off on a frontal offset crash. Maybe they should be, based on all the reports (not just the Spectra's) that say "driver's head hit B-pillar."

     

    Actually, there does appear to be an issue with the Spectra's structure--it was rated only "Acceptable", not "Good" like most other cars including its cousin the Elantra. There was "moderate intrusion into the driver footwell area." That seemed to contribute to the potential for leg injuries.

     

    I too think Kia can make the fixes needed, if they want to. I just think they'd better do it fast if they want to succeed with an otherwise fine small car in a tough market.
  • time to fix this problem. I would venture a guess they're busy on it already. Post in here anything you hear from Kia headquarters. Sounds like a recall is in quick order here.

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • Good video link of test, plus interview info:

     

    ( USES REAL PLAYER )

     

    http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/files/specials/videolineups/video_if- - rame.html?videoName=1220crash_tests&videoHeadline=Kia%20Spect- - ra%20Gets%20Worst%20Rating%20in%20Crash%20Tests

     

    Note: Using the pause/play button, you can see that the bag appears to be fully inflated at the point that the body travels forward into it. What I'm surprised to see is how little the shoulder belt restrains the upper body of the dummy. Considering that the Spectra now has the pyro-technic pre-tensioners, it is puzzling to watch. I wonder if the pre-tensioners didn't fire? It also appears that the seat back flings forward very far too, but only after the upper torso of the dummy has squarely landed on the airbag/wheel. Weird.

     

    I guess if there's any bright side to this, it appears that the cabin structure of the car stays fairly intact. The intrusion into the foot well doesn't appear to be that bad.

     

    The other thing I try to keep in mind (or perspective) when I watch something like this, is that I ran around for 6 years in a 1983 Ford Escort with NO airbags. Granted, I was never in a severe crash, but obviously that car could not have been built anywhere near as well as even the "poorly" rated new Spectra. Yes, it would be nice for my car to have been rated as good as its sibling Elantra, but do I need to unload it due to it being inherently unsafe? Probably not. (Although a recall and fix would salve my conscience a bit!)

     

    -SM

     
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    It seems to be all dependent on how the side inflatable restraints are programmed to deploy. For example, if you've ever seen an IIHS test of any Nissan/Infiniti with side inflatable restraint (whether combo bag or curtain), the side bags always inflate. However, no Toyota/Lexus model (or any other make that I can recall offhand) uses the side restraint to the passengers' advantage as does Nissan. In a severe frontal crash, the car is going to be totalled anyway, so personally, I'd rather have the side airbag inflate and protect the rebounding head, but I'm sure some would find grounds to argue this on.

     

    To your point though, I bet you are right that if the Spectra's side curtain had inflated, the dummy's head likely would not have passed the window plane and go outside the vehicle, nor would the pillar hit been as hard. My thoughts are that had the airbag fired on time, the rebound would not have been as hard.

     

    With regards to structure, an Acceptable rating still means the car can get a Good, just not a Best Pick. My only point is that its not a lost cause- if the structure had been rated Marginal or Poor, modifications to improve the structure would be much harder. For the Spectra, I dont think it would be that hard for Kia to make mods to the floorpan around the drivers feet.

     

    Sorry for continually referencing Nissan, but look at what was done to the Maxima two generations ago- the 95 was fairly uncrashworthy, but the retested 98/99 version with modifications fared much better, going from Poor overall to Acceptable.

     

    ~alpha
  • website reading about new Spectra NHTSA crash-test results. The new Spectra rates a "4" for the driver, a "4" for the passenger and a "4" for the rear seat occupants. "4" means that those people would stand a 10-20% of being seriously hurt in an accident. A "5" is the best, that being those people stand a 0-10% chance of being seriously hurt in a crash. I don't understand why the side bags didn't inflate. I know it was a 40 mph frontal crash but I would've guessed that the side airbag curtain would run up and inflate. Did the Spectra get a fair test? Did it hit where they intended it to hit? Are their tests infallible? I don't who made the comment that Kia Motors America already commented that they are confident that the new Spectra is crashworthy in the real world, or something like that. I haven't been able to find a quote anywhere directly from Kia Motors America or Korea, for that matter. I take this news as somewhat troublesome but not a crushing blow by any stretch. It might warrant a recall fix, we don't even know that for sure right now.

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,748
    Did the Spectra get a fair test? Did it hit where they intended it to hit? Are their tests infallible?

     

    It's the same test they put all the other cars through, so in that sense it was fair. As for whether the tests are infallible--they are conducted by humans. But most of the small cars tested have done well enough to earn a "Good" rating.

     

    If you look at photos of other IIHS frontal offset tests, you'll see that the SABs didn't inflate in those either. For example, they did not appear to inflate on the test of the '04 Elantra. But they did inflate on at least one of the tests the IIHS did on the '01 Elantra, and they kept the dummy from hitting the B-pillar in that instance. So it makes you wonder why the SABs aren't designed to inflate on a severe frontal impact.
  • but, yeah, I would think that a direct hit in front at 40mph or more would warrant the side curtain airbags coming open. This one will need some follow-up by Kia. It's not really surprising that we don't see a comment from Kia on this yet. Come to think of it it was the newscaster today on the TV news who quoted Kia as saying that they're confident in the Spectra's current crashworthiness, or words to that effect. Kia may not react engineering-wise at all to this crash-test result. I will say this: if I was set on getting a new Spectra before these results I would still go ahead and purchase. I just think there's too many variables at play and I really don't get a gut feeling the new Spectra would do any worse than any other small car(Elantra, for instance)in a frontal accident. Or I'd need more information to help me decide. I'm not saying that Mr.Lund is wrong on his testing, though.

