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Ford Five Hundred/Mercury Montego



  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    Very good, you have kept up well with Ford's CVT development :)
  • emtemt Posts: 39
    My Eagle was the straw that broke the camels back and I went to Japanese cars since. I have a Subaru and Toyota that have never been back to the dealer other than for routine maint. Having a tranny rated for 221 ft. lbs of torque hooked up to an engine that is rated at 200 is asking for trouble I think. GM pulled this type of stunt in the mid 70's with the famous "metric" 3 speed auto. It could not handle the power of the small V-8's. I hope it all works for Ford as I think this is their last shot to get customers back into the fold.
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Posts: 1,564
    I think it is quite a stretch to say the least, to relate tranmission problems in an Eagle Premier to the CVT transmission that will show up in the 500 just because they both may have come from the same transmission manufacturer. The Eagle Premier was the last gasp design thrown together by the AMC/Renault alliance before Chrysler bought it all and flushed down the drain all but the Jeep line. Eagle Premier was by all accounts a bust with numerous major quality problems.

    That being said, I would still not myself go with a CVT from any manufacturer, foreign or domestic in the first year of production, I prefer to buy what has been on the market at least a year or two or three. Just my conservative nature, I guess.

    Looks feature wise the 500 will have the bases pretty well covered in the full size-large sedan market currently served by Avalon, Pontiac Grand Prix, Buick LeSabre, and Ford's own Crown Victoria.
  • emtemt Posts: 39
    I agree with you, I will only consider the 500 after it has been on the market at least a year. The 500 is a great looking car and is the only domestic (family) car out there that I really like the looks of. Hopefully the Ford-ZF venture will work well. With all the troubles I had with a ZF tranny though, you can understand my feelings. Take care
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    There's also the 6 Speed automatic option on FWD models, for those who do not wish to deal with the CVT. And later the 3.5L will be implemented, so that might be another good reason to wait a bit.
  • fsmmcsifsmmcsi Posts: 792
    The distance someone drives is probably the most significant factor in deciding to buy when the new cars come out or to wait one year. For people such as myself who drive much more than average (I drove 29,000 miles for business in 2003), the potential benefits of waiting one year have to be balanced against one year of enjoyment of a new Five Hundred / Montego. Ford and Mercury dealers will not be able to mark the cars up or demand full sticker, so there is no price issue.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    Yes good point. If someone generally keeps there vehicles 5+ years, I would say maybe waiting a year, might not hurt. But there's some (like myself as well) that can tack on miles quickly, and don't have much of a choice but get what is available.

    I had a 2000 Lincoln LS8 which I just replaced a few months ago, and that vehicle had 121K without any warranty repairs. I was holding off for the new Mustang but considering production will not start till August of this year, simply I couldn't wait. Hence, I had to get another LS and I guess I must wait till next year's '06 model.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    "I hope it all works for Ford as I think this is their last shot to get customers back into the fold."

    A lot of us have very pleased with our Ford products generally, and never left. :)
  • buckwheatbuckwheat Posts: 396
    If you mean to imply the Five Hundred will compete with the full size cars you mentioned in your post, Avalon etc. I agree, but to be accurate Ford classifies its flagship to be, the Five Hundred, as being a midsize car, albeit at the top of the midsize sedan segment, a car with a large size interior. An obvious distinction when it comes to insurance. Even with all the hoopla about more usable space if you match vehicle specifications with these other vehicles, say the Ford Crown Victoria, there is not any overwhelmingly more space but you then have to remember your matching midsize to full size and under those circumstances the Five Hundred is a clear winner in that respect.
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Posts: 854
    There is a stigma against calling a car "full size", so it seems like half the cars are labeled "mid size". Rental firms call a Corolla mid size, in fact.
  • fsmmcsifsmmcsi Posts: 792
    Ah yes, the old rental company lies. Everyone else thinks of the Camry, Sable, E-Class, and so forth as mid sized. I wonder who they think they are fooling - foreign visitors?

    The Five Hundred / Montego are so spacious that the Fairlane should finally be full sized in the sense that rear passengers have excellent leg room and ease of entry better than many Limos.
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Posts: 1,564
    I may be wrong, but I believe the EPA or some government agency has a criteria for categorizing sedan classifications by total interior volume, and by that measure I have no doubt 500 will qualify as a full size sedan if its interior room is significantly larger than the current Taurus which is likely near the top of the midsize category.

    Ford appears to be taking the tactic of developing two cars to replace Taurus, the 500 which is slightly larger in external dimensions but with significantly more room than Taurus, and the Futura which will be somewhat smaller dimensionally than Taurus but may have nearly the same interior room as Taurus does now.

    This puts Futura squarely up against Camry, Accord, and the new Malibu, and 500 up against Avalon, Buick LeSabre, and Pontiac Bonneville, and maybe Chevy Impala-though I would suspect Impala may morph again in a few years as its design is getting fairly long in tooth.
  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 7,600
    It is the EPA that created the interior volume ranges for auto sizes. But there are ranges.

    It is interesting that both the Focus and Taurus wagons are considered mid-size and the current BMW 3 series and previous 5 series are listed as compacts.
  • Has anyone seen information as to whether the back seats of the 500 will fold down as they do in my Audi? This is an extremely useful feature for toting long items.
  • badgerfanbadgerfan Posts: 1,564
    It says rear seats fold down standard and passenger front seat fold down is an option.
  • tomcat630tomcat630 Posts: 854
    The Impala is rated as "full size" by the EPA, but GM wants to call it "premium mid sized".

    Chrysler is not being shy in calling the new LX cars "full sized".
  • buckwheatbuckwheat Posts: 396
    badgerfan & robr2 you're right. The EPA does determine vehicle size using the enclosure volume of both passenger and cargo compartments and measuring same in cubic feet.
    Nhtsa determines size for purposes of crash testing using curb weight criteria less driver/passenger/cargo.

    Why Ford would refer to the Five Hundred as mid size might have something to do with other government requirements such as CAFE regulations, but I don't know, in any case its misleading.

    From what I have gleaned the EPA classifications;
    Compact - (includes mini-compact & subcompact) a coupe or sedan that has an interior volume of less than 110.0 cubic feet:
    Midsize - A coupe or sedan that has an interior volume between 110.0 and 119.9 cubic feet.
    Full size - a coupe or sedan that has an interior volume of more than 120.0

    If the information given to me is correct then the Five Hundred totals out to 128.1 cubic feet
    the Crown Victoria totals out to 131.8 cubic feet
    obviously placing both in the full size category.

    Because there is no federal rule regulating how rental companies classify their vehicles they can size any vehicle as they see fit. For the most part they use the criteria of the vehicles popularity and the publics willingness to pay which can vary among companies and different locations in the country.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    Ford is classifying the 500 as Mid-size? All I kept hearing was Full-size, where does it state this?
  • buckwheatbuckwheat Posts: 396
    In the title of the following link and again in the last line third paragraph, second line seventh paragraph - - 644

    Also look at this link on the Montego, last line second paragraph 661
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    HEH, thanks for spotting that out. I never referred to it as a Mid-size since by EPA standards it's Fullsize.

    A) It might be done because they do not wish for consumer's to perceive it to be as LONG as the Crown Vic.

    B) They might have a larger RWD vehicle coming out that might complement to the Crown Vic. -(I'm betting on this one).
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