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Ford Five Hundred/Mercury Montego

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Comments

  • s852s852 Posts: 1,051
    I don't think nav will be an issue for the people they plan to sell these too. There is a reason a Buick Century doesn't have a nav system or play mp3s.

    As posts above prove, the majority of people buying a Montego or Five Hundred are the type to say "Why spend $2000 on a navigation system when a $2 gas station map is exactly the same thing?"
  • fsmmcsifsmmcsi Posts: 792
    Sorry, couldn't resist the title ;). Don't forget that the Five Hundred and Montego will offer two things the others cars don't have:

    - A high seating position for a good view, as in minivans, SUVs, and pickups, but not so high that you have to step up as is typical with SUVs, and,

    - A very large back seat and trunk, meeting the need to carry passengers in comfort and cargo, but in a package which is not a primative, frumpy and expensive Town Car, nor a relatively rough riding, and poorer handling SUV/truck.

    The Chrysler 300 will also offer a generous back seat and an elevated seating position, but it has a high beltline and 50's hot rod type roof . Unfortunately, it is highly probable that visibility will be horrible - fashion for the sake of fashion. Contrast that with the open and airy Five Hundred greenhouse. A big V8 is not enough to make me buy a car I can't see out of, and the Five/Hundred / Montego also has a much larger trunk.
  • tpat3tpat3 Posts: 119
    With theater seating, trunk and passenger room and available AWD, the Five Hundred is aimed squarely at Mini Van/small SUV market. Why drive a truck when you can have most its utility with the superior handling of a sedan?
  • If they ever phase out the traditional body on frame full sized cars, then calling a FWD big car 'mid sized' would be incorrect. "Mid size" compared to what?

    If it's rated "large car" by the EPA, then it's a full sized car, FWD or not.
  • The EPA can call it whatever it wants, but Ford is still better off labeling it a midsize because it will be more appealing to buyers.
  • s852s852 Posts: 1,051
    Rental car companies make up their own sizes. They consider a Taurus "full size."
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    Yes, they indeed do! I have issues with that myself.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    Internally, the 500 is known as D258, "D" denoting full-size, the Montego is D333. Comparison, the Futura is CD338 which can be translated to midsize but almost getting close in size to "D" Class.

    Ford might be calling these "Midsize" to not downstage the Crown Vic. Because the CV is RWD and V8, most will perceive that as being the "higher vehicle" in the line. Yet mechanically and in techonology, the 500/Montego are far more advanced overall.

    Ironically the other day I was looking at rental cars from some companies, and one mentioned the Cavalier as being "intermidiate" vehicle in their line up. Granted, space wise I might be able to swallow the Focus for maybe Intermidiate, but the cramp Cavalier??? Both the Cavalier and Focus are compacts, and should be respected as such. Next up, maybe the Sonata and Mazda6 are intermidiate (Hertz got this one right). A few had "standard" as a vehicle class (no such class). Then midsize are ALL the vehicles we know of like Accord, Taurus, Camry, new Malibu, etc. While the fullsize really being vehicles like Buick Park Avenue, Crown Vic/GM, Chrysler Concorde, etc.

    I suggest some view various rental agencies before they rent from them. I dislike that deceptive trick of trying to upsize a car. I don't think I would have been SO offended if maybe they used a larger "compact" like a Focus, Corolla, etc, but calling the cramp and lousy Cavalier Intermidite? Ahhh ! I fired off an email to those companies of course :)
  • "but Ford is still better off labeling it a midsize because it will be more appealing to buyers."

    Yeah that's true, but at some point, virtually all cars are going to be called "mid sized" and confuse buyers. Why not call it 'standard size'?

    And yes, rental firms are decieving. I went to an outlet and they claimed that a Neon was 'mid sized'!
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    Uh huh, they got one of my emails alright...
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    Well, I rent from Hertz all the time, and they have the nerve to call a Taurus "full size", which still makes me laugh. If I can reach the door handle on the passenger side with my seat belt on, it ain't full size to me!
  • Rental cars don't have "compacts" then, do they?
  • Mercury will feature high-tech design touches that will distinguish them from Fords "without balooning the price". For example, the Montego will feature high intensity discharge headlamps and light emitting diode taillamps. And some Mercury models will come with seats that can be heated or cooled, while only heated seats will be offered in matching Ford models. Product planners also could use more robust or refined powertrains to set the Mercury models apart. If the recently released Mercury Monterey volume models price of between $34,000 - $36,000 compared to Ford twin Freestar $27,000 - $30,000+ gives hint to the price spread between other Ford - Mercury siblings, so much for that "without balooning the price".