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    Be careful with the NHTSA side impact testing!

     

    Those tests, in my opinion, are extremely misleading to consumers because the side impact star rating DOES NOT take into account the injury measures recorded on the dummy's head. Simply put, this means that a vehicle can get a 4 or 5 star rating for side impact, but inflict injury serious enough to cause a lethal blow to the head of a real person. NHTSA has NEVER explained why they use this methodology, so consumers must be aware that the NHTSA side impact test is a gauge ONLY of the injury to the front and rear passengers' chest and torso.

     

    Also, iluvmysephia, beaware that the meaning of the star rating, in terms of percentage injury, is different for the frontal crash and the side crash on the NHTSA website.

     

    ~alpha
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    Backy, some manufacturer's side airbags ARE designed to inflate in severe frontal collisions.

     

    ~alpha
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,748
    Which ones?
  • I would think that a severe enough collison from the front would trigger the front and side bags to inflate. And inflate at the right speed and angle nonetheless. Not like there's any intense engineering required for this or anything!

    2011 Kia Soul Sport 5-speed

  • jprybajpryba Posts: 201
    The IIHS has been doing some side impact tests of their own, and they are including head injuries in their ratings as well. This is more realistic, and as a result, you'll notice some cars that did well in the NHTSA side impact test will get a poor rating when the IIHS does their version of the test on the same car.

     

    The IIHS doesn't have side impact ratings for all cars, at least not just yet. I think they are still in the middle of implementing this.

     

    I bet the Spectra will do well in this test, at least!
  • Here's some related info from Edmund's (now outdated) review of the new Spectra. Note specifically the IIHS mention about the *old* Spectra. It looks like Edmunds also thought that the side seat and curtain air bags would benefit the offset crash results. It also shows that it doesn't look like KIA has learned much from the testing done on their previous model. (You would have thought that the Hyundai engineers would have shared their collective knowledge on this one... esp. since they too had to learn this hard lesson. The 'GOOD' results of the Elantra supports that statement.)

     

    Maybe KIA can retrofit some logic into the sensing system to go ahead and fire the side protection system in the situation of an offset crash? My guess is that their sensing system won't be flexible enough to do that retroactively. It will probably have to be designed into the 2006's at the earliest.

     

    Read the Edmunds review excerpt...

     

    "The old Spectra fared well in government crash testing, earning four stars for driver and front-passenger protection in frontal crashes and three stars for side-impact protection. IIHS testing told a more dismal story, however, as the Kia was rated "Poor" (the lowest score possible) for the 40-mph frontal offset crash.

     

    The redesigned Spectra has not yet been tested, but we expect it to fare much better, as both LX and EX models feature standard front seat-mounted side airbags and full-length side-curtain airbags."
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    Check out the IIHS offset crash tests for any Nissan/Infiniti which has side airbags standard. In all of those tested, the side restraint has inflated. Ex- Nissan Murano, Maxima, Quest, any of the Infinitis tested....

     

    ~alpha
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,748
    That is a lesson for Kia (and others). If they designed the standard SABs and SACs on the Spectra to inflate on a frontal impact, perhaps the driver would be restrained without injury, as happened with the Maxima etc. They might even be able to do that with a software fix, meaning it could be done on existing cars. Fixing the footwell intrusion would be more difficult (as a retrofit) but that's not the biggest problem.
  • lngtonge18lngtonge18 Posts: 2,228
    I personally have a problem with the Spectra being rated poor. All of the individual ratings were either marginal or acceptable. There were no poor ratings at all. I have to ask how the IIHS thinks the Spectra deserves an overall rating of poor when none of the individual ratings were poor. If anything, the Spectra should be rated marginal. Look at the Dodge Neon for example: It's structure was seriously compromised, there was little survival space left, the steering wheel broke off, and there was a poor reading for one of the legs. And yet it was rated marginal overall. It appears they arbitralily gave a poor rating just to make the headline of "first car rated poor since 2001" and make an example of an automaker that failed to make a huge improvement.

     

    This car does not deserve the poor overall rating. It does deserve a marginal rating and I think Kia needs to address the problems.
  • alpha01alpha01 Posts: 4,747
    Actually, I think the Kia deserves the Poor rating at this point in time. Its 2005, and most brand new designs perform well in this test. In comparison to the Neon which you cite, yes, the Kia's structure did better than the Neon's,

     

    HOWEVER, comparing the actual injury measures, the Kia does much more poorly than the Neon.

     

    The Neon inflicted no serious injuries to any VITAL body parts/organs, as it was rated the highest mark for both Head/Neck and Chest.

     

    In comparison, the Kia rated only a 'MARGINAL' for Head/Neck, which is a serious issue, and an Acceptable for the chest, also worse than the Neon.

     

     

    For leg injuries, the Kia is rated Acceptable and Marginal, while the Neon is Poor and Acceptable. I cant speak for anyone else, but Id rather have better ratings in the vital organs area. A broken leg heals- risk of serious injury to the Head/Neck and a lower rating for chest pose a bigger problem, IMO.

     

    I dont think the rating of the Kia as Poor is arbitrary, I think its based on Marginal kinematics and comparatively Poor injury measures.

    As far as I know, the Injury measures for the Head/Neck and Chest are appropriately weighted more heavily by the IIHS than for the legs. Thats why you'll see a few 'Best Picks' which have an Acceptable for the legs.

     

    ~alpha
This discussion has been closed.