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Ford Five Hundred/Mercury Montego

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Comments

  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    Which would you rather have, a

    2006 Five Hundred SE FWD
    with Safety package and Traction Control
    Total MSRP $23,920?

    Or a 2006 Ford Fusion SE-V6
    With SE Sport Package (alloys and 6CD)
    Safety and Security
    ABS and Traction control,
    Total MSRP $22,955?

    Mark
  • jh1977jh1977 Posts: 40
    Why will it be two more years before the new 3.5 Liter engines are installed in the 500/Montego. I will not consider buying a 500 or Montego until they have these new engines. Does Ford understand how car sales it will lose over the next two years because these engines are not installed in the 500/Montego currently?
  • I test drove the 500 with the current engine. It seemed very peppy and no lag at all. I really don't see a problem with the current config.

    Frank
  • bruneau1bruneau1 Posts: 468
    For rational people there isn't a problem, but with everybody else laying the horsepower on heavy and a press in love with 0-60 numbers, it becomes a problem- a very serious one for the future of Ford. When Ford catches up, everyone else will have moved far ahead again.
  • "When Ford catches up, everyone else will have moved far ahead again."

    I wouldn't be so sure of that, given current trends in oil and gas prices.
  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    The press doesn't buy the cars.

    Here is a good example the new Jeep Grand Cheoroke offers the "Hemi" as an option.

    The new Explorer only offers the 4.6L 3 Valve engine from the new Mustang.

    In a quarter mile run, the Jeep clearly beats the Explorer by about 1.5 seconds.

    In racing that might as well be 2 hours but in the real world, are you really going to pay $2,500 just so you can get away from a stop light a little quicker? Especially with todays gas prices?

    The wimpy frame used on the Jeep doesn't even allow it to take advantage of the HP, as the Explorer leads in tow capacity.

    The goal for Ford should be to build good cars that are very competitve at doing what they were designed to do.

    The Five Hundred was designed to be a big comfortable family sedan offering more features for the money than an Accord or Camry.

    Whether or not this car offers a person's perceived level of performance is mute. Those people are not shopping for this kind of car anyway.

    People say to them selves "Gee this car doesn't feel as fast as the Chrysler 300 but I can get AWD for the price of the Rear Drive Chrysler. And we do get snow here. I know traction control helps rear drive cars in the snow but you should still get snow tires. The 300 has a smaller trunk and I like to go on golf weekends now that the kids are out of the house. The Five Hundred has better crash test results. The styling on the 300 seems like it will be OUT of style in a couple of years and I always keep my cars a long time.

    What are your reasons for buying a car?

    Mark
  • The styling on the 300 seems like it will be OUT of style in a couple of years

    I liked the styling of the 300 and Magnum when they first came out. I must say, though, that now I don't really care for it all that much.

    However, they DO still stand out in a crowd.
  • bruneau1bruneau1 Posts: 468
    I agree, and i like the 500, Montego, Freestyle trio. But the press exerts a strong influence wether we like it or not. These days, rightly or wrongly, it is self-defeating to introduce vehicles that others perceive as underpowered in their class. Perception is sometimes everything, even though you and I have our priorities straight.
  • I agree. It's not necessarily about "what is adequate." Plenty of people make it to work every day in cars with 100 HP, so you could say that 100 HP is adequate. Like it or not, Ford is at a competitive disadvantage because of the lack of a more powerful engine on the 500. All the talk about not "needing" more power is a bit silly. How many people driving 500's now who are staunchly defending their purchase would have opted for the 3.5 V6 had it been available? My guess is that many of them would have. If the 500 launched with an engine lineup that trumped Chrysler in power, these same people would probably be singing it from the rooftops, and telling us how much better the 500 is because of the extra power vs the 300. Loyalties run deep in the automotive world.

    For the record, I've driven a 500, and would describe the power as, um, adequate. ;)
  • Good points, Frizz. The perception of the 500's power also depends to some extent what you are accustomed to. For example, if you are trading in a Vulcan equipped Taurus or a 4 cyl Camry, the 3.0 500 probably seems more than adequate. However, if you are used to a Duratec Taurus, a V6 Camry or Accord, or even one of the GM cars with their 3.8, the 500 will seem a bit lethargic.

    Another thing to consider is the smoothness and sound quality. The 3.0 Duratec is not the smoothest or quietest engine around. I don't mind that in our '01 Duratec Taurus because the thing was only $16K and change when new. However, as you move to a higher class of car for more money, the little tingle you feel through the accelerator or the labored sound under acceleration is more annoying. I am expecting the 3.5 to be improved in those areas.
  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    I definately agree that flooring the 500 either 6 speed or CVT is not a plesent experience for your ears.

