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Dodge,Ford,Chevy------who wins?

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  • KCRamKCRam Mt. Arlington NJPosts: 3,516
    DC will not be making a 5.5L OHC V8 (a stroked 4.7). Instead, they have announced their plans to build both a 5.7L V8 and a 6.1L V8. Click here for the story from Ward's Automotive.
  • sd99sd99 Posts: 65
    Wow, is that really you Dave40?
  • RoclesRocles Posts: 985
    Knuckleheads. That's all I can muster at the moment. I come back after a brutal bike accident and you guys(different characters;same argument)are still throwing numbers in the wind!!
    I have said this as an authority:Dodge is getting better and maybe in five years they will push the envelope but overall truck QUALITY is Ford. Although I have been relegated to financial partner status at my roofing firm since my ordeal, I haven't forgotten the quality. All makes of different years and the Fords routinely are the cheapest to repair and run.
    Forget that the Chevy might have 3ft/lbs more of torque than the Ford. What really matters to the consumer? Initial price, overall quality, years of service, and sound sales of many (more)other buyers. Dodge is fine. Chevy....Ok. Ford? Don't like the swoosh? So what!! What are we? 16? Only MEN should operate and USE a truck. Men would not be concerned if they think their truck is sissified. When does function topple aestetics? With Ford owners.

    My incredibly loud two pennies.
  • bobmar24bobmar24 Posts: 1
    Greeting you truck gurus,
    My name is Bob and I'm 24 years old...soon to be graduating from Az State. When I am hired I will reward myself w/ the purchase of my first truck. I will most likely be buying a full size ext. cab truck 97-99. I love trucks and I have fallen in love with them driving trucks that belong to various friends and family members. My parents have never owned trucks nor it their any real mechanical know-how in my immediate family. Thus I turn to you guys for help. Here's my qusetions....What would you guys suggest? I love the looks of the F150's as well as the Dakota and Rams. I also wouldn't rule out a 4x4 Tacoma either...or what about the T100 or Tundra or Frontier 4x4? Reliability and safety are very important to me. I will also be lugging my daughter around in this truck and she'll be about 3 years old at time of purchase. So keep in mind that I need a user friendly and comfortable truck as well. To be honest, I love the exterior as well as the interior looks of the F150's. I have had an opportunity to look these trucks over a great deal at a local dealership and I think they're awesome looking. But are they the right truck for me? Also, I won't be using the bed of the truck for hard daily use; just occasional use. And if you guys do recommend an F150 for me...what features/options should I keep in mind when purchasing this truck? I really appreciate your help.
    Thanx,
    Bob
  • dave40dave40 Posts: 582
    GET THE LIGHTNING
  • smcpherrsmcpherr Posts: 114
    BobMar,

    I drove a '97 F-150 4x2 XLT for three years, and now drive a '99 F-150 4x4 XLT. Loved the first one, Love the second even more. For a truck, the ride is very good, even in the 4x4 with the offroad package. The truck handles exceptionally well, and has good engine choices. It also is a well built truck, three years and the only problem I had was a leaking brake line which was quickly fixed under warranty. Also important, my girlfriend, mother and sister all love riding in it, and can drive it very easily. I only know Ford (which I recommend to anyone), but other manufacturers build good trucks too. Try asking specific questions in the specific conference rooms (for the Tundra, Ram, Dakota, F-150, etc...). Those topics are more frequented than this one. Whatever choice you pick, if you pick one you like, you will be happy with it. (Even the Lightning!)

    Rocles, good to have you back. Hope it was nothing too serious. Rehab is a pain, good luck.

    Scotty
  • ladyblueladyblue Posts: 326
    BobMar:

    I've had an F150 4x4 and now drive a Ram. I would recommend both. The only way Chevy/GMC could enter the running is if they come through with their promised 4th door.

