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Ford Five Hundred/Mercury Montego



  • porknbeansporknbeans Posts: 464
    There is no mistaking who Ford is gunning for on this car. They finally realized that although the Taurus is a fine car, it's wonderfully mediocre. Even though it is just an illustration it has more visual appeal than the Taurus. Now lets see how well it works and how well it's built.
  • porknbeansporknbeans Posts: 464
    Here is another article:

    I just realized that the designer for this car used to be the lead designer at VW/Audi. That helps to clarify the similar style lines. 6-speed auto with cvt sounds nice but I have to wonder about the performance of the 3.0litre v-6. How long do you think before they stuff the v-8 from the Mustang in this thing and turn it into a true competitor. IMO Ford is either going to have to increase the output of the 3.0 or increase the engine size.

  • machiavellimachiavelli Posts: 260
    This seems like a good idea. I like the idea of the tall sedans. While I'm not a big fan of the looks of the Toyota Echo, I always thought it would be interesting to apply that "tall car" philosophy to a bigger car and end up with a really huge interior. That's what it seems like this Ford is to me.
  • teoteo Posts: 2,508
    Interesting. I'll believe it when I see it. And Bill Ford better not mess up the initial quality of this car.

    Still 2 years away. Maximum Bob, take notice.
  • machiavellimachiavelli Posts: 260
    That brings up a continuing problem for "domestics" - they are slow to market. Ford needs this right now, but it won't be on dealer showrooms for another 2 years. By then Toyota will have a new, re-designed Avalon, the new Accord will be out, etc... Just like Chevrolet needed the new Vectra last year, not next year. Better late than never, I guess.
  • machiavellimachiavelli Posts: 260
    porknbeans - from post #3 - I think the 3.0L V6 engine will be fine. I don't think the car will be much bigger than the current Taurus, just taller and roomier. Sort of like a Camry vs. an Avalon. I think the 3.0L with around 200-230HP will be fine. I doubt the 4.6L V8 will fit, and I wouldn't want that much power in a FWD car anyway.
  • teoteo Posts: 2,508
    My problem with the Ford 500 is that it looks very similar to the current VW Passat. Keep in mind that by 2004 VW will likely have an all new Passat sedan and wagon.
  • porknbeansporknbeans Posts: 464
    Your point is taken, however even if Ford is able to keep the weight the same the market they are targeting suggests more performance. The Taurus and Toyota appeal to a certain type of driver and the Nissans and VW's appeal to another. Personally, I think they are going after the Nissans and VW's with this car. I would even go so far as to say that they may be going after the entry Lexus, Infinity and Acura's. With that kind of target market I think Ford has to up the ante.

    As far as shoehorning a v-8 under the hood VW was able to do it with the Passat I would doubt that Ford would come to the table without having that ability in their hip pocket. After all they were able to get a v-8 into the SHO (granted it was anemic) and the 4.6 that is currently in the Mustang isn't all that big (size wise).
  • Wow, it was nice of Ford to sit there and style their new car after my Audi A4. I'm honored. Even the same rims.
  • machiavellimachiavelli Posts: 260
    My impression was it's more like Ford's interpretation of a Toyota Avalon, not a sports sedan. The emphasis was on roomy interior, tall seating postition like an SUV, the press release you posted. Nothing wrong with that IMO.

    BTW, the SHO had a special 60 dgree V8 made by Yamaha (more compact than a "normal" 90 degree V8), and the Passat has VW's W8 which is very compact. I still doubt the 4.6L V8 could be crammed in there. Maybe the SOHC version but not the DOHC version.
  • teoteo Posts: 2,508
    If the assembly and initial quality are right from the get go I don't see a problem for the 500. But the car tries to copy too much the German looks, nothing negative about that, but I think manufacturers need to be more original with thier designs while still borrowing some "Likeable" bits and pieces of design.
  • machiavellimachiavelli Posts: 260
    I'm not a big fan of J Mays. What has he done that is original? VW new Beetle, new T-Bird, Ford GT-40, Ford 49er, etc...are all "inspired" by previous cars.

    Did he create the "new edge" look, i.e. the Mercury Cougar, Ford Focus, etc.. look? If so, then I'll give him credit for some originality.
  • bobbyknightbobbyknight Posts: 121
    I don't think he was around at Ford until '99. Good observation about styling cars that were not orginial, like the Beetle. However, I like the styling direction Ford is taking. I would rather have an American Audi than an American ? in the CTS.
  • lancerfixerlancerfixer Posts: 1,308
    I see a lot of Mondeo in it, too. Not a bad thing.
  • bac111bac111 Posts: 9
    Their styling for the longest time has just be crazy. I hope the real metal looks as good as the drawing. I mean, really, it has been years since a really good Ford sedan hit the market. The '86 Taurus was amazing, light years ahead of what GM had going. What did they do? They "freshened" it for '91 or so and then BAM the Oval Taurus came out in '96. Whoever was in charge of that design should have been fired. I remember reading when it came out about "the first Ford in 40 years with an oval window" and "there is not a straight line anywhere in sight" like these things were designing triumphs. Ya gotta be kiddin' me. The current version is better than the '96, but it still doesn't look like a "total" package. I am hoping the 500 is a good looking car and I don't care if the "stole" from Audi or VW. You can argue that the '86 Taurus stole some from the '83 Audi 5000 if you want.
  • regfootballregfootball Posts: 2,166
    that v8 SHO was not 'anemic'. I know, I drive one.

