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Ford Explorer Mercury Mountaineer 2005 and earlier

18990929495108

Comments

  • chuck1chuck1 Posts: 1,405
    If you can't buy a Ford backed warranty with either one of these vehicle, I would run the other way. If I understand the warranty situation correctly, both of these vehicle have too many miles to qualify for a (Ford) warranty. There are far too many "lingering issues" to buy these used without a warranty. Some of these are: bad rear ends, bad transmission solenoids, bad power window motors, the transmission needing a reflash is common.

    Remember- a used car (Or SUV) was traded in for a reason. Why did the previous owner get rid of it?
  • Thank you Chuck1 you are the BEST!
  • Oops! I must be brain dead. I subtracted a year (from the current '05 model) instead of adding. I MEANT to say that I saw the '06 Explorer, and reviewed it above! Oops!
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    With all due respect to our friend chuck1, I take some issue with his concern over a used car. I have bought and delivered hundreds of used cars at the Manheim auctions, and never had a bad one - many of them have been Explorers & Mountaineers. They're not all bad, in fact the vast majority of them are very good. Occasionally, there is a clunker out there, and boy do you hear about it here, because that's what this board is for. My 2002 Mountaineer had one repair on it - a squeaky idler arm pully, and it had the cracked liftgate thingy. That's it. But it's in the used car lot now, because the wife wanted an 04. That was because she loved her 02 so much, which she wanted because she loved her 98 so much, which she bought because she loved my 97, which I bought because I loved our 94. See the point? I've never had a bad one, and the 94 was bought used. The rest were new.

    Another thing. I'm not saying the extended warranty is always bad - but it's likely to cost you $2000 or so. If you have $2000 to spend for the warranty, you can handle a pretty hefty repair, which is why you are buying the warranty. So, I don't agree with chuck1 that you shouldn't buy a used Explorer without an extended warranty. It's a crap shoot. If you get a bad truck, then he's right. But if you don't, you'll waste the money. Which is how the warranty companies make their money.

    Anyway, that's how I feel. For the money, the Explorer/Mountaineer is the best SUV on the market, and damn good at that. You can pay more for a 4-runner, and it's probably going to last longer without issues, but it's not even close to as good an overall design, very trucky and hard to drive by comparison.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    Ok, spring - here's some hard core numbers for you. Manheim auctions sold 179 Mountaineers nationwide last week. At 55,000 miles, they went for about $11,000, assuming your prospect is AWD and a 4.0L six. (You didn't specify). Your dealer is making PLENTY of markup on that White one he's offering you at $14,000 in my opinion. Tell him you'll give him $12,500 for it (plus tax & fees of course) period. He'll still make $1500 on the car, unless he paid too much for it, which shouldn't be your problem. That's what I'd do. If you lived closer, I could buy you one out of the auction just like it for $11,000.
  • chuck1chuck1 Posts: 1,405
    "I take some issue with his concern over a used car. I have bought and delivered hundreds of used cars at the Manheim auctions, and never had a bad one - many of them have been Explorers & Mountaineers."

    NVBanker,
    As I think you may be aware-I purchased a NEW Explorer in '02, and experienced EVERYONE of the problems I mentioned. (And other problems I didn't mentioned.) You know my new 4Runner doesn't have a rear end that whines between 55 and 60mph? Imagine that!! :shades:

    The repair for the rear-end out of warranty I hear is around $1,800.00 You can buy a Ford backed warranty for that on the net that covers the powertrain. I did just that, and got over a $500.00 refund when I traded it in and notified the dealer who sold me the warranty (a dealer over the net) that I nolonger owned this vehicle. With all due respect, I disagree with you. To buy one of these used without a warranty is foolhardy! IMHO!!
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 9,621
    nv... my GUESS is that spring25 told the dealers they had 15k in hand. how much do you think a vehicle is then going to cost them? ;)
  • I have an '03 Mountaineer that was bot in Sept, '02 so it's an early ;'03. Just hitting 40,000 miles and only had 1 (warranty) repair...a leaking strut (and I am not even sure if that was the truth...perhaps the dealer was just "looking" for a way to milk the warranty as it was near 36,000 when he "happened' to find that). And the driver's seat "leather" isn't holding up too well.

    Other than that, this has been the best Ford product we've ever had and that is over 20. The paint still looks like new, the ride is fine and the mileage does hurt at $3/gallon, but for the size of the vehicle it's as fuel efficient as the competition.