    Mark
  • bobw3bobw3 Posts: 2,997
    I agree too. I have a Freestyle, and it's loud when you floor it. But in reality, I never need to floor it anyway, so the fact that it's loud is a good thing as far as I'm concerned because it's the car telling me to ease off a little ;) But seriously, if I needed to floor it for emergencies or for a quick pass, it is loud, but again I floor it so rarely it doesn't matter to me.
  • Hi all,

    This is my first post here.

    I drove a loaded (except nav and entertainment dvd) Limited AWD a couple of days ago. The salesman suggested I take it overnight, which I did. This allowed myself and my wife to get a pretty good idea of the car.

    We really liked it - extremely safe; lots of features; tons of room; very nice interior; great ride/good handling; well put together; great value (including .9% financing up to three year term!!); etc...

    The only major thing we didn't like, which I see is a current topic of conversation on this board, is the engine.

    The power did not seem lacking, but it was the noise that accompanied some acceleration that was annoying.

    We certainley hope that Ford installs the 3.5 enging, perhaps in the 2007 model year - at which point we would probably buy one.

    Any consensus/idea as to the realistic possibility of that happening? Any idea of other features/options that might be new for 2007?

    Any/all comments are appreciated and thanks!!
  • "The power did not seem lacking, but it was the noise that accompanied some acceleration that was annoying. "

    This is why they put a radio in the car. LOL

    Crank it up! :P
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    No new engine for model year 2oo7. Think Model Year 2oo8, not before....
  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    If you find the Freestyle to be unacceptablely loud, and you definately want a seven passenger vehicle. Go take a look at a new Explorer. dbs are in the low 60s in thats truck. thats luxary car level. There are some really great deals right now on Explorer especially if you lease.

    You can probably lease a decently equipped Explorer for similar money as the loaded Freestyle.

    Mark
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    If you go the Explorer route, be ready to pay much more money on insurance and fuel. The Five Hundred (and the Freestyle) get incredibly low insurance rates and the fuel economy is much, much better than on the Explorers. You can't have everything. Either better fuel economy or more power...it's physics, to a large extent.
  • jh1977jh1977 Posts: 40
    When will Ford stop making bland, conservative, old fashioned body style sedans which have no wide appeal? Ford should bring in new Designers for the 500 and Montego so the cars can be redesigned. These cars are currently designed for the 65 plus senior citizen crowd and they remind of the 1970s Plymouth Valiant. When the new 3.5 liter engine arrives for the 500/Montego, Ford needs to redesign the 500 and Montego so they can have attractive body styles to appeal to customers in their 20s, 30s, 40s and 50s. The Camry and Accord cars have attractive body styles, why can't the 500 and Montego have the same.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    a. The 3.5L equipped Five Hundred/Montego will have a refreshed body style.

    b. I see no beauty or uniqueness in either the Camry or the Accord. Many others agree.

    c. I own a Five Hundred. I know many others who also do. I am nowhere near 65.. I even have one friend who is 18 who owns one! I also consider the current body style attractive. To me, the biggest need for the car is more power (and I particularly like the CVT, which, from what I read, is not likely to make it to the 2008 models, at least not with the 3.5. A pity, IMHO).
  • I rented a 500 SEL with leather for a week and I was impressed by the interior, the exterior styling (to me) is quite nice to the eye. The fuel economy far exceeded my expectations and the ride was very smooth. The engine did produce a bit more noise than I thought should be coming from the compartment when attempts to "jump on the gas". That's where I have my only concern for this vehicle. I feel that with the additional noise generated that I should expect an equivalent amount of "go".

    After spending a week with this car I realize that it wasn't meant to spur the sport/performance side of me. Instead, the 500 appears to have been designed to be a well mannered family sedan... period (and quite a nice one at that). Hopefully, within the next month I will choose the 500 as my next vehicle.
  • evandroevandro Posts: 1,108
    I feel that with the additional noise generated that I should expect an equivalent amount of "go".

