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Dodge Sprinter Gas Mileage

2

Comments

  • i have a 2006 2500 140wb shc bone stock with 16 inch rims and i've noticed that my speedometer is steadily 2-3 mph above the vehicles actual speed. i'm able to meter these figures because my local law enforcement agency has been kind enough to place radar machines all over town for everyone to enjoy. my other cars have been spot on accurate and i spoke with local cop whom explained to me the extreme calibrationing these machines go through before they go into the public. i may be wrong here, and if i am please correct me, but if if your car is traveling 25 mph for one hour burns just one gallon of fuel and the speedometer is reading (and recording) 28 mph then your apparent fuel milege is going to be 28 mpg when actually your MPG is only 25. so this means that... i either have defective speedometer and must return to the dealership... or the local cops bought 15 broken radar machines and it's slipped by so many people and i'm the first to notice the mistake or, just maybe all you folks that are getting 21 mpg are actually getting 18 mpg....

    my 97 powerstroke diesel e-350 gets 18 mpg on the highway loaded. my sprinter gets 21 mpg loaded. my PSD E-350's speedometer is accurate as per the radar machines (as compared to a 2003 honda, 97 s-10 pu and 1993 geo) so does this mean that if my speedometer is 3 MPH off my sprinter it is actually getting 18 MPG-- same as my ford diesel? hmmm? i guess i spent and extra $10k for a lighter duty, gutless van? not to mention it's fancy computer controlled assyt system that can count how many miles you need go before you're next service but can't figure out how fast the vehicle is going at 30 mph without a 10% error (radar says 27, speedo says 30. i did this five time one night)

    don't get me wrong... i like this van a lot... but the level of quality that i thought i bought is just not what it's priced to be. my dealer totally misrepresented this vehicle to me and i'm upset about that. i ve been to the dealer six times in the last two months only to have the dealer just finally tell that they don't have anyone that really knows about these vans and can't fix my problems (2 broken lumbars, un-fixable side and rear door rattling, trans vibrations) and that my next service is going to cost me $500. hooraay five star chrysler dealers.

    please, if anyone can get a chance do your own experiments with this please do. with a buddy's car, cell phones and cruise control you should be able to compare it with any other modern car.

    any comments on this?????
  • this maybe happening to some of you out there so i tell you about my fix. early in the ownership of my van i noticed the side door was rattling. after 3 trips to the dealer they kind of fixed it and told me that the push-rod plunger for the power locks had come loose and was rattling. OK, the noise subsided a little but the door still made some noise. so i return to the dealer and they spend a whole day doing adjustments and it goes away for 3 days. finally i return and they said they're was nothing they could do. so, i told 'em, "if i'd run my business they way they do, by not knowing anything about the products they're selling, i couldn't afford their van."

    anyhow, so i decide to fix it myslef and it turns out that there are two metal pintles on the leading edge of the door that align into two sockets that cause the door to be guided and held in place when it's closed. the solution is to put a little duct tape (just one layer, maybe two) around the pintle and dampens the vibration rattle and reduces the tolerance. the door is now totally quiet. six days of down town at the dealer then fixed in 2 minutes by an graphic artist.... WTF???
  • jim314jim314 Posts: 491
    Rather than just checking your speedometer, you should check your odometer by driving a known distance and comparing the change in the odometer. Depending on how these two are connected, the speedometer might real high by say 10%, but the odometer might be accurate to within say 1%. I say might be; you have to check it.

    I think that errors in the speedometer and odometer are usually a constant factor rather than a constant increment that you add or subtract. That is I think that, just for example, if the speedo reads 30 mph when you are actually travelling 33 mph, then it will read 60 when you are actually going 66, etc. (So that in this case true speed = indicated speed x 1.10.

    I have heard that by law speedometers are allowed to be off by a much higher factor than one would imagine. I have heard that the speedo can read plus or minus 10% of the true speed, but you would need to check this.