    As far as options, get as many as you can afford! This will avoid future "truck envy" when you start wishing you'd gotten this bell or that whistle. Just my opinion.
  • RoclesRocles Posts: 985
    bobmar,
    I presume you are a single guy. With that in mind, I would consider a regular cab with a short bed. 4x2 with either the 4.6 eight or the 4.2 basic six. I wouldn't strap myself right out of college paying for the extended cab or the XLT trim package. Not that an extended cab wouldn't be useful! Just more pesos. Lighting? Yeah, they roar but I hope you have a great first job...
    Scotty, thanks for the encouragement. It looks like rehab through the rest of the year. Hopefully I'll be able to sit up for longer times so I can hit the site more often.
  • dave40dave40 Posts: 582
    Who has the nicest looking Truck DODGE FORD CHEVY
    Show Your Truck Pictures at Topic #775 Truck Pictures
  • KCRamKCRam Mt. Arlington NJPosts: 3,516
    GM announced today that the new Isuzu direct-injection 6.6L V8 turbodiesel will be available for the 2001 model year in the HD Silverado/Sierra pickups. It is named the "Duramax 6600", as the joint venture plant in Indiana is called DMAX Ltd. Power output was not mentioned.

    The Duramax has its work cut out for it. The current Ford/Navistar Powerstroke 7.3 V* is rated at 235 hp and 500 lb-ft. The 2000-1/2 (available after January 15th) Dodge/Cummins will be rated at 245/505 from just a 5.9 liter six. If the Duram,ax falls short in either horsepower or torque, GM and Isuzu wil have wasted a lot of development money, because the diesel consumer will say "why'd you bother, if the Ford and Dodge are still more powerful?"

    And who is coming up with these engine "names"? In the full-size group, we will now have Vortec and Duramax from GM, Triton and Powerstroke from Ford, PowerTech from Dodge (thank God they didn't name the Cummins), and "i-force" from Toyota. The folks in Marketing must have time on their hands...
  • dave40dave40 Posts: 582
    Ford Super duty vs Sierra 2500
    http://www.caranddriver.com
  • cdeancdean Posts: 1,110
    well, KC, i don't think GM has to absolutely top both the Cummins and Navistar in the power numbers, but it would sure help their marketing if it did. if they put up an engine that is within 10-20 ftlbs, or a few horsepower, thats not enough that different gearing wouldn't hide. what if it had a more reliable design or better mileage. and not to mention if they truck was the best on the market, an engine that fell short by 20 ftlbs at peak, shouldn't be the only reason for not getting a truck.

    But, i agree, it will be hard to make an advertisement for a new engine that doesn't have the raw numbers. Just read some posts around here and see how people preach peak numbers as bible.
  • KCRamKCRam Mt. Arlington NJPosts: 3,516
    cdean,

    My point exactly. Today with the consumer buying light trucks as much as the work/commercial user, manufacturers have to play the numbers game. Cummins is sending that revised engine to Dodge in January not just to make some drivability adjustments, but to reclaim the hp and torque lead from Navistar. Never mind that, since both engines currently produce 235 hp @ 2700 rpm, physics tell you they are also both producing 460 lb-ft @ 2700 rpm as well. That "500" number from Ford sat in people's minds at the number to beat. So Dodge will have 505 to work with - a big improvement? No. A numbers game and a marketing tool? Absolutely.

    With the Nav at 235/500 and the Cummins at a projected 245/505, the Duramax really needs to come in at 230-250 hp and it must have 500 lb-ft. That magic digit "5" will be a sales killer for GM if they can't meet it, just as the magic digit "3" makes or breaks a gas engine's horsepower figure.
  • cdeancdean Posts: 1,110
    i think i heard on the radio that overall, all vehicle sales were down for the past month. I think a lot of people are holding out on GMs in hope of 4 doors, and/or new heavy duty models.