    Welcome to the world of CVT transmissions. :P

    Yet, many have stated here that the A6 is a bit dumb on the shift points. Hopefully, the new A6 transmission designed with GM will be better, but apparently only in 2007.
  • avantiavanti Posts: 27
    ANT14 - if you are out there - can the "spats" (aka mudguards) from the 2006 Montego (running change along with deletion of bodyside moldings and addition of color-keyed rocker panels) be used on the 2005 model? I see they are part of a TSB kit for the paint chipping. Can you get the part numbers for the spats? I've been unable to get them so far... Thanks!
  • Yeah... during midweek is when I pretty much accepted the CVT for what it was and had a good time with the vehicle. *Although, in the back of my mind I just kept wondering about it*

    But curious enough though was just how smooth that tranny was during shifting. Very smooth... And one more concern is just how long the CVT will hold up as I don't, nor do any of my associates, have any experience with it.
  • bruneau1bruneau1 Posts: 468
    I really like the action of the CVT in the Ford. It is superior to the current Ford 6spd. However, I too wonder about the future. While there is nothing wrong with the design, it is unclear what will happen to the CVT when Ford gets its new Ford-GM 6spd in the fall. It seems that most of the reported problems have been in the AWD models among the 500, Montego, Freestyle trio. Hopefully Ford will use the CVT in other vehicles so that we are not left with an obsolete transmission.
  • lweisslweiss Posts: 342
    I am in the market for a car to replace my Volvo S70, have owned Ford Tauruses in the past (good cars, last one a 1994), but I just can't get excited about the Ford 500- still looks like a taxicab wannabe. Now the new Ford Fusion looks exciting and a better image. I'll bet the Fusion outsells the 500 bigtime- am I right?
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    It's too early to tell, but the Fusion is doing quite well...

    The Five Hundred will be refreshed for Model Year 2oo8.

    Coming from a VOLVO, I wouldn't think you would be very concerned about styling....

    Know, too, that the Five Hundred has an exemplary safety record, and indeed has done better than most VOLVO's in crash testing (which only makes sense, since it is a newer design)
  • Does anyone have an opinion on whether or not I should purchase a new 2006 vs a new 2005? There are some pretty good deals on 2005's in my area but I am a bit nervous about purchasing last year's model. Any advise is appreciated.
    Thanks
  • micwebmicweb Posts: 1,617
    The most urgent mechanical/electrical updates during the first year of a new model introduction are made "on the fly" before the end of the model year, but still a LOT of updates to fix bugs are saved by manufacturers until the second year of the model, when the assembly lines stop and restart. Also, sometimes it takes feedback from the field before they can spot first year glitches, and this doesn't tally up until later in the first model year, too later to make a running change. In essence, first year buyers are often the "beta testers" for a completely new model car.

    That having been said, I'd say the first four months of production are probably the most problematic, since the assembly line is still learning to assemble the cars.

    Check the label, inside the door jamb, on the 2005 you are interested in. That's where the manufacturer information and build date are required to be placed. I would look for an assembly date of April or May of 2005 or later, and really, really worry about an '04 build date.

    Better yet, just hammer them for a deal on an '06. They have more cars than customers right now. The first year of any car is always buggy. It's not like you saw the car, fell in love with it, and can't wait for the much-less buggy second year of production. The second year is here. It's not like you are buying the de-bugged second year instead of a third year.

    Finally, one of the personal finance magazines said that end of the year savings are illusory unless you keep the car for more than five years - what you save on the purchase price, you lose on the immediate one year depreciation, since the new model is out, and depreciation is tied to model year, not purchase date. You are actually better off buying an early '06, you get to drive it for a year before the model change in '07 depreciates it more.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    Depreciation is only a factor if one trades, sells or wrecks the vehicle (people often forget about that last one).

    I have 51,000 completely trouble free miles on my Five Hundred. And it was built in September 04...
  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    The decision you make should be based on how long you intend to keep the car.

    Assuming the 05 is $3k or so less than the 06 and
    if you keep a car for 7 or 8 years and put 12k miles a year on it, 7 years from now an 06 Five hundred with 84k miles on it will mostly like have a trade value within a $1k of the trade value of a comparable 05 with 84k on it. (the 05 will be considered low milage for that year thus trade higher than a typical 05 which will have 8 years worth or 96k miles on it).

    This senerio leaves you with $2k to your advantage if you buy the 05.

    If you flip your cars every three years the absolutely buy the 06. In thee years, an 06 will still probably be worth $3k more than the 05 with similar milage.

    Just INSIST on a BRAND NEW BATTERY if the car you buy was sitting for over 90 days. Ask to see the invoice which will have the ship and build dates on it.

    INSIST on this the Battery can be replaced by the dealer under warrenty at no cost other than inconvenience to them.

    You might also ask them to change the oil as well.
    Mark

    Mark.
This discussion has been closed.