    I am under the impression that the odometer is much more accurate than this. Are these 16 inch wheels the stock wheels and are the tires stock? Changing the wheels and tires or even just the tires to a different size can give a larger or smaller diameter and circumference wheel. Usually people change to a larger diameter wheel/tire and it they don't change the speedo and odo calibration then they will be going both faster and farther than the speedo and odo, respectively, indicates. That will mean that their true fuel mpg will be higher than they calcluate from the uncorrected odometer readings.

    But if your odo is following your speedo

    True speed = Indicated speed x (27/30) = Indicated speed x 0.90, then your distances would follow True dist = Indicated dist x 0.90, and your true mpg would be given by true mpg = 0.90 x indicated.

    Check your odometer, both trip odo and regular odo on a section of roadway whose distance you know.
  • i have a hard time believing that mercedes benz would make and inaccurate speedometer and wholly accurate odometer in the same unit. how could a speedometer determine velocity and at the same time the odometer determines distance traveled at the same RPM (shaft rpm) and it not show the error. so anyways, engineering speculation aside... let's say that this may be the case... the speedometer is wrong and odometer is right (or may be right). hard to believe VDO would let this slip by or better yet, i'd love to hear a BS-covered technical explanation why they meant to have an inaccrate speedometer but an accurate odometer...

    it really seems funny to me that in such a controverisal fuel situation that we live in today with hig consuption commercial vehicles and SUV's, that an error like this, which could perhaps help the consumer mis-calculate his or hers vehicles fuel consuption, would go unoticed.

    the main selling point for these vans in our current economy is their apparent miser-like FUEL CONSUMPTON. at 3.00+ a gallon working vehicles are under a never before felt scrutiny due to the soaring operating cost of cents per mile. my wife doesn't think about how much her honda cost per mile... but i must think about how much my van cost per mile so i can adjust my prices to offset my overhead and not lose money (remember making money is why i bought this van). lets be honest... sprinters are working cars and they are nearly twice the cost of competiton but they boast a huge fuel savings marketing gimmick that, in the long run, will save you money. it hard to determine how much it'll save becuase of the speculation of future fuel prices. and i'm sure not all too many civillian sprinter owners out there have sat down with calculator and figured out how much this little van is saving them... bottom line... no one likes to pay 3 bucks for something they paid a dollar for three years ago. fuel price inflation is bringing mental havoc onto the mind of the fuel consumer and causing panic and wild specualtion by those small business folk who work their cars for living. this is changing the type of car the consumer believes they need to invest in order to stay competitive. when i bought mine i asked my self will a 14 mpg gas van be as competitve as the more fuel economic 22 mpg diesel van. i'm sure every sprinter owner out there who bought these spriter vans for their businesses thought of this and that's why they decide to leave the tradtional van market (v-8 FordChevGMC) which has worked extermely well for 30 years.

    car companies realize all of this now, finally. most of us sprinter owners are happy with the apparent milege and don't suspect a thing because that's what dodge said it would do. it tells us what we want to hear.

    so why wouldn't chrysler fudge the numbers a bit. playing with numbers is not new practice in the corporate world and seldom goes noticed.

    most of these vans are fleet vehicles. when it comes time to do the books the bean counters are gonna look at fuel consumed and miles covered and they'll decide if this new vehicle is saving them money. they'll do this by taking an odometer reading and fuel quantity used. a driver for DHL or UPS isn't gonna email the big boss man and bring it to his attention that the speedometer is inaccurate and that the new MPG figures is bogus. shoot no! he could care less. and a lot of the folks who buy these cars for their businesses aren't driving 'em personally and or will never discover this error. in fact, i could beleive that only a small single digit percentage will ever notice the speedometer error because, well, shoot... why would this super expensive piece of equipment have an inaccurate speedometer in this day and age... hey, it's mercedes-benz right! and i'm sure an overwhelming amount of sprinter owners out there are satisfied and happy with looking at the milege and fuel consummed and reading 21-22-23-24 mpg and leave it at that.

    the first thing i learned when i enrolled at my alma mater business school at ol Hard Knox Univ is when something seems to good to be true it's usually not.