    http://autoweek.com/cat_print.mv?port_code=autoweek&cat_code=- carnews&loc_code=index&content_code=05512497&47610159- 1
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    That's good to hear. I feel the MErcs should have premium engines over the Ford offerings. The next level up, at least.
  • Merc's Need Nav systems available at least as options. Amoung "Younger" buyers like myself, it is very important. I don't mind a missing Nav in a Mustang (not too much) but in a car that is going to compete with 340hp V-8's? Ford needs something.
    Brawn or brains, choose one or loose both.
  • nedc2nedc2 Posts: 192
    " If I can reach the door handle on the passenger side with my seat belt on, it ain't full size to me! "
    Well if that's the standard, then I can't find a full size car on the market today;)
  • I agree with the need to offer navigation and a larger engine.
    I was thinking maybe this platform could the basis for an updated Lincoln Continental sedan?
    It would simply need a stretch and a v8 to set it apart, as the 1988 model more or less did with the Taurus/Sable platform.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    I do wish the Continental would return in some form.
  • i like how the lincoln concepts at detroit this year were displaying their "new" retro chrome eggcrate grill. mercury should keep the waterfall grill design now used on the navigator and aviator to distinguish its own line-up.

    a new continental with suicide doors and a grand design would be slick.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    "I was thinking maybe this platform could the basis for an updated Lincoln Continental sedan?"

    This is one option being tossed around.... The upcoming trend in vehicles from Ford will be availability of AWD, therefore this platform can also sustain that. As well as the Lincoln version of the Futura sedan, will also be AWD.
  • fsmmcsifsmmcsi Posts: 792
    Besides the fact that there seems to be no space for a V8 (remember, the Duractec is a 60 degrees V6), Ford would also need to have a strong enough transmission. The best solution may be to simply use the Volvo engines and transmissions.

    As for Mercury and Mazda, they sould sell them in combined Ford - Lincoln - Mercury - Mazda dealers as alternate styles, and advertise that Ford gives buyers a choice of styles (the Ford look, the Mercury look, or the Mazda look).
  • i think mercury has always been treated as the poor cousin to ford and lincoln. a new cougar coupe/convertible built on the new 2005 mustang platform with styling reminiscent of the '67-'68 XR7 with its electric shaver grille and sequential rear turn signals would increase ford pony car sales as a personal luxury coupe offering like the buick riviera.

    the marauder should be given a more luxurious interior, a power boost, a freshened exterior--including a GT sportwagon variant--and be positioned as an american muscle classic to compete with the dodge magnum.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    "Besides the fact that there seems to be no space for a V8 (remember, the Duractec is a 60 degrees V6), Ford would also need to have a strong enough transmission. The best solution may be to simply use the Volvo engines and transmissions. Ford would also need to have a strong enough transmission. The best solution may be to simply use the Volvo engines and transmissions."

    Actually the Volvo transmission are just "up to par" for what they are able to handle. There's many Ford designed transmissions which are much stronger overall.

    The next S80 will be using a Yamaha massaged(just the heads and a few other items) Jag 4.0-4.2L engine, and that itself will require a different transmission to handle it. And that itself is able to fit within the P2 platform. With a bit of minimal redesigning, some V8's can enter the engine bays of the P2 platform. The only difficult factor would be Ford's modular V8's which are a bit tall to fit in that platform without major modifications.
  • fsmmcsifsmmcsi Posts: 792
    The problem is that Ford dealers would not stand to have the top line models sold only by Mercury. Thus, there will be a Five Hundred Limited, and an almost identical Montego.

    I bought my 2002 Mountaineer because it was $1,200 LESS than an identically equipped Explorer Limited (V8, every option except 4WD, sunroof, and running boards).

    Thus, my suggestion that instead of trying to maintain a separate brand, Ford simply offer buyers a choice of different looks.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    Doing away with the Mercury brand would cost Ford Motor Company hundreds of millions of dollars, at the very least. GM has paid through the nose to end Oldsmobile. Dealers are entitled to compensation under very liberal state laws.

    I doubt you will see Mercury going anywhere.

    Besides, Lincoln dealers depend on Mercury to help pay the bills.
  • fsmmcsifsmmcsi Posts: 792
    There should be very little cost if they make all of the dealers Ford, Mercury and Lincoln outlets, and it would give them a market advantage to gain that many more Ford outlets. The only cost would be new signs. Since most of the Lincoln-Mercury dealerships are owned by people or groups who also own Ford dealerships, I doubt that they would complain.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    You've obviously not dealt with dealers from the manufacturer's point of view. Dealer-manufacturer relationships are very hostile in many instances. And existing dealers would not be pleased to have new competitors, many of whom are in the very close proximity to their shops.

    To get this back on topic, other than HID lights and LED tail lights and a waterfall grille, does the Montego have anything to recommend it over the Five Hundred? I know the interior is two-toned.
  • fsmmcsifsmmcsi Posts: 792
    I like the front end of the Five Hundred much better, but would make the choice based on price - send letters to a batch of dealers and see what offers come back.
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