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Ford Explorer Mercury Mountaineer 2005 and earlier



  • drew_drew_ Posts: 3,382
    If you wish to find out more info about the Mercedes-Benz M-class, the discussion topic for that vehicle is located here:


    Good luck!

    Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards
  • dindakdindak Posts: 6,632
    Ya, the improvements on the 02 Envoy seem more impressive than those on the Explorer. I wish they sold the Mountaineer here in Canada because it looks better that the Explorer inside and out.
  • njdevilsrnnjdevilsrn Posts: 185
    I might just be some poor Yank talkin here, but if we want to buy American made trucks, let us. Not everyone can afford a Mercedes or an Acura. If I wanted a minivan or a sportscar, I would buy one. Because I wanted an SUV built on a truck platform (95-2000 Explorer is built on a Ranger platform) that is what I bought.

    If the Mercedes is so great, buy it. Enjoy waiting 3 weeks for a service appointment, or having to drive far from home to find someone besides a dealer who will even touch it.
  • tonysracingtonysracing Posts: 80
    Ford Recalls 50,000 New Explorers

    WASHINGTON (AP) - Ford Motor Co. (NYSE:F - news) is recalling 50,000 brand new Explorers because an assembly line conveyor belt that was too narrow for the wider 2002 model may have cut the tire tread.

  • thor8thor8 Posts: 303
    Proteus at #119 sums it up well, I never sugggest to anyone what to buy, but I have to shake my head when someone buys an Explorer over an ML for two or three thousands difference, the total quality and refinement of the ML over the Explorer is big, to put it mildly, I know by first hand experience.

    For those that say they want a truck built on a truck platform, the ML is a truck built on a heavy frame and rides like a car while the Explorer rides like a truck.

    If buying for the sake of buying U.S. made the ML is made in the U.S, except the engine and transmission, but percentagewise is no worse than Ford or GM since most of their engines are cast in Mexico and source parts from there or Canada. If patriotism is a concern, it should be a two way street, in return for my money Ford should give me first class quality. I have owned enough Fords in my life to know that I am not missing a thing on the other hand I am so glad that I bougth an ML430.
  • proteus456proteus456 Posts: 65
    Couple of points here...
    NJDevils-Thor sums it up well. If you can afford a Explorer Limited/Eddie Bauer, you can afford ML. In fact, ML is almost identical on lease (due to higher resale). GM seems to be waking up however......
    Fedlawman..I drove the Buick Rendezvous..and was shocked..its nice! GM almost got it perfect. Nice handling (not typical mushy ride, more sedanlike), nice interior room, amazingly better fit and finish than most GM products. Priced very nicely too. At 33K out the door, i'd consider it a very nice competitor in this class. Unfortunately it is a bit down on power for me, but probably adequate for most. Put the new DOHC 6cyl from the Envoy/Bravada in there, and you'd have a class leader. Fit, finish and handling is about equal to the Acura MDX. Besides Buick dealers here in Seattle are much nicer than Acura.:P
  • mazman1mazman1 Posts: 229
    I also own an Explorer, but am not incredibly enthusiasic about the build quality, especially since I had a 1994 with better.

    If you look at the MB discussion threads on the SUV topic and compare the type of discussion to the "Explorer complaint boards" - and there are 4.. you will see that the MB users are basically talking about pricing and aftermarket do-dads to go on their vehicle, while the Explorer boards have many posts that begin with "Help.. I have a problem..."

    If those of you that have had the Timing Chain Tensioners go bad on your SOHC engine, and watched as they had to lift the engine out of the vehcile to get to the 3 timing chains (two in front and one in the rear) would feel the way I do.

    Ford management should be ashamed of themselves ...
  • thornthorn Posts: 91
    Ford Recalls New Explorers:

    Firestone ends 100 year relationship with Ford - citing Explorer safety problems:

    Firestone fires Ford - from WSJ:

    "Our analysis suggests that there is a significant safety concern with a substantial segment of Ford Explorers," Mr. Lampe said Monday. "We have told Ford of our concerns. They have steadfastly refused to acknowledge those concerns. We have always said that in order to insure the safety of the driving public, it is crucial that there be a true sharing of information concerning the vehicle as well as the tires. Ford simply is not willing to do that."

    "We believe they are attempting to divert scrutiny of their vehicle by casting doubt on the quality of Firestone tires. The tires are safe, and as we have said before, when we have a problem, we will acknowledge that problem and fix it. We expect Ford to do the same."

  • dindakdindak Posts: 6,632
    Good riddance for Ford. Firestone is a big liability.
  • I would just take a time out to congradulate you on ignoring the first major firestone tire recall and insist that that was just a minor defect in the "old " models. You all were safe, right? you got the new explorer! its new! its different! no more recalls! WRONG! Looks like the Explorer and recalls go together like peanut butter and jelly. The first 2002 recall was the back liftgate glass, the problem was when you would slam the glass part shut, the glass would shatter. Now, you all have another recall on your hands with something about the thiness of the tire tred, but Ford insists that its just a "minor" recall and that its just a "cosmetic" problem. Now Ford's trying to cover up and desguise their recalls as "cosmetic" problems, but if that were the case, then why would they have such a large and demanding recall? Well, i know its not the owner's faults, but its not like you all haven't been warned.
  • bobcatbobbobcatbob Posts: 187
    An Explorer Limited for $42K??? What the heck is that dealer thinking and what the heck did they do when you laughed in their face?
  • proteus456proteus456 Posts: 65
    Well, after explaining my position, the salesguy said "oh...thats just because they were rare before, now availability isn't a problem anymore so we should be able to make you a good deal". I told him it unless he was selling for about 5k UNDER invoice, it was a lousy deal compared to MDX or ML class..he got all huffy then, claimed the MDX was a cheap "isuzu knockoff", and that ML had lousy quality. I told him I wasn't interested, turned and left
  • bjk2001bjk2001 Posts: 358
    Just test drove both V6 & V8 2002 Mountaineer yesterday. Sales let me drive around a few blocks. We didn't have chance to get on the LA freeway. I can't tell the difference between V6 & V8. Wife liked the "roomy" 3rd row seat. She fitted comfortably during both test drives. After we got home, wife anxiously wanted to get a good deal on the Mountaineer. She prefered Mountaineer over Explorer, coz she likes the Mountaineer dash board design.