    all things aside it does get good milege... but does it get what it said it advertised, really? if that sale brouchure said "19 mpg average" and not "22 MPG average" maybe more of us out there wouldn't have digged so deep in our pockets to buy it. a ford econoline 150 with a v-6 gets up 18 mpg on the hwy and is as equally stout and only cost $20,000. the fact that it got over 20 MPG's was the selling point for me to spend an EXTRA $10,000.... does it really do it, hmmm i thought it did, but now i'm wondering.

    this definately wouldn't be the first time big business tried to screwed the little guy by misrepresenting a product. the sad thing is that what they're doing (or letting happen) is probably totally legal because of some ancient US speedometer calibration law. it's funny how us americans never realized where getting screwed until after we get screwed. wonder if DR Z is out there and will vouch for his product!!!!

    and by the way @ $3.35 for fuel a 14mpg van will get 24 cents a mile and the 22 mpg van will be 15 cents a mile... at that rate it would take 111k miles to make up the cost difference of the $10000 premiuim for the sprinter... if it gets 19 mpg true, then it would be 17 cents a mile and it would take 200k miles to make up the difference... and that's not taking into account the increased cost to maintain this thing over a regualar van... but of course as fuel prices rise the difference in cent per mile will be greater and the milege gap will close so... i'm anxious to see what happens.
  • The only oil I have found that is currently compliant is the Amsoil Synthetic See the link below. I shows it meets the new MB 288.3 specs.

    http://www.amsoil.com/StoreFront/deo.aspx
  • I recently drove by one of those speed limit/radar machines. (As was
    stated here in several post) the machine revealed that my Spinter
    (118,Low) was doing 35 mph while my speedometer showed me to be doing
    38 mph. Hmmmm.

    Being an automotive mechanic here in the northeast I went to the
    garage and picked up my Snap-On MT-2500 Scan Tool. I then went home
    and picked up my handheld GPS that I use hiking.
    I plugged the scan tool into the OBDII socket and turned on my GPS. I
    then fetched up my Wife and we headed for the highway. With my Wife at
    the wheel I setup the scan tool and GPS on the dash in the passengers
    seat and told the driver to bring it up to 60 MPH.

    Guess what!

    The only thing out of calibration turned out to be the speedometer.

    The PCM MPH PID in the scan tool matched the GPS down to the tenth.

    The speedometer is an analog device that converts digital infomation
    from the PCM to something that makes the speedo needle move.
    Apparently, it's not very accurate. Which is the case with a lot of
    vehicles I'm sure. But the odometer is not effected in this way. In
    fact, the instrument cluster is simply a "dumb terminal" in most
    modern vehical. If you replace it you will not change your odometer
    reading because this reading is calculated and stored in the PCM.

    What a relief. I've been watching my mileage figures using the
    odometer as a constant. And now I know that the figure is correct. But
    the speedometer is advanced by 3.5 mph at 60 mph.

    This doesn't bother me in the least unless of course, the gas gauge is
    also wrong.
  • kenbakerkenbaker Posts: 239
    Yes,
    the fuel gauge has many more miles in the top 1/4 tank and second quarter tank than it has in the last two quarters...

    Also have easily put 26.5 gallons in a 26.4 gallon tank and I was NOT out of fuel at the time...

    the Speedometer error seems so weird because it does not seem to be proprtional (always about 2-3 MPH off). It does NOT seem to be 1 MPH off at 20, 2 at 40, 3 at 80. How about yours? At 82-83 the GPS says 79 MPH (my TOP speed).

    Got to 85 on the speedo one time when it overshot the mark... never have gotten close to 90 (top speed in manual)!

    KenB :shades:
  • Has anybody an idea as to how far one can go when the fuel light comes on. I have been sweating a few times thinking I was going to run out,( I hear that is not a good thing). The needle was bottomed out. When I fueled up I still had 2.5 gallon left in the tank.