    And at 3 years, LOTS of people trade just to trade. It doesn't mean anything is wrong as implied above. I would not be afraid to buy a used one of these puppies.
  • thank you very much for your opinion, yes you are right, the Moutaineer is AWD and 4.0l six and I am offering him $15000 with everything including, the SUV price and tax & fees but he doesnt want to give me for less thant $15575 and it is not even Leather seats or sunroof or all that kind of stuff, My loan is going to expire on 09/24/05 and all these dealers want to make too much money in all their SUV, do you think is a bad deal I am offering him $15000 for a 55,000+ miles Moutaineer?
  • No when I went to the dealer I didn't tell the guy what I have, I let him show me and gave him a price range, he asked me if I was financing the SUV either through them or another bank, I just told him, let see what you have to offer me, so we took it from there...whe he started giving me numbers like $179990 for 2002 Moutaineer with 55,000+ miles then I told him it was too much then he went down to $16789, then to $15990 and then finally $13990 but with tax & fees he said I have to pay $15575.63 and that is when I took my check out and told him $15000 with everything including and we can close the deal right now, he said that I needed to pay taxes and stuff and seriusly I think I can do better, yesterday I was checking again some dealers online and I found another Moutaineer with less miles on it and leather seats and the dealer starting price is $16789 so if I got this guy going down from $179990 to $139990 (well technically $15575) then don't you think I can get this other guy go down until I have my deal of $15000 with all?
  • alman08alman08 Posts: 282
    spring25, from what I'm reading, chuck1's opinion is the best for your situation. no offense, but if you're only qualified for $15k and nothing more, just think, what if the car does break down a week or 2 from the day you bought it and you have no warranty on it?
    also, nvbanker just told you how much the car would go for in the auction, so yes, definitely $15k for that moutaineer is a VERY BAD DEAL!
    just to give you an idea what is out there, last year in august (yes in 04) I saw a 03 slightly used eddie bauer model, v6, fully loaded , 15k miles sitting on a ford dealer lot asking for $16,999. Get the picture?
  • chuck1chuck1 Posts: 1,405
    "to milk the warranty as it was near 36,000 when he "happened' to find that). And the driver's seat "leather" isn't holding up too well".

    There hasn't been any wide-spread issues with the struts, so I guess this is an isolated situation. I can tell you the leather on these vehicles is JUNK. There have been many complaints about cracking. When you consider my wife is alone in the vehicle 70% of the time, and the drivers seat is cracking-and then the rest of the leather (save for the third seat which was not used very much) was also showing the same "cracking", this all points to very thin/cheap leather directly due to cost cutting. I might also add that I used "conditioners on the seats" but it didn't seen to help much. They also cut costs with the aluminium rear-end that is a wide spread problem. Where did Ford cut corners where you can't see?
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    Well, somebody has to tell the other part of the story, chuck. I also bought a new 2002 Mountaineer, and experienced NONE of the problems you mentioned. People need to know that too. Sorry you had a bad one, enjoy your 4-runner. I, for one, don't care for the design, of the Yoda, though I acknowledge, they are bullet proof.
  • Yes, there are always 2 sides to every story. I am really happy with my 1997 XLT V8 and my 2000 XLT V8.
    My wifes been driving the 97 for 3 1/2 years now, runs and drives perfect at 140,000 miles. I only had one problem so far, I had to replace the multifunction switch, which cost me about $63 at the dealer and it was easy to put on myself.
    I have been driving the 2000 XLT for 6 months, so far it's very good at 107,000 miles.
    Both are wonderful vehicles, the only problem is they drink a lot of gas, 13-14 around town, 17-18 on the road.
    E.D.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    GOOD GRIEF, MAN!! How do you dare drive those two Vehicles without a WARRANTY!!!
  • chuck1chuck1 Posts: 1,405
    The testimonials prior to the redesign in'01 are meaningless. They were redesigned and consequently, completely different vehicles. I am glad you enjoyed yours.
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    I understand that, I had both versions. I still drive them. I just think it's disingenuous for you to hit this board constantly, warning everyone who may buy one, that they'll need an extended warranty I've purchased Ford ESP plans four times, and needed them exactly twice, once for a power steering pump leak, and once for a loose crank pulley. Both on an 87 Mercury Sable. Never even came close to getting my money out of it. Never needed it on any SUV. I have concluded that in general, Ford is making money on them. Obviously they do, or they wouldn't offer them. For every time somebody soaks up their warranty cost with an engine or transmission failure, 100 customers don't use them for anything catastrophic and waste their money. I'm sorry your experience wasn't good. They're machines, it happens. The Asians make the best cars. Not everything Ford makes is great. But some of their products are very good. Their trucks generally are among them. I have a Mercedes on order, and hope it treats me as well as every Explorer/Mountaineer I have owned, for the record.
  • the 6 Fords (Explorers, Town Car, Mustang) spend MUCH less time in the shop than the Mercedes. Trust me....you'll appreciate the Mercedes loaner car (usually a Toyota around here, by the way)!!!!!
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    Yeah, I've noticed the Toyota Camry loaners here too. I don't understand that logic, but evidently MB doesn't think there is value in tempting their customers with a nicer newer Benz while their heap is in the shop. If the Mercedes is a hanger queen, it won't last long with me. I'm quite used to not having between oil change service intervals with my Ford products, and I like it.
  • Yeah, it has cache', but the quality just isn't there. Sure, a Mercedes will run 300,000 miles, but it will cost you two arms and two legs in the process. And while under warranty you won't care, but the volume of needed repairs/maintenance will make you crazy. Don't do it.
  • marsha7marsha7 Posts: 3,670
    earlier threads...I think high fuel prices will hit GM/Ford where it hurts the most, in their highest profit vehicles, the SUVs...with Delta and NW Airlines in Ch 11, I make a prediction...