    Not as fast as it should have been, maybe. That crticism is fair. 0-60 in 7.4 is not anemic for a 3.4 litre engine in a 3600 pound car.

    The best published time i saw on the original v6 with a 5 speed was 6.7 seconds.

    The best time I think I saw on a GTP was 6.8. The lauded 300M was around 7.7 seconds.

    The promise of 8 cylinders was let down by a typical slow shifting Ford automatic.

    Still, it was a faster v8 than the Olds Aurora.

    So no, not anemic.

    So with this new Ford 500, it seems to me that this absolute brilliantly compact, beautiful to look at jewel 60 degree Duratec/Yamaha v8 would be a perfect powerplant for this new car. Maybe as an option to the 3.0. It would fit the upscale image well. Pump up the HP to about 250 and mate it to the 6 speed auto and the engine would have no problem getting the car in the 6.5 second range for 0-60 which is quite good still in sedan land.

    I mean....most sedans tested today you see above 8 seconds and even most automatic sports sedans are still above 7.5. So a 0-60 in 7.4 is hardly anemic.

    That v8 would be so perfect for the upscale image Ford wants with the A6, errr... I mean 500. Hey Bill it please.
  • jsylvesterjsylvester Posts: 572
    While I will wait to see it in person, it looks like a copy of what everyone else is doing. It lacks what traditionally Galaxie 500's always had - inspired styling and attitude. Still might be nice as another blend into the crowd type of car.

    Have another personal reason. If I parked this car in my garage next to my 1967 Ford Galaxie 500 XL convertible, the old gal may just refuse to start after seeing it's progeny reduced to being just another copycat of Audi.

    Here is a link to a real Ford "500", alas 35 years old.

  • porknbeansporknbeans Posts: 464
    My apologies, I stand corrected. I'm working from memory and must admit that I've never driven it, but didn't that V8 make fewer horses than the V6 that was in the previous SHO? I thought that I read a review that stated that the performance on the V8 SHO vs the V6 SHO was worse. I could very easily be wrong. Again I'm working from memory and that's why I called it anemic.

    For Ford to stay competitive, especially in light of their declining sales, I think they MUST build it.
  • porknbeansporknbeans Posts: 464
    In an interview with Reuters, Mays stated that Ford is going for a worldwide "look" that is recognizable for all models. He stated that European and Australian models are "perfect" and the American models will be changed to that model over the next couple of years. I would guess that the 500 is a major step in the "perfecting" of their American division.

    I thought that some of you might get a kick out of this.
  • bobbyknightbobbyknight Posts: 121
    The hp in the latter versions of the SHO V6 had 220. The V8 had 230 hp.
  • audia8qaudia8q Posts: 3,138
    as a Ford dealer we are very excitied about this car....

    considering j.mayes background, it's easy to see where the styling overtones have come from.
  • porknbeansporknbeans Posts: 464
    Thanks for the info. I stand corrected.....again.
  • porknbeansporknbeans Posts: 464

    I have a few questions:

    1. Has anybody seen or have pictures from this video?

    2. It looks like the competition is the Avalon and Max. Still think it doesn't need more power and more refinement than the Taurus?

    3. Personally, I think that raising the front seat is a bad idea. What do you think?

  • stormdavystormdavy Posts: 83
    I think it is a great idea: better visibility, 'command of the road' feeling, tall driver position w/o the attendant higher drivetrain & tipover potential.

    Hopefully someone really tall could adjust the seat down accordingly.
  • machiavellimachiavelli Posts: 260
    Plus, if you have a high roofline, you can have a more "chair like" position in the backseat, too, so you have more leg room. That's why a Toyota Echo is roomy for a small car. Cars in general are getting taller.
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Posts: 854
    "It has a sophisticated look to it that has been severely lacking in Ford cars for many years, finally purging the ghosts of the cartoon-ish Taurus once and for all."

    From today's "issue" about the Ford 500.

    If this was an Asian car, there would be no moans of "it looks like a.." and "its not original".
  • machiavellimachiavelli Posts: 260
    Good point. Everyone knows a Lexus LS430 looks almost exactly like the previous generation S-class Mercedes.
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Posts: 854
    What else i can't stand is detractors never acknowledge any improvments, just nit pick silly junk like trim and image.

    When it's radical its too "wacky" and if its conservative its a "copy".
This discussion has been closed.
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