    My speedo also is 3 mph off. I just rely on the GPS. I have hit a top end of 80. To get more I would have to be going down hill, off a cliff with a large sail. Boy I hate getting stuck in the fast lane and I got nothing left, and can't get over to the right lane.

    Tom :D
  • kenbakerkenbaker Posts: 239
    Tom,
    The dreaded Yellow Triangle supposedly comes on with 2.8 gallons left in the tank (up to about 60 miles of wiggle room for my Sprinter at 20.nuttin' MPG, no A/C). Still haven't run out at 537+ miles (should do about 528 at 26.4 Gal. and 20.0001 MPG.) I always try to get fuel by 500 miles, less in the Summer when I might use both A/C units.

    I am learning to just set back and let the really fast lane alone... but it is hard not to go there when the right lane is going S l O W w w w w.

    KenB
  • remember with diesl that milage gets better over
    time,it can take a good 20k miles for these engines
    to break in
  • there is a hand pump..
    if you ever run out of fuel after
    you fill up unscrew that pump and goto town
    until fuel comes out.
    dont even try to start before that.
  • kenbakerkenbaker Posts: 239
    I certainly thought about break-in...

    Now 22,000 miles and I just got an incredible 21.2 (up from about 20.001). What else influences that number? Cold weather, no A/C required for most of the tank, what else?

    I have mostly heard the the post break-in will go up about 5% at the most (2 MPG on 20 MPG base figures). If that is true, then I am half way there.

    quit using power service until it turned COLD again, now am using for the anti-gelling properties (white bottle, red and black lettering).

    KenB :shades:
  • jim314jim314 Posts: 491
    You are there! Five percent of 20 is 1, an increase of 2 mpg on 20 mpg is 10 %.
  • hey, guys: quit belly achin' about the speedometers being off. i'm from the old school where all speedometers were off; this is pretty typical, and it doesn't bother me in the least. my gps shows about 56+ mph when the speedo shows 60.

    as for mpg, i'm getting around 24-28 in my sprinter 2500 118" wheelbase regular roof line. but i drive with fuel economy in mind. those of you who are watching your mpgs carefully, consider your speed and load (obviously) but also your roof profile. i'm still pretty happy with my sprinter and will have it for a long time (i sure hope so, anyway). the better mileage (compared to the usual gas engines available with the domestics) and better inside dimensions will convince me i made a good decision for a long time.

    i'm also seeing more mobil 1 0w-40 on the shelves in the local auto stores and at wal mart.
  • a lot of mfgrs are now making their speedos read fast intentionally
    VW does it but you can punch the right code into your climate control unit and it will display the accurate speed digitally

    reason for the fast reading speedo is litigation concerns
    go figure - that was from the vw na technical director
  • kipkkipk Posts: 1,576
    MPG ratings are averages.

    With economy in mind, a given vehicle, with the same driver will not deliver the same mileage when driven under different conditions. Hilly conditions will result in lower figures than relatively flat roads. Adding or subtracting weight will affect mileage.

    If your truck is carrying around a lot of cargo weight, it will not deliver the "AVERAGE" mpg. One that is near empty may deliver better than average.

    A GPS will most likely reveal your speedometer is reading a bit higher than actual speed, but your odometer will be pretty much dead on.! I can't explain it, it is just the way things are sometimes.

    Anytime anyone contemplates paying extra to get a few more miles per gallon, they need to do the calculation before the fact, rather than after the fact! :confuse:

    To drive 100,00 miles:
    Consider 15mpg with gas @ $2.50 gal.. It would cost $16,667 for fuel. Now 22mpg with diesel at $2.70 a gal would cost $12,272. Diesel will save about $4400 in fuel.

    I used a 20 cent higher price for diesel because of prices in my ares. Yours may vary.

    My understanding is that there is a slightly higher maintaince cost associated with diesel and possibly additional additives that gas engines don't require.
    That would make the above $4400 figure lower.

