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What is this thing worth?

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Comments

  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,679
    Only two hubcaps?

    Well, since it has the chrome Mustang wheels I would need a bigger garage.
  • fintailfintail Posts: 33,687
    If I end up with wheels I might sell them myself ;)
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,278
    But you said the body, paint, and interior are done, right? That's the biggest expense of a resto. So $3k + $1k trans + $1k install and you've got yourself a running, driving, nice looking v8 stang. Is that the whole of it? Then sell it cheap at $10k without doing the finishing work.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,679
    My biggest problem is space and I don't feel like paying 400.00 a month for a storage building. We only have a two car garage and I hate (unlike most of our neighbors) leaving cars outside.

    And I just KNOW parts will be missing. Things like bolts, brackets etc.

    Still, what a buy it is! I've learned to trust my instincts and I just see red flags waving at me.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,796
    edited October 2013
    I had a friend who bought a 60s Maserati like that...he figured $20K to finish...it ended up being $93,000, on top of what he paid for the car (not an insubstantial amount) . He did have a very nice car at the end, though, but factoring in what he paid for the "project", he about broke even...and if he holds the car another 5 years, he'll even make a little.

    What screwed the deal? Two things---1) missing or wrong parts and 2) shoddy workmanship to those parts already done.

    If I bought that 'Stang, very first thing I'd do is tear the engine down and look around. I have seen 'rebuilt' engines with vice grip marks on the connecting rod bolts!

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  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,679
    Well, what's wrong with that?

    Isn't a pair of vise grips a poor man's torque wrench?

    Once, when I was 17 years old. I had to change a fuel pump on my buddy's
    55 Chevy in a parking lot. We were a long way from home and broke.

    We walked across the street to a handy wrecking yard and bought a used one for 3.00 and using a pair of vise grips (only tool we had) and by using the old gasket, I changed it.

    Lucky it was a 6 cyl and I didn't want to be the guy who had to deal with those
    rounded off fittings the next time.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,796
    edited October 2013
    The term "rebuilt" is abused about as much as "I Love You".

    Rebuilt is SUPPOSED to mean that the engine is returned to factory spec. It does NOT mean that "we replaced what was worn and left what was still okay. "

    That latter definition should be called "overhaul".

    Then there's the second question: Rebuilt by WHOM?"

    Hopefully not by the Krylon Engine Co.

    image

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  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,679
    edited October 2013
    Have an appointment to see it tomorrow morning.

    It sounds like he has had a lot of interest on it.

    Link wouldn't post...in Seattle Craigslist a MINT 1999 Saab 93 convertible.

    Selling it for his mother in law who bought it new and babied it.

    Wants 3500.00 and has other showings scheduled.

    112,000 miles.

    Yeah, I have lost my mind!
  • omarmanomarman Posts: 704
    Beautiful Convertible Saab 9-3 - $3500

    Compared to columbus, there's a lot of listings in tacoma for 1999 Saabs! ;)
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,796
    Oh, an automatic----I don't think I'd touch that one. Price is too high for the miles anyway. I'd offer about $2200.

    1. It's an orphan

    2. Nobody likes to work on them

    3. Parts are expensive

    4. Resale value is nil.

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  • hpmctorquehpmctorque Posts: 4,201
    edited October 2013
    Beginning with the 1994 model year the 9-3 used the GM Opel platform, and the automatic transmission is a GM 4-speed unit, as far as I know. haven't heard that that one is problematic, as the 3-speed unit of the pre-1994 Saabs was reputed to be. Just commenting, but I don't hold myself out as an expert on this.

    Now, I believe the convertible switched to the Opel platform after 1994, but certainly before 1999. However, your four points are probably still valid, even if the transmission has a normal life expectancy. For example, I heard from the owner of a body shop who had one from the generation of the one we're talking about in his parking lot that the convertible top mechanism is very expensive to replace.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 28,456
    Those are all great reasons... if you are a used car dealer..