    By July 1 2006, either GM or Ford, maybe both, will file for Ch11...I have read that GM has over 200 Billion in long term debt, and Ford has about 125 Billion in long term debt...add to that they both have pensions underfunded by at least 5 Billion, and they will file Ch 11, jettison their pension plans, and downsize by 50%...

    The only actual prediction is the Ch 11 filing by one of them...the other thoughts are suppositions...
  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    Chapter 11 isn't even a consideration in for Ford.

    In fact a recent article suggested that Ford's best solution would be to go private. Thats right, Ford could easily raise enough cash then when combined with what they have on hand they could buy back their Class A shares and retire their unsecured bonds.

    This would make Ford a privately owned company in the hands of the Ford family which still controls a vast vast majority of the voting shares.

    Fords legacy costs are huge, and right now it is said that an American auto worker is actually more expensive than a German auto worker because germany has a state pension and universal health care.

    The UAW is going to have to make big concessions in the 2007 renegotiation season. Ford will probably want to close at least 2 factories. St. Louis and Wixcom.

    The auto market is not shrinking, its just becoming more and more competitive and fragmented into more and more market segments. At the same time, with safety and emission regulations growing at an ever frantic pace, the development of product is getting more and more expensive while the fierce competition is forcing automakers to update their cars more often making harder to pay back the development costs.

    What this means is that we will definitely see further consolidation or partnerships in the automotive world.

    I predict that we will see Chinese brand cars on our roads in the next 5 years. And the competition, fragmentation, and cost pressures will get even worse.

    The strong will survive.
  • steverstever YooperlandPosts: 40,182
    Hertz is on the block as we speak; but all of this Ford doom and gloom talk is better suited for the News & Views board. Like the What about the future of Ford Inc?? discussion.

    Steve, Host

    Moderator
    Need help navigating? stever@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.

  • marsha7marsha7 Posts: 3,670
    Hey, thanks...you know, there are topic threads out there that we just do not know about, because there are, at last count, at least 328 billion threads on Edmunds Town Hall...OK, maybe not 328 BILLION, but, to use scientific terms, "a lot"...

    Thanks for the update..."Future of Ford" is right up my alley... :shades:
  • fitguyfitguy Posts: 222
    Well I've had a complete turnaround in philopsophy and leased a 2005 Explorer XLT today. I traded in a 2000 Expy in nice shape with 47K that we planned to keep and drive till it needed expensive repairs. The price breaks and deals were just too hard to resist. I worked an interesting deal:
    Got the family price + rebates- MSRP $36,700 discounted to $26,970
    It's a XLT V8, sunroof, tow pkg, appearance pkg. & convience group. I orig paid cash for the Expy used 2 years ago ($20K), put nothing into it but tires & front brakes. After some haggling was able to get $9200 for the Expy (no small task- nobody wants these things no matter how nice), the low mileage saved me. I did a 0 down 36 month lease @ 5.5% and used the trade to pay the first payment with the rest cash back to me. I'll now take the remainder and open a special checking account to make the lease payments, carrying me for 17 months.
    So essentially I will drive a brand-new vehicle using equity from the old one to make 17 months of payments ($520/mo including sales tax and excise tax).
    And the new Explorer is a dream compared to the old-style Expy- plus with the V8 the Explorer has 1500 lbs MORE tow capacity; and a 3rd row seat that folds flat (smaller, though) instead of humping a huge bench seat in/out all the time.
    There are some nice deals out there for those that still need truck-based SUV's, and even if the value continues to plummet on them (which it no doubt will) we can just turn it in 3 years from now and walk away. By then, if gas is 5 bucks a gallon we may dump our skiboat too and won't need an SUV at all. Right now, this just seemed real sensible for us.
  • chuck1chuck1 Posts: 1,405
    "payments ($520/mo including sales tax and excise tax)."

    So let's see---after 3 years you are paying over $18,000.00 and will not own the car after that. That's a great deal...........................
  • steverstever YooperlandPosts: 40,182
    Leasing can be a great deal, depending on your individual circumstances. Check out Ford Explorer: Lease Questions if you want get info about an Explorer lease or see the Lease Questions - Ask Here discussion in the archives for more.

    Steve, Host

    Moderator
    Need help navigating? stever@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.

  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    Actually, it could be a good deal - especially if the bottom continues to fall out of the SUVs, and the residual is much higher than resale value. He's able to dump the car back on Ford, and let them take the extra depreciation hit. Not the worst strategy. If he likes the car, he can buy it out of the lease at the end, and the cost won't be a lot different than if he had financed the whole thing for 6 or 7 years.
  • spring25--- I don't know about in NY, but here in MO I could get you a LOW mileage 3rd seat Explorer or Mountaineer (under 45k if not under 36k) for the 13000 mark or less. I passed on one at the Ford auction- Lease turn-in with 40k, 4x4 XLT with 3rd seat and rear AC- just yesterday. Would have been able to get that one for somewhere around $12000! I'd be glad to help, sorry so far away.
    Scott
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