    Even if the savings were the $4400, it would take over 200K miles to break even for an extra $9000 purchase price. :sick:

    Keeping in mind that higher or lower fuel cost will affect numbers. :)

    Kip
  • jim314jim314 Posts: 491
    And really you must consider that the extra $9000 purchase price for a diesel Sprinter is an upfront cost and that the $4400 fuel savings are received over the 8 or 10 years it would take to drive the 100,000 mi.

    This is a "time value of money" calculation, which I can't do without some investigation, but it can be approximated as an interest calculation. If you buy the 15 mpg gasoline Ford or Chevy van and put $9000 in savings at 5% interest compounded anually for 9 years, it would turn into $9000(1.05)^9 = $9000(1.55) = $14,000.

    Of course, a Sprinter has features that the Ford and Chevy vans do not. When the gasoline Sprinters become available you will be able to separate the premium for a diesel from the premium for a gasoline Sprinter. Very possibly it will turn out that a gasoline Sprinter may make more financial sense than a diesel one for many who want a Sprinter.

    Also it may be an important value to you to save fuel whether it makes economic sense or not. Note however that in doing fuel use comparisons between gasoline and diesel you should really use the weights of fuels and not the volumes. Diesel fuel is 15% denser than gasoline, (and gasoline has 87% of the density of diesel fuel). So to correct the mpg of a gasoline engine for the difference in density you'd multiply the gasoline mpg value by 1.15 to get a corrected mpg value equivalent to that of a diesel. Therefore, the 15 mpg of the Chevy is corrected to 17 mpg for comparison to the diesel value of 22 mpg for true amount (that is weight) of fuel used for environmental purposes. You do not make this correction for cost because motor fuel is sold by the gallon and not by the weight.
  • kipkkipk Posts: 1,576
    Yep!

    To be fair, if fuel should go considerably higher and the vehicle was to be driven for several hundred thousand miles during that 9 years, the savings of a diesel would become apparent.

    Of course there may become an even greater cost difference at the pump between diesel and gas, if/when Bio-diesels are forced upon us and higher cost plus poorer mileage kick in. :sick:
  • jim314jim314 Posts: 491
    So in the previous post (#58) I calculated the original est $9000 in purchase price savings of the gasoline engine would accrue $5000 in interest over 9 years, but to compare you would have to assume that the fuel cost savings of a diesel would be saved and put at interest each month or year. Over 9 years this would grow to some amount which could be calculated, and which would be in the diesel's favor. That is, one would subtract this amount from the $14,000 advantage for the gasoline engine to get a net monetary gain for the gasoline engine.
  • kipkkipk Posts: 1,576
    True! There is a big IF! IF the savings were actually put into a savings instrument.

    Figured on a yearly basis of 11,111 miles driven, the diesel would save $488 a year. The $9000 would grow $450 the first year.

    At 22,000 miles a year the diesel would save $976 and the $9000 would still have only grown the $450.

    If that $976 were saved in a 5% instrument and the diesel maintenance cost are not overwhelming, the diesel is a winner.

    As stated earlier, the diesel needs lots of mileage to be worthwhile.

    Average homeowner that wants a van for trips to Home Depot or occasional camping or towing would probably be better off with the 15 mpg V8. Me thinks.

    Maybe Dodge will slip a V8 into it while Mercedes is not looking! ;)

    Kip
  • jim314jim314 Posts: 491
    The 2007 Sprinter will be available with a gasoline engine--a 3L V-6, I think.
  • kenbakerkenbaker Posts: 239
    money saved always has a time-value (interest rate equivalent) whether you put it into an "instrument" or not.

    What you are looking for is a MARR (minimum accetable Rate of Return) for your investment, and time-value of money is always a part of that equation. More money saved earlier is better... and money saved over time is less so.

    Since I got my Sprinter at a $7000 (+/- $500) discount, I don't have a problem getting my investment back...

    Money saved on maintenance, extended service intervals (if efective), and reduced shop down-time are more intangible in nature when compared to MPG and initial cost.

    At least in the passenger model, I don't see as big a difference in the Sprinter compared to a GM or Ford product for price on a 3/4 ton or 1 ton model basis. That is, of course, if you don't mind (or, like me, prefer) Rubber Mat flooring and simple/sturdy (Sprinter) instead of carpeted and plush (which most GM and Ford vans will be).