    It appears that the Tundra was "immune" to the slow month of June.
  • dave40dave40 Posts: 582
    300 hp 520 lbs torque
    heard it through the grapevine
  • RoclesRocles Posts: 985
    Numbers this close don't matter to the average consumer. 500,520 or 530? So what. Now if GM was boasting 600--then my jaw would probably be slacked...
    I think that GM really has to figure which part of the truck debate they want to go all out for. Throwing new engines around has always been a Chevy stronghold but they have lost customers through the years with the other features. Ford has really positioned itself as the work-truck leader with the exceptional line of the super-duty's. Their light half-tons are nimble enough to appeal to new truck-owners which completes the circle.
    Dodge knows that looks won't get them to Ford's level so they have been improving options and the like. GM is right to design a new diesel but better start looking at the whole package.
  • moparmannmoparmann Posts: 1
    Test drive a dodge and you won`t even look at the rest. The rules HAVE changed. Chevrolet/Gmc is having problems competing and ford has to change body styles each year to even try to keep up.
  • dave40dave40 Posts: 582
    Well here's Chevy's New numbers for the 2000 Silverado's
    4.8 + 15 hp same torque
    5.3 + 15 hp + 10lbs torque
    6.0 + 25 hp same torque
  • KCRamKCRam Mt. Arlington NJPosts: 3,516
    the 6.0 is an interesting rating then - 325 hp, and 355 lb-ft of torque. Is it mentioned whether it was a further increase in the rpm band, or is the necessary torque actually higher at the hp peak point?
  • dave40dave40 Posts: 582
    Not sure on the rpm curve's
    but the hp increase was achieved with new cam's
    4.8 270 hp
    5.3 285 hp
    6.0 325 hp
  • quadrunner500quadrunner500 Posts: 2,728
    I drove next to an GM/Izuzu heavy duty truck the other day. The diesel motor, in comparison to a Navistar or Cummins is exceptionally quiet. So much so, they may have to sweeten it up a bit to satisfy the cravings of the light truck market segment. It may make 300 hp, but if you have to floor it to make anyone notice....
  • cdeancdean Posts: 1,110
    ha! its funny but you're right. I have a couple of friends who admittedly bought a powerstroke for one simple reason: "It sounds so cool!"
  • RoclesRocles Posts: 985
    Moparmann,

    The rules have changed but the first rule hasn't:Ford is the truck leader. They haven't changed styles "each year" to keep up. Keep up? Last time I checked keeping up for Ford means maintaing number 1.
    Don't misinterpret me; Dodge has made VAST improvements during the past decade and I think it was great for the other two. It does add to the mix. Trust me, I own all three for our firm and the Rams have held their own.
    Chevy is in the biggest need for a good shot in the arm if they want to stop the bleeding. Boy,that strike couldn't have hit them at a worse time.
  • RoclesRocles Posts: 985
    maintaining. Damn I knew I should used that spellcheck!!!!!!!!!
  • cdeancdean Posts: 1,110
    I agree, I think GMs supply problems are still repercussions of the strike. very possibly some quality or mechanical problems are due to the scramble to set up the factories after it was resolved.
  • kernickkernick Posts: 4,072
    First off let me say that I have no particular loyalty to any particular brand. The only truck I've ever owned was a used 1986 Jeep Cherokee. Now that I have a house and live in the country in New Hampshire, I decided I needed a truck. And my wife wants a horse (and trailer). So I entered the pickup market.
    I looked at the Ford and the Dodge, and testdrove the Tundra and the Silverado (Z71). If the Toyota weren't 95% fullsize I may have bought it. I have owned Ford, Dodge, and Chevy cars and found that the Chevies had the best quality (always started and ran - not necessarily the shake-rattle-paint quality). So you can see I'm going to say I'm buying a Chevy Siverado 1500 - 4x4, ext. cab, Z-71, w/5.3L engine. Why? It has the largest interior, for 2000 - the 5.3 makes 285hp and I believe has better mpg than the large (same power range) Ford and Dodge engines, and it has Autotrac instantaneous 4wd as an option. Hopefully GM has most of the bugs worked out after a year of production.
  • RoclesRocles Posts: 985
    May I ask how much it cost?
  • markbuckmarkbuck Posts: 1,021
    horse and trailer? I'd go 3/4 ton....
  • kernickkernick Posts: 4,072
    I haven't purchased my Silverado yet, so I don't have a price. I want it before winter comes as I have a wholly inadequate-in-the-snow '98 Camaro. I am going to the closest Chevy dealer, and want to order it for near invoice. If they want more than the 3% Holdback from GM, I'll tell them I'm going to a AAA or Costco Warehouse Club dealer, or even on the Internet - I think there's a place "invoice.com" or something. I'm going to try the last-day-of-the month factor also.
    I won't be pulling a horsetrailer much, and estimate the max. wt. to be around 3000lb. So the 1500 should be fine. I want to keep the truck for a longtime, and I just couldn't live with the 12mpg people are getting from the 6.0L in the 2500.
  • RoclesRocles Posts: 985
    The gas mileage won't be any better when yanking a heavy trailer. I also seriously doubt that 3,000 pounds will be the limit. You might want to do more research in fifth-wheel trailers and reconsider a 3/4 ton. If you want to keep this truck over time-it'll be hard without changing a fair amount of bearings and the like on stressing a half-ton on big jobs like a horse trailer.
This discussion has been closed.