    Then I read the 50,000 Explorer/Mountaineer recall story. Ahhhh. Not again. Looks like we are going to wait for a few more months make sure no more recalls.

    Have a few questions regarding the Ford plants.

    Does Mountaineer/Explorer VIN tell where it was built ? Does anyone know which plant has better quality (less recalls)? If you do, please share.

  • bobcatbobbobcatbob Posts: 187
    I don't know that I'd expect 5K under invoice for a vehicle this new, but I'd offer invoice as they still have a nice holdback.

    As far as the MDX being a cheap Isuzu knowckoff, give me that guys name a number he needs to be dealt with. The MDX is a beautiful vehicle will last a very lng time. Of ocurse when it first came out, dealers here in MD were asking 10-15K OVER sticker and that was with a 6 month delivery timeframe.

    And the M-Class, well, I don't know a lot about those. I did stand next to one the other day and finalyl realized how big they are. I figured they would be this little flimsy thing, but they are a heafty vehicle.
  • proteus456proteus456 Posts: 65
    Hehe...I know they'd never sell for that, was just informing the salesguy what I thought the car was actually WORTH! Needless to say, I have a 2002 ML320 on order...:-) Now I hear theres yet ANOTHER recall for the Ford Exploder....LOL!
    Why people buy this overpriced junk escapes me. Sure, if you have 7 people to haul, or major towing to do, a stripped down Explorer might be a good deal. But paying 37K for a "luxury" version? ROFL!
  • proteus456proteus456 Posts: 65
    If you're looking in the mountaineer price range, i'd highly suggest checking out the ML320. (MDX is nice too, but limited towing ability and tiny 3rd row). ML has a nice 3rd row, with even more legroom than the Mountaineer, you get Mercedes safety, fit, finish handling..etc (see above). Heck, the V6 in the Mercedes is just a few hp (220 vs 239) shy of the V8 in the Mountaineer! (and sucks FAR less gas).
  • njdevilsrnnjdevilsrn Posts: 185

    Are you a Mercedes salesman or something? Or the person in charge of a new marketing campaign?

    A majority of Explorers on the road are Sport and XLT. Then XLS, then Eddie Bauer, and a relatively small amount of Limiteds. If people want to buy it, let them buy it.

    I own an XLS. I agree with you that if you are going to spend that kind of money ($35-40K) you would be better off with something other than an Explorer. Your point is well taken. Feel free to stop reminding the rest of us about it whenever you want.
  • I do not understand why you think 220hp vs. 239hp is a very minor difference, but at the same time, you think a difference of 15 mpg city/20 mpg hwy compared to 17city/21hwy is a HUGE difference ("sucks FAR less gas").

    To compare apples to apples, the Ford V6 is 16/21 mpg, compared to 17/21 for the Mercedes.

    The Ford V8 is 15/20, compared to 16/20 for the Mercedes.

    I am not saying that the Mercedes doesn't have a great engine. It is probably faster and may get very slightly higher gas mileage (1 mpg city, the same highway). Just don't overexaggerate the figures to slant them the way you want them.
  • Also, I don't understand how you can say that the Explorer and the Mercedes are in the "same price range."

    The MSRP for the base vehicle may be similar (I assume you are comparing a Limited or EB), but there are a couple of things you are leaving out that change things a lot:

    1) You can buy a Ford for a lot closer to invoice than you can a Mercedes. (I am buying mine for invoice -- not 1 penny over).

    2) To get the same features on the Mercedes as you have on the Explorer, you have to add some options, which are pretty costly. These include: Luxury package(leather seats, ...), heated seats, premium audio system, convenience package (Fuel consumption computer, intermittent wipers, power door mirrors), and the 3rd row seat.

    I added everything up for both the Explorer and the Mercedes, using Edmund's TMV(a more accurate measure of what people actually pay than MSRP), and came up with:

    Explorer Limited 4WD with sunroof and 3rd row seat: $33,778

    Mercedes ML320 with above options + sunroof (you have to add the sunroof when you get the luxury group option): $41,616

    This is still not a completely fair comparison, because the Mercedes has some features that are unavailable on the Ford.

    To me, however, a difference of $8,000 is not really in the same price range. I think that the Mercedes is a great vehicle, and probably a class above Ford, but there _is_ a difference in the price you will actually pay, even if it doesn't look that way at first glance.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    Proteus - I agree with your assessment of the Explorer vs. ML320, although I will point out that carefully optioned, an Explorer XLT 4X4 can be had for less than $30K. My wife and I also looked at the Mountaineer AWD and we liked it very much. It can also be had for about $30K. The main reason we eliminated the ML320 from our list is that we plan on using the 3rd row seat fairly often and we didn't like the ML320's 3rd row design or function. Also, although it is an artificial barrier, the $30K threshold is a big one for me...I just find it difficult to justify spending more than that for a car...I have MANY other things to spend my hard earned $ on. I am VERY excited about the Buick...your opinion of the build quality means a lot to me. I can't wait to actually drive it!

    BTW, I live in Seattle (Kent (hold the jokes)) too.

    Mega - Congratulations is spelled with a "T", not a "D".
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