    My last Astro/Safari listed for nearly what I spent on my Sprinter and the Sprinter still gets better mileage than the Safari mini Van!

    KenB :shades:
  • jim314jim314 Posts: 491
    I didn't know the best deals people were actually getting. I just used the $9000 difference that one person gave. I know my calculations are not properly done return on investment calculations. They were not even proper TVM calculations.

    Personally, I much prefer the rubber mat flooring because it can be cleaned extremely well. And the greater inside height would be a huge plus for me. Are you saying that the Sprinter deals and the Chevy Express deals are much closer than $9000. How close would you say? Estimate if you don't know for sure.
  • kenbakerkenbaker Posts: 239
    within about $3K-$5K Sometimes tighter... On passenger vans. Mine was certainly nearly even-steven.

    The thing is as you point out with the high roof is that GM and Ford CAN'T match it... Except for aftermarket or co-production deals (and a bit of extra expense, I don't have a figure on that) you can't get a domestic high-roof, and then there is NO door that opens top-to-bottom full heighth on the whole vehicle.

    Of course, so far the Sprinter doesn't have alot of power for towing. My dad has the Ford 1ton PowerStroke Diesel van (a $45K+ vehicle), it gets close to the mileage I get (19 MPG for the Ford, I get 20-21 in my Sprinter). He also can tow an Airstream 26 footer easily (about 8,000 Lb.)

    My Sprinter can tow 5,000 Lb., and I have heard good things about them towing except that your acceleration will be limited (I don't expect to hurry when I tow anyway).

    As the 2007 model gets closer to the USA market, I expect the 2006's (if available on the dealer lots) to get a price drop (not much, but some). The extra horsepower and updated van are a strong draw to some, but the existing vehicle is strong enough for us and the space-to-MPG ratio is HUGEly in our favor as it is.

    We haul family, friends, church folks, co-workers on lunch outings, etc. and most all are impressed (and I have the shorter version of the two).

    KenB :shades:
    2004 Arctic White MWB 2500 HC Dodge Sprinter converted back to Mercedes: badges/hubcaps/decals/grill(white)
  • jim314jim314 Posts: 491
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel
    "The density of [petroleum] diesel is about 850 grams per liter [18% greater than gasoline] whereas gasoline has a density of about 720 g/l, about 15% less. When burnt, diesel typically releases about 40.9 megajoules (MJ) per liter, whereas gasoline releases 34.8 MJ/L, about 15% less. Diesel is generally simpler to refine than gasoline and often costs less (although price fluctuations sometimes mean that the inverse is true; for example, the cost of diesel traditionally rises during colder months as demand for heating oil, which is refined much the same way, rises). Also, due to its high level of pollutants, diesel fuel must undergo additional filtration which contributes to a sometimes higher cost.

    "Diesel powered cars generally have about a 40% better fuel economy than equivalent gasoline engines[1] and produce only about 69% of the greenhouse gases. This greater fuel economy is due to the higher per-liter energy content of diesel fuel and also to the intrinsic efficiency of the diesel engine. While diesel's 15% higher volumetric energy density results in 15% higher greenhouse gas emissions per liter compared to gasoline[2], the 40% better fuel economy achieved by modern diesel-engined automobiles offsets the higher-per-liter emissions of greenhouse gases, resulting in significantly lower carbon dioxide emissions per kilometer."

    So you'd multiply the gasoline mpg by 1.18 to correct for the lower density of gasoline compared to diesel fuel. So the 15 mpg of a gasoline engine should be corrected to 15(1.18) = 17.6 mpg for comparison to an equivalent weight of diesel fuel.
  • kipkkipk Posts: 1,576
    "Diesel powered cars generally have about a 40% better fuel economy than equivalent gasoline engines[1] and produce only about 69% of the greenhouse gases....

    Jim, I realize your information is probably accurate according to some study somewhere. I'm just having trouble with it. Mostly from personal experience and observation.