    But, if you want the car for yourself... None of that matters except for #2 and #3... (no one buys a $3500 car for the resale value)

    So, if you can find someone to work on it, you are set... That is a pretty nice car for $3500... You can't find an old Civic with under 150K miles for that amount...

    That doesn't mean you shouldn't try to get it cheaper... but, someone will snap it up soon for over $3K.. (I'd rather have a stick, too, but that just makes four or five of us....lol)

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  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,679
    I really need to stay away from Craigslist!

    About a week ago, someone asked a question in the "Questions" section on these forums about the advisability of buying a used Saab.

    Since that person was concerned about maintenance costs, I jumped in and told her that if that was important to her that there were much better choices.

    I reminded her that she would be buying an "orphan" etc and I tried to steer her away.

    So, here I am, looking at a SAAB!!

    I've never owned one but for some reason I've always been attracted to them. I know they tend to attract Engineers and people like that who are usually fiercely loyal to the brand.

    I also know that a lot of shops simply refuse to work on them.

    Still, I'm meeting the owner in an hour. Thinking I probably will pass
    or make him an offer he won't take but you never know.

    I just can't STAND not having an "extra" car in the garage!
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 28,456
    You really need to find a Saab mechanic, before you buy that car, though... ;-)

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  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,679
    Yes, good advice.

    There is a Euro shop about three miles from where we live and I've seen Saabs in there but I should give him a call anyway.

    I've owned two Peugeots years ago. Don't laugh!

    They were both diesels and they were strong and built like a tank. they had the most comfortable seats ever.

    There are (or were) a couple of shops in Seattle that worked on them and nearer there was a one man shop that only worked on Peugeots.

    That guy was a real Prima Donna who always made sure you knew he was doing you a favor by working on your Peugeot.

    And...maybe he was!
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,796
    To give you an idea---I live in "car repair mecca"---some of the finest mechanics in the world reside in the SF Bay Area---I'd be LUCKY to beg someone to work on a Saab. I know only tHREE 'specialists", all of which have Yelp reviews that would make your socks roll up and down. To be fair, they aren't ALL bad.

    SAMPLE: (paraphrasing from memory, from a woman poster)..."then he threw the keys at the floor in front of my feet and said "Get your freakin' car out of here, you Marin County _____!"

    Another Saab repair shop: "So, sorry to say, that despite a high recommendation from my mother, who had given my son the Saab in the first place, I found XX at XX Saab to be arrogant, rude, unethical, possibly incompetent, and seemingly intent on fee gouging and ripping me off. Perhaps, as he hinted, he is overworked, stressed out, broke and hurting himself."

    3rd Saab shop: "The quote ended up being a minimum of $1500 for a job that ended up costing less than half that at another shop. If you're going to gouge people on prices, make sure they don't have a fast Internet connection in their pocket."

    As opposed to our resident Subaru specialist: '"5 stars on steroids if possible. I've never met a more honest Auto Service owner in my life! He deserves the humanitarian award!"

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  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,679
    Well, I met the guy with the Saab and I took it for a short drive.

    Photos always seem to hide the small stuff and that was the case here.

    When he pulled into the parking lot, I thought.." Wow, that is one sharp looking car" and, it is!

    Body wise, it only has a couple of Dent Wizard type door dings. Paint has some weak areas but nothing bad. Clean Car Fax for what that's worth.

    What appeared to be the original top is starting to show some wear in a couple of areas as would be expected for a 13 year old car. I wouldn't drive it in the rain so no big deal, at least for now. Probably 2000.00 or more for a top I would think.

    Interior, probably would give it an 8 out of 10. Broken switch for HVAC controls that could be difficult to find. Seemed to run well and shifted well.

    After pouring through some of the forums, listening to you guys and reflecting back on my own limited experiences I have to say, the thing scares me.

    One major problem and it's totaled.

    I learned the engines are sludge prone and really need synthetic. The guy was selling it for his mother in law and had zero receipts and had no idea about what kind of oil she had used or much else.

    I learned through one of the forums that the convertible top hydraulics can be trouble prone and are a nasty, expensive [non-permissible content removed] to fix IF a person can be found to do this vexatious work. The seller operated to top for me and it was interesting to see how it worked. It seemed to work quite well.

    I still remember being at an old car show a couple of years ago when it started to rain. A guy with a retractable 1959 Ford scrambled to get his top up but mid way up. something broke leaving it stuck halfway up.

    Several guys ran over to help but 20 minutes later, it was still jammed. I don't know how they eventually dealt with that.

    The guy quickly dropped his price to 3000.00. I passed without giving him a number. He went on to his 11:00 appointment so who knows.

    He has my number. At 2400.00 I might be tempted.

    I do appreciate your opinions as always. Funny, I would (and have) have offered the exact same advice.

    Still, they ARE cool cars in an oddball quirky way and for some perverse reason, I like them!
  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,679
    I did check and there are two or three highly rated on Yelp shops that work on Saabs.

    Bad thing is they are in Seattle which would be like you taking your car to Oakland to get it worked on.

    Not talking about the demographics, just the distance involved and the hassle.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,278
    edited October 2013
    my '99 had more miles than that and I got, IIRC, $3300 for it. Mine was green on tan. Black on black convertible is something I'd never do again. My Alfa was that color. While it looks good, it sucks to live with.

    For what its worth, the Saab never gave me, nor my father, whom I bought it from, an ounce of trouble. And parts were never a problem, but we never had to touch the engine (so just suspension, brakes, and some electrics).

    I still pine for a manual trans 9-3 sedan or hatch, but I'd prefer an '04+ for the slight styling change.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,796
    Oh I'd still buy one, but only for very very cheap. Was Saab out of business at the time you sold yours? That does make a difference.

    It's not hard to get parts--it's just hard to pay for them.

    Nothing inherently "bad" about those later Saabs (the earlier 900 series were very problematic)--just a question of upkeep and expense.

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  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,679
    I have owned cars that Consumer's Report said were junk and had great luck with.

    " parts were never a problem"

    Well, how long ago was that?

    Right now, the red flags are SERIOUSLY winning over the green ones!
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,796
    It's the kind of car you have to buy cheap. Whenever I've bought 'risky' cars (and I am not averse to risk in this area), I have to discipline myself to not pay any more than rock-bottom wholesale for it.

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  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,679
    At this point he hasn't called me so I'm guessing he probably sold it.

    I know I softened him up a bit which would make it easier on the next person looking at the car.

    I figure if I can buy it for 2500.00, I would do the deal. Otherwise I'm not going to have any regrets.

    Saabs do have their fans and a person would be hard pressed to find one much nicer than this one.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,278
    Had to look at my spreadsheet to find out it was 2 years ago. wow. Didn't feel like that long ago.

    Anyway, thing to remember is that so many generic parts are interchangeable on more than 1 car (such as brakes, shocks, plugs, filters, etc). And many Saab parts carried over for so many years, and I think aftermarket manufacturers will be happy to keep making the parts as long as people are buying.

    According to wiki, that first gen 9-3 uses the same basic engine that was introduced in 1981 and was produced up through 2009, at which time the tooling was sold to Beijing Automotive Group, so its probably still being used.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • isellhondasisellhondas Issaquah WashingtonPosts: 17,679
    I wouldn't worry so much about mechanical parts as I would the other things.

    Like that broken HVAC knob for instance. Now, that would be a "dealer only" item but, of course there are no more dealers.

    Trim pieces, body parts, those may be difficult to find as time go's by.

    It's not a 55 Chevy where EVERYTHING is reproduced.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,278
    edited October 2013
    true. An accident would be pretty much be it... but, then again, at that value, that would be true no matter what. For minor incidents, I'm sure there is no shortage at junkyards... just yet. :)

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • texasestexases Posts: 5,562
    Two friends had 2000-ish Saab convertibles, both had them bought back under lemon laws. Those things were just toooo complicated.
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