    The part I don't understand is the "equivalent".
    Just how do we compare and make equivalent the gas and the diesel engines. Do we compare torque, horsepower, or displacement?

    Diesels generally will produce more torque and less horse power than an "Equal Size", displacement, gas engine. Therefore diesels of equal displacement will do more "work".
    However their MPG will be similar to the same displacement gas engine unless working really hard.

    Just reading the "Real World Mileage" over on the Dodge Ram forum, the Diesels are getting a little better than the gas, but not 40%. I know that is not a fair comparison as they are comparing trucks that "WORK" with heavier loads and weigh more.

    My 360 CI Ram was considerably "quicker" than a friends Cummings Turbo Diesel. Mine was a 98 and his a year or two newer. His was rated to tow considerably more. I averaged a shade over 14 daily driving and 18 road. He said he was getting about 2 better on both. Still not 40%.

    It does get confusing to me!

    Kip
  • jim314jim314 Posts: 491
    I agree that there is a problem with the meaning of equivalent. We should be comparing gas and diesel engines of the same horsepower, but we don't.

    Torque output can be changed by gearing, power output is proportional to the product of the torque and the rpms. A diesel engine will have a lower max power rating than a gasser of the same max torque because the diesel cannot reach the same max rpms. But most diesels do get more power out of the same weight of fuel than a gasoline engine. You can find explanations of why this is so, usually cited is that air pumping resistance in the gasser is higher because gassers are "throttled" whereas diesels have no throttle restricting air flow into the cylinders; and higher thermodynamic efficiency of the diesel due to its higher compression ratio.

    But the fact is that most people hardly ever run their engines in passenger cars at high rpms and peak power. They drive at rpms around the torque maximum because this is fuel efficient and doesn't give the impression that the engine is straining. Under these conditions a diesel and a gasser with the same max torque rating will accelerate the car about the same. The fact that the diesel will have a much lower max hp rating than the gasser will not be evident unless you are trying to pass another vehicle on an uphill 2-lane road, or are testing 0-60mph performance.

    I think that in the past people who got diesels in passenger cars were looking for fuel efficiency and would accept lower hp engines which gave inferior acceleration that the gassers offered in that car.

    Here is a quote from an automotive engineer: ". . . look at the BSFC (Brake Specific Fuel Consumption) of each engine. For example, a Cummins ISB (the Dodge Pickup engine) is rated at 0.34 lbs/hp/hr. As a comparison, the Detroit Diesel Series 60 is rated at 0.38 lbs/hp/hr and most gasoline engines are in the .48-.52lbs/hp/hr class. (Those figures are for peak torque, which is generally the most fuel efficient point.)"

    See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BSFC

    But in my opinion the diesel engine in pick-up trucks do not appeal to the buyer as much on the basis of fuel efficiency, but rather high torque, fairly high horsepower (not much less than the gasoline engines offered in that truck), longevity, durability, diesel image. So the engines in diesel trucks are slower 0-60mph than gassers but not a lot slower.

    The diesel will be a much more expensive engine which can better tolerate continuous operation at a higher percent of max power output than the gasoline engines offered in that truck. Hence it will probably have a more durable transmission and a higher towing rating.
  • jim314jim314 Posts: 491
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W%C3%A4rtsil%C3%A4-Sulzer_RTA96-C

    The large 2-stroke marine diesel is the most efficient reciprocating engine with BSFC of 0.28 lb/bhp-hr. Also diesels are now being produced for general aviation use. At least some of these are 2-stroke which would have the advantage that the power to weight ratio would be higher than a four stroke.
  • Well it got down to -12. I put a light under the battery to keep it warm. And would not start :cry:. But had plenty of cranking power. Any suggestions on a fuel additive. Thanks, Tom
  • kipkkipk Posts: 1,576
    In our ares most folks with Diesel P/Us plug in the engine block heaters if air temp gets into the teens.

    Don't know what they do if away from an electrical outlet!

